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The market ward system is usable nowFollow

#1 Dec 29 2010 at 3:36 PM Rating: Good
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I'm quite serious.

I walk in, pick the ward that contains what I'm looking for, star the retainers that have it and I go get it.

The only failing in the system is that I the items might simply not be there, an issue that would be rectified by either merging some of the market wards with other wards or by making the search function global through all the wards instead of just the ward where the goods SHOULD be posted. Alternatively, adding more retainers slots would also be a huge help as it would allow players to cover more territory to post goods in the appropriate wards.

So yeah, a global search would be great, but I can at least USE the wards now.
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#2 Dec 29 2010 at 3:46 PM Rating: Default
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This is old news, but being that you seemed to have just noticed today, did you know SE gave us a second retainer slot?
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#3 Dec 29 2010 at 3:49 PM Rating: Decent
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Jefro420 wrote:
This is old news, but being that you seemed to have just noticed today, did you know SE gave us a second retainer slot?


Yes, I've been enjoying my 2nd retainer since we were given one, but having the option to have more would still be extremely helpful, especially a means in-game instead of paying more each month for additional retainers (once the functionality is implemented, I mean).

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#4 Dec 29 2010 at 3:58 PM Rating: Good
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TheRealDestian wrote:
Jefro420 wrote:
This is old news, but being that you seemed to have just noticed today, did you know SE gave us a second retainer slot?


Yes, I've been enjoying my 2nd retainer since we were given one, but having the option to have more would still be extremely helpful, especially a means in-game instead of paying more each month for additional retainers (once the functionality is implemented, I mean).


I doubt they will do that because of the extra inventory space. 100 extra inventory slots is a lot to give away all willy-nilly. If they gave us too much inventory space, I think it could negatively affect the economy.

Edited, Dec 29th 2010 4:59pm by Jefro420
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#5 Dec 29 2010 at 4:34 PM Rating: Excellent
It seems most servers are using U'lDah as a central ward, so if you can't find anything... go there.

Having said that, it leaves a major profit opportunity for any one who can corner Grid and LL for certain items (shards and such for sure as crafters tend to hang around the city that has their guild or npcs that sell important items. Then theres obviously gear, huge lack of gear everywhere but UlDah).

What I'm saying is, it works, but we're still relying on players to put their retainers in the correct ward and relying on players not to reward folks selling a whole inventory of incorrect goods or the cycle never ends.
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#6 Dec 29 2010 at 4:38 PM Rating: Excellent
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I never put a retainer into the market wards until search function... I've done it for 3 days now and I am netting like 100K a day profit on fairly low level goods. It is a fair bit of work but I am digging it. It is nice to rank up on stuff that nets me nice gil.
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#7 Dec 29 2010 at 4:47 PM Rating: Good
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Jefro420 wrote:
TheRealDestian wrote:
Jefro420 wrote:
This is old news, but being that you seemed to have just noticed today, did you know SE gave us a second retainer slot?


Yes, I've been enjoying my 2nd retainer since we were given one, but having the option to have more would still be extremely helpful, especially a means in-game instead of paying more each month for additional retainers (once the functionality is implemented, I mean).


I doubt they will do that because of the extra inventory space. 100 extra inventory slots is a lot to give away all willy-nilly. If they gave us too much inventory space, I think it could negatively affect the economy.

Edited, Dec 29th 2010 4:59pm by Jefro420


the space i have now is far too much lol. i think it would be wise of them to reduce space on retainers and possibly give one more. all tho i fear market ward lag. maybe restrict one per ward (not including same ward/dif nation). and honestly i think only finished goods and parts should be in market, items you collect off mobs should go to an AH. the items you collect off mobs just ranges so far it takes for ever to vendor them. or possibly an ah for low quantities of them (like limited postings... just like ah).

Edited, Dec 29th 2010 5:48pm by TempLoop
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#8 Dec 29 2010 at 6:05 PM Rating: Good
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Olorinus the Vile wrote:
I never put a retainer into the market wards until search function... I've done it for 3 days now and I am netting like 100K a day profit on fairly low level goods. It is a fair bit of work but I am digging it. It is nice to rank up on stuff that nets me nice gil.


I was putting them in, but finding items I needed for specific crafting was a NIGHTMARE.

Yesterday, however, I caught a guy selling rock salt on his retainer while he was still trading items with it. I had to pester him to get off the retainer so I could buy the item, heh...
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#9 Dec 29 2010 at 6:12 PM Rating: Good
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TempLoop wrote:
[quote=Jefro420]the space i have now is far too much lol. i think it would be wise of them to reduce space on retainers and possibly give one more. all tho i fear market ward lag. maybe restrict one per ward (not including same ward/dif nation). and honestly i think only finished goods and parts should be in market, items you collect off mobs should go to an AH. the items you collect off mobs just ranges so far it takes for ever to vendor them. or possibly an ah for low quantities of them (like limited postings... just like ah).


Seriously? I've still been filling them up as it is.

I'm taking it slow and leveling several crafts and I find I need to hang onto most of my items. One retainer holds all things mined (ore, nails, ingots, gems, etc.) and all animal products (bones, wings, leather, skins, horns, etc.) while the other holds everything else (reagents, wood, etc.).

I recently liquidated most of my weaving mats (my fiancee weaves now and she didn't need them, so I dropped them all on one retainer for sale in the Uldah clothier's ward) and I've already made 144k from simply posting them in the correct ward where people will go to find them.

I'd say give it time. I think people will figure out that posting the wrong items in the wrong places is a bad idea in time and stop doing it.
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#10 Dec 29 2010 at 6:28 PM Rating: Excellent
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I've been really shocked that low level items like copper buckles are selling. Unheard of! I finally have an actual use for my copper! Now if only those Brass Breastpins would move...
#11 Dec 29 2010 at 6:43 PM Rating: Good
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Ravashack wrote:
I've been really shocked that low level items like copper buckles are selling. Unheard of! I finally have an actual use for my copper! Now if only those Brass Breastpins would move...


Sadly, I'm still having a hard time moving my copper. Glad to hear it's working for you, though.
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#12 Dec 29 2010 at 7:01 PM Rating: Good
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TheRealDestian wrote:
by making the search function global through all the wards instead of just the ward where the goods SHOULD be posted.


Not really sure what you mean by global but what I get from this sentence is that if you use the search for lets say Iron Hatchet, and your saything that the red stars will only appear in the tradescraft ward, if you search for Iron Hatchet any ward you go in, in that city will display a red star over any retainer that has it. For example if you search Iron Hatchet and go into Battlecraft Ward there will be red stars above people that have them along with Tradescraft Ward, as well as any ward you go in, if a retainer has it. Also the number next to the item your searching for is the number of items in all wards in that city.

Edited, Dec 29th 2010 8:01pm by BluntzBlazin
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#13 Dec 29 2010 at 7:07 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
Also the number next to the item your searching for is the number of items in all wards in that city.


Pretty sure the number is for the items in the correct ward. Even if something I really want shows 0, I'll sometimes run the search anyway and try some other wards and find it. Memory isn't the greatest, but I think that's happened a few times. The red stars definitely show up in all wards, not just the correct one though...

Edited, Dec 29th 2010 8:08pm by TwistedOwl
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#14 Dec 29 2010 at 7:25 PM Rating: Good
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TwistedOwl wrote:
Quote:
Also the number next to the item your searching for is the number of items in all wards in that city.


Pretty sure the number is for the items in the correct ward. Even if something I really want shows 0, I'll sometimes run the search anyway and try some other wards and find it. Memory isn't the greatest, but I think that's happened a few times. The red stars definitely show up in all wards, not just the correct one though...

Edited, Dec 29th 2010 8:08pm by TwistedOwl


Ahh, I did not know this...

It'd still be nice if you could search for an item across all wards, though I'll definitely try walking around other wards now (usually the one that gets stuffed with all the retainers :P ).
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#15 Dec 29 2010 at 7:36 PM Rating: Excellent
SE has said they'll be continually updating and improving the Market Ward system. We may very well see global listings by cities, or listings of items put in the "wrong" wards.

What we got with the recent patch is just the first implementation of the new system. With as much as they've been willing to take in player feedback lately, I would not be surprised to see these sorts of changes in the future.
#16 Dec 29 2010 at 7:41 PM Rating: Good
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Osarion, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
SE has said they'll be continually updating and improving the Market Ward system. We may very well see global listings by cities, or listings of items put in the "wrong" wards.

What we got with the recent patch is just the first implementation of the new system. With as much as they've been willing to take in player feedback lately, I would not be surprised to see these sorts of changes in the future.


I'm just happy that, as a basic functionality, it works.

It's now entirely possible to find the item I was looking for within minutes instead of searching all over the place in the slim chance I might find the thing on some random retainer.
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#17 Dec 29 2010 at 8:44 PM Rating: Good
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The best part of the changes isnt that you can search

its that people are, for the most part, using the correct ward now

i mean seriously, just look at how populated all the wards are compared to what they used to be.....people obviously want the search function to hit their items and that in itself is the biggest advantage to what has happened.


personaly, i dont think it needs to search the other wards, cuz then itl give people the impression they can jam into one ward again cuz itl tell people they are in that ward anyway. and even though you can find them, the massive loading in there is annoying as only a small portion of the retainers can load at a time when that happens.
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#18 Dec 29 2010 at 10:53 PM Rating: Default
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i mean seriously, just look at how populated all the wards are compared to what they used to be


Every time I go in the wards since the last Dec update, there is no retainers in them, including mine - because they crash all the time now.

The ward crashes right after I put my retainer up, and whenever I try to access a ward to find stuff to buy, that one happens to crash too ; ;
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#19 Dec 29 2010 at 10:57 PM Rating: Decent
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Gopi wrote:
Quote:
i mean seriously, just look at how populated all the wards are compared to what they used to be


Every time I go in the wards since the last Dec update, there is no retainers in them, including mine - because they crash all the time now.

The ward crashes right after I put my retainer up, and whenever I try to access a ward to find stuff to buy, that one happens to crash too ; ;


thats cuz something is bugged and causing them to crash(and i wouldnt doubt people doing it on purpose to get rid of competition if they know how)
something that im sure will be addressed in the next patch

but in general, the wards are populated more correctly is what im getting at
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#20 Dec 29 2010 at 11:12 PM Rating: Good
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PerrinofSylph, ****** Superhero wrote:
Having said that, it leaves a major profit opportunity for any one who can corner Grid and LL for certain items (shards and such for sure as crafters tend to hang around the city that has their guild or npcs that sell important items. Then theres obviously gear, huge lack of gear everywhere but UlDah).


Shhhh, stop giving away all our secrets. :)

In all seriousness, the current market ward setup offers tremendous money-making opportunities for someone with a little time to spend in them. More often than not, people just come in and throw things up for whatever price they like, rather than doing their homework to figure out what fair market value is for said items. In many cases, this means they list things for much less than what they may indeed be worth. For someone willing to take the time to work the wards, buying items below market value and reselling them at a profit represents a consistent source of income. While this would likely still be possible depending on how an AH were implemented, it would be nowhere near as lucrative.

The market wards are not ALL negative. There are some very positive aspects to them, if we as a community are willing to acknowledge them...
#21 Dec 29 2010 at 11:20 PM Rating: Decent
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It would be nice to see what price the items going for be for going in the ward and find out the item going for way more then you want to pay and still have to recheck all the retainers that have the item for a lower price
#22 Dec 29 2010 at 11:39 PM Rating: Decent
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Elswick78 wrote:
PerrinofSylph, ****** Superhero wrote:
Having said that, it leaves a major profit opportunity for any one who can corner Grid and LL for certain items (shards and such for sure as crafters tend to hang around the city that has their guild or npcs that sell important items. Then theres obviously gear, huge lack of gear everywhere but UlDah).


Shhhh, stop giving away all our secrets. :)

In all seriousness, the current market ward setup offers tremendous money-making opportunities for someone with a little time to spend in them. More often than not, people just come in and throw things up for whatever price they like, rather than doing their homework to figure out what fair market value is for said items. In many cases, this means they list things for much less than what they may indeed be worth. For someone willing to take the time to work the wards, buying items below market value and reselling them at a profit represents a consistent source of income. While this would likely still be possible depending on how an AH were implemented, it would be nowhere near as lucrative.

The market wards are not ALL negative. There are some very positive aspects to them, if we as a community are willing to acknowledge them...


yup, buying out your competition who don't have the time to determine the fair price their goods is awesome...
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#23 Dec 29 2010 at 11:52 PM Rating: Good
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KujaKoF wrote:
Elswick78 wrote:
PerrinofSylph, ****** Superhero wrote:
Having said that, it leaves a major profit opportunity for any one who can corner Grid and LL for certain items (shards and such for sure as crafters tend to hang around the city that has their guild or npcs that sell important items. Then theres obviously gear, huge lack of gear everywhere but UlDah).


Shhhh, stop giving away all our secrets. :)

In all seriousness, the current market ward setup offers tremendous money-making opportunities for someone with a little time to spend in them. More often than not, people just come in and throw things up for whatever price they like, rather than doing their homework to figure out what fair market value is for said items. In many cases, this means they list things for much less than what they may indeed be worth. For someone willing to take the time to work the wards, buying items below market value and reselling them at a profit represents a consistent source of income. While this would likely still be possible depending on how an AH were implemented, it would be nowhere near as lucrative.

The market wards are not ALL negative. There are some very positive aspects to them, if we as a community are willing to acknowledge them...


yup, buying out your competition who don't have the time to determine the fair price their goods is awesome...


There's nothing even remotely unfair or unethical about this. If I took them in a back room and put a baseball bat to their knees to force them to sell for a lower price (think the vice in "Casino"), THAT would be unfair. In this case they're being paid the exact price they're asking for the item. By very defenition, this means they're being paid the exact price the item is worth to them.

In an MMORPG, and even in life in general, time is a viable commodity. The profit I make on a transaction is a proximate result of the time I took; time which the original seller was unwilling to take, for whatever reason. A free-market economy is largely based upon this very principle...

Edited, Dec 30th 2010 1:02am by Elswick78
#24 Dec 29 2010 at 11:56 PM Rating: Decent
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I've seen a very dramatic reduction in the price of shards/crystals as a result (at least in part) of the updates to the wards. I've also found that certain items are extremely difficult to come by (see: buffalo hide) because they're in perpetually high demand and low supply. All in all I very much appreciate being able to cruise 5-6 wards in a few minutes to find out there's no buffalo hide to be had as opposed to taking 10 minutes/ward poking around to find the same thing. Still needs work, though. It's on the list.
#25 Dec 29 2010 at 11:58 PM Rating: Good
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Aurelius wrote:
I've seen a very dramatic reduction in the price of shards/crystals as a result (at least in part) of the updates to the wards. I've also found that certain items are extremely difficult to come by (see: buffalo hide) because they're in perpetually high demand and low supply. All in all I very much appreciate being able to cruise 5-6 wards in a few minutes to find out there's no buffalo hide to be had as opposed to taking 10 minutes/ward poking around to find the same thing. Still needs work, though. It's on the list.


i feel ya on the hides
but ive been lucky ernough to find many many more then usual with this change

**** i found someone with 10 stacks of them, for 3k a hide this morning(i couldnt believe it, he obviously didnt know the value or didnt care)
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#26 Dec 30 2010 at 12:01 AM Rating: Excellent
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I just would like to add that I too am having luck finding things and my opinion of the system is growing. However, my opinion is skewed because I have TONS of free time right now, we'll see how I feel next week...

On the matter of 'cornering markets' it only sucks when people are getting paid to do it, i.e. fraudulently.

If someone wants to spend their opportunity cost on 'market trading' then more power to them. They'll only get the maximum of what people are willing to pay and nothing more. Given that there is usually infinite supply of most items (obtainable in different ways) I really don't see it a big deal.
#27 Dec 30 2010 at 12:02 AM Rating: Decent
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Vedis wrote:
Aurelius wrote:
I've seen a very dramatic reduction in the price of shards/crystals as a result (at least in part) of the updates to the wards. I've also found that certain items are extremely difficult to come by (see: buffalo hide) because they're in perpetually high demand and low supply. All in all I very much appreciate being able to cruise 5-6 wards in a few minutes to find out there's no buffalo hide to be had as opposed to taking 10 minutes/ward poking around to find the same thing. Still needs work, though. It's on the list.


i feel ya on the hides
but ive been lucky ernough to find many many more then usual with this change

**** i found someone with 10 stacks of them, for 3k a hide this morning(i couldnt believe it, he obviously didnt know the value or didnt care)


I found one retainer this morning with 2 hides for 6k each. I thought I did pretty well on that one. Then I found another retainer with a stack for 30k (2.5k gil each). That made me happy. Then I realized I was out of shards and said **** it. I still bought the hides for later use but at the end of the day it just goes to show that fixing the central exchange (in whole or in part) isn't going to fix the game. Not by a long shot.
#28 Dec 30 2010 at 12:05 AM Rating: Decent
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Yea, they are actually functional and facilitate the bazaar system very well, but I still see ridiculous variations in prices and I get undercut constantly. It is annoying how hard it is to judge an item's worth, and how easy it is to get ripped off, and for people to just buy out their competitors.
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#29 Dec 30 2010 at 12:17 AM Rating: Good
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Kierk wrote:
If someone wants to spend their opportunity cost on 'market trading' then more power to them. They'll only get the maximum of what people are willing to pay and nothing more. Given that there is usually infinite supply of most items (obtainable in different ways) I really don't see it a big deal.


After considering the comments left here in response to my initial post, I feel I need to clarify something. I do not use this method as a vehicle to drive prices higher. I relist them at fair market value. I will give an example of my latest "find" to illustrate. Someone had listed three stacks of lightning shards at 40 gil apiece. I do not know the reasoning behind this low price, but it is not my concern either. They wanted 40 gil per shard, and they got it. I then relisted these shards at 225 gil apiece, which is at or even slightly below fair market value for lightning shards on my server. Perhaps my moral compass is skewed, but I don't feel this is unethical.

For the record, I believe "cornering the market" and maintaining a monopoly on a given item is unfair, and I do not engage in this behavior.
#30 Dec 30 2010 at 12:32 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'm liking the new search too, people are actually putting their retainers in the proper wards now. However, I ran into a small side effect of that just now. It seems that the Middle Tailors Row in Ul'dah on Rab is at capacity. I tried to summon my retainer there to sell my wares, and I got a message saying that no more retainers could be summoned in that area. I realize I could stick him in another city, but it seems that Ul'dah is the main hub these days. Meh, probably a minor complaint but it bugs me that I can't sell there for the time being.
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#31 Dec 30 2010 at 1:18 AM Rating: Good
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I've been really shocked that low level items like copper buckles are selling. Unheard of! I finally have an actual use for my copper! Now if only those Brass Breastpins would move...
I've bought low level items such as copper buckles before as they're used for weaving. Some people, such as myself, prefer to buy lower level items rather than craft them themselves because they would rather focus on a handful of crafts. Also saves on the inventory space needed for things like ore or ingots. Nothing wrong with that, and it gives even lower level crafters a way to make a little money, or at least reduce any losses.

Refreshing to see such positive attitudes towards the ward system now. Hopefully it will continue to expand and improve.
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