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Magic effects need to be remade. Weapon Skill animations tooFollow

#1 Jan 10 2011 at 7:21 AM Rating: Excellent
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I posted this on the feedback forum also
http://ffxiv.zam.com/forum.html?forum=173&mid=1294664956154322385&page=1
but thought it'd be good to post up here for discussion considering there's a lot more heat in general. Weapon skills and spell effects is what you'll see the most through your DoW career, I don't want this fixed when 3/4s of my skills have fallen into oblivion.





The effects of spells are mediocre at best. Half the time its really hard to even tell what you casted.
I also dislike how there's no connection between the caster and the result (like how you can't see the spell coming out of the caster himself and shooting out towards the mob). But that's a toss up between personal taste and style.

Here you can take a look at some ancient magic in this video they posted on the conjurer forums

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wodu_aYjSdU

Thats not right. They are so small an irrelevant. Like giving the enemy a small and sudden elemental aneurism.

The same happens with weapon skill animations. Most of them are just the same weapon underswing.
Sure with weapon skills we get some variety and a few cool looking skills, but the difference in looks between most of the skills is negligible at best.

Edited, Jan 10th 2011 8:44am by MajidahSihaam
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#2 Jan 10 2011 at 7:34 AM Rating: Decent
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Some of the higher level ones, yep. Probably placeholders at best. 40-50 rank range seems like it was thrown together at the last minute really.
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#3 Jan 10 2011 at 7:49 AM Rating: Decent
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Most definitely agree!
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#4 Jan 10 2011 at 10:02 AM Rating: Good
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wish they did go back and think about the animation properties of the game, but this kind of stuff we can only hope for.
#5 Jan 10 2011 at 11:03 AM Rating: Good
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+1 from me.

Needs some more pizaz!
#6 Jan 10 2011 at 11:30 AM Rating: Default
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Well, to be fair, they effects look more impressive on large targets.
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#7 Jan 10 2011 at 11:32 AM Rating: Good
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/signed

The textures for the game are great! You can tell in the cut-scenes that the models are really huge and well rendered ... the spell effects are pretty lame, most of the sounds are too for them. :-(
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#8 Jan 10 2011 at 11:38 AM Rating: Excellent
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They also need to make new animation for battle regiment :(. I hate how for GLA it's the same 2 animations for all the attacks >.>, either a stab or a spin slash...
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#9 Jan 10 2011 at 11:38 AM Rating: Good
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I agree, Maruader got shafted on eye candy weapon skills.
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#10 Jan 10 2011 at 12:00 PM Rating: Good
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I agreed with this beforehand... now, after seeing the "ancient magic" that looks like tier-I spells from FFXI, I agree even more strongly.
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#11 Jan 10 2011 at 12:05 PM Rating: Good
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Lol that second cast in the video I barely even saw ..... DEFENIT HUGE OVERHAUL needed !
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#12 Jan 10 2011 at 12:10 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah they really need to make the effects more flashy.

They should really have put in the same amount of dedication into the animations as they did with simian thrash, seismic shock, arrow helix and luminous spire.
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#13 Jan 10 2011 at 12:26 PM Rating: Good
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Not to rub it in... but FFXI's spell effects both looked and sounded much better, and that game is a PS2 port from eight years ago!
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#14 Jan 10 2011 at 12:32 PM Rating: Default
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Not to rub it in... but FFXI's spell effects both looked and sounded much better, and that game is a PS2 port from eight years ago!


*******.

You are showing off endgame spells from this a year or so ago as your example?

I can say with confidence that lower level skills and spells aren't that impressive in either game. If rank 75 spells don't look like that later on, we have a problem. But 50? Give me a break.
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#15 Jan 10 2011 at 12:35 PM Rating: Decent
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I can't really complain about this because my THM has some really cool-looking spell animations. I agree though on the other classes. My CON spell animations are pitiful.
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#16 Jan 10 2011 at 1:07 PM Rating: Good
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Archer has some great animations.

I just wish arrows actually showed as projectiles.
#17 Jan 10 2011 at 1:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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/signed

It's an excruciating grind to get CON up to TIII/AM, give them a cookie SE!
#18 Jan 10 2011 at 1:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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Some of those were pretty sad yeah... I wonder if they'd go back to redo them. I hope they do though.
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#19 Jan 10 2011 at 1:46 PM Rating: Good
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I wasnt excited about the spell and weaponskill animations either and greatly disappointed how crappy and sad it is compared to FFXI WS and spell animations.

Hopefully they go back and redo alot of it. WS really need more variety instead of the same slashy appearance to every other melee class.
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#20 Jan 10 2011 at 2:07 PM Rating: Excellent
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KaneKitty wrote:
Not to rub it in... but FFXI's spell effects both looked and sounded much better, and that game is a PS2 port from eight years ago!


I stumbled upon that link and I have to agree. Even Stone III has more punch than any of those and that's not even anything special.

I guess they tried to make them fit the fast pace?

It's not just XIV, I literally couldn't tell the difference between most spell visuals in XIII. Not that it mattered in that game anyway..
#21 Jan 10 2011 at 2:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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The rest of the game was half finished so I don't know why you expected this to be of a high standard
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#22 Jan 10 2011 at 2:22 PM Rating: Good
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To be honest, I'd be willing to bet my computer we'll never see the current WS/spell animations change. Just hope that the new ones look more distinct.
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#23 Jan 10 2011 at 2:27 PM Rating: Good
Edited by bsphil
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Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
Not to rub it in... but FFXI's spell effects both looked and sounded much better, and that game is a PS2 port from eight years ago!


*******.

You are showing off endgame spells from this a year or so ago as your example?

I can say with confidence that lower level skills and spells aren't that impressive in either game. If rank 75 spells don't look like that later on, we have a problem. But 50? Give me a break.
FFXI's tier 1 spells and weapon skills looked more interesting than the high end spells and weapon skills in FFXIV.
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#24 Jan 10 2011 at 2:37 PM Rating: Default
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Quote:
FFXI's tier 1 spells and weapon skills looked more interesting than the high end spells and weapon skills in FFXIV.


Truly. Hot Shot > Arrow Helix. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opXanYJD_rs

Combo > Seismic Shock. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAaABkixFKo

Fast Blade > Luminous Spire. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByqVoKfoOB4


Edited, Jan 10th 2011 11:44pm by Hyanmen
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#25 Jan 10 2011 at 2:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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bsphil wrote:
Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
Not to rub it in... but FFXI's spell effects both looked and sounded much better, and that game is a PS2 port from eight years ago!


*******.

You are showing off endgame spells from this a year or so ago as your example?

I can say with confidence that lower level skills and spells aren't that impressive in either game. If rank 75 spells don't look like that later on, we have a problem. But 50? Give me a break.
FFXI's tier 1 spells and weapon skills looked more interesting than the high end spells and weapon skills in FFXIV.


I said pretty much this exact same thing in beta, the simplest skill I can think of in FFXI, Boost, is more impressive than ancient magic in FFXIV, really?
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#26 Jan 10 2011 at 2:54 PM Rating: Default
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I said pretty much this exact same thing in beta


Thank God you did, otherwise people wouldn't know just how bad these animations and effects are.

I mean, take a look at Simian Trash.. Even Boost is better looking.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KIXk51aqyM

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#27 Jan 10 2011 at 2:56 PM Rating: Good
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MajidahSihaam wrote:

I also dislike how there's no connection between the caster and the result (like how you can't see the spell coming out of the caster himself and shooting out towards the mob). But that's a toss up between personal taste and style.


This does not invalidate your concern, but this is a Final Fantasy tradition: the magic just appears, it doesn't shoot. You don't have to like it but it is something SE has done (with the exception of 13, which did shoot the magic out.)
#28 Jan 10 2011 at 3:10 PM Rating: Good
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Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
I said pretty much this exact same thing in beta


Thank God you did, otherwise people wouldn't know just how bad these animations and effects are.

I mean, take a look at Simian Trash.. Even Boost is better looking.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KIXk51aqyM



Combo, Raging Fists, Dragon Kick, and Asuran Fists all look better than that video, I think the glowyness of that fists looks kinda dumb.

It looks like he's swinging at the air, not having any impact.

Edited, Jan 10th 2011 4:11pm by FeanaroOnPhoenix
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#29 Jan 10 2011 at 3:10 PM Rating: Good
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@Hay

I love how your trying to make the game look great by comparing basic level 1 abilitys from a game made 8 YEARS ago, to some of the better animated ones. (which are VERY few and far between). Should try doing that with all of them comparing ones of all classes that are about the same level. Some are clearly decent or better, but there are so few of them.

Most of the abilitys/spells are very half assed. Can you explain the horridness that is the LNC WSs that get repeated 8+ TIMES?

Troll a bit harder next time.


as for the animations coming from them, the above guy is right, they just apepared, but its sad that they went from the cooler animations (which were usually different stances between races) go from FFXI's to FFXIV's. holding your thing to your face and its either red or purple over what FFXI did 8 years ago....its just so rushed and half assed.

Edited, Jan 10th 2011 4:12pm by zanfire
#30 Jan 10 2011 at 3:16 PM Rating: Default
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Combo look better than that video


Well, you certainly are entitled to your opinion, lol.

Quote:
I love how your trying to make the game look great by comparing basic level 1 abilitys from a game made 8 YEARS ago, to some of the better animated ones


So I am actually on-topic? *gasp*

Everyone was talking about how tier 1 ws's look better than any ws in XIV. I showed them how right they are. Sorry if I ruined your day.

In other words, trolling. Rate up.

Edited, Jan 11th 2011 12:18am by Hyanmen
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#31 Jan 10 2011 at 3:28 PM Rating: Decent
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^ wrong, they are talking about T1 AM's, which looks way better by a mile in FFXI. Other people are talking about how reptative they are, which i know personally having leveled LNC and seen the same animation, with maybe a different swirly at the end be used 8 times (one being for chaos thrust, a Multi hit WS...huge letdown)

Your just trying to skew what people see by comparing basic low level skills with higher end ones...and ones that are the few better animations. WHen you need to compare fast balde...a lvl 1 skill to LS a rank 24 skill, your trying to troll.
#32 Jan 10 2011 at 3:40 PM Rating: Default
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^ wrong, they are talking about T1 AM's


Ohh. I didn't know AM's were called "weapon skills" by the community nowadays. Geez, has it been so long already?

Ahh. Maybe they mean "T1 ultimate weapon skills" aka the relic skills? Of course! I understand now.

Quote:
by comparing basic low level skills with higher end ones.


Hey, it's not me who made the comparisons in the first place.

Edited, Jan 11th 2011 12:41am by Hyanmen
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#33 Jan 10 2011 at 3:49 PM Rating: Default
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Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
^ wrong, they are talking about T1 AM's


Ohh. I didn't know AM's were called "weapon skills" by the community nowadays. Geez, has it been so long already?

Ahh. Maybe they mean "T1 ultimate weapon skills" aka the relic skills? Of course! I understand now.

Quote:
by comparing basic low level skills with higher end ones.


Hey, it's not me who made the comparisons in the first place.

Edited, Jan 11th 2011 12:41am by Hyanmen


Aside from 1 person who made a general comparison (another said why cant they be as good as the ones you later put videos to compare to) noone pointed out lvl 1 WSs being better then anything else....only you did. YOu just wanted to show the few mentioned good ones and compare it to not so good ones from FFXI to make your point seem better. Again an 8 year old game overall had better animations...and variety in animations then its Predecessor.

**** even the names were atleast changed from one to the next, even in ones that repeated. This game went with Ver. 1-3 (even with normal abilitys, not just WSs)
#34 Jan 10 2011 at 3:56 PM Rating: Default
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Quote:
Aside from 1 person who made a general comparison


Aside from the person I quoted.. obviously.

"But they meant high level ws's, not the low lvl ones" hurrr durrr.

Quote:
compare it to not so good ones from FFXI to make your point seem better.


I thought I picked the more impressive tier 1 ws's from XI as a comparison? Maybe Tachi: Enpi but this game doesn't have a GK ws to compare yet. Do you mean.. Slice?!

Quote:
Again an 8 year old game overall had better animations


The game still has better animations than any other MMO out there, and frankly it's quite hard to do a better job than what the XI team did. The age doesn't matter in this genre.

Edited, Jan 11th 2011 12:56am by Hyanmen
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#35 Jan 10 2011 at 3:59 PM Rating: Excellent
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Not really sure this is the time or thread to be arguing in, please keep it clean everyone.

Back on point I pretty much agree with the original post. When I first saw that ancient magic video I had to rewind the video and squint because I thought either the video hiccuped or I just wasn't paying attention. Certainly anti-climactic.
#36 Jan 10 2011 at 4:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Not really sure this is the time or thread to be arguing in, please keep it clean everyone.


Not at all. This is the time and thread to baselessly bash XIV. Let's stay on topic everyone.
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#37 Jan 10 2011 at 4:06 PM Rating: Decent
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The 1 (yes only one, not "Everyone was talking about how tier 1 ws's look better than any ws in XIV" im dure that one guy is not everyone lol)

And yes it does matter, when its your second MMO, that is all hiked on hype, that is using graphics as one of its best features....you need to try a bit harder...especially when people know you can do a solid job already. Nowadays you HAVE to step it up to compete..they know that and hence whats going on right now with the game.

i find it pretty funny you seem to be getting angery and super defensive....the "hurr-durr" bit got me to chuckle a bit.


But hey keep telling us how this games so great...when even the Devs say it sucks XD

rushed half baked game is a rushed half baked game.
#38 Jan 10 2011 at 4:06 PM Rating: Excellent
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I do kinda think the animations are a bit lackluster on average when compared to XI on average.
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#39 Jan 10 2011 at 4:11 PM Rating: Decent
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FFXIV great axe > Sturmwind........why can't SE make some awesome effects 9 YEARS LATER!!!
God I'd resub to FFXI in a heartbeat if SE made a new server.
#40 Jan 10 2011 at 4:21 PM Rating: Excellent
I think the best scenario to look at in this case is the difference in quality of the Tier I and Tier II En-Spells from FFXI. THe huge difference in the quality of the animation astonished me. I used to cast the tier II en-spells sometimes just for fun because they LOOKED amazing. I was expecting THAT kind of difference between FFXI and FFXIV. Instead I got let down.
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#41 Jan 10 2011 at 4:22 PM Rating: Decent
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i find it pretty funny you seem to be getting angery and super defensive....the "hurr-durr" bit got me to chuckle a bit.


I was in the ZAM forums during the 1960's Son... 'twas a slaughter, lemme tell ya. Baseless accusations everywhere, good criticism buried under the explosions of the trolls bashing the game every chance they got.

It takes it's toll, y'know. I'm still not completely over it.. *a single tear falls on my cheek as I look to the skies above, my mind in the past*
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#42 Jan 10 2011 at 4:27 PM Rating: Default
Hyanmen wrote:
I was in the ZAM forums during the 1960's Son...


For a second I was lost. But only for a second.
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#43 Jan 10 2011 at 5:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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Many of those spells don't even hint at their element. Quake and flood just looked like vague special effects. If it is called quake, or flood, I expect to see some kind of violent upheaval of earth or at least some water, something that actually corresponds to the element and the gravity of the spell's name.

As far as weapon skills go, there are only 2 or 3 animations per class, with various streaks of color to signify a difference between otherwise indistinguishable moves.

I am surprised that SE neglected these areas, as they usually do a fairly good job with spells and abilities.

I did hear that the guy who did FFXI's animations was being hired on or put in charge or whatever, and I hope this true.
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#44 Jan 10 2011 at 5:38 PM Rating: Excellent
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Wow...

Really?

AM was on one of the few things I was looking forward to as CON. "Surely they can't ***** this up" I thought to myself, "they did such a great job in XI that even if the animations are only 1/2 as stunning they'll still be awesome." I was wrong... I can't believe they did such a mediocre job with animations in this game. Not just that, but on top of the casting time for the AM spells in XIV, you have to wait like 30 seconds after you cast it for the spell to have ANY EFFECT AT ALL. So poorly animated magic + ridiculously delayed magic effect = win?

Seriously SE?

This fails on a level that even a double facepalm could not accurately convey. *sigh*

I can only pray that 90% of the animations in the game right now are placeholders because they rushed it into production.
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#45 Jan 10 2011 at 5:40 PM Rating: Default
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Wow and to think the major reason i like this game was the graphics was looking forward to higher level spells and and let down again thanks SE or should i say FAILENIX
#46 Jan 10 2011 at 6:20 PM Rating: Good
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Square certainly created a standard which would be very difficult to beat when they made the XI animations and sound effects. The only thing they could really improve with them is using higher-resolution textures, and causing them to cast light on the environment/mobs. They failed on the lighting with XIV, since only mobs are lit by spells, and not the environment. As far as not seeing spells being emitted by the caster, XI bard songs have a very cool-looking distortion trail from the bard to each character effected by the song. I'll be very happy if they add bard sometime soon!
#47 Jan 10 2011 at 6:25 PM Rating: Good
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#48 Jan 10 2011 at 6:30 PM Rating: Good
Edited by bsphil
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Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
FFXI's tier 1 spells and weapon skills looked more interesting than the high end spells and weapon skills in FFXIV.


Truly. Hot Shot > Arrow Helix. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opXanYJD_rs

Combo > Seismic Shock. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAaABkixFKo

Fast Blade > Luminous Spire. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByqVoKfoOB4


Edited, Jan 10th 2011 11:44pm by Hyanmen
Yes, there are a couple good looking WSs. 95% are junk.
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#49 Jan 10 2011 at 7:00 PM Rating: Default
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Yes, there are a couple good looking WSs. 95% are junk.


Backhand blows, burning blades nor shadowstitchs aren't any better. And those aren't even tier 1 ws's. Usually everything looked boring as heck until later levels, with raging fists penta thrusts and rampages.

FFXIV has both many unimpressive ws's and less impressive ws's. Nothing to go crazy about in XI, nothing to go crazy about here. Sword ws's in particular were very bland and uninspiring until stuff like Savage and Vorpal blade.
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We really want to compete against World of Warcraft and for example the new Star Wars MMO.

#50jakarai, Posted: Jan 10 2011 at 10:04 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I hate to say but honestly they should just strap this whole thing that is FF XIV and start all over. Make a new game with improved EVERYTHING and don't release it early. I hope they learn from this if they ever plan to release another FF MMO.
#51 Jan 11 2011 at 12:54 AM Rating: Excellent
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I would like to see them fix the animation timings first. Half the time my killing blow spell doesn't even play the animation instead playing what looks like a failed spellcast. When I look in my combat log however I see I have successfully cast the spell and have done quite a bit of damage killing the mob.
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