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Should I be looking into a better VC or a new processor?Follow

#1 Dec 28 2010 at 6:34 AM Rating: Decent
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I'm running on 4 GB of RAM, 64bit windows 7, processor's intel(R) core (TM)2 DUO CPU E8400@3.00 GHz 3.00GHz.
Currently I have a GeForce GTS 250 with 1GB physical memory. I upgraded into this card just for XIV.

I also retired the old HD which seemed to improve the FPS considerably.
I'm still running the game with standar settings and without all the whistles on though.

Ambient Occlusion no, depth of field yes, texture quality high, filtering high, multisampling 4x msass, general draing 8 (standar), background drawing 3 (standar), shadow detail high.

Usually windowed at 1440x900 so I can still look at my other windows.


After calling off my vacation plans I ended up with a little something something in my pocket. So I was considering another upgrade. I was thinking a motherboard and processor upgrade would be the next step, but do you think it'd be best to get a better videocard instead of a new processor in order to see an increase in performance on XIV?

Edited, Dec 28th 2010 7:35am by MajidahSihaam
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#2 Dec 28 2010 at 6:59 AM Rating: Decent
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3.0ghz is already pretty close to the best you're gonna get. I got 3.2ghz for the game and it's not bad. According to the specs I found for your graphics card it has 738MHz core speed which is nice. FFXIV runs well in the 1100MHz memory speed range and yours has up to 2200MHz. You might be able to overclock over 2200MHz safely with what you have but I would look around before cranking it up that much. The software RivaTuner is appropriate for what you have. If that doesn't work out then a new graphics card would be cool. As for CPU I'd look for something you can overclock as well, but that's up to you.





Edited, Dec 28th 2010 8:04am by Creepygiggles
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#3 Dec 28 2010 at 7:01 AM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
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They're both pretty limiting. The GTS 250 isn't all that bad, but would be the easier one to replace. You'll see an increase in performance and the gap between lower and higher resolutions will be less significant, but the CPU will still hold you back somewhat.
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#4 Dec 28 2010 at 7:14 AM Rating: Decent
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Might as well ask my question now:

I have a MacbookPro 13inch laptop - top of line specs for 13inch. Specs as follows:

RAM - 4 gig
NVidia 9400M (m stands for mobile I guess)
Windows 7 - 64bit

FFXIV runs super slow (my character seems to lag)... and I set most settings to low except drawing quality a bit higher (8 - standard).

How can I improve performance on the MBP? It works totally fine on an iMac running bootcamp with lower specs... but using winXP.

Should I use Windows XP 32-bit instead of windows 7 64-bit?

Edited, Dec 28th 2010 8:15am by odinpingpong
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#5 Dec 28 2010 at 7:20 AM Rating: Good
I had a an e5200 Core 2 Duo OC'd to 3.3ghz, and it was severely bottle necking my GPU (which is a GTX 460). Now I realize the FSB and cache are higher on your CPU, but it could still be limiting your GPU. I agree with bsphil, you could probably upgrade the GTS (and still keep it for some physx if you have an additional PCI-E slot), and see how that goes. There were some sales here after christmas for GTX 460's and such for about 140$ which is not a bad price.

The issue once you upgrade, is that your CPU might limit the GPU. I upgraded from my e5200 to a q9550 (Core 2 Quad), it helped so much that my video card was actually performing fully, and over heating my PC. Of course, it's hard to tell what will happen cause your E8400 is a better CPU than my E5200. From what I'm seeing, the GTS 250 is lower in the GPU rankings then my old GTX 260. That card performed OK with XIV, but was nothing great.

So if you decide to upgrade the GPU, and it runs FFXIV well, great! You've only spent 150$ (or whatever you're willing to spend on a GPU). On the other hand, if you don't get a huge performance increase, you're being limited by your CPU and need to consider upgrading that. That's where things get a little tricky, you can either go for the new motherboard, ram and CPU combo (for the core i7 series), OR simply try and find a used Core 2 quad (q9450, q9550 or q9650). The q series new are now running in the 300$+ here in Canada, quite a bit cheaper in the states though.

I chose to upgrade simply for a q9550 for 190$ as it gave me the performance I wanted out of XIV (which is pretty close to maxed out), and spend my money on a new case and PSU. If you're in the states you can probably get a decent ram, mobo, cpu combo for a good price. So really, it all depends what you're looking to spend, and how much future proofness you want out of your PC. Most people here will probably tell you that going the Core i7 route is probably the way to go as it will last you much longer. That being said, I'm sure my q9550 will last awhile, especially if I stick to XIV or similar games.

Anyways, that's it for my rant. I'd just listen to bsphil for now and grab a new GPU and see where that takes you.
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#6 Dec 28 2010 at 8:58 AM Rating: Default
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Save the $$ and overclock your current CPU. With the stock heat sink, you should be able to get that C2D up to 3.3-3.4GHz. Also, if you really don't need to run in window mode, use full screen. It will eat up less resources.

If you really want to buy something though, upgrade the CPU.
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#7 Dec 28 2010 at 9:06 AM Rating: Default
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Try looking in to a new game :D

















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#8 Dec 28 2010 at 9:45 AM Rating: Good
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odinpingpong wrote:
Specs as follows:

RAM - 4 gig
NVidia 9400M (m stands for mobile I guess)
Windows 7 - 64bit

How can I improve performance on the MBP? It works totally fine on an iMac running bootcamp with lower specs... but using winXP.

Should I use Windows XP 32-bit instead of windows 7 64-bit?


Changing operating systems won't help here, your video card is holding you back. That being the case, to improve performance use a different machine.


Edited, Dec 28th 2010 11:45am by Jefro420
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#9 Dec 28 2010 at 10:04 AM Rating: Decent
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odinpingpong wrote:
Might as well ask my question now:

I have a MacbookPro 13inch laptop - top of line specs for 13inch. Specs as follows:

RAM - 4 gig
NVidia 9400M (m stands for mobile I guess)
Windows 7 - 64bit

FFXIV runs super slow (my character seems to lag)... and I set most settings to low except drawing quality a bit higher (8 - standard).

How can I improve performance on the MBP? It works totally fine on an iMac running bootcamp with lower specs... but using winXP.

Should I use Windows XP 32-bit instead of windows 7 64-bit?

Edited, Dec 28th 2010 8:15am by odinpingpong



Since you didn't tell us what your CPU specs are, I'll just tell you that the nVidia 9400M is what is holding you back.

Also, if you use a 32-bit OS, you will not be able to use all 4GB of your system memory (RAM).
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#10 Dec 28 2010 at 10:24 AM Rating: Decent
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I'd say upgrade the processor first. The video card is a G92, which is still a very viable card that's strong enough to run the game at high settings (my 8800GT was running the game at 30-50 fps on high with AO, DoF, and AA off). You really don't have to upgrade to an i7 (only like 4-5 games really tax the CPU as much as FFXIV does), since even an old quad core will run the games perfectly well without bottlenecking a good card.

Obviously you'll get better FPS with an i7, and it will last you for a long while to come, but if you're just looking to upgrade your current chipset (775) to last a little longer and not looking into building a brand new PC (basically what you'll be doing if you get an i7, since you need to buy a new mobo, RAM, and probably PSU along with it), then a good quad will work wonders for you.

The Q9650 is still competing quite well against i7 processors in game performance, even with the new graphics cards. They're quite expensive though. A great cheap CPU would be a Q6600 which you could find for $80-140 on ebay and various tech forums' for sale sections. Comparing my home computer (i7 920, GTX 480) with my apartment computer (Q6600, GTX 460), the performance difference in-game isn't much different. The difference is less than 10 FPS average, and when you're determining the difference between 30-60 FPS and 40-60 FPS, the difference is negligible. The only time there will be a major difference is with large-scale first-person shooters where you need the higher FPS. My Q6600 runs BC2 at around 60-80 FPS while my i7 runs it at 90-115 FPS.
#11 Dec 28 2010 at 10:33 AM Rating: Default
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McDomination wrote:
odinpingpong wrote:
Might as well ask my question now:

I have a MacbookPro 13inch laptop - top of line specs for 13inch. Specs as follows:

RAM - 4 gig
NVidia 9400M (m stands for mobile I guess)
Windows 7 - 64bit

FFXIV runs super slow (my character seems to lag)... and I set most settings to low except drawing quality a bit higher (8 - standard).

How can I improve performance on the MBP? It works totally fine on an iMac running bootcamp with lower specs... but using winXP.

Should I use Windows XP 32-bit instead of windows 7 64-bit?

Edited, Dec 28th 2010 8:15am by odinpingpong



Since you didn't tell us what your CPU specs are, I'll just tell you that the nVidia 9400M is what is holding you back.

Also, if you use a 32-bit OS, you will not be able to use all 4GB of your system memory (RAM).


doesnt matter if he has a 32 bit os. most games are still 32 bit in nature. and most cant have 2 GB of System RAM Allocated to them anyways. i personally think anything over 4 gigs is stupid unless well you are playing you are browsing the internet and playing with photoshop all at the same time...
#12 Dec 28 2010 at 12:15 PM Rating: Decent
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MajidahSihaam wrote:
I'm running on 4 GB of RAM, 64bit windows 7, processor's intel(R) core (TM)2 DUO CPU E8400@3.00 GHz 3.00GHz.
Currently I have a GeForce GTS 250 with 1GB physical memory. I upgraded into this card just for XIV.


Moving up to a more modern CPU would help, but ultimately your GPU is going to be your bottleneck. The 200 series are just supped up 9000s, which are just supped up 8000s. So, you're still running a chipset basically from 4 years ago, I believe from November of 2006.

ironmonk25 wrote:
doesnt matter if he has a 32 bit os. most games are still 32 bit in nature. and most cant have 2 GB of System RAM Allocated to them anyways. i personally think anything over 4 gigs is stupid unless well you are playing you are browsing the internet and playing with photoshop all at the same time...


You're personally incorrect, and probably shouldn't try to comment on things you know nothing about. I can personally think of a situation in which even 24 GB of memory isn't enough for myself personally for music composition. Because you don't know of any uses of the higher cap doesn't mean they don't legitimately exist.

SoumaKyou wrote:
A great cheap CPU would be a Q6600 which you could find for $80-140 on ebay and various tech forums' for sale sections.


I don't recommend the Q6600, simply because it has had problems with heat dispersion (and the others of that die size series). The Q8300, which I just had to upgrade to (from the Q6600) is around the same price for a significantly higher FSB right out of the box.

Edited, Dec 28th 2010 1:20pm by StrijderVechter
#13 Dec 28 2010 at 12:30 PM Rating: Decent
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OP, Turn Depth of Field OFF and drop MSAA down to 2x (or No AA if it's still slow at 2x). Your system can not handle those bells and whistles. Update your GTS250 driver to the latest version at Nvidia.com. If it's still slow, download MSI Afterburner and overclock the GPU in small steps (it's much easier than Rivatuner for a beginner).
#14 Dec 28 2010 at 1:39 PM Rating: Decent
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Jefro420 wrote:
odinpingpong wrote:
Specs as follows:

RAM - 4 gig
NVidia 9400M (m stands for mobile I guess)
Windows 7 - 64bit

How can I improve performance on the MBP? It works totally fine on an iMac running bootcamp with lower specs... but using winXP.

Should I use Windows XP 32-bit instead of windows 7 64-bit?


Changing operating systems won't help here, your video card is holding you back. That being the case, to improve performance use a different machine.


Edited, Dec 28th 2010 11:45am by Jefro420


Thanks, I guess it's time to build a PC.
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#15 Dec 28 2010 at 1:49 PM Rating: Decent
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StrijderVechter wrote:
I don't recommend the Q6600, simply because it has had problems with heat dispersion (and the others of that die size series). The Q8300, which I just had to upgrade to (from the Q6600) is around the same price for a significantly higher FSB right out of the box.

Depends on which Q6600. The B3 stepping Q6600's ran stupid hot and usually topped out at about a 3.2GHz overclock on a really good cooler. The G0 stepping Q6600's could reach 3.6GHz easily with a decent cooler.

From my understanding, Q8300's don't overclock well in comparison, due to the lower FSB multiplier.

Q8300: 7.5x FSB Multiplier
Q6600: 9x FSB Multiplier

So you would need a much higher FSB speed to achieve on the Q8300 what you could on the Q6600, which makes the Q6600 the better processor.

Here's an example...

Q8300: 400MHz FSB x 7.5 Multiplier = 3000MHz
Q6600: 400MHz FSB x 9 Multiplier = 3600MHz

That's a 600MHz difference in clock speed, which is more than enough for the Q6600 to noticeably outperform a Q8300. ****, it's probably enough for a Q6600 to power a GTX 480 without a bottleneck.

Although, if OP isn't planning to OC their rig, then the Q8300 would be the better choice. Overall though, the difference in either is minimal. Regardless, the Q6600 is ridiculously cheap and comparable to an i5 in game performance.

Edited, Dec 28th 2010 3:09pm by SoumaKyou
#16 Dec 28 2010 at 3:05 PM Rating: Decent
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By the way any tips on where to buy the parts for new PCs, or any good guides on how I should go about it?

Thanks in advance.
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#17 Dec 28 2010 at 3:07 PM Rating: Decent
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StrijderVechter wrote:
ironmonk25 wrote:
doesnt matter if he has a 32 bit os. most games are still 32 bit in nature. and most cant have 2 GB of System RAM Allocated to them anyways. i personally think anything over 4 gigs is stupid unless well you are playing you are browsing the internet and playing with photoshop all at the same time...


You're personally incorrect, and probably shouldn't try to comment on things you know nothing about. I can personally think of a situation in which even 24 GB of memory isn't enough for myself personally for music composition. Because you don't know of any uses of the higher cap doesn't mean they don't legitimately exist.


Edited, Dec 28th 2010 1:20pm by StrijderVechter


Wow not only can you not read, but you are an idiot. did i say hey ALL programs cant allocate more then 2 gigs or did i say most? im pretty sure i said most. and as i also said most games are still 32 bit in nature....prove me wrong there...please. i should have said in a gaming rig i think anything over 4 gigs is stupid...for idiots like you, who cant read in between then lines.
#18 Dec 28 2010 at 3:11 PM Rating: Decent
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odinpingpong wrote:
By the way any tips on where to buy the parts for new PCs, or any good guides on how I should go about it?

Thanks in advance.


for you i will give you advice to build a great computer for cheap. go on craigslist and look around for cheap gaming pcs, try to get one that already has a good mobo and ram and cpu. try to get one that is quad core. you can always OC them. do not worry about the gpu, should be around300-400 bucks. it will save you a lot of money that way, then you can spend the other 100-400 on a graphics card.

going this route i built a pc that has a amd phenon II quad core OCed to 4.0 ghz, 4 gigs of ram, radeon 5870, 750wat power supple, coolermaster tower. and a MSI 790 fx mobo for 900 dollars.
#19 Dec 28 2010 at 3:17 PM Rating: Good
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ironmonk25 wrote:
odinpingpong wrote:
By the way any tips on where to buy the parts for new PCs, or any good guides on how I should go about it?

Thanks in advance.


for you i will give you advice to build a great computer for cheap. go on craigslist and look around for cheap gaming pcs, try to get one that already has a good mobo and ram and cpu. try to get one that is quad core. you can always OC them. do not worry about the gpu, should be around300-400 bucks. it will save you a lot of money that way, then you can spend the other 100-400 on a graphics card.

going this route i built a pc that has a amd phenon II quad core OCed to 4.0 ghz, 4 gigs of ram, radeon 5870, 750wat power supple, coolermaster tower. and a MSI 790 fx mobo for 900 dollars.

For $900 you could buy all the parts on newegg.com brand new and not inherit someone else's problems.

Edited, Dec 28th 2010 4:18pm by Jefro420
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#20 Dec 28 2010 at 3:31 PM Rating: Good
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A rig with the following parts comes to about $850 on newegg, it would certainly do the job



COOLER MASTER Centurion 5 CAC-T05-UW Black Aluminum Bezel , SECC Chassis ATX Mid Tower Computer Case

Seagate Barracuda ES.2 ST31000340NS 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive

ASUS M4A87TD EVO AM3 AMD 870 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard

EVGA 768-P3-1362-AR GeForce GTX 460 (Fermi) Superclocked 768MB 192-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video ...

CORSAIR XMS3 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model CMX4GX3M2A1600C9

AMD Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition Deneb 3.4GHz Socket AM3 125W Quad-Core Processor HDZ965FBGMBOX

iStarUSA TC-500PD8 500W Single PS2 ATX High Efficiency Switching Server Power Supply - OEM
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#21 Dec 28 2010 at 3:32 PM Rating: Decent
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So...

Motherboard
CPU Unit
Graphics Card
RAM
DVD Drive
Computer Case (comes with fan + outlet)

Anything else I need?

edit.... thanks Jefro, I just saw your post.

Edited, Dec 28th 2010 4:33pm by odinpingpong
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#22 Dec 28 2010 at 3:39 PM Rating: Good
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odinpingpong wrote:
So...

Motherboard
CPU Unit
Graphics Card
RAM
DVD Drive
Computer Case (comes with fan + outlet)

Anything else I need?

edit.... thanks Jefro, I just saw your post.


lol, I missed a dvd drive in my list, you may want to add a hard drive to your list unless you are re-using one. Also, I would consider an aftermarket CPU cooler even if you don't plan to overclock, but it's not absolutely essential.
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#23 Dec 28 2010 at 3:50 PM Rating: Decent
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Oh yeah forgot about HD... so everything comes out to about $1k.

Worth it I guess b/c I'll be spending a lot of time playing this game.

I'm also going to try to overclock my MacbookPro GPU before I invest 1 grand, just found this thread about OClocking for Nvidia 9400m:
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=893740

I heard ATI was coming out with a new card in April and was hoping I could get the current top of the line Radeon for cheaper at that time.

Edited, Dec 28th 2010 4:51pm by odinpingpong
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#24 Dec 28 2010 at 3:50 PM Rating: Good
Other thing would be a Power Supply. Higher wattage isn't necessarily the only way to go, as Amps on the 12v rail are also important. I usually recommend a single rail over multi. Also, for an aftermarket cooler, I'd recommend the Corsair h50. It's water cooling, but all self contained with 0 maintenance, easy to install and you can usually find it for about 50$. You get great CPU temps with it, and it also hardly takes up any room.

Also, on the note about the PSU, Corsair tends to make their's with single rails with enough amps on the 12v.
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#25 Dec 28 2010 at 3:56 PM Rating: Good
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for a power supply, I picked up one of these recently and am extremely pleased with it, but it adds a decent chunk of change to the price.

http://www.ocztechnology.com/products/power-supplies/high-performance/ocz-750w-fatal1ty-series-power-supply.html
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#26 Dec 28 2010 at 3:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Jefro420 wrote:
A rig with the following parts comes to about $850 on newegg, it would certainly do the job



COOLER MASTER Centurion 5 CAC-T05-UW Black Aluminum Bezel , SECC Chassis ATX Mid Tower Computer Case

Seagate Barracuda ES.2 ST31000340NS 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive

ASUS M4A87TD EVO AM3 AMD 870 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard

EVGA 768-P3-1362-AR GeForce GTX 460 (Fermi) Superclocked 768MB 192-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video ...

CORSAIR XMS3 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model CMX4GX3M2A1600C9

AMD Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition Deneb 3.4GHz Socket AM3 125W Quad-Core Processor HDZ965FBGMBOX

iStarUSA TC-500PD8 500W Single PS2 ATX High Efficiency Switching Server Power Supply - OEM


Personally, I would go for an AMD card with AMD cpu, especially when you don't have an aftermarket heatsink... when I OC my 965 to 3.9~4.0GHz and play XIV, my CPU temp was around 46 degree, that's with an aftermarket heatsink. Personally, I would get an HD5770 or 6870 if budget is allowed.

Also for power supply, I'm not familiar with iStarUSA, but I would go for some name brand such as OCZ and pick one with 80+. Rosewill is a pretty good brand too, and their price is very reasonable.

edit:
After reading the specs...I actually have a couple more suggestion

Case: I would suggest Rosewill Smart One ATX Mid Tower Computer Case, it comes with 3 fans, one in the front, one in the back and one on the top and it's cheaper than the cooler master one on the list.

HDD: This is only personal preference, I would suggest WD over Seagate.


Edited, Dec 28th 2010 5:08pm by dunlag
#27 Dec 28 2010 at 4:08 PM Rating: Good
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dunlag wrote:


Personally, I would go for an AMD card with AMD cpu, especially when you don't have an aftermarket heatsink... when I OC my 965 to 3.9~4.0GHz and play XIV, my CPU temp was around 46 degree, that's with an aftermarket heatsink. Personally, I would get an HD5770 or 6870 if budget is allowed.

Also for power supply, I'm not familiar with iStarUSA, but I would go for some name brand such as OCZ and pick one with 80+. Rosewill is a pretty good brand too, and their price is very reasonable.

I just haven't had great experiences with ATI, so I don't recommend them. But to each their own.
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#28 Dec 28 2010 at 4:13 PM Rating: Decent
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Jefro420 wrote:
dunlag wrote:


Personally, I would go for an AMD card with AMD cpu, especially when you don't have an aftermarket heatsink... when I OC my 965 to 3.9~4.0GHz and play XIV, my CPU temp was around 46 degree, that's with an aftermarket heatsink. Personally, I would get an HD5770 or 6870 if budget is allowed.

Also for power supply, I'm not familiar with iStarUSA, but I would go for some name brand such as OCZ and pick one with 80+. Rosewill is a pretty good brand too, and their price is very reasonable.

I just haven't had great experiences with ATI, so I don't recommend them. But to each their own.


I see, I only recommend them because of the CPU. Nvidia's card seems much hotter than AMD's card and AMD's cpu is much hotter than Intel's, so with AMD cpu, I usually recommend AMD card. Also, some AM3 socket mobo only supports AMD's crossfire, but not SLI, I think M4A87TD evo is one of them, so just in case OP wanna do CF some time in the future, that can ensure his mobo can support it.
#29 Dec 28 2010 at 4:19 PM Rating: Decent
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AMD really can't beat Intel's i7's in terms of performance if he's looking to build a brand new PC. Nvidia's also got the GPU market locked down in terms of performance over ATI for this generation of GPU's, but that's entirely dependent on whether or not Nvidia can release an actual driver that releases all of the power hidden in the Fermi chipset. Right now, ATI's got the advantage due only to superior driver compatibility.

As far as PSU goes, nothing really beats the Corsair line. They're among the most efficient, and are generally underrated by the manufacturer (a VX450 could run at 500w without much trouble).
#30 Dec 28 2010 at 4:25 PM Rating: Good
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SoumaKyou wrote:
AMD really can't beat Intel's i7's in terms of performance if he's looking to build a brand new PC.
While I certainly understand that, my suggestion was meant as a "bang for the buck" solution. With the i7 range being twice the price of the AMD i listed (or more in some cases) I can't really recommend them.

The AMD Phenom II 965 black is more than enough processor for this game. I have one and I have two other friends that have them, all of our rigs run this game flawlessly.

Edited, Dec 28th 2010 5:27pm by Jefro420
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#31 Dec 28 2010 at 4:31 PM Rating: Decent
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SoumaKyou wrote:
Nvidia's also got the GPU market locked down in terms of performance over ATI for this generation of GPU's, but that's entirely dependent on whether or not Nvidia can release an actual driver that releases all of the power hidden in the Fermi chipset. Right now, ATI's got the advantage due only to superior driver compatibility.


So NVidia has better hardware, but b/c of the drivers ATI is actually better performance right now?
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#32 Dec 28 2010 at 4:38 PM Rating: Good
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They are just rebadged Seasonics...pretty much the best there is.

With regards to the OP or anyone else trying to decide whether to upgrade video card or processor. Configure your settings for good gameplay, then set FFXIV to run in Windowed mode, start the game up in a city, then use your video driver software to see how hard the video card is being pushed, and use task manager to see how hard your processor is being pushed. This is an easy way to find your bottleneck.

The E8400 will benefit from upgrading, but so will the GTX 250....
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#33 Dec 28 2010 at 4:42 PM Rating: Good
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odinpingpong wrote:
SoumaKyou wrote:
Nvidia's also got the GPU market locked down in terms of performance over ATI for this generation of GPU's, but that's entirely dependent on whether or not Nvidia can release an actual driver that releases all of the power hidden in the Fermi chipset. Right now, ATI's got the advantage due only to superior driver compatibility.


So NVidia has better hardware, but b/c of the drivers ATI is actually better performance right now?

That's pretty much the consensus.
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#34 Dec 28 2010 at 5:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Jefro420 wrote:
While I certainly understand that, my suggestion was meant as a "bang for the buck" solution. With the i7 range being twice the price of the AMD i listed (or more in some cases) I can't really recommend them.

The AMD Phenom II 965 black is more than enough processor for this game. I have one and I have two other friends that have them, all of our rigs run this game flawlessly.

Edited, Dec 28th 2010 5:27pm by Jefro420



Can I ask you what's your avg FPS?

The reason I ask is because I'm also running the game with 965, I OC'd it to 3.7GHz (from bios), and if I want, I can easily take it to 4.0GHz with AMD's overdrive. My video card is HD5870, running the game at full screen mode, 8X AA, no DoF, no CC, everything else set to max. My FPS is usually 2x~3x, very seldom pass 40. When my character is running, it seemed like there's a little lag, but if used first person view to run, it's very smooth. So I'm wondering if I'm setting something wrong.
#35 Dec 28 2010 at 5:20 PM Rating: Good
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Jefro420 wrote:
SoumaKyou wrote:
AMD really can't beat Intel's i7's in terms of performance if he's looking to build a brand new PC.
While I certainly understand that, my suggestion was meant as a "bang for the buck" solution. With the i7 range being twice the price of the AMD i listed (or more in some cases) I can't really recommend them.

The AMD Phenom II 965 black is more than enough processor for this game. I have one and I have two other friends that have them, all of our rigs run this game flawlessly.

True, the i7's are definitely more costly than AMD's. AMD's are solid CPU's, no doubt about it, but when it comes to games like this and BC2 -- games that are really heavy on the CPU -- there really is no comparison in performance. I'd care to wager at least a 10-15 FPS difference with the same exact hardware configuration outside of Mobo + CPU, in favor of Intel. Then again, that's entirely dependent on whether you're an obsessive-compulsive FPS enthusiast like me, or the average gamer, to whom 10-15 FPS might not matter as long as it's perfectly playable. In that case, yeah, I'd definitely go the AMD route.

odinpingpong wrote:
So NVidia has better hardware, but b/c of the drivers ATI is actually better performance right now?

Pretty much.

ATI's cards are running at 90-100% GPU usage across the board on every single modern game as far as I know. This means they're running at their optimum potential because they're rendering the game software properly.

GTX 400 Fermi cards are pretty much getting stomped because the drivers are only utilizing anywhere between 30-60% GPU usage, which makes them perform no better -- and sometimes worse -- than an 8800GT or GTX 260, which leads people to the false assumption that they're experiencing a CPU bottleneck. This really isn't the case, because even i7 CPU's have this issue, and there's no way in **** a GTX 460 is gonna bottleneck an i7.

So Nvidia needs to get on the ball with drivers, because if you've ever seen a Fermi card's full capabilities, you're gonna wonder how the **** a card like that could ever run any game terribly.
#36 Dec 28 2010 at 7:53 PM Rating: Decent
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i suggest changing the processer first. i also had a core 2 duo with a hd 5770 gpu and was benchmarking 2700. changing to an i7-950 boosted that to 4700, with my next purchase going to be the hd 6990 released Q1 of next year.

im not going to lie, the easiest upgrade you can do right now is buy a new gpu, because getting an i7 your also going to need DDR3 ram, and a new motherboard.

if your interested in upgrading, i bought an i7-950: ebay ~279$
dx58s0 motherboard (2 pci-e slots for 2 cards if you want): ebay ~259$
crucial ddr3 1333 mhz ram: ebay ~80$ (for this i actually recomend 1600 mhz ram for overclocking purposes)

if you have the money to throw down change the cpu + board + ram and buy a 5770. the 5770 is low end and is a pretty good card for it's cost.

now just in case anyone makes the same mistake as i did, changing the mobo means you MUST also re-install windows.

hope this helps.
#37 Dec 28 2010 at 8:13 PM Rating: Decent
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If you go for a video card watch out for bottlenecking, you wont be able to up the settings as much as your video card may have the potential for, if you get something mid-high end anyway.

Someone threw in a suggestion for the 5770, not a bad card if your just looking for a better frame rate.

FFXI has an impressive range from its recommended specs to its maximum potential.

If your gonna upgrade your processor it would be wise to also get a new mobo and new DDR3 ram, even if you use solid budget parts it'll still run you about 300.
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