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Should stat points be done away with entirely?Follow

#52 Jan 07 2011 at 3:19 PM Rating: Decent
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DoctorMog wrote:

You guys are so dense...


You're not earning yourself any friends with posts like this.

Edited, Jan 7th 2011 4:20pm by TheRealDestian
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#53 Jan 07 2011 at 3:20 PM Rating: Good
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QuickShadoww wrote:
@Doctor Mog

Don't try to make them change their mind. It's useless. They are part of the "i'm never happy category" because they thought FFXIV would be their "ideal personnal view of a MMO".

That's bull. I defend this game on a daily basis. However, I don't do it blindly and I can at least see where it has its faults.

DoctorMog wrote:
Really? Go to an aetheryte and READ what it says sometime.

STR = physical attack
VIT = physical defense
DEX = physical accuracy
INT = magical attack
MND = magical defense
PIE = magical accuracy

The game tells you what the stats do.

Don't be so stupid.

No ****. Again, thanks for stating the obvious.

Like I said, PROVE TO ME that DEX increases accuracy. PROVE TO ME that PIE increases accuracy.

Oh, you can't?
#54 Jan 07 2011 at 3:26 PM Rating: Decent
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QuickShadoww wrote:
@Doctor Mog

Don't try to make them change their mind. It's useless. They are part of the "i'm never happy category" because they thought FFXIV would be their "ideal personnal view of a MMO".

BTW, great videos and posts about the NMs, crafting gear and all. People may call you a white knight but I think you are just enjoying the game and sharing your knowledge and enjoyment with others. Keep going. I enjoy the game and like your work.


Way to brown-nose.

And FYI, we're suggesting the system be changed because it's awful and only serves to hinder players when they try to enjoy the freedom that the armory system promised to start with.

SE: Try out the armory system! It lets you change classes at ANY time, any PLACE!...Except for the fact that the class you switch to will be gimped and poorly-built, but don't worry! You can change SOME of your stat points once every 30 minutes, so you'll be a slightly-less crap version of that class!

And again, isn't dealing with the correct gear for the correct class already enough?
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#55 Jan 07 2011 at 3:26 PM Rating: Decent
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Prove to me that it doesn't

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#56 Jan 07 2011 at 3:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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SoumaKyou wrote:
DoctorMog wrote:
This topic encouraged me to make another video explaining myself, and my "general allocation" method.
My video is an example of how to "generalize" your stats and "swing" them with minimal reallocations and traits:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGNlv1cO8m4


This is a good baseline for most players until they know what class they plan on taking to 50. In which case they can move to a "prime allocation" setup for the 1 class they want to play. I will make a video explaining that in the future.

That's the problem with this system. The stats are TOO general, in that they barely do ANYTHING.

Honestly, a stat system like Ragnarok Online's would've been perfectly fine while keeping the 1 hour partial resets. Stats in that game were practically perfect. It was strict enough where your class NEEDED certain stats to actually be viable, yet flexible enough where there were several different possible builds per class. Putting points into DEX actually noticeably improved my accuracy. Putting points into LUK actually noticeably improved my crit chance. Right now, it's TOO flexible and there really is no true distinction. It makes classes feel generic.

Edited, Jan 7th 2011 4:02pm by SoumaKyou



I loved in RO when I made an AGI knight, that my attack speed went up as my AGI went up. Just throwing that in there.

Also I agree with your earlier post about jobs needing more 'character.'

However in FFXI for example I liked THF because of it's defining move: sneak attack. I loved NIN for its obvious Ninjutsu.

Now the reasons for this are plenty. We already knew (as NA players) what skills to look forward to and how they were to be used. We only had a few abilities to pick from. Lastly, we couldn't mix and match abilities; the current class system in FFXIV is more open ended to a fault. I don't think this system AND defined characters go together, because, well, we're the ones defining them.

I'm at a loss right now as how to make characters more defined, without removing or limiting the current class system.
#57 Jan 07 2011 at 3:28 PM Rating: Good
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This topic is as old as the game. There was much discussion about this in the beta forums and I was a vocal proponent of abolishing the stat allocation system entirely. As others in the thread have pointed out, it conflicts with the armoury system and adds more headaches than anything else.

DoctorMog wrote:
This topic encouraged me to make another video explaining myself, and my "general allocation" method.
My video is an example of how to "generalize" your stats and "swing" them with minimal reallocations and traits:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGNlv1cO8m4


This is a good baseline for most players until they know what class they plan on taking to 50. In which case they can move to a "prime allocation" setup for the 1 class they want to play. I will make a video explaining that in the future.

Mog, your archer has 75 INT, which only has a marginal effect on Shock Spikes and 50 PIE, which actually does absolutely nothing for an archer. How can you with a straight face keep saying people are doing it wrong when you're literally wasting dozens of points? Then you instruct us how useful the point traits are, and they are, but they don't add anything to your argument. A +10 STR -10 PIE trait will benefit a melee class no matter what his stats are. They're not a tool for tilting your balanced stats, they're a tool for adding useful stats at the cost of useless stats and every class has both of those regardless of how you've allocated your points.

I know you go on and say focused stats are ok if you only level DoW or DoM, but that's where the alarm bells should start ringing in your head. Don't you realize you're gimping yourself by trying to level multiple jobs? I mean, you just confessed you can't support an optimized stat allocation because you need to be able to play your THM as well as your ARC. Do you not see how that is a problem?

I personally leveled both THM and CON to 20 not too long ago even though I really had no interest in maining either. It took me days to switch over my stats from full physical to full magical. It then took me another several days to swing them back. And yes, I use stat traits but that makes no difference as I'd still rather have 105 STR and 5 PIE than 100 STR and 10 PIE.
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#58 Jan 07 2011 at 3:29 PM Rating: Good
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DoctorMog wrote:
And yes, that video comment was a shot directly at the people who are too stupid to take 5 seconds and figure something out on their own instead of having to be told what to do.

Think for yourselves people.


No, you've been a condescending jerk in pretty much all of your videos, going on about "how people just don't get it" because they're not willing to put up with bad game design but you ARE.

Protip: your ability to endure terrible game design does not make you special. It does not make you a better gamer. It makes you a *********.

Edited, Jan 7th 2011 4:30pm by TheRealDestian
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#59 Jan 07 2011 at 3:30 PM Rating: Decent
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My "wasted points" are there because in 20 minutes I plan on leveling with a friend and playing Thaumaturge.

Flexibility.
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#60 Jan 07 2011 at 3:31 PM Rating: Decent
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DoctorMog wrote:
Prove to me that it doesn't

And here you go with another cop out.
#61 Jan 07 2011 at 3:33 PM Rating: Decent
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TheRealDestian wrote:
DoctorMog wrote:
And yes, that video comment was a shot directly at the people who are too stupid to take 5 seconds and figure something out on their own instead of having to be told what to do.

Think for yourselves people.


No, you've been a condescending jerk in pretty much all of your videos, going on about "how people just don't get it" because they're not willing to put up with bad game design but you ARE.

Protip: your ability to endure terrible game design does not make you special. It does not make you a better gamer. It makes you a *********. Glad to see that degree in game design of yours has helped you so much...



Protip: My ability to endure terrible forum blockheads makes me a superhero.

I know you all can't see this, but I get messages DAILY from people thanking me for my videos, standing up for myself, and providing information on how to more effectively play this game.

THEY are why I am here refuting the idiocy that is rampant in these forums.

Most of them are too worried about karma to stand up for themselves in these debates, and as is proven by quick who said something agreeing with me and promptly sub defaulted for his opinion.

This is also proven by the fact that after posting, I am defaulted and then put back to a good rating overall because people AGREE with me but are too afraid to post.
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#62 Jan 07 2011 at 3:33 PM Rating: Good
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Kierk wrote:
I loved in RO when I made an AGI knight, that my attack speed went up as my AGI went up. Just throwing that in there.

That's exactly what I'm saying. RO's stat allocation had noticeable increases to each class. AGI increased attack speed and dodge rate. LUK increase crit chance, craft success, and lucky dodge chance. XIV simply doesn't have these, so there's really no feeling of stat progression outside of, "oh look, more stats to put in random places".
#63 Jan 07 2011 at 3:33 PM Rating: Decent
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SoumaKyou wrote:
DoctorMog wrote:
Prove to me that it doesn't

And here you go with another cop out.


same to you sir.
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#64 Jan 07 2011 at 3:33 PM Rating: Decent
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@ TheRealDestian

what looks terrible to you IS terrible for everyone right? Are you god?

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#65 Jan 07 2011 at 3:34 PM Rating: Excellent
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This game needs to remember your stat point allocations per class - as well as the skills and traits you put on your action bar.

Problem solved.
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#66 Jan 07 2011 at 3:34 PM Rating: Good
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I have yet to find changing my stats affects how many coblyns I can kill. In about a year when I'm done with coblyns...I will start to worry about this. -- sarcasm

Again..do not get too comfortable with anything as anything that seems to be a bit quirky/clunky has a good chance of being changed/tweaked/removed.
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#67 Jan 07 2011 at 3:35 PM Rating: Good
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kronohofsylph wrote:
This game needs to remember your stat point allocations per class - as well as the skills and traits you put on your action bar.

Problem solved.


Good solution.
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#68 Jan 07 2011 at 3:36 PM Rating: Decent
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DoctorMog wrote:
My "wasted points" are there because in 20 minutes I plan on leveling with a friend and playing Thaumaturge.

Flexibility.

Flexibility never got you anywhere in MMOs. This is why hybrids classes always have to abandon their hybrid roots and move towards specialization. This is why RDMs in FFXI don't melee in a group setting and why Shamans and Paladins in WoW were eventually pigeonholed into healing specialist roles in raids. Hybrids just pain suck because you can only do one thing at a time and when each person is performing one task at any given time, they need to be as good as possible at that one task they are performing right then.
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#69 Jan 07 2011 at 3:36 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Difference is, I COULD do this:

STR 90
DEX 60
VIT 80
INT 15
MND 45
PIE 25

and actually have Mp to backup heal.

You guys are so dense...


You could and you wouldn't cause there is no point.

They could just as easily add +mp skills and accomplish the same thing. Besides if they normalize the stats that number would be higher anyways so you would end up getting the mp regardless at the expense of nothing. Stat allocation adds nothing to this game but just another click.
#70 Jan 07 2011 at 3:37 PM Rating: Decent
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Omena wrote:
I personally leveled both THM and CON to 20 not too long ago even though I really had no interest in maining either. It took me days to switch over my stats from full physical to full magical. It then took me another several days to swing them back. And yes, I use stat traits but that makes no difference as I'd still rather have 105 STR and 5 PIE than 100 STR and 10 PIE.


This! A thousand times! THIS!!!

And the fact that we have these "stat point patches" at all should be a gigantic warning light.

So SE's answer to the fact that the stat point system is so terrible for switching classes was to make players BUY abilities that move stats around when they have them active?!

That's like putting a bandaid on a bullet wound, then shooting the SAME wound, then putting yet ANOTHER bandaid on THAT wound...
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#71 Jan 07 2011 at 3:39 PM Rating: Decent
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DoctorMog wrote:
Protip: My ability to endure terrible forum blockheads makes me a superhero.

I know you all can't see this, but I get messages DAILY from people thanking me for my videos, standing up for myself, and providing information on how to more effectively play this game.

THEY are why I am here refuting the idiocy that is rampant in these forums.

Most of them are too worried about karma to stand up for themselves in these debates, and as is proven by quick who said something agreeing with me and promptly sub defaulted for his opinion.

This is also proven by the fact that after posting, I am defaulted and then put back to a good rating overall because people AGREE with me but are too afraid to post.


And this justifies being a condescending jerk...how?

I don't care if a man cured cancer and caught Osama Bin Laden in the SAME AFTERNOON. If he's going to be a condescending, elitist jerk, he's still a jerk.

Think of how many more votes-ups you'd have if you weren't being a jerk. Just saying...

Edited, Jan 7th 2011 4:41pm by TheRealDestian
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#72 Jan 07 2011 at 3:40 PM Rating: Good
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Shamans and Paladins in WoW were always able to do end games in all 3 roles (enhance, elemental and resto / ret, tank and holy) since WoW came out. It was just harder to perform well and to get the appropriate gear (an enhance shammy used to be top dps in vanilla wow raids like BWL and AQ40). Flexibility = harder to be optimal in every role. Flexibility /= easy mode faceroll wins.
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#73 Jan 07 2011 at 3:41 PM Rating: Good
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Ok, to the people talking about stat point reallocation as an abuse prevention system when fighting NMs or monsters in general. That's all well and good except for the fact that you CANNOT CHANGE CLASSES WHILE AN ENEMY IS ENGAGED. Whether you're attacking it or not, whether you're in combat mode or not, as long as any monster is engaged, you can't switch classes. Period.

So on the the next excuse.
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#74 Jan 07 2011 at 3:42 PM Rating: Decent
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TheRealDestian wrote:
Omena wrote:
I personally leveled both THM and CON to 20 not too long ago even though I really had no interest in maining either. It took me days to switch over my stats from full physical to full magical. It then took me another several days to swing them back. And yes, I use stat traits but that makes no difference as I'd still rather have 105 STR and 5 PIE than 100 STR and 10 PIE.


This! A thousand times! THIS!!!

And the fact that we have these "stat point patches" at all should be a gigantic warning light.

So SE's answer to the fact that the stat point system is so terrible for switching classes was to make players BUY abilities that move stats around when they have them active?!

That's like putting a bandaid on a bullet wound, then shooting the SAME wound, then putting yet ANOTHER bandaid on THAT wound...


It's interesting you say that, because according to:

http://ffxiv.zam.com/forum.html?forum=152&mid=12895716242505663&page=1
(here on the Zam forums no less)

The stat cap for rank 20 is 76.

I for one would rather have 70 STR and 5 Pie and be able to play a different class between now and 8 hours from now when I need to reallocate all that STR.
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#75 Jan 07 2011 at 3:43 PM Rating: Decent
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DoctorMog wrote:
SoumaKyou wrote:
DoctorMog wrote:
Prove to me that it doesn't

And here you go with another cop out.


same to you sir.

No. My point is proven by the simple fact that you need a large sample size to even begin to determine the real world effects (not just what a tooltip says) of stats in XIV, whereas other stat allocation systems are noticeable immediately.
#76 Jan 07 2011 at 3:43 PM Rating: Decent
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TheRealDestian wrote:
DoctorMog wrote:
Protip: My ability to endure terrible forum blockheads makes me a superhero.

I know you all can't see this, but I get messages DAILY from people thanking me for my videos, standing up for myself, and providing information on how to more effectively play this game.

THEY are why I am here refuting the idiocy that is rampant in these forums.

Most of them are too worried about karma to stand up for themselves in these debates, and as is proven by quick who said something agreeing with me and promptly sub defaulted for his opinion.

This is also proven by the fact that after posting, I am defaulted and then put back to a good rating overall because people AGREE with me but are too afraid to post.


And this justifies being a condescending jerk...how?

I don't care if a man cured cancer and caught Osama Bin Laden in the SAME AFTERNOON. If he's going to be a condescending, elitist jerk, he's still a jerk.

Think of how many more votes-ups you'd have if you weren't being a jerk. Just saying...

Edited, Jan 7th 2011 4:41pm by TheRealDestian


Its interesting that everyone can be a jerk to me, but as soon as I turn it around, its flaunted like Im the only one doing it.

It seems you missed quoting the person who said the exact same "protip" line to me 2 post earlier.



Edited, Jan 7th 2011 4:45pm by DoctorMog
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#77 Jan 07 2011 at 3:44 PM Rating: Good
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DoctorMog wrote:
kronohofsylph wrote:
This game needs to remember your stat point allocations per class - as well as the skills and traits you put on your action bar.

Problem solved.


Good solution.


Yeah, the one Torrence posted 20 posts ago...

Torrence wrote:
I also have Conjurer leveled, which I may need to use. Now why is it that I cannot have a separate build for it? Why can't the game remember my choices for Marauder, and then when I am playing a different class lock my choices for Marauder away so that I can make different choices for a new class?


No offense to the person who suggested it again, but why did it sound like a "good solution" coming from him but not coming from Torrance?
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#78 Jan 07 2011 at 3:45 PM Rating: Decent
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QuickShadoww wrote:
Shamans and Paladins in WoW were always able to do end games in all 3 roles (enhance, elemental and resto / ret, tank and holy) since WoW came out. It was just harder to perform well and to get the appropriate gear (an enhance shammy used to be top dps in vanilla wow raids like BWL and AQ40). Flexibility = harder to be optimal in every role. Flexibility /= easy mode faceroll wins.

Let's not kid ourselves here. Enhancement shamans didn't become a viable DPS alternative until TBC and even if they were any good at it, they would be specializing in damage, not being hybrids. If an enhancement shaman stopped to cast some sub-par heals, he'd be betraying his role in the raid.

The same goes for paladins. I don't think to this day retribution has been a viable PVE dps alternative, though paladin tanks became good in TBC. Again, in both cases the paladin would only have one role, hence a specialist, not a hybrid like a newly created character of said class. Likewise, nobody in WoW makes a hybrid warrior. It's either damage or tanking, not both.

DoctorMog wrote:

It's interesting you say that, because according to:

http://ffxiv.zam.com/forum.html?forum=152&mid=12895716242505663&page=1
(here on the Zam forums no less)

The stat cap for rank 20 is 76.

So? I'm R29, not that it matters as I was merely giving an example.

Edited, Jan 7th 2011 4:47pm by Omena

Edited, Jan 7th 2011 4:48pm by Omena
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#79 Jan 07 2011 at 3:46 PM Rating: Default
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DoctorMog wrote:
It's interesting you say that, because according to:

http://ffxiv.zam.com/forum.html?forum=152&mid=12895716242505663&page=1
(here on the Zam forums no less)

The stat cap for rank 20 is 76.

I for one would rather have 70 STR and 5 Pie and be able to play a different class between now and 8 hours from now when I need to reallocate all that STR.


And I for one would rather have a system that doesn't put bandaids on bullet wounds.

Just give us a stat allocation for each class and that's at least some stitches to close the wound...
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#80 Jan 07 2011 at 3:46 PM Rating: Decent
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Because I missed that post?
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#81 Jan 07 2011 at 3:47 PM Rating: Decent
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QuickShadoww wrote:
Shamans and Paladins in WoW were always able to do end games in all 3 roles (enhance, elemental and resto / ret, tank and holy) since WoW came out. It was just harder to perform well and to get the appropriate gear (an enhance shammy used to be top dps in vanilla wow raids like BWL and AQ40). Flexibility = harder to be optimal in every role. Flexibility /= easy mode faceroll wins.

No Enhance Shaman could off-heal. ****, Elemental Shamans couldn't even do it reliably.

Ret and Prot Pallies off-healing? Ret and Holy Pallies off-tanking? LOL? What version of WoW were you playing? The Hello Kitty Island Adventure expansion?
#82 Jan 07 2011 at 3:49 PM Rating: Good
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TheRealDestian wrote:

And might I add something else? We already have GEAR to be an issue for deciding what to choose to level. Why do we need stat points on top of that?


How dare they combine numbers and thinking?!?!?
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#83 Jan 07 2011 at 3:49 PM Rating: Default
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QuickShadoww wrote:
@ TheRealDestian

what looks terrible to you IS terrible for everyone right? Are you god?



It's my opinion that this system is terrible, convoluted and unnecessary.

It should be removed entirely at worst and at best we should at least have a different stat selection for each class so we can enjoy the freedom the armory system promised.

If you disagree with it, that's fine. As long as you can do so civilly and present a counter-argument, I won't rate you down for it.
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#84 Jan 07 2011 at 3:52 PM Rating: Decent
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DoctorMog wrote:
Its interesting that everyone can be a jerk to me, but as soon as I turn it around, its flaunted like Im the only one doing it.


In your earlier videos, you were already going on about how people just "don't do enough research" about how you like seeing when people have trouble figuring out the game mechanics.

Then, you did it again in this video. Then, you did it AGAIN when you called people in this thread "morons" and "dense".

Can you see just MAYBE how you fired the first salvo here? :\
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#85 Jan 07 2011 at 3:52 PM Rating: Decent
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TheRealDestian wrote:

If you disagree with it, that's fine. As long as you can do so civilly and present a counter-argument, I won't rate you down for it.

What? No! Counter-arguments, and arguments in general, are for those elitist wannabe intellectuals! It's much cooler to just call everyone stupid because they just don't get it.

Edited, Jan 7th 2011 4:52pm by Omena
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#86 Jan 07 2011 at 3:53 PM Rating: Decent
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Tankue wrote:
TheRealDestian wrote:

And might I add something else? We already have GEAR to be an issue for deciding what to choose to level. Why do we need stat points on top of that?


How dare they combine numbers and thinking?!?!?


Actually, it's "how dare they combine one massive inconvenience with something that's already rather inconvenient?!".

And if the decline in playerbase is any indication, "what were they thinking?!" applies rather thoroughly to this game.
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#87 Jan 07 2011 at 3:55 PM Rating: Decent
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Omena wrote:
TheRealDestian wrote:

If you disagree with it, that's fine. As long as you can do so civilly and present a counter-argument, I won't rate you down for it.

What? No! Counter-arguments, and arguments in general, are for those elitist wannabe intellectuals! It's much cooler to just call everyone stupid because they just don't get it.

Edited, Jan 7th 2011 4:52pm by Omena


Ah, the "Bill O'Riley" method of debate. Indeed! ;)
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#88 Jan 07 2011 at 3:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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It seems like people are upset with a couple different aspects of the current system...

Ignoring those that want all classes to have the same exact stats, and assuming that even if stats do nothing now, they will be important in the future (not because their opinion is invalid or anything like that, but cause its extremely difficult to have a decent discussion about system without taking it a small piece at a time...)

Is it that having a time delay to wait out before you become optimal after switching classes that require different physical attributes seems somehow disingenuous in a system that touts the ability to switch classes instantly?

Its flexibility thats touted in this system (the one character all classes) and flexibility is definitely relative...

I can be optimally specced out as a tank, instantly switch weapons and mine anything I want (provided my miner rank is high enough, instantly craft anything I want, though not with the same chance to make as high a quality product, instantly change to a DD or a healer and be effective though not NEARLY as effective as if I spent the time to switch my physical attributes over fully...

On the other side of things, I can go from being an optimal tank instantly to an optimal... absolutely nothing else. In the case where I'm taking my highest stat and transforming it back to its base minimum it takes around 12 to 14 respecs where my character is online, but not optimal at anything... I can still craft at a loss, or gather, or be a gimped whatever (to the point where I'd only solo, not be in a pt) For 6-7 hours of respeccing... definitely not what some people thought when they saw the armory systems claim of instantly switching class (sure you can do it, but you wont be optimal for a day of respeccing)

UI problems aside, and assuming we could set our character to automatically redistribute everytime its up, it all comes down to a question of time... what is the right amount of time delay? Its a tradeoff of rewarding someone for specializing, vs punishing someone for wanting to take advantage of what they thought was a major selling point of the game...

I can see anything from 3 seconds to a week or more honestly... (but my background is from both ffxiv where it was a second in a mog house, no stat options and UO where you had 100% flexibility to respec your skills/stats some would just take months of playing on end)
#89 Jan 07 2011 at 3:57 PM Rating: Good
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Actually, my distaste is only directed at the people who look at my evidence for something, and then continue to refute my evidence with half cocked theories on how they think the game could be better.

Never are any of my comments directed at anyone looking to learn something new, find a better way to play this game, or just to find another opinion on things.

What really needs to happen to this game is that people need to stop bashing it. The #1 issue with this game is the 10% who are unhappy with the game and feel the need to voice their opinion so loudly on the forums that they give the illusion that they are the majority, when in fact they are not.

People coming to look at the forums of this game promptly leave because of all the negativity. This game will NOT succeed if people keep bashing the systems in place.

People need to work out the best way to use the system, offer CONSTRUCTIVE feedback in the correct forum, and to stop driving the people who are looking for information AWAY from these forums.


Edited, Jan 7th 2011 5:01pm by DoctorMog
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#90 Jan 07 2011 at 4:01 PM Rating: Decent
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DoctorMog wrote:
What really needs to happen to this game is that people need to stop bashing it. The #1 issue with this game is the 10% who are unhappy with the game and feel the need to voice their opinion so loudly on the forums that they give the illusion that they are the majority, when in fact they are not.


And I have to respectfully disagree with you here.

If people "stop bashing" the game, SE will have no idea what needs to be made better. If all we do is sit around and talk about how wonderful the game is, SE will be scratching their heads while the playerbase dwindles and the game dies, wondering what the **** went wrong.

It's our job as players to voice our complaints with the game, and I'm sorry that you can't see the value in such a thing but clearly SE DOES, since they've started sending out polls and everything now...
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#91 Jan 07 2011 at 4:01 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
The #1 issue with this game is the 10% who are unhappy with the game and feel the need to voice their opinion so loudly on the forums that they give the illusion that they are the majority, when in fact they are not.


Are you high?
#92 Jan 07 2011 at 4:02 PM Rating: Good
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Who's opinion of better though?

Yours?

Put it in the correct forum, leave your bashing out of the forums people read looking for INFORMATION. Not opinions.
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#93 Jan 07 2011 at 4:02 PM Rating: Decent
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DoctorMog wrote:
Actually, my distaste is only directed at the people who look at my evidence for something, and then continue to refute my evidence with half cocked theories on how they think the game could be better.

Never are any of my comments directed at anyone looking to learn something new, find a better way to play this game, or just to find another opinion on things.

Or you could also just think that maybe you don't know everything about this game and consider the possibility that maybe there is a different approach, or maybe there is something wrong. Your own belief is not the be-all-end-all of XIV.

DoctorMog wrote:
What really needs to happen to this game is that people need to stop bashing it. The #1 issue with this game is the 10% who are unhappy with the game and feel the need to voice their opinion so loudly on the forums that they give the illusion that they are the majority, when in fact they are not.

Again, I'm one of the biggest defenders of this game. But I've played enough MMO's with stat allocation systems to know that XIV's stats just aren't as relevant as they should be in a system like this.
#94 Jan 07 2011 at 4:03 PM Rating: Default
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MippsCat wrote:
Quote:
The #1 issue with this game is the 10% who are unhappy with the game and feel the need to voice their opinion so loudly on the forums that they give the illusion that they are the majority, when in fact they are not.


Are you high?



Are you stupid?

The people on any forum do NOT make the majority.

And it is those with the worst opinions that speak the loudest, I'll say it again.
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#95 Jan 07 2011 at 4:03 PM Rating: Decent
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DoctorMog wrote:
Actually, my distaste is only directed at the people who look at my evidence for something, and then continue to refute my evidence with half cocked theories on how they think the game could be better.

What evidence? Were you trying to prove something? All you've done in this thread is say it's fine to be "just decent" if that's what it takes to be able to play multiple classes. Personally, I abhor such embracing of mediocrity.

Quote:

What really needs to happen to this game is that people need to stop bashing it. The #1 issue with this game is the 10% who are unhappy with the game and feel the need to voice their opinion so loudly on the forums that they give the illusion that they are the majority, when in fact they are not.

The company itself says the game sucks. That's why it's free. That's why my LS of probably ~100 members is completely dead most of the time. It's time to wake up to reality: people don't like the game.
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#96 Jan 07 2011 at 4:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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To be fair, you've both spent the majority of the whole second page derailing the thread to argue with each other, what would have been best for the boards is if you both took it to PMs, clearly you're both online wailing away at the refresh button... to the dismay of anyone left actually wanting to talk about the stat system...
#97 Jan 07 2011 at 4:06 PM Rating: Good
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DoctorMog wrote:
Who's opinion of better though?

Yours?

Put it in the correct forum, leave your bashing out of the forums people read looking for INFORMATION. Not opinions.


I'm not the one who called the other people in this thread "morons" and "dense".

And as for who's opinion is "better", I started this thread asking what people thought and expressed my opinion on the subject. I argued civilly until some name-calling occurred and even then I didn't sling anything stronger than "jerk" back, which is aimed more at behavior than the person in question (you can stop being a "jerk", but not a moron).

My opinion is what it is, and I don't feel I deserve to be called a "moron" or "dense" for expressing it. I feel like this system could be improved and I've stated how. Either you agree or you don't, but if you don't agree, you can be civil about it.
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#98 Jan 07 2011 at 4:06 PM Rating: Decent
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Omena wrote:
DoctorMog wrote:
Actually, my distaste is only directed at the people who look at my evidence for something, and then continue to refute my evidence with half cocked theories on how they think the game could be better.

What evidence? Were you trying to prove something? All you've done in this thread is say it's fine to be "just decent" if that's what it takes to be able to play multiple classes. Personally, I abhor such embracing of mediocrity.

Quote:

What really needs to happen to this game is that people need to stop bashing it. The #1 issue with this game is the 10% who are unhappy with the game and feel the need to voice their opinion so loudly on the forums that they give the illusion that they are the majority, when in fact they are not.

The company itself says the game sucks. That's why it's free. That's why my LS of probably ~100 members is completely dead most of the time. It's time to wake up to reality: people don't like the game.


Yes, I post videos and comments refuting peoples claims at "broken" and "this should be this way" and I post WHY. So yes, I post evidence of WHY things are the way they are. I also post how to work around it and use it as effective as possible.

People DO like this game. Stop pulling random opinions into posts as if they were fact.
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#99 Jan 07 2011 at 4:09 PM Rating: Default
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If anyone wants to come to a forum where people are enjoying this game, and are working to improve the knowledge of the game and community;

you are welcome to come to my LS site:

daevaofwar.com

People who think they know how to make the game better can just sit out. Otherwise you would be working for a game company already, wouldn't you?
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#100 Jan 07 2011 at 4:11 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
And it is those with the worst opinions that speak the loudest, I'll say it again.



That was a nice chuckle want to tell me what drugs you are using that amazingly poor non-existent statistics are a great way to prove a point?

If 10% people are unhappy with this game I'm fairly certain that reviews/players/the producer of the game itself wouldn't openly say the game sucks.

But on meth it is.

Try again.

Edited, Jan 7th 2011 5:12pm by MippsCat
#101 Jan 07 2011 at 4:12 PM Rating: Good
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DoctorMog wrote:

Yes, I post videos and comments refuting peoples claims at "broken" and "this should be this way" and I post WHY. So yes, I post evidence of WHY things are the way they are. I also post how to work around it and use it as effective as possible.

People DO like this game. Stop pulling random opinions into posts as if they were fact.


Fact: The game is free.

Fact: SE does not give things away for no reason.

I hate to tell you but if SE honestly believed there were enough people willing to pay for this game they would be charging us a monthly fee already. SE is not the kind of company that makes it a habit to give us things free of charge for no reason.

Though there ARE people who enjoy the game, clearly SE does not consider them the 'majority'.
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