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All Worlds Maintenance (Dec. 21)Follow

#52 Dec 21 2010 at 1:41 AM Rating: Decent
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Gemgenie wrote:

but the point is since there is no content, what else better we can do? I can see that SE giving us free period so we can just don't bother login until something better is added. But if the sp thing not changed, u still cannot escape from that **** of leveling no matter u shrink the duration into 2 months like those hardcore full time player or span it over years as a light player.

If people really want SP to be changed then I want it to changed into something that could benefit both solo and party plays. Even if SE were to adjust the SP and make you reach the level cap faster, the gap between hardcore and casual will still be the same regardless because of the surplus. Once reached level cap, what else better things to do? (I am referring to the end-game content). The game has content, it keep most people occupied working their ranks up but what about the end-game content? Aren't you going to be stucked at level cap until the end-game content arrives?

Gemgenie wrote:

What's the point of making skill up so hardcore? Is that really a game that everyone hoping to enjoy like bullying weak mobs few hours a day for the coming year? Are we really that pathetic as nothing else better to do? If skill up is not that hardcore, there shouldn't be a issue for solo or party play. If solo is that important, why mmo? I thought ppl play mmo coz of the community.

The game is not made for hardcore players. They invented the game for both casual and hardcore players and of course they intended to maintain such difficulty so that people could stay longer working up their ranks and given them more time to develop more contents. SE has made a statement that FFXIV will support both solo and party for a reason. MMO doesn't mean that you must have a group of people to play with and because it is not every time that you will be in a party, in such case that is where solo play comes in.
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#53 Dec 21 2010 at 3:09 AM Rating: Default
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Aucis wrote:
The game has content, it keep most people occupied working their ranks up but what about the end-game content? Aren't you going to be stucked at level cap until the end-game content arrives


..... So u considering solo weak mobs, regional leve and local leve are contents that keep u busy ranking up....
A battle system with no strategy... (ya coz it's for solo, u only need to kill fast, hit 111121112. Who need enfeebled magic)
Regional leve... Activate, mobs are there, killed, reward and end in 10 mins, same for every leve
Local leve, I don't know why I'm always getting rank 1 leve with my 29 armorer....
And ya same thing craft and deliver, time to spend anima

I still login everyday... Usually repeat those leve everyday, about 1 hr for craft, 1 hr for battle (usually solo)....
So **** bored, I go solo mobs... Feel sleepy. My ls only has a few ppl... I ask them to go party for some fun and they think I'm asshxle becoz they prefer solo. So what else I do.... Oh ya let's go some mining.....zzzZzzz

I'm glad that u find the game is fun. U have ffxiv and SE got u, how sweet.
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#54 Dec 21 2010 at 3:20 AM Rating: Excellent
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I just want a mog house to horde all my shiet in.
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#55 Dec 21 2010 at 4:08 AM Rating: Decent
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northernsky wrote:
aj7418 wrote:
For me if I had to chose between the AH from FFXI+my personal rolandberry bazaar VS the retainer system in FFXIV + my personal repair npc bazaar I have to say I like the new retainers much better(including the search features planned). I can sell 10x as many things with retainers simply from having 20 slots available. If people sold items in the proper wards only (and this update is going to force you to do that) then the system should be just fine in place of an AH. I REALLY LIKE the bazaar modeling feature (as a weaver) this lets me display my wares like a store front window. I always sell the things that display on my retainer first before the rest.

What this update brings that really is missing without the search feature is the ability to see what is available quickly, IE I want to upgrade my gloves. Right now you have to search online or just randomly check ppl to see whats out there. With a search feature you can just search up the gloves and see whats available quickly. I know many ppl keep their gear longer then they want to out of saving the hassle of just figuring out what they want. I can't wait to see what kind of economic growth this brings. More sales and shoppers => more $$$ for me.

There is room for improvement like a sale history on my retainer so I can see what I sold each night but they said this was coming and hopefully its here tomorrow.


Excellent point.

With still a few improvements in the mechanics, the Markets Wards will become a very effective option for people with a lot of stuff to sell (namely crafters). Then, once a solid system is in place, if SE eventually implements an AH, both systems would work well in parallel and this way an AH would not destroy the usefulness of the market wards.

Implementing an AH right now would just kill the market wards and would strongly limit the overall efficiency of the economy system they ultimately want to install.


Can you please elaborate? I think if they stick with retainer I doubt you're going to see an AH because whether its implemented now or 10 years down the road, an AH would completely nullify the market wards...if you have any idea as to why it WOULD'NT, please share.
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#56 Dec 21 2010 at 6:36 AM Rating: Default
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SolidMack wrote:

Can you please elaborate? I think if they stick with retainer I doubt you're going to see an AH because whether its implemented now or 10 years down the road, an AH would completely nullify the market wards...if you have any idea as to why it WOULD'NT, please share.


FFXI had both AH and bazaars. Not only can it work, but there is precedent.

Just because you can't think of any possible solution doesn't mean SE can't.

I personally don't think they'll add anything resembling a typical AH, but you never know. For over 5 years it was guaranteed SE wouldn't raise the level cap in FFXI above 75 (even out of their own mouths). Anything can happen.
#57 Dec 21 2010 at 8:16 AM Rating: Decent
32 posts
Very happy to see any update to the game :o)

that said however AH is still #1 priority needed, retainers will never work as well. ever.........ever. Far too many possible items to sell, in EVERY ward/character.
not gonna work....again -.-

we need asap

1 AH right now plz and ty.
2 mail needed since release
3 purchasable retainers
4 chocobos
5 sp gained/mob doubled...yes doubled
6 more questchains

:oD
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#58 Dec 21 2010 at 9:05 AM Rating: Good
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SolidMack wrote:
northernsky wrote:
aj7418 wrote:
For me if I had to chose between the AH from FFXI+my personal rolandberry bazaar VS the retainer system in FFXIV + my personal repair npc bazaar I have to say I like the new retainers much better(including the search features planned). I can sell 10x as many things with retainers simply from having 20 slots available. If people sold items in the proper wards only (and this update is going to force you to do that) then the system should be just fine in place of an AH. I REALLY LIKE the bazaar modeling feature (as a weaver) this lets me display my wares like a store front window. I always sell the things that display on my retainer first before the rest.

What this update brings that really is missing without the search feature is the ability to see what is available quickly, IE I want to upgrade my gloves. Right now you have to search online or just randomly check ppl to see whats out there. With a search feature you can just search up the gloves and see whats available quickly. I know many ppl keep their gear longer then they want to out of saving the hassle of just figuring out what they want. I can't wait to see what kind of economic growth this brings. More sales and shoppers => more $$$ for me.

There is room for improvement like a sale history on my retainer so I can see what I sold each night but they said this was coming and hopefully its here tomorrow.


Excellent point.

With still a few improvements in the mechanics, the Markets Wards will become a very effective option for people with a lot of stuff to sell (namely crafters). Then, once a solid system is in place, if SE eventually implements an AH, both systems would work well in parallel and this way an AH would not destroy the usefulness of the market wards.

Implementing an AH right now would just kill the market wards and would strongly limit the overall efficiency of the economy system they ultimately want to install.


Can you please elaborate? I think if they stick with retainer I doubt you're going to see an AH because whether its implemented now or 10 years down the road, an AH would completely nullify the market wards...if you have any idea as to why it WOULD'NT, please share.


First, I badly want an AH, I do not enjoy crafting so much and prefer to go the tough way and pay the big gils for my gear.

Now, I was referring to a post who compared FFXI AH + bazaar system to FFXIV retainer system. I think that with adjustments, the retainer will become efficient (not as much as an AH, but it allows more slots for selling stuff (20 compared to 7)) in addition to holding some of your material/gear, limiting the need of mules. Granted, it needs to be way more efficient from the buyer's point of view.

Then, IF they ever implement an AH, it would be a great complementary addition to efficiency because they would have a solid background system to sell your crafting stuff and/or high quality gear or hard to obtain stuff that can't be found on AH (referring to FFXI again here) along with an efficient AH system where you could, for example, sell the 5 or 7 items you want to get rid of fast.

They could even throw in incentive to keep emphasis on the wards, for example, HQ items and quest items could be impossible to obtain through AH, some kind of "exclusive" items could be found in bazaar but not in AH, high AH taxes etc.
Obviously this is purely speculation but you asked me how I could see the co-existence of an AH and a retainer system...

Edited, Dec 21st 2010 10:07am by northernsky

Edited, Dec 21st 2010 10:09am by northernsky
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#59 Dec 21 2010 at 9:21 AM Rating: Good
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Hydragyrum wrote:
SolidMack wrote:

Can you please elaborate? I think if they stick with retainer I doubt you're going to see an AH because whether its implemented now or 10 years down the road, an AH would completely nullify the market wards...if you have any idea as to why it WOULD'NT, please share.


FFXI had both AH and bazaars. Not only can it work, but there is precedent.

Just because you can't think of any possible solution doesn't mean SE can't.

I personally don't think they'll add anything resembling a typical AH, but you never know. For over 5 years it was guaranteed SE wouldn't raise the level cap in FFXI above 75 (even out of their own mouths). Anything can happen.

Wasn't part of the bazaars popularity because of items that couldn't be sold on the AH and the pathetic number of slots they provided on the AH? Then I have to wonder if that means if they were to implement an AH, would they choose another pathetic number of slots in and effort to keep the market wards around?

No one really knows what they will end up doing. Everything is kind of in the air at the moment.
#60 Dec 21 2010 at 9:56 AM Rating: Good
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MrTalos wrote:
Wasn't part of the bazaars popularity because of items that couldn't be sold on the AH and the pathetic number of slots they provided on the AH? Then I have to wonder if that means if they were to implement an AH, would they choose another pathetic number of slots in and effort to keep the market wards around?

No one really knows what they will end up doing. Everything is kind of in the air at the moment.


That's exactly my point. People who cry "AH now!" rarely consider the fact that FFXI's AH wasn't very good and required player-conceived work arounds. But according to them an AH will solve all of FFXIV's problems (obvious sarcasm).

Personally I think an AH at this stage would be a very bad idea and I hope SE is holding off on it. The FFXIV economy has many hidden problems that will only become worse if an AH is allowed to bring them to the foreground.

For example, look at how many gil sources there are compared to gil sinks. You can easily generate 100,000+ gil every leve reset between rewards and NPCing junk acquired along the way. What gil sinks do we have? Retainer stands? No one uses them and they're only 500 gil per day. Setting teleport locations? A few thousand gil a few times per week, assuming you change favorites weekly. Taxes in the wards: You'd have to sell 2 million gil worth of items to equal 100,000 gil at 5% taxes. Buying items from an NPC is the only significant gil sink we have, and I doubt anyone spends 100,000+ gil on NPC items every leve reset. Feel free to let me know if I'm forgetting any other gil sinks.

Our economy is inflating at a huge rate. People are already bragging about having millions upon millions of gil. I wouldn't be surprised if some people have over a billion gil by now. What kind of havoc would this wreck on the economy if an AH is implemented?

I find it hard to believe that SE didn't see this coming. Perhaps they wanted to inject gil into the game because it's new and plan on reducing gil generation or adding more gil sinks. But one thing is for sure, this is much more important than adding an AH. Just think how easy it would be for someone with 100 million gil to manipulate the AH? You really want that to happen?

Edited, Dec 21st 2010 9:57am by Hydragyrum

Edited, Dec 21st 2010 9:59am by Hydragyrum
#61 Dec 21 2010 at 10:21 AM Rating: Default
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Hydragyrum wrote:
You really want that to happen?


If it means that I can easily look stuff up and and buy/sell without having to travel between numerous wards...sure. The wards system with a decent search feature would work fine...but it would still be clunky and time consuming. As an adult player who maybe has time to play 2 hours a day...time is very important. One stop shopping is a priority for me. In FFXI...I could care less about RMT manipulating the AH....never affected me. I did my thing...had plenty of $$...and had fun out in the world...not hanging around Jueno all day.

So keep the wards...fine...but also give me an AH. Tax the heck out of me...don't care.

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#62 Dec 21 2010 at 11:45 AM Rating: Good
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Hydragyrum wrote:
SolidMack wrote:

Can you please elaborate? I think if they stick with retainer I doubt you're going to see an AH because whether its implemented now or 10 years down the road, an AH would completely nullify the market wards...if you have any idea as to why it WOULD'NT, please share.


FFXI had both AH and bazaars. Not only can it work, but there is precedent.

Just because you can't think of any possible solution doesn't mean SE can't.

I personally don't think they'll add anything resembling a typical AH, but you never know. For over 5 years it was guaranteed SE wouldn't raise the level cap in FFXI above 75 (even out of their own mouths). Anything can happen.


Ok, I'm not talking to SE am I? I asked the guy a question what's it to you exactly? I was wondering how he thought an AH wouldn't nullify the retainer system and please tell me how the market wards are anything like Bazaars (considering too we have Bazaars in this game). An AH would completely nullify the need for a market wards because no one would even use the wards if they implemented an AH....tell me otherwise, i'm willing to listen, but my head just isn't coming up with anything "SE might come up with".
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#63 Dec 21 2010 at 11:56 AM Rating: Good
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SolidMack wrote:
Hydragyrum wrote:
SolidMack wrote:

Can you please elaborate? I think if they stick with retainer I doubt you're going to see an AH because whether its implemented now or 10 years down the road, an AH would completely nullify the market wards...if you have any idea as to why it WOULD'NT, please share.


FFXI had both AH and bazaars. Not only can it work, but there is precedent.

Just because you can't think of any possible solution doesn't mean SE can't.

I personally don't think they'll add anything resembling a typical AH, but you never know. For over 5 years it was guaranteed SE wouldn't raise the level cap in FFXI above 75 (even out of their own mouths). Anything can happen.


Ok, I'm not talking to SE am I? I asked the guy a question what's it to you exactly? I was wondering how he thought an AH wouldn't nullify the retainer system and please tell me how the market wards are anything like Bazaars (considering too we have Bazaars in this game). An AH would completely nullify the need for a market wards because no one would even use the wards if they implemented an AH....tell me otherwise, i'm willing to listen, but my head just isn't coming up with anything "SE might come up with".


I was just continuing a conversation on a public forum. Forgive me for sharing my opinion.

Let's consider the possibility that SE "copy & pastes" FFXI's AH into FFXIV. Each player would only have 7 slots to sell items, and not all trade-able items could be sold on the AH. Right here we already have two major limitations since it's clear people want to sell more than 7 items simultaneously and certain items would require the wards to be sold.

I doubt SE would use FFXI's AH though. My prediction, and suggestion, is that SE integrate an AH window with the incoming ward search function so that players could immediately buy an item from the AH window for a "convienience fee". This game needs more gil sinks and this would be a perfect one. If the player wants to avoid paying the fee they walk to the ward and buy the item directly from the retainer. Consider buying a 5 million gil piece of gear; you may not want to pay 500,000 in convenience fee. AH + Wards living happily together, including some realism, gaming convenience, and economy management (removing gil).
#64 Dec 21 2010 at 12:00 PM Rating: Good
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I've seen a ton of posts against the AH, using FFXI's AH an what the new one would be. FFXI's AH made it easier to manipulate people who wern't familiar with prices, which is a bad thing. I actually don't like blind auctions for this type of thing at all. They're rarely used in the real world for good reason.

Personally, I would rather see something along the lines of wow's AH. I think it leads to the most effecient economy. It basically lets you open every retainer in that ward/city/world at the same time and see what is for sale. SE can choose to apply auction timers, or buy it now options, or both, I wouldn't care.
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#65 Dec 21 2010 at 12:17 PM Rating: Decent
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I really wish people would stop crying about not having an AH and come to the realization that SE will not give us one unless they feel the wards are a complete failure. Clearly that is not the case. Early on they stated it's a possible option as a backup plan, you don't move forward on a backup plan when your original plan is not even fully implemented. That's just common sense.

Edited, Dec 21st 2010 1:19pm by Jefro420
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#66 Dec 21 2010 at 12:27 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:


I was just continuing a conversation on a public forum. Forgive me for sharing my opinion.


Sorry i misjudged your tone. I read your post seems like a plausible idea.
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#67 Dec 21 2010 at 12:57 PM Rating: Good
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To be honest, after spending the last few days on XI and buying from the AH, when certain items get low people get greedy. Something that was selling for lets say 50k jumps up to over 100k. I was looking at something that last sold for 100k and ended up paying 150k. Blind auction is a pain. And also, just because its my luck, when something i have has been selling for 50k i put it up around 45k and the ah gets flooded with that item and the price drops to under 10k.

The Bazzar system in XI, when i do look i tend to see a lot of 999,999,999 prices. Not saying that people don't sell things via Bazzar just saying thats what i see a lot of the time.


XIV Market wards can work your retainers have 20 slots to sell things with. Group up according to what you have the most of then move to another ward for other things. Say you have lots of crystals/shards/clusters you want to sell, then you have gear you want to sell, but you have been doing Bot as of late and have woods and such to sell. Put 1 retainer in crystal ward, Put your gear in the gear ward, put yourself in the ward that carpenters would buy wood from or put your self outside the carpenters guild.

You have a total of 30 bazzar slots to work with. 300 total inventory spaces. The search function can help but does need to be tweeked a bit. I think that XIV's Wards can work if ppl would just give them a chance. I have seen this since beta "we want an ah" and i am pretty sure, from what friends that were in alpha have said, it has been around since then as well. Why not just try it out for more then a few minutes before going off and complaining about this need for an AH. I happen to like the wards i thnk that all they need is better organization. And SE has tried to give us that but, as others have said, when, lets say the battlecraft ward, is flooded with gear that kinda makes it hard.

Sorry for the wall and any spelling issues. This is how i feel and i am not saying everyone else has to feel the same way. :)

Edited, Dec 21st 2010 1:58pm by Kindredsouls
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#68 Dec 21 2010 at 1:08 PM Rating: Good
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I wonder why SE doesn't just make it so you cannot sell items in wards not designed for them? I mean...that would eliminate the garbage...but would also increase the numbers of bazaars. It would also force people to buy more retainers if they like using that system.

Just a thought...not sure I've seen anyone propose that idea.

Mix that with a highly taxed AH(for items not in the Wards)...that may work for shoppers and lazy AH people.
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#69 Dec 21 2010 at 1:29 PM Rating: Good
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Simool wrote:
I wonder why SE doesn't just make it so you cannot sell items in wards not designed for them? I mean...that would eliminate the garbage...but would also increase the numbers of bazaars. It would also force people to buy more retainers if they like using that system.

Just a thought...not sure I've seen anyone propose that idea.

Mix that with a highly taxed AH(for items not in the Wards)...that may work for shoppers and lazy AH people.


because their initial vision didnt even have ward divisions. Because they still want you to be able to buy complementary items that may not be sold in the same ward (such as repair items with the weapon it goes with).
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#70 Dec 21 2010 at 1:29 PM Rating: Decent
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shinichoco wrote:
nyanda wrote:
shinichoco wrote:
So much for hoping they would improve synthesis. They certainly didn't with the last update... =/


What's wrong with synthesis that requires immediate attention?


Well, when it's not monotonous it's extremely aggravating and frustrating. The random elements to it is are too dominating-- they need to be looked at and adjusted a bit. Guild marks are also a pain to get. Our local leves do not tell us whether we are getting
gil or guildmarks upon getting them at the counter. To make things even worse, we can't even be guaranteed there are local leves that are suitable for our level available. A level 20+ crafter can get a whole reset full of level 1-5 guildleves if he/she is unlucky.

They also mentioned that synthesis would be getting "improved controls" in the December update notes along with the recipe book feature and, from what I can tell at least, there have not been any adjustments made to that effect. We got glitzy little lights when we succeed now, but... that doesn't really sound like "improved controls".


I believe they were talking about the item selection when crafting. That to me is a fairly big and very handy improved control feature. And the auto-add repair function...
#71 Dec 21 2010 at 2:14 PM Rating: Default
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KujaKoF wrote:
Simool wrote:
I wonder why SE doesn't just make it so you cannot sell items in wards not designed for them? I mean...that would eliminate the garbage...but would also increase the numbers of bazaars. It would also force people to buy more retainers if they like using that system.

Just a thought...not sure I've seen anyone propose that idea.

Mix that with a highly taxed AH(for items not in the Wards)...that may work for shoppers and lazy AH people.


because their initial vision didnt even have ward divisions. Because they still want you to be able to buy complementary items that may not be sold in the same ward (such as repair items with the weapon it goes with).


Actually, with a proper search engine (also they said they would highlight the retainers with the searched item in his/her bazaar)and a decent response time for other characters to appear on your screen (this thing gotta be fixed some day, that's pathetic), it would be easier with just one ward.
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#72 Dec 21 2010 at 3:17 PM Rating: Decent
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Going to be massively disappointed if the the Item Search for Market Wards is all there is to this update.


My main class is alchemist. There are zero lvl 30 leves and only one lvl 35 leve, which obviously doesn't pop every reset (I've been told there is one lvl 30 leve but I've never seen it and I've been to all 3 cities every reset and not seen one.
#73 Dec 21 2010 at 3:59 PM Rating: Decent
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marsupialboy wrote:
"A search option that tells players how many items of a certain type are being sold in the market area with which that item type is associated."
So am I reading this correctly, in that if people don't have their Retainer in the proper ward, then the search wont show any results? ie ...if everyone selling crystals/shards are in the battlecraft ward still instead of the crystal ward, then 0 results found?


Agree with this , its pretty much the same tough i had which kinda sucks that "players" are going to keep putting their items in the wrong place and 0/zero results will be shown ...thanks for nothing SE.
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#74 Dec 21 2010 at 4:04 PM Rating: Default
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"Hydragyrum
Wouldn't that be great? Finally real incentive to use the proper wards!"


what about those players who would like to sell more than 5 things and of different Proffesions then that screams give us 5 retainers ?? , why wouldn't they implement a AH from the start sigh.
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#75 Dec 21 2010 at 4:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Mitsubashibashi wrote:
Going to be massively disappointed if the the Item Search for Market Wards is all there is to this update.


My main class is alchemist. There are zero lvl 30 leves and only one lvl 35 leve, which obviously doesn't pop every reset (I've been told there is one lvl 30 leve but I've never seen it and I've been to all 3 cities every reset and not seen one.


really? no level 30 leves?
i got one yesterday in uldah, on beseid server for alchemy
and ive seen a 40 pop too, the problem is the lower level ones pop so often you never see the higher one
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#76 Dec 21 2010 at 4:06 PM Rating: Good
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LauroS wrote:
marsupialboy wrote:
"A search option that tells players how many items of a certain type are being sold in the market area with which that item type is associated."
So am I reading this correctly, in that if people don't have their Retainer in the proper ward, then the search wont show any results? ie ...if everyone selling crystals/shards are in the battlecraft ward still instead of the crystal ward, then 0 results found?


Agree with this , its pretty much the same tough i had which kinda sucks that "players" are going to keep putting their items in the wrong place and 0/zero results will be shown ...thanks for nothing SE.


I'm confused by your sentiments. It almost seems that you want to have to search through every ward just to find 1 item. With the new search feature you can be sure anyone selling a highly sought after item will be in the correct ward so their retainer shows up on the search. If you want to buy a Marmot pelt, why would you care that the retainers in Battlecraft are ignored? There will be plenty for sale in the correct ward.
#77 Dec 23 2010 at 10:27 AM Rating: Decent
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I think the lack of an AH house was to prevent 3rd party apps and RMT's from controlling the market. Once they apply the search function this will leave the same hole if there was one. It's hard for a game to admit a mistake, although ffxiv just did admit there was problems with the initial game launching software. So now admit there should have been an AH and do it. Even with retainers you have to manage, exchange items etc while an AH would eliminate that. Many of us have full time jobs, families, etc, and time is a premium. User friendly is a large part of WOW's success, if FFXIV could combine user friendliness and the challenges and broad scope of FFXI they would have a winner. IMHOP.
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