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EDITORIAL: FFXIV Poll Raises QuestionsFollow

#1 Jan 03 2011 at 10:50 PM Rating: Excellent
Hey all,

Like many others, I eagerly awaited a New Year's Day update about the near future of Final Fantasy XIV. When I saw the Player's Poll on the Lodestone Web site, I was somewhat dismayed.

Read why in this week's editorial.

I'm all for the development team listening to us. And I'm a big-time advocate of communication. Given the fragile state of the game, though, wouldn't it be more prudent for developers to tell us what their primary goals are? They already know what we want, so what exactly does this poll accomplish?

And what exactly will we be rebooting?
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#2 Jan 03 2011 at 10:53 PM Rating: Good
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initial thought, it sounds like they don't know what they're doing yet.

I'm not really worried that there will be a reboot, character wipes, or anything of that nature. But I do think that we will see alot of major changes. It looks to me like FFXIV 1.0 wasn't working, and they are trying to see if they should struggle with tons of updates trying to fight for subs, of if they should take the leap and try out FFXIV 2.0. O predict we're going to see a NGE type move. If they'd planned on 'adjustments' getting their subs up, I think this survey is telling them not to bother.

I agree with you though, does not make me feel like logging in. I don't want to get involved with a game thats sitting in limbo. Then again I was rarely logging in as it was, because I had so many problems with the game.

Edited, Jan 3rd 2011 11:59pm by KujaKoF
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#3 Jan 03 2011 at 11:05 PM Rating: Good
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This is just a guess on my part, but I'm getting the impression they're trying to track differences in feedback by area, primarily.

Each feedback requires you to log in and although the questions are the same, it's a different page by region. And since you have to log in, that cuts down on the number of multiple surveys in case someone wanted to spam them over and over (although it won't get rid of it completely for those actually paying for more than one login...)

Given the questions they are asking, it also seems like they are trying to see if there are similarities in the opinions submitted. However, that is, again, just a guess.
#4 Jan 03 2011 at 11:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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I for one am actually feeling somewhat good about this. Should they have a clear direction for the game by now? I think most of us would give a resounding YES to that question. However with the game in the fragile state its in and the playerbase crying foul at every turn I think its a wise decision to have an official poll so players can give theyre input on something other than forums. Ultimately they cant please everyone and hard choices will have to be made. Collecting an official form of feedback before doing anything drastic is a step in the right direction. I checked yes to the question about making huge changes to the game because I believe it may be the last good chance to get things right. To me the game (as a whole) just doesnt work right now and I really want the game to succeed even if that means shutting down the servers and relaunching the game.
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#5 Jan 03 2011 at 11:29 PM Rating: Good
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I agree, it's very confusing Thayos.

Plus I'm still confused about the word "live." To live or die? Or we're live on camera?

Ultimately SE has heard of these complaints since beta; remember that on one of the questions it stated what we wanted to see FIRST, implying that things like an AH, and NPC quests were in the works.

However now I think Yoshida and his new team is covering their bases with this survey by judging the opinions of people who really care about the game (hence the question(s) how many FFs have you played and WHY are we still playing (the FF name)). WE are the ones still left, the ones who aren't vested have left or don't care, OUR opinion I think carries a bit more weight and perhaps Yoshida is banking on that to base his decision on.

The final question did throw me for a loop, kinda negating the entire survey. What do they mean about changes and why are they so cryptic about it. Yes, it draws questions about the integrity of ideas and compromise on ideals to appease a mass audience. But I believe that SE wants a bigger piece of the pie this time around and I think it looks like his team has been given the freedom to try some new things.

Although I'd be somewhat miffed if SE decided to start from scratch (more or less) and had to re-level a character, if it were a better game there'd be no hard feelings.
#6 Jan 03 2011 at 11:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think the poll was a smart move on SE's part. They can't read forums to find out what people want. Forums aren't representative of the majority of players and even if they were, the discussions on forums would be impossible for them to decipher even through an interpreter. Everything is a debate. Everything is an argument. And the motivations of the participants aren't always clear. A lot of the time, someone will argue against something they know nothing about because their ego is involved in a tangential way.

I've presented a couple of examples of this recently. Prior to beta, people mentioned that they liked what had been said about retainers because it sounded like the bazaar farms outside Jeuno. And a LOT of people agreed with them. But when it actually made it into XIV as a functionally identical concept minus the need to park your own character there, everyone hated it. So how is SE supposed to reconcile what people say with what they really mean? How can a developer tell the difference between someone who says they like a concept because they thought it was neat as a part of a bigger picture and someone who says they like a concept because they find merit in it as an isolated concept?

And you wouldn't have to look far even on these forums to find extended "debates" from people saying the grind in XI was awesome and if you don't like the grind you're lazy and all these people appreciate everything so much more when they have to work their asses off for it and...we get an inordinate grind in XIV and almost everyone is crying foul.

Would anyone really expect SE to try and sort through that and determine the majority consensus?

I was disappointed to see a survey instead of a plan, too. But at the end of the day when people are saying, "amg why doesn't the developer listen to us?!?!" what they're really saying is, "why doesn't the developer listen to ME?" And if they pull their head out long enough to realize that they're just one voice in the cacophony of conflicting opinions, they realize that this poll was actually probably one of the best things SE could have done. Ask some reasonable questions and restrict the answers so smartasses can't come along and just check every box and think they're helping, compile the data, and get to work.

My sense is that Yoshida saw an enormous project ahead of him to turn this sinking ship around. And after identifying what needed to be done, he put forward that poll largely to help prioritize what to move on first. And the final question was vague in terms of what they meant and it didn't have to be clear because it wasn't intended to provide US with an idea or a hint of what was going on. It was a clear question with a yes or no answer and provided SE with a more clear consensus from their players with regards to the potential backlash of a major overhaul.

Sometimes it's helpful to try and read between the lines to discover the concealed meaning. Sometimes it's fruitless. We got the survey, we responded to the survey, and now we wait (or not) for SE to communicate a plan.
#7 Jan 03 2011 at 11:37 PM Rating: Decent
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They could have polled the player base and announced a clear vision for their game and an aggressive content update schedule. They were not limited to one or the other.

The sad thing about the poll questions were that whenever multiple choices were offered, I kept thinking "All of the above, God **** it!" That SE, one of the largest and most storied game developers in history (if not the greatest, maybe a notch below Miyamoto and Nintendo) is dithering away the month of December and January without offering a clear plan for their game or concrete particulars regarding short-term content updates is the height of absurdity and completely mystifying. The bazaars are dying, the camps are empty, very few are communicating, and time is running out.

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#8 Jan 04 2011 at 12:24 AM Rating: Good
Aurelius, all I can say is impressive. Not trying to be sarcastic here but your post really did make me think a little about it. I gotta agree on all views there. Honestly I checked no for the drastic changes, even if I might welcome something big that could change FFXIV in a good way the rules already set forth I fully enjoy. The Armoury system, the elements of combat, market wards, they need a little tweaking maybe, but I like these.
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#9 Jan 04 2011 at 12:28 AM Rating: Good
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I think Yoshida has an idea of what he wants to do, but not a "clear vision" yet. I think the big guys gave him the keys to the car and said "get goin kiddo".

The more interesting questions on the survey were first couple.

Which online games have you played before?
I have never played an online game
Age of Conan: Rise of the Godslayer
Aion
Champions Online
City of Heroes / City of Villains
Dark Age of Camelot
Darkfall
Dungeons & Dragons Online
Everquest / Everquest II
EVE Online
FINAL FANTASY XI
Guild Wars
Lineage / Lineage II
Ragnarok Online
Star Wars Galaxies
The Lord of the Rings Online
Ultima Online
Vanguard: Saga of Heroes
Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning
World of Warcraft
Other (monthly-subscription based online game)
Other (online game with microtransactions)
Other (free online game)



Which forthcoming online games do you wish to play?
Blade & Soul
DC Universe Online
Guild Wars 2
Star Wars: The Old Republic
TERA The Exiled Realm of Arborea
The Agency
Other (monthly-subscription based online game)
Other (online game with microtransactions)
Other (free online game)
None


I don't think they are trying to find out what style of game we like, more what style of payment. Otherwise the last 3 options could have just been rolled up into a single "Other". This makes me more confident than ever that FFXIV will end up being F2P with micro-transactions, and a P2P subscription option for unlimited access.


Edited, Jan 4th 2011 1:29am by KristoFurwalken
#10 Jan 04 2011 at 12:38 AM Rating: Good
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Kristo Furwalken,

Great post and insight, and I tend to think that you're right, but I'm holding out hope.

Regarding the disincentive to play because of possible impending large-scale modifications to the game, gathering mats, equipment and gil might be the best option to inoculate oneself from making a bad time investment as opposed to level grinding. To state the obvious, things are plain and simply chaotic, and I feel bad for the masters out there such as Doctor Mog and Kilnaga who might end up watching that investment get flushed down the toilet.
#11 Jan 04 2011 at 1:31 AM Rating: Good
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In my opinion there weren't enough questions.

Ask me what games I play? Ok, now ask me why I play them instead of assuming. Ask us what we want. Questions like: Do you enjoy renting a chocobo or would you like having your own to be an integral part of the game. Should high level players be able to achieve the awesomeness of having their own personal flying machines? Or do you want to spend 30 minutes getting places again?

It's funny that they wouldn't give us neat things like that, but they built in this horrible teleport system.

Unless SE turns up the fun factor, I don't see this game going anywhere no matter what they do. There are just too many better games out now and coming out in the future. If you don't want to fly around on a dragon or something of that nature, then you're a boring person.

Oh yeah, and guildleaves suck. Big time. Do a poll on how rad people think they are. Stupid, retarded survey to see what game they should copy to make money.
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#12 Jan 04 2011 at 1:39 AM Rating: Default
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What they plan on by rebooting is the entire trashing of the game we love in order to attract people who hate the game
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#13 Jan 04 2011 at 1:44 AM Rating: Good
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The more I think about it, the more I feel the only meaningful question on there was the last one.

What did we play, what are we thinking of, everyone asks that in every MMO survey/beta application etc.
Any question with the term "most" used in it, seems like just kinda general feeler questions. they're going to do all of them. What would you like to see for lodestone I guess was something they can work on, but I pretty much see them doing all of the above.

But the last question, to me read "Would you like us to pull the trigger and remake this game." And the fact that they even asked it, makes me feel its more of a loaded "are you ok with us remaking this game"

Edited, Jan 4th 2011 2:45am by KujaKoF
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#14 Jan 04 2011 at 2:04 AM Rating: Decent
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Kuja,

Exactly why I answered in the negative on the last question. I actually like what we have, we just need more content. You know, like content that one might find in a ******* FINAL FANTASY game.

I still can't believe I'm speaking about a FINAL FANTASY game when discussing issues like this.
#15 Jan 04 2011 at 5:19 AM Rating: Excellent
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I hope everyone ticked Blade & Soul so bust and hip sizes get upgraded. God ****.

What is with this FFXIV reboot panic? Suppose SE did unmake the world or do whatever a "drastically altered rules of Eorzea" entails. I don't imagine any of us are particularly attached to the world since there is little in the game world to attach oneself to. The city-states can't distinguish themselves from one another beyond aesthetics, the gods are lore jargon, the main quest/Path of the Twelve is hit-or-miss (mostly miss), guild quests have quaint moments but lack a strong character like Shanttoto or Naja...

We really stand to lose nothing.

Or are you just worried you'll lose your character progress and have to grind more coblyns?
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#16 Jan 04 2011 at 5:55 AM Rating: Decent
Lets be logical for a second, SE re-vamped there dev team around the end of Nov, start of December. Now they made promises to deliver Nov and Dec updates, to keep there word the new dev team could NOT change much of the agreed updates due to time constraints so that means all of Nov/Dec updates were from the previous team save the market change which might have had further testing done to it (hence the split Dec updates) Add to that the festive holiday period, I doubt the new team have had any time to do anything new apart from a few brain storming sessions and general meetings. The poll is a chance for SE to hear there player base needs first hand not from a 3rd party website as that way they have a unbiased view of what needs improving first they also get the views straight away and don’t have to spend hours trawling through pages of forums looking for the “can I has AH” posts. Naoki Yoshida is customer focused so he isnt just gonna dive right in and start heading off in there own direction, with the results the new dev team can take the most important views on board and start working towards getting them completed. With the results they can build there own time table on getting things achieved and provide that to the playerbase as promises on updates, ones which they can keep.

Give them 1-2 weeks to go through the poll data, provide clear outlines on what is most important and a timetable of updates to match it.
#17 Jan 04 2011 at 6:24 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
4Gamer: I’d also like to ask, just how far reaching is the change? I’m assuming that there have been shifts in roles not listed on the Lodestone as well.

Yoshida: Well, you can’t expect to get great results just by adding more people or changing some out. However, the game contents are also not going to change much if you just replace the names at the top of your organization chart. What you really need is for each person on the staff to know what they need to be doing, meet their goals, and take care of the technology problems they come across. On top of that, you have to listen to the players and set priorities. Until you do those things, you can’t think about the pace of development or program accuracy. The other stuff comes first.
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#18 Jan 04 2011 at 6:57 AM Rating: Good
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He big announcement that they mentioned is encased in the riddle most likely . Se has done this in the past.

I honestly think that the poll was added to figure out where we wanted then to start first and not necessarily wanting to know what we want them t do. They already know that as by the answers in the poll questions, they have obviously have been listening
#19 Jan 04 2011 at 7:04 AM Rating: Good
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IlethiusTarraban wrote:
Add to that the festive holiday period, I doubt the new team have had any time to do anything new apart from a few brain storming sessions and general meetings.


Considering most of the Dev team lives in Japan, that is not an issue as Christmas is not a national holiday. It's just another work day.
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#20 Jan 04 2011 at 8:57 AM Rating: Decent
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I liked the way you wrote this editorial Thayos.
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#21 Jan 04 2011 at 9:09 AM Rating: Decent
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I wanted to see some answers, or some definite direction, so yeah I was a little bummed. I have actually been hoping for correlation in the forms of surveys though, so at the same time I think that it is pretty cool. I think surveys are more effective than forums to show where the players stand (e.g. if you went with the forums you would be convinced that most people want to restructure gameplay to make partying imperative, but I have a very hard time finding people who don't like the aspect of primarily soloing MMORPG in-game. Forums tend to only get the voice of the dissenting).

I hope they will feel confident enough to at least announce their list of priorities (perhaps time frames also) in the next little while.
#22 Jan 04 2011 at 12:35 PM Rating: Decent
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If there was a server wipe I will never buy another S.E. product again.

Edited, Jan 4th 2011 10:39am by Daggit
#23 Jan 04 2011 at 2:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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hehellfire wrote:

What they plan on by rebooting is the entire trashing of the game we love in order to attract people who hate the game


You have to ask yourself "why" do people hate the game though? This game has hemorrhaged subs since it launched while all sorts of other titles are breaking worldwide records. The fact of the matter is, without a strong subscriber base, Square Enix doesn't have a snowball's chance in **** of keeping this game afloat as well as FFXI. You can cry all you want about "the game we love" and "all the haters" but there won't be a game at all if SE can't cover their costs, and a recovery needs to come on swift wings in order for the "game you love" to continue.

Personally, I'm still on the fence. It's moderately interesting to mess around in, but I still wouldn't pay a subscription for it. The improvements aren't the great strides forward that some folks on these forums are trying to push. I sat down and ground out three levels on leves Saturday, just to check out the changes and see what's new.

The changes to the market wards are... Still just not enough. I won't complain TOO loudly because at least I was able to get a decent set of upgraded armor in around 45 minutes time, but I couldn't help but thinking to myself as I'm running back and forth to the back wall, "Holy sh*t this is still just tedious and not at all immersive." You can only track one thing at a time, and you have to manually take it out of the log even if you have bought it (should auto-clear, in my opinion). It's little things like that which will make people run for the hills. It's still too tedious, even though it's vastly improved over what it was.

Lag is still there, and most noticeable when trading with retainer. It will always be there no matter how many servers they stripe it across; the UI needs to come client side. Period.

This poll was needed, and I voted "Yea" to drastic changes - not because I really hope that they will kill the look and feel of the game, but because it will take a miracle to put this game back on the map after all the editorials and all the reviews and all the horrible polls. Nothing short of a miracle will bring it back, and I'm sorry if that offends some of the folks here who are genuinely enjoying the game. You are the minority, and while I don't want to see you driven away, I also don't want the small voices to drown out the larger ones who are screaming for the walls to be torn down.

Edited, Jan 4th 2011 3:51pm by Torrence
#24 Jan 04 2011 at 3:29 PM Rating: Good
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Hello well this is a personal request . currently im living in Mexico but every time i try to take the poll i get the message

"The region is different."

which is kinda bul**** but w/e

if anyone know a way to "change" this so i could take the poll ?? i know there are a few way to do this proxi/annon etc anyone point me in the right direction(link) feel free to send me a private message , thanks
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#25 Jan 04 2011 at 3:30 PM Rating: Good
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KristoFurwalken wrote:
Which forthcoming online games do you wish to play?
Blade & Soul
DC Universe Online
Guild Wars 2
Star Wars: The Old Republic
TERA The Exiled Realm of Arborea
The Agency
Other (monthly-subscription based online game)
Other (online game with microtransactions)
Other (free online game)
None


I don't think they are trying to find out what style of game we like, more what style of payment. Otherwise the last 3 options could have just been rolled up into a single "Other". This makes me more confident than ever that FFXIV will end up being F2P with micro-transactions, and a P2P subscription option for unlimited access.


Edited, Jan 4th 2011 1:29am by KristoFurwalken


I respectfully disagree. I believe what they are attempting to establish here is a timeline. The notable exceptions to this list are the new WoW expansion and Rift. These are already released and releasing imminently, respectively. In my opinion, this question was intended to give SE a feel for how long they have to make improvements before they start getting, "The **** with this game. Imma go play xxxxxxx."
#26 Jan 04 2011 at 4:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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When they say "reboot" I don't envision a ground-up new game and/or game design.
My opinion is they are talking about removing/retooling things that are not working, but that we are used to dealing with and some players may very well have learned to use to their advantage.

I'm talking things like removing item degradation, removing "optimal" ranks for items, I think the most radical "reboot" they would consider would involve battle mechanics. That I could see them reworking entirely to try and make party play more viable to the whole player-base.

I really think SE is realizing how bad a design the "optimal" rank thing is.
It kinda negates the need for any gear that isn't the best you can buy, you can do a leve and have enough to repair out of rank gear that is degrading at a high rate. The penalties for wearing out of rank gear is not really that horrible.
The other con to this system is you really have nothing to strive for gear-wise. You don't need to be a particular job, you don't need to be a particular level.
You can very well have one player who made it to 50, got some nice new leve-nm gear standing next to a rank 35 LS mate wearing the exact same thing. Where's the sense of pride in accomplishment if anyone can wear/equip the same thing from rank 1-50? You hear the nay-sayers always saying "I just couldn't find any reason to logon anymore."
Obviously that can't be true even with the limited content XIV has atm. It's limited, but not absent! It was the goal issue, and goals in MMO's are very "next shiney thing" driven.
It's a BIG part of the player hook in every MMO, and you can't just remove it totally and not have a substitute hook designed. I foresee THIS as one of the major retools.

The repair issue is kinda polarized. I can't tell if the people arguing that it's a great system are serious or if it's just a fanboy thing. I haven't really seen any benifit to the repair system on any level of the game. It doesn't seem to do anything ground breaking economic-wise, sure it is a little bit of a gil sink, but most everyone has things player repaired anyway. When it offers SP to the repairer it's nothing to get excited about. It does virtually nothing gameplay-wise other than **** people off. The penalties for running around with damaged gear are negligible, and it's not worth anyone's time to run back to town in the event you or no one in the field can repair.
It's a nuisance design, nothing more, so I can see them ditching it under the "retool/redesign" definition.

Point being, these are the types of things I see in a retool/redesign. Things they for whatever reason just did not think through past the "wouldn't that be cool" part of the conversation during the concept phases. The vanishing of some mechanics that are perceived as unpopular and reworking of stuff that we are used to but not really sold on.
I don't think for a second SE would have us waking up one morning and logging into a different game, where all our work so far is negated.
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#27 Jan 04 2011 at 5:27 PM Rating: Decent
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The poll didn't ask you what you want in this game at all, but "WHICH" of the following things are most important to you, or would like to see implemented first.

That basically shows they know what they want to get into the game(everything thats in that list), they just want to make sure they implement and fix the things most people want to see implemented and fixed first.

Thinking must be hard when all you see is FFXIV sucking for you...
#28 Jan 04 2011 at 5:40 PM Rating: Default
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All polls are biased, therefore they are worth their weight in shiet.

Also, everyone that uses polls are commies.

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#29 Jan 04 2011 at 7:15 PM Rating: Good
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Kierk wrote:
The final question did throw me for a loop, kinda negating the entire survey.


If the point of the survey was to gather information and/or gauge player opinions, then having a cryptic question does not negate any that came prior.

They want to know what people want most, and they want to see how "attached" people are to the world as it currently exists; it doesn't negate anything, it gives SE a vague idea of whether, as a whole, people find things in a state worth preserving or whether, in general, they wouldn't mind a change in battle mechanics, stat distribution, etc.
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#30 Jan 04 2011 at 8:15 PM Rating: Good
I think that this poll introduces a new era from Square: Officially wanting to hear from their players. Something that never happened in FFXI. Now they have huge challenges in their hands, an extremely short time to make a miracle and their heads ready to be chopped by Square CEO as they were probably chosen to be the sacrificial lamb and save Tanaka for future titles.

I think the game needs a miracle. Pretty much redesign entire maps that are completely dull and repetitive, make transportation interesting and enjoyable instead of annoying, making leveling and crafting have faster rewards or less obstacles, create like 5000 quests on npcs around the world to link them with characters and the world story, expand the main plot with dramatic things so people get interested on whats happening...

As much as you guys default me i really don't see a bright future for this game. DC Online is almost here and there is Star Wars/Guild Wars2 and Diablo 3 to pretty much kill whats left of FFXIV population.

My opinion is: they have to make this miracle before start wars, diablo 3 and guild wars 2 are released. After that its too late.

Even if this miracle happens the only chance of recovering the game to a healthy position would be relaunching it with the PS3 version. Square have to learn that their players back in 1988 were kids and had 16h a day to play games. Now they are grown ups with responsibilities and cant afford more than 4h hours a day for one game. Unless its someone with severe social or mental problems.

But the majority of MMORPG gamers are grown ups, have family and a job. They gotta put that into their minds before trying to come back with an old school MMORPG like Everquest or FFXI.

Edited, Jan 4th 2011 9:34pm by MclarenTAGPorsche
#31namasy, Posted: Jan 04 2011 at 10:29 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) wow ppl are still talk about this game??!!
#32 Jan 04 2011 at 10:45 PM Rating: Good
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Almalexia wrote:
I hope everyone ticked Blade & Soul so bust and hip sizes get upgraded. God ****.


I did, so I can have mouselolis playing with catgirls.

Wait, you no see what me typed <_<
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#33 Jan 04 2011 at 11:33 PM Rating: Decent
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Way to go for a ANOTHER positive editorial ::sarcasm::. Just what the community needs.
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#34 Jan 05 2011 at 8:02 AM Rating: Default
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onineko wrote:
Way to go for a ANOTHER positive editorial ::sarcasm::. Just what the community needs.


Thats just what I am thinking...I always have the feeling Thayos Editorials are supposed to look like they are "critizising" in a good manner, but all I can read between the lines is "I hate FFXIV and SE sucks"...sorry...thats what I always read out of your editorials...

Like I said before...it takes 2 seconds of thinking to see that SE doesn't ask the community what they should do with FFXIV, but what they should do with FFXIV FIRST before doing anything else.
The list shows what they want to get into the game and now they want to know from the community what they should get into the game first before anything else.

I for myself am pretty sure that we will get EVERYTHING thats in that list, just not all at once.
#35 Jan 05 2011 at 8:45 AM Rating: Excellent
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Well, editorials are largely based on the opinion of the author, and there are far more folks who agree with Thayos than disagree. The numbers reflect that directly. The opinions will change when the problems in the game that created those opinions are gone. Until then - his editorials have gotten SE's attention in the past. It always seemed to me like after he wrote something up, SE started to make some noise.

Square Enix taking a direct approach like this Poll is actually better than just vomiting random plans on the Lodestone like some people were asking for - this shows that they are finally accepting feedback directly rather than farming it out to Zam and logging in as Square Enix Community once every couple years to communicate. The fact that they even put a question asking if we would like forums shows that they are looking around and seeing what other companies have been doing for years.

It may take them a while yet to catch up, but at least now they are asking the "right" questions.
#36 Jan 05 2011 at 10:51 AM Rating: Good
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I took it as a way for SE to prioritize the things they are working on.

They are trying to do a lot right now and they probably want to focus efforts so that they can roll out individual updates as soon as possible in the order of what's most important to us first.

If you got much more than that out of it, I think you might be reading too much into things.

#37 Jan 05 2011 at 12:22 PM Rating: Good
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KaneKitty wrote:
Kierk wrote:
The final question did throw me for a loop, kinda negating the entire survey.


If the point of the survey was to gather information and/or gauge player opinions, then having a cryptic question does not negate any that came prior.

They want to know what people want most, and they want to see how "attached" people are to the world as it currently exists; it doesn't negate anything, it gives SE a vague idea of whether, as a whole, people find things in a state worth preserving or whether, in general, they wouldn't mind a change in battle mechanics, stat distribution, etc.


In theory I still stand by my statement as a measure of my own feelings. I think the weight of the question in itself carries and manages the tone of the entire survey. Without the question it would have been a totally different survey.

But you're right. I shouldn't have used 'negate.' It doesn't negate the entire survey in content, just the questions like: "What would you like to see implemented first?"

If I want more guildleves to be implemented first, but then SE decides to change the guildleve system, what would be the point of answering that question?





#38 Jan 05 2011 at 4:53 PM Rating: Good
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I find the OP's stance and overall negativity/pessimistic stance refreshing.

To much, do you find ADMINs at fan sites afraid to say anything bad about said game. Especially when its actually warranted like many of the issue I see brought up here.

Keep up the constructive criticism
#39 Jan 05 2011 at 4:54 PM Rating: Excellent
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Kierk wrote:
KaneKitty wrote:
Kierk wrote:
The final question did throw me for a loop, kinda negating the entire survey.


If the point of the survey was to gather information and/or gauge player opinions, then having a cryptic question does not negate any that came prior.

They want to know what people want most, and they want to see how "attached" people are to the world as it currently exists; it doesn't negate anything, it gives SE a vague idea of whether, as a whole, people find things in a state worth preserving or whether, in general, they wouldn't mind a change in battle mechanics, stat distribution, etc.


In theory I still stand by my statement as a measure of my own feelings. I think the weight of the question in itself carries and manages the tone of the entire survey. Without the question it would have been a totally different survey.

But you're right. I shouldn't have used 'negate.' It doesn't negate the entire survey in content, just the questions like: "What would you like to see implemented first?"

If I want more guildleves to be implemented first, but then SE decides to change the guildleve system, what would be the point of answering that question?







I think they had the right idea, but forgot to add what should've been the natural choice for the next question:

What would be considered a drastic change to the game?
(or rephrased "What changes would make you want to leave the game?" or "Is there anything in the game we should consider sacred/untouchable?")

I mean adding an Auction House is a drastic change and so is changing the xp/sp distribution. Heck even something "small" such as actually spelling out the effects of the foods will have a drastic effect on the gameplay and economy. Nevermind if they tried to change the graphics or added jump/swim/mounts/skymounts and the effect that would have.

Let's be honest. They're not going to change the plot (except to add to it, hopefully make it more epic). They're not going to change the discipline system (I don't hear a lot of complaints about it, of course adjustments for balance as needed). The most drastic thing they would change would be the guildleve system (and I think even if they did, it would be more along the lines of turning more npcs into leve/material givers) or allowing user generated add-ons (obviously a mixed bag there).

BTW, I think this survey is a simply Yoshida being cautious, yet following his own keywords.

Fun: He's not trying to base this game off his impression of fun (the apparent flaw of his predecessor), instead he is creating a consensus among those dedicated enough to stay with the game in some form. This is his goal. That FFXIV is fun.

Live: It's not enough that characters fight and craft all day. If people feel their characters "live" in the world, that's how they get more attached. That means having characters being more part of the story and not only doing things, but having a reason to do them besides xp/sp.

Reboot: Think of it more like a tv/movie reboot, not a computer. The secret of a sucessful reboot is to maintain the right combination of core elements to keep the atmosphere while taking the product in a different direction. For successful reboots I refer you to Batman, Marvel Ultimate Universe (from which the current movies spring), Dr Who, and Battlestar Galactica to name a few. Now I realize on the other side of the coin I realize the potential for such flops as House of Wax remake, (IMHO) any Power Rangers season that did not include the originals or Tommy, the live action TMNT series, or the Voltron with the cars. But my point is, given the delicacy of the situation, i highly doubt they are going to focus time on things people are not complaining about.

Rebuild: This one is all about the trust and image of the Final Fantasy brand. When building a custom home. You get the floor plans approved before you build. I didn't see how long they were giving to complete the survey, but I'm personally expection a return of some sort in the next two weeks.


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#40 Jan 05 2011 at 6:44 PM Rating: Excellent
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One of the better editorials I've read. I think its main point, "there are more questions than answers" explains things perfectly. Sure we'll all take different conclusions from that survey. Some will put positive spin on it, others negative. What the survey did to both my in-game experience and my experience here on zam is reset the same old cycle of uncertainty.

In-game, I'm still trying to carry on, developing my character and having fun where I can. Yet still clueless about the game's direction. What's gonna change? And for worse or better? Am I gonna stick around? Are my new friends & LSmates gonna stick around? That's not a good gaming environment to be playing in.

And on here...Smiley: banghead We're just replaying the same old cycle of trolling, speculating, & arguing. Sure, that's what happens on forums, but the discussions should eventually change. Not the same exact ones over and over again. Months after release, it would be nice to be past that part. I get that they wanna gather player input before making serious decisions, but I'm getting worn out from this cycle of uncertainty. Man up, set a plan & lay it down for us.
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#41 Jan 05 2011 at 7:55 PM Rating: Excellent
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I also think the editorial was great, I actually answered the survey few days ago but today reading what Thayos wrote I couldn't help but nod at most of it.

From a very personal point of view, SE looks like a scared boyfriend kneeling before his long disappointed girlfriend saying something like "I will do what ever you want! but please don't leave me"

I feel this approach will only have 2 possible outcomes neither of which is any good.

A) Certain part of the player base (myself included) will shake their head at the way SE it's approaching the situation and simply stay away at least until they can come with an answer, the truth is, we are not game developers, we may have good ideas and suggestions of what could be fun or interesting to have but ultimately we are paying to be entertained not to mold the game, this kind of scenario is only followed by "We did what our players wanted still they are not happy with the game" they need to take our suggestions and come up with some professional and creative ways to address them, I'm quite shocked to see that a company like SE lack the maturity to understand this.

B) The client-provider relationship will become abusive, it's true that a customer will never be completely satisfied, even when a product is perfect we will always want it cheaper, faster or able to run in your smart phone. The bottom line is that these requests will be eventually unsustainable.

Let see what the next news from Lodestone have for us, hopefully they will offer a more oriented plan of action.

Ken

Edit: typo

Edited, Jan 6th 2011 6:07am by kenage
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#42 Jan 06 2011 at 8:02 AM Rating: Good
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The new director is kind of in the same situation Obama is in. It's pretty much a lose-lose scenario. This ship is way too big to turn in half a term. Yet you will be held accountable for 1. what happened before you were director and 2. not fixing **** really really fast. Sucks to be him.
#43 Jan 06 2011 at 8:43 AM Rating: Good
Mithsavvy wrote:
The new director is kind of in the same situation Obama is in. It's pretty much a lose-lose scenario. This ship is way too big to turn in half a term. Yet you will be held accountable for 1. what happened before you were director and 2. not fixing sh*t really really fast. Sucks to be him.


I won't say any about politics, however you do strike a chord there. Becoming the Director of something new (even with no current problems) must be a big step up let alone inheriting the problems of your predecessor. I do hope we see a leap forward in the effort to get FFXIV back on track. But I also understand the need for caution. It would be pointless to assign a new director just to have them rush a fix and botch the game even more.
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