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Should NPC Quests Give SP/EXP?Follow

#1 Feb 05 2011 at 5:50 PM Rating: Good
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As much as we've been enjoying the recent fixes/tweaks, most people in my LS feel that SE is at risk of losing players if the next patch doesn't include some actual content. One of the suggestions that keeps popping up is NPC quests.

At the moment our only options for leveling are grinding, Levequests, and Behest. When SE does get around to adding NPC quests, do you think they should award SP/EXP upon completion or just gil/items/fame a la FFXI?
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#2 Feb 05 2011 at 5:57 PM Rating: Decent
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I vote NPC quests give SP/EXP, but at maybe 75% the rate that partying gains it. I am all for questing to level, but not when it overshadows actually grouping with others and communicating. I think the major point of a MMO, is communication and teamwork.
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#3 Feb 05 2011 at 5:58 PM Rating: Good
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Gil/Items/Fame only. There are enough ways to SP/EXP.

Everything in the game shouldn't be geared towards hitting cap as quickly as possible...

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#4 Feb 05 2011 at 5:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Yes Please
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#5 Feb 05 2011 at 6:23 PM Rating: Good
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Kashius wrote:
Gil/Items/Fame only. There are enough ways to SP/EXP.

Everything in the game shouldn't be geared towards hitting cap as quickly as possible...

-KW-

This.
#6 Feb 05 2011 at 6:34 PM Rating: Good
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XenoKrates wrote:
Kashius wrote:
Gil/Items/Fame only. There are enough ways to SP/EXP.

Everything in the game shouldn't be geared towards hitting cap as quickly as possible...

-KW-

This.


Thirded
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#7 Feb 05 2011 at 7:16 PM Rating: Good
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I believe if quests gave sp/exp then the ranks for levelling would be drastically increased ala other mmo's who use that system. 100k tnl is rediculiously low otherwise.
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#8 Feb 05 2011 at 7:51 PM Rating: Good
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And how do you propose we are going to get SP for which disciple in said quest? Pick story quest, there is no limit to what Disciple you're at to do the quest, nor is there a limit to how many Disciples you changed into in the middle of the quest. Even during DoH quest like Carpenter r30 one or Goldsmith r30 where there is a bit of supporting the NPC fighting mob, I just switch to my DoW and pwnz the mob instead because it's faster. How are we going to get SP in such example? A specific Disciple only, or all of the Disciples you used in said quest?
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#9 Feb 05 2011 at 8:26 PM Rating: Excellent
Dranio wrote:
XenoKrates wrote:
Kashius wrote:
Gil/Items/Fame only. There are enough ways to SP/EXP.

Everything in the game shouldn't be geared towards hitting cap as quickly as possible...

-KW-

This.


Thirded



Going to have to go with this. Implementing a fair distribution system with the current armory seems problematic at best. Not to mention, SP is practically easy to get with the recent patch. Also, I'd really rather avoid them adding "Kill 10 of X mob, 12 of Y mob, 14 of Z mob" quests. We already have those. They're called Guildleves. What we need are story based quests (as was mentioned in the survey).
#10 Feb 05 2011 at 9:05 PM Rating: Good
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Polls/questions like this are like asking: "Would you like cheese on your ham sandwich?"

My first response is YES!!!

Until I realize that you put a loaf of Velveeta on it...

Personally even if EXP quests are done wrong (with extra Velveeta), I still would welcome the notion...especially if our only choices are guildleves and grinding solo. (As the OP alludes to)

When I think of quest exp, I think just that; a quest that gives EXP. Anything other than that is pure speculation on what type of system would be implemented.

Now should quests be the primary form of leveling? That's an entirely different question.

Again I wouldn't mind a system like that if it was done creatively; perhaps a behest like system where the game would manage the parties. For instance for a certain quest you need four people to start it. Once the quest was done you couldn't do it again, and in the end you get loot, EXP and whatever else.

#11 Feb 05 2011 at 9:16 PM Rating: Decent
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I think quests should give SP. They always do in RPGs, all RPGs.
It's part of what makes a quest a quest in an RPG.

Just doesn't have to be a lot. If its 1k or something that's not really so bad.
This game isn't going to have 10,000 quests most likely.

But make quests different from leves, not kill quests. Leves are kill quests.
As quests generally won't be 100% killing mobs, you should still be progressing your character not just grinding faction. if you remember in FFXI how many quests were for BS rewards..

I don't think quests should be giving 10K SP or anything, and repeatable quests should be minimal.
If you beat, for example, a quest arc for a special weapon you should get like 1k SP upon completion.
If you defeat a storyline boss give 3k. FFXI did this too, remember how Promyvions gave 1k EXP? It's one way to at least give some benefit to people helping others on quests.

I mean if a quest gives 10k Gil and 1k SP, it's not going to be what you grind on to level up or make money.
Since you can already grind SP at 150-600SP per kill(assuming your above 30), whats the harm in making a 30 minute - 3 hour quest give like 1k? Questing will never replace grinding unless they add thousands of quests.

Realistically we're going to see quests more like FFXI, not like WoW, and in that scenario I'm fine with getting 250 SP, or 500, or 1000, or more, depending on the quest, and its difficulty. I don't think anyone wants or expects 10k SP rewards where 10 quests will level you at 49.

Edited, Feb 5th 2011 10:17pm by Eadieni
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#12 Feb 05 2011 at 9:20 PM Rating: Default
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Raiziell wrote:
I vote NPC quests give SP/EXP, but at maybe 75% the rate that partying gains it. I am all for questing to level, but not when it overshadows actually grouping with others and communicating. I think the major point of a MMO, is communication and teamwork.


I think it should give sp/exp, but if your are a DOW or DOM, it shouldn't be as much as say, a DOL or DOH should receive. DOL and DOH only have synthing and leves to do in order to level. THe DOW and DOM have grinding, mobs and behest. I think if you are a DOL and DOH you should get decent sp/exp.

IF they were to give items and gil, it better not be like the quests in XI, being chinsy about it. IT should be something that is non-tradable and decent. (Not saying all NPC quest gear was awful, but the starting ones that I remember were.)
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#13 Feb 05 2011 at 9:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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I agree with the no SP/EXP for quests crowd as well. If anything besides gil/gear/fame, NPC quests could award faction points, which aren't dependent upon class at all, and would be useful for NM hunts or any other activity that would be faction related in the future.
#14 Feb 05 2011 at 9:42 PM Rating: Decent
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Khornette wrote:
And how do you propose we are going to get SP for which disciple in said quest? Pick story quest, there is no limit to what Disciple you're at to do the quest, nor is there a limit to how many Disciples you changed into in the middle of the quest. Even during DoH quest like Carpenter r30 one or Goldsmith r30 where there is a bit of supporting the NPC fighting mob, I just switch to my DoW and pwnz the mob instead because it's faster. How are we going to get SP in such example? A specific Disciple only, or all of the Disciples you used in said quest?



I agree. And even more so when it comes to the disciplines.
#15 Feb 05 2011 at 9:57 PM Rating: Excellent
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Faction points or some kind of quest points, yeah.

SP/EXP, no. Especially after the last patch. We have the means to get EXP and SP now, I want to use that EXP and SP to do something cool. Like save the world, or save some children from some Am'djdaa's(sp? those ogre things) that kidnapped them in an instance or whatever. Maybe get EXP and SP from killing the mobs related to the quest, but not as a reward for completion.
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#16 Feb 05 2011 at 10:12 PM Rating: Excellent
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Serielley wrote:
I agree with the no SP/EXP for quests crowd as well. If anything besides gil/gear/fame, NPC quests could award faction points, which aren't dependent upon class at all, and would be useful for NM hunts or any other activity that would be faction related in the future.


I'm going with this also. Quests to me are those little side stories and adventures you do to take a break from the XP grind. It's the part of FF11 that I liked so much; there are hundreds of quests available in that game. Most only awarded you extremely small sums of gil or a RA/EX item that was just about useless, but it was the journey of discovery that you made traveling around that made them enjoyable. Heck, I still have a mog house full of random gear/items from all the quests I've done. I don't feel I need to be rewarded with SP/XP just for completing a quest, I already have those with the guildleves. Ask anyone who played FF11 about the SOB or Serpent Generals quests, the stories alone made them worth the time and effort to complete them.

I'm not saying the devs should turn this into FF11-2, but we have plenty of ways to earn SP/XP now. I just hope we get what Final Fantasy games are known for, the epic stories and adventures. Quests are one part of bringing that to us, making us part of the world we are in.
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#17 Feb 05 2011 at 10:29 PM Rating: Decent
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i think the only quest that should give any amount of sp or exp are like assault or bcnms from ff11 you still have to do some battle cause i think its pointless to get exp/sp for runnng around and talking to this person and that person. the mobs should be appropriate to the level of the highest member of the party and there should be a exp penalty for people who go in that are to far below the level of that person to prevent power leveling like abyssea parties in ff11
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#18 Feb 05 2011 at 10:55 PM Rating: Excellent
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If you examine FFXI's quest design there's a lot of reason to why its so engrossing while it gives you otherwise sh*tty rewards for their average fetch quests.

One thing, Quest in FFXI were open to how you went about them. There's a point A and B and C but you had different options to get to those points. Sometimes it was having your homies tag along. Sometimes its buying the item from the auction house instead of farming it. Sometimes it was Sneak and Invising.

The rewards for XI's quest went beyond cash and items. You also received fame, an invisible stat that is persistant and opened new quest, gear, and gameplay possibilities. The biggest rewards for FFXI's quest were the fact that new gameplay opened along with them. Sometimes it was unlocking access to new areas, The ability to ride certain points of transportation, the ability to continue leveling, the ability to equip a subjob.

In FFXIV we have a few pieces of progress that go beyond gear, items and money. These include:

Guild Marks : Can act like merit points. Can open up new actions and strategies. General Class upgrade currency.
Faction Points: The simplification of Seals and guildlevequest Fame.

One opens up new skill possibilities and combinations and the other one opens up more quest. In the main story quest you gained the ability to parley. They could continue with awarding guildmarks and faction points for upcoming quest and miniquest and i will be A ok with that.

Edited, Feb 6th 2011 12:01am by zhinse
#19 Feb 05 2011 at 11:04 PM Rating: Default
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i vote for SP/EXP gains for NPC quests simply because i dont believe this game should be 140% niche, i think this would be a good factor in stabalizing server populations in general.
however i also believe most quests should consist of some fighting one way or another if the quest itself is very time consuming. i remember so many times in FFXI having to spend hours upon hours of traveling and dodging True sight mobs all just so i can talk to one NPC way out in the middle of @#%^ing nowhere. it made me feel like i didnt really accomplish anything, i just wasted an excess amount of time. so had there been a few quest related feasibly solo-able/small group battles with some good SP/EXP and a NPC reward at the end i would have been in heaven and never would have left.
so if a quest just requres you to do some chatting then no i dont think there should be any SP/XP, but keep the time sink at a bit more reasonable pls.
the reason why that concerns me is because id love to bring in my friends who are unfamiliar with FF to this game however its going to take some familiar elements to convince them to try it. i think it takes alot more for an MMO to be a WoW clone than just having a handful of basic Modern MMO features.

someone above mentioned possibly having the quests give reduced SP/EXP rates which to me sounds great for solo NPC questing.

Edited, Feb 6th 2011 12:13am by pixelpop
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#20 Feb 05 2011 at 11:08 PM Rating: Good
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No, because it's incompatible with FFXIV's multiple jobs-per-hero system.

What would better is if more leves per day would be available. Those would serve as generic kill task quests.
#21 Feb 05 2011 at 11:29 PM Rating: Decent
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XenoKrates wrote:
Kashius wrote:
Gil/Items/Fame only. There are enough ways to SP/EXP.

Everything in the game shouldn't be geared towards hitting cap as quickly as possible...

-KW-

This.


Dranio wrote:
XenoKrates wrote:
Kashius wrote:
Gil/Items/Fame only. There are enough ways to SP/EXP.

Everything in the game shouldn't be geared towards hitting cap as quickly as possible...

-KW-

This.


Thirded



Why can't it give both? I'm at marauder 32 and I need like 40k SP to rank up. I'm not gonna get that from questing. Maybe if we put together all the available quests I'd get one good level? Why wouldn't quests give SP is beyond me. I hate grinding and I tolerate leves. I want to quest. A lot of quests require to team up and socialize and its a lot more challenging than doing a freaking leve.
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#22 Feb 05 2011 at 11:30 PM Rating: Decent
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zhinse wrote:
If you examine FFXI's quest design there's a lot of reason to why its so engrossing while it gives you otherwise sh*tty rewards for their average fetch quests.

One thing, Quest in FFXI were open to how you went about them. There's a point A and B and C but you had different options to get to those points. Sometimes it was having your homies tag along. Sometimes its buying the item from the auction house instead of farming it. Sometimes it was Sneak and Invising.

The rewards for XI's quest went beyond cash and items. You also received fame, an invisible stat that is persistant and opened new quest, gear, and gameplay possibilities. The biggest rewards for FFXI's quest were the fact that new gameplay opened along with them. Sometimes it was unlocking access to new areas, The ability to ride certain points of transportation, the ability to continue leveling, the ability to equip a subjob.

In FFXIV we have a few pieces of progress that go beyond gear, items and money. These include:

Guild Marks : Can act like merit points. Can open up new actions and strategies. General Class upgrade currency.
Faction Points: The simplification of Seals and guildlevequest Fame.

One opens up new skill possibilities and combinations and the other one opens up more quest. In the main story quest you gained the ability to parley. They could continue with awarding guildmarks and faction points for upcoming quest and miniquest and i will be A ok with that.

Edited, Feb 6th 2011 12:01am by zhinse


Good point. XIV needs a fame quest system.
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#23 Feb 05 2011 at 11:46 PM Rating: Decent
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I think that quests should give some exp/sp, however it shouldn't be anything huge. I think it should still be faster to party up for exp, but hey, if your doing quests why shouldn't you get a little exp out of it?
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#24 Feb 06 2011 at 3:08 AM Rating: Excellent
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NOoOooooooo Nononononononooooo!

What a terrible terrible idea.

I'd like to have something more meaningful that I can't obtain from anywhere else. Like in XI.

Fame would be plus too.
#25 Feb 06 2011 at 3:38 AM Rating: Good
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I would like nice gear and item rewards (maybe unique stuff like an empress band that only has 10 charges on it non refillable) or fame/gil. Just this time I'd like there to be an option that we can choose as a reward. If the quest reward is a weapon, let us pick from a few in case we don't need a spear or a sword. Or perhaps rewards based off what class you complete it as. For example, if I complete the quest on Pug I get some new Hora or a new shirt style armor. A bow or hunting tunic style armor as Arc, etc.

*Wow that was almost incoherent, I'm going to bed.
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#26 Feb 06 2011 at 3:49 AM Rating: Decent
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This game is soooooooooooo staying niche
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#27 Feb 06 2011 at 3:54 AM Rating: Excellent
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tylerbee wrote:
This game is soooooooooooo staying niche


Not sure if you mean that in a good or a bad way.
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#28 Feb 06 2011 at 4:08 AM Rating: Excellent
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MajidahSihaam wrote:


Why can't it give both? I'm at marauder 32 and I need like 40k SP to rank up. I'm not gonna get that from questing. Maybe if we put together all the available quests I'd get one good level? Why wouldn't quests give SP is beyond me. I hate grinding and I tolerate leves. I want to quest. A lot of quests require to team up and socialize and its a lot more challenging than doing a freaking leve.


In Air Rivals I can do my appropriate "quests" (the generic go kill x mobs and gain ridiculous exp and money that everyone seems to want and love with MMOs) for my level range which is about 5-10 side missions and 1-2 main missions and get 30-50% of my xp required TNL then I have to grind out the rest of it.

So I vote no because quests should be about the story/backstory/character story and not another way of leveling up. I don't care if you have 20 imps invading your farm and you will reward me 70% of my XP bar for getting rid of them. I want to know why they are and if they've been up to other shenanigans around the world (i.e chain of quests ala Star Onion Brigade.)


Transmigration wrote:
tylerbee wrote:
This game is soooooooooooo staying niche


Not sure if you mean that in a good or a bad way.


When people say this they m ean it in a bad way because it won't be easy mainstream trash gameplay that appeals to everyone despite the fact MMORPGs still remain a niche genre in itself.

Quest Example:

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Downward_Helix

This is a quest.


Quote:
NPC: Please kill 10 boars to prove your worth!
Reward: 16,570 XP
(Currency): 300
Item/Weapon: Leather Armor


This is not a quest.

Also since someone will bring it up:

Quote:
NPC: Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. Integer pulvinar, velit in porttitor egestas, risus magna ultricies leo, eget dignissim ante erat ac nunc. Mauris sollicitudin interdum quam nec semper. Nam risus diam, semper eu fermentum eget, facilisis sit amet ligula. Etiam ante elit, volutpat dignissim pharetra ut, commodo eget ante. Sed mollis, nunc ut pellentesque accumsan, tortor erat elementum neque, sit amet ultrices sem elit eu arcu. Curabitur volutpat porttitor pretium. Ut mattis tempus ligula sed ornare. Donec mollis sem ac neque egestas accumsan. Morbi tincidunt, augue quis aliquam mattis, ipsum sapien elementum tortor, nec rutrum lorem augue eu tellus. Quisque viverra nisl commodo sem dictum accumsan at eu velit. Aliquam erat volutpat. Sed nec est sed justo sodales pharetra. Phasellus odio elit, interdum ut rhoncus non, congue sed ipsum. Fusce ac lorem tempor risus tempor cursus et tempor nunc.
Target: 4 Boars
3x Minks
4x Wolf Cub
5x Fire Spewing Goblins
1x Baby Eating Goat
Reward: 20,800 XP
(Currency): 8000
Item/Weapon: Sword of Lorem


Is also not a quest either. Why do I have to slaughter a certain amount of species because it's invading your ipsum? What's their backstory? Is it only because they're invading? it's also why I don't consider Guildleves quests like some say it is.

Giving exp rewards for quests make it feel like you only want to do quests for the reward and not the story (you know, what RPGs are mainly about? Since you know you're assuming a role in a world and everything.)

As much **** as XI got for lack of rewarding quests it actually offered nice insights into the history/backstory of a lot of events/nations/etc.

Edited, Feb 6th 2011 2:48am by Theonehio
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#29Rinsui, Posted: Feb 06 2011 at 4:17 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) SP/EXP for quests? Why not?
#30 Feb 06 2011 at 4:37 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
SP/EXP for quests? Why not?


Not everything in the game must be for the sake of "getting to the cap ASAP SO I CAN START RAIDING!!"
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#31 Feb 06 2011 at 6:00 AM Rating: Decent
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Mistress Theonehio wrote:
MajidahSihaam wrote:

Transmigration wrote:
[quote=tylerbee]This game is soooooooooooo staying niche


Not sure if you mean that in a good or a bad way.


When people say this they m ean it in a bad way because it won't be easy mainstream trash gameplay that appeals to everyone despite the fact MMORPGs still remain a niche genre in itself.


To be clear, I just wanted to say that FFXIV is one of the easiest if not the easiest MMO i've ever played in terms of difficulty based on skill, I could literally train a monkey to level in this game.

If by easy you mean smoothing out the hideous and pointless leveling curve by adding quest based and objective based leveling, then maybe we can agree on that definition.

Also, being niche can be interpreted either way. I'd say the people still playing believe the game staying niche is a good thing. There are others who believe leveling content in most mainstream MMOs is a good thing. It all depends on your perception.

Indeed, MMOS are a niche genre. So what happens to the niche genre inside the niche genre? You could even add another niche genre on top of that (Final Fantasy Fans) if you wanted :P
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#32 Feb 06 2011 at 6:08 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
To be clear, I just wanted to say that FFXIV is one of the easiest if not the easiest MMO i've ever played in terms of difficulty based on skill, I could literally train a monkey to level in this game.


Give us an example of an MMO where this doesn't apply.
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We really want to compete against World of Warcraft and for example the new Star Wars MMO.

#33 Feb 06 2011 at 9:05 AM Rating: Decent
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Depends on the types of quests really. Non-repeatable, one time quests such as the spell-scroll quests from FFXI, those are big enough rewards that SP isn't needed, plus they are meant to be done at any level really. If its a guided experience/progression type quest, along the lines of guild leves or WOW quests, then they absolutely should.
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#34 Feb 06 2011 at 9:16 AM Rating: Good
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I like quests for items. Even if they are not great items.

I like in FFXI when someone would say, "Where did you get those Power Sandals" and I would tell them it was some random quest I got in Selbina. The quest was one of ooodles where you had to travel afar, kill or sneak past mobs, and recover some items and return it to the NPC. Many times where was a decent stoyline along with it and completing the quest would trigger the next quest, which was a continuation of the story.

****, in FFXI they managed to turn a map quest into a week long goal (was it crawler's next that was so involved?).

#35 Feb 06 2011 at 9:19 AM Rating: Good
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Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
To be clear, I just wanted to say that FFXIV is one of the easiest if not the easiest MMO i've ever played in terms of difficulty based on skill, I could literally train a monkey to level in this game.


Give us an example of an MMO where this doesn't apply.


Having played through almost every FF game I'd say XI is the hardest of them all even if you count in all the hardest extra bosses in FF games. So so very very hard and dying has the most impact which keeps me on my toes at all times when exploring new areas as one false step can cost me huge chunk of xp.

Doing quests and even normal crafting sometimes can take up days or weeks of planning which makes accomplishments incredibly rewarding.

I remember how much planning getting the pup job unlocked was and no game quest comes even close to that level of involvement. Veterans in XI tell me that quest was a "cakewalk" o_O()

If you can train a monkey to play XI for me to lvl my BLM from 59 to 100 I'd say you're an AMAZING monkey trainer and should probably host your own tv-show about it!
#36 Feb 06 2011 at 9:32 AM Rating: Excellent
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tylerbee wrote:
This game is soooooooooooo staying niche


Best news I've heard all day. If I wanted to play a game with mechanics exactly like most/all of the mainstream games currently out, I'd be off playing those games and not stalking these forums. For the love of all that is holy, please keep FFXIV niche. :)
#37 Feb 06 2011 at 9:36 AM Rating: Good
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No, I don't want quests to give SP/XP. They should be solely for the reason of immersion with the world of Eorzea and its inhabitants.
I want Story to beinvolved, not leveling content.

Some should give Item rewards if it fits with the Quest itself, but not each one should be.
#38 Feb 06 2011 at 9:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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They should reward fame and some items and they should have some that make life a little easier if you take the time to do them.

For example how FFXI had gobbie bag quests for more inventory space. Or the quests that allowed you to exit your mog house into and district of the town you were in stuff like that.

Its to bad they don't have spells though like FFXI where you had to do a quest for a spell or pay a huge amount of gil for it.


Edited, Feb 6th 2011 10:55am by nickb91
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#39 Feb 06 2011 at 10:04 AM Rating: Default
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Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
SP/EXP for quests? Why not?


Not everything in the game must be for the sake of "getting to the cap ASAP SO I CAN START RAIDING!!"



Isn't that really what we do anyways? Get to cap asap to do end-game and advanced content? Get XXX job to YY level so I can join LS events that call for capped jobs. I heard people say constantly in FF11 the need to get to 75 so I can do CoP, Sky, Dynamis, Limbus, Sea, KS99, HNM. People always talked down about WoW like everything was handed to people, it was easy mode. I don't see the opposite of lfg for 6 hours on DRG being the optimal better deal, not like FF11 or even 14 are "hard", in fact with SP being adjusted I would say leveling in 14 is easier then WoW. I don't see a problem with quest rewards for exp/sp, I'm not talking significant gains, but is it any different then weekly quests from FF11 or doing FoV every new game day? lol no... If adding exp/sp adds an aspect to the game that makes it enjoyable for people who like to do quests why not? Sure beats sitting at camps for an hour to just get beat out for behest.
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#40 Feb 06 2011 at 10:28 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Isn't that really what we do anyways? Get to cap asap to do end-game and advanced content?


"we"?

Maybe after the first time, but the second+ time around is never as fun as the first time was. Journey > destination, although you can still somewhat enjoy the game when you reach that destination. At that point efficiency is more important than "having fun" doing what you do.

It doesn't have to be that way the first time, even if all MMO's lead you to believe so.

Edited, Feb 6th 2011 7:28pm by Hyanmen
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#41 Feb 06 2011 at 10:34 AM Rating: Good
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AnnabelleCloud wrote:
Hyanmen wrote:
[quote]SP/EXP for quests? Why not?

I don't see a problem with quest rewards for exp/sp, I'm not talking significant gains, but is it any different then weekly quests from FF11 or doing FoV every new game day? lol no... If adding exp/sp adds an aspect to the game that makes it enjoyable for people who like to do quests why not? Sure beats sitting at camps for an hour to just get beat out for behest.


It is different from XI. For one thing quests are supposed to give you story. Fields of Valor has not even "flavor text". It probably makes it enjoyable for people because they don't care for story.
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#42 Feb 06 2011 at 10:34 AM Rating: Excellent
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tylerbee wrote:
This game is soooooooooooo staying niche


It's not that I want the game to be as far away from EQ/WOW as possible, it's that the exp-per-quest thing is extremely awkward and probably pointless for a game where you can level all your classes on a single character. You are not going to be able to go back on new classes to redo these quests for experience.

Actually, we already have the workings of a questing system for leveling. They put in repeatable quests that grant exp via the leve system. That's what they should focus on if they want to emulate EQ/WOW objective-based leveling.
#43 Feb 06 2011 at 11:25 AM Rating: Decent
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Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
Isn't that really what we do anyways? Get to cap asap to do end-game and advanced content?


"we"?

Maybe after the first time, but the second+ time around is never as fun as the first time was. Journey > destination, although you can still somewhat enjoy the game when you reach that destination. At that point efficiency is more important than "having fun" doing what you do.


Edited, Feb 6th 2011 7:28pm by Hyanmen


So adding quests with a storyline that helps leveling a job wouldn't be "fun" no matter is it's 2+?
To me what isn't fun:
1. Waiting an hour for a behest you might not get to do because of 30 ppl also waiting.
2. Leves that reset every 36 hours.
3. Mindlessly killing the same mobs over and over *(and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.)

Between leve resets and being lucky enough to do a behest with 30 other people clicking the battlewarden and killing the same mob * why not add content based quests that envelop you into the game that has a small exp/sp gain? I get 2 hours on a good week night to play, once leves are done what else is there to do for fun that doesn't include behest or mass mob killing time sink, nada, zero, zilch. Almost everyone here saying no to quests exp/sp is refering back to FF11, next time you log in check which FF this is. If SE doesn't adapt to a broader audience that goes outside of FF faithfuls they are severely limiting $$ to be made.
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#44 Feb 06 2011 at 11:41 AM Rating: Good
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AnnabelleCloud wrote:
Almost everyone here saying no to quests exp/sp is refering back to FF11, next time you log in check which FF this is. If SE doesn't adapt to a broader audience that goes outside of FF faithfuls they are severely limiting $$ to be made.


People refer back to XI because it's *gasp* a good example of what quests are with no Exp rewards.

AnnabelleCloud wrote:

why not add content based quests that envelop you into the game


Why not just add quests that gives you story and immerse you into the world without needing to be rewarded for doing so?
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#45 Feb 06 2011 at 11:50 AM Rating: Good
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Mistress Theonehio wrote:
AnnabelleCloud wrote:
Almost everyone here saying no to quests exp/sp is refering back to FF11, next time you log in check which FF this is. If SE doesn't adapt to a broader audience that goes outside of FF faithfuls they are severely limiting $$ to be made.


People refer back to XI because it's *gasp* a good example of what quests are with no Exp rewards.

AnnabelleCloud wrote:

why not add content based quests that envelop you into the game


Why not just add quests that gives you story and immerse you into the world without needing to be rewarded for doing so?


Actually FFXI had a lot of quests that had exp rewards so that point isn't true. There were A LOT of quests in FFXI that I didn't do simply because A.) Didn't need to do them because fame was repeatable. B.) Reward was maybe 100gil if they offered one at all. C.) Didn't advance my character progression all it did was clear quest log. Actual reasons other then to simply say not to do it.
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#46 Feb 06 2011 at 11:53 AM Rating: Good
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I vote no. I'd hate to see sp turn into quest grinds, it's one of the main things that made quit playing WoW, along with no controller support, lousy PvE endgame, and a bad community. Those 4 things are my main draws in an mmo, and I'd really like for SE to get them right like they did in FFXI.

They're already too close to a bad leveling system, and for a while there it was downright not usable to me. Since the sp change, parties have come back, so that's good... But leves/behest grinds are still too close to being the main way to level for me. But thankfully, traditional sp parties are still doable. Would be nice to get a few more mobs and maybe seal drops or something as an incentive to get more people lfp, but hey, I'll take limited party sp over no party sp, as I only sp in parties and try to avoid leve grinds.

If I feel like solo'ing I'll fire up my 360. If I'm online in FFXIV, I'm lfp, and it's not for quest grinds. :P
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#47 Feb 06 2011 at 11:54 AM Rating: Default
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AnnabelleCloud wrote:
Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
Isn't that really what we do anyways? Get to cap asap to do end-game and advanced content?


"we"?

Maybe after the first time, but the second+ time around is never as fun as the first time was. Journey > destination, although you can still somewhat enjoy the game when you reach that destination. At that point efficiency is more important than "having fun" doing what you do.


Edited, Feb 6th 2011 7:28pm by Hyanmen


So adding quests with a storyline that helps leveling a job wouldn't be "fun" no matter is it's 2+?
To me what isn't fun:
1. Waiting an hour for a behest you might not get to do because of 30 ppl also waiting.
2. Leves that reset every 36 hours.
3. Mindlessly killing the same mobs over and over *(and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.)

Between leve resets and being lucky enough to do a behest with 30 other people clicking the battlewarden and killing the same mob * why not add content based quests that envelop you into the game that has a small exp/sp gain? I get 2 hours on a good week night to play, once leves are done what else is there to do for fun that doesn't include behest or mass mob killing time sink, nada, zero, zilch. Almost everyone here saying no to quests exp/sp is refering back to FF11, next time you log in check which FF this is. If SE doesn't adapt to a broader audience that goes outside of FF faithfuls they are severely limiting $$ to be made.


I agree with you 100%. I usually want something to do after my leves, that doesn't involve grinding. In the higher camps it's hard as **** to join behests. Most monsters respawn too slow for me to tolerate grinding. So I would prefer some SP/EXP for the quests, maybe not as much as the leves. Now every quest doesn't have to have SP/EXP rewards, but I would say at least half of them should.
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#48 Feb 06 2011 at 11:59 AM Rating: Decent
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That is what I am trying to get at Terra, I agree. I'm not saying quest exp/sp has to be enough to seriously level a job with like leves, behest, or grinding. Just enough to get a small story about NPCs in this game with a small reward. Make me feel like a part of a storyline in the game not just a person who can press 1 1 1 4 3 3 1 1 1 5 6 1 1 1.
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#49 Feb 06 2011 at 12:01 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Between leve resets and being lucky enough to do a behest with 30 other people clicking the battlewarden and killing the same mob


You are doing something horribly wrong if you have to deal with leve resets yet are surrounded by 30 other people competing for a Behest spot. I would have leves to do for 6+ hours in that scenario, enough for one night at the very least (and more the next day if needed).

Leves and Behest is all the content XIV needs for EXPing purposes (although I guess hamlet battles will help soloers too), especially when fleshed out properly. The rest of the content doesn't need to make the already fast leveling even faster. In addition, grouping is also fun. Doing quests isn't as fun.

Quote:
Make me feel like a part of a storyline in the game not just a person who can press


And you would do these quests only if they had a reward? You're not looking for a storyline, you're looking for a carrot on a stick. People should see these stories because they want to immerse themselves and be a part of the "world", not because they give +1000 SP and a Chainmail. If you need that +1000 SP to do them, you're not looking for a story nor lore, you just want the reward.



Edited, Feb 6th 2011 9:04pm by Hyanmen
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#50 Feb 06 2011 at 12:04 PM Rating: Decent
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AnnabelleCloud wrote:
That is what I am trying to get at Terra, I agree. I'm not saying quest exp/sp has to be enough to seriously level a job with like leves, behest, or grinding. Just enough to get a small story about NPCs in this game with a small reward. Make me feel like a part of a storyline in the game not just a person who can press 1 1 1 4 3 3 1 1 1 5 6 1 1 1.


Which said quests you didn't do in XI made you feel, because their purpose was for story/making you feel like you're actually part of the world by helping them.

The quests you mention that gave XP were escort/tour type quests which weren't that plentiful actually. Unless in the 8 years I've played XI I somehow missed getting the exp from all of the non escort quests I did?

@Bolded:

You mentioned also:

Quote:
There were A LOT of quests in FFXI that I didn't do simply because A.) Didn't need to do them because fame was repeatable. B.) Reward was maybe 100gil if they offered one at all. C.) Didn't advance my character progression all it did was clear quest log.


For wanting to feel apart of the world you ignored a lot of quests because you wouldn't be rewarded or had your character progressed.

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#51 Feb 06 2011 at 12:08 PM Rating: Decent
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Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
Between leve resets and being lucky enough to do a behest with 30 other people clicking the battlewarden and killing the same mob


You are doing something horribly wrong if you have to deal with leve resets yet are surrounded by 30 other people competing for a Behest spot. I would have leves to do for 6+ hours in that scenario, enough for one night at the very least (and more the next day if needed).

Leves and Behest is all the content XIV needs for EXPing purposes (although I guess hamlet battles will help soloers too), especially when fleshed out properly. The rest of the content doesn't need to make the already fast leveling even faster. In addition, grouping is also fun. Doing quests isn't as fun.

Quote:
Make me feel like a part of a storyline in the game not just a person who can press


And you would do these quests only if they had a reward? You're not looking for a storyline, you're looking for a carrot on a stick. People should see these stories because they want to immerse themselves and be a part of the "world", not because they give +1000 SP and a Chainmail.

Edited, Feb 6th 2011 9:03pm by Hyanmen


Once people finish leves and even time between leves people camp the battlewardens at the top of the hour.

The only reason I did some quests (as did a lot of people) was to get for example a scroll of sleepga2, warp, drain, teleport scroll, Brygid the stylist armors. Quests in FF11 were mostly done for items, either for a job or to be sold. How many people did scroll quests on alts for the gil?
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