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Fatigue, the great equalizerFollow

#1 Feb 08 2011 at 4:58 PM Rating: Decent
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So with the new SP changes, it is time to go back to that old conversation we have all loved....Fatigue.

As we now have a highly increased SP gain, I am not looking at it as more of something we do need in order to keep people from hitting 50 in 1-2 weeks rather then a feature that didnt affect any buy the most addicted players or those who only play 1 job period.

So I say, fatigue is now a good thing! It will keep people from really overdoing it and racing to 50 in 1 week.

Before leveling was slow, now its a bit too quick.(until you hit fatigue which only slightly slows it)

Lets hear some other thoughts on this.
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#2 Feb 08 2011 at 5:02 PM Rating: Good
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They need it because there's nothing to do at 50 yet. If there was endgame content I'd say they should get rid of or at least drastically reduce fatigue.
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#3 Feb 08 2011 at 5:03 PM Rating: Good
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I think fatigue now serves its purpose. You can grind for about 8 hours and get close to full fatigue now, or play for about 2 hours, hit fatigue, then change jobs. When it took 8 hours to make you lose 10 SP a kill, it was just an annoyance. Now, 2 hours and you start losing 20-50 a kill, and its suddenly powerful
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#4 Feb 08 2011 at 5:05 PM Rating: Good
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Eadieni wrote:
I think fatigue now serves its purpose. You can grind for about 8 hours and get close to full fatigue now, or play for about 2 hours, hit fatigue, then change jobs. When it took 8 hours to make you lose 10 SP a kill, it was just an annoyance. Now, 2 hours and you start losing 20-50 a kill, and its suddenly powerful


another way to look at it

before the change
180 hours to hit 50
now 60 hours to hit 50 if not faster

thats not counting fatigue, 60 is way too quick so fatigue will actualy raise that bar, unless you only level when off fatigue

Edited, Feb 8th 2011 3:05pm by Vedis
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#5 Feb 08 2011 at 6:09 PM Rating: Decent
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Vedis wrote:
So with the new SP changes, it is time to go back to that old conversation we have all loved....Fatigue.

As we now have a highly increased SP gain, I am not looking at it as more of something we do need in order to keep people from hitting 50 in 1-2 weeks rather then a feature that didnt affect any buy the most addicted players or those who only play 1 job period.

So I say, fatigue is now a good thing! It will keep people from really overdoing it and racing to 50 in 1 week.

Before leveling was slow, now its a bit too quick.(until you hit fatigue which only slightly slows it)

Lets hear some other thoughts on this.


I really wouldn't have such an issue with it if reassigning points wasn't such a time sink. I mean people who only like melees are pretty fine right now but if my Conjurer gets fatigued then I don't really wanna go to THM. No offense but it's just too similar for me. I wanna hit up PGL. GLA. MRD. I hope I'm not alone in that mindset.
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#6 Feb 08 2011 at 6:25 PM Rating: Decent
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Kitprower wrote:
Vedis wrote:
So with the new SP changes, it is time to go back to that old conversation we have all loved....Fatigue.

As we now have a highly increased SP gain, I am not looking at it as more of something we do need in order to keep people from hitting 50 in 1-2 weeks rather then a feature that didnt affect any buy the most addicted players or those who only play 1 job period.

So I say, fatigue is now a good thing! It will keep people from really overdoing it and racing to 50 in 1 week.

Before leveling was slow, now its a bit too quick.(until you hit fatigue which only slightly slows it)

Lets hear some other thoughts on this.


I really wouldn't have such an issue with it if reassigning points wasn't such a time sink. I mean people who only like melees are pretty fine right now but if my Conjurer gets fatigued then I don't really wanna go to THM. No offense but it's just too similar for me. I wanna hit up PGL. GLA. MRD. I hope I'm not alone in that mindset.


im leveling all 7 combats up and i havent seen the need to reassign
yes if your trying to optimize you should....but you dont have to
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#7 Feb 08 2011 at 7:08 PM Rating: Default
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The increase in SP has not changed fatigue at all. It is still a percentage, so it has the same decline in SP and expected time to level..

You hit it quicker now, but it won't stop anyone who wants to brute force a class to 50 from doing so. All in all, ineffective gating is ineffective.
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#8 Feb 08 2011 at 7:37 PM Rating: Good
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Tankue wrote:
The increase in SP has not changed fatigue at all. It is still a percentage, so it has the same decline in SP and expected time to level..

You hit it quicker now, but it won't stop anyone who wants to brute force a class to 50 from doing so. All in all, ineffective gating is ineffective.


Except for the fact that they eventually brute force their way into a wall with "0 SP gain" spray painted on it.
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#9 Feb 08 2011 at 7:50 PM Rating: Good
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Kitprower wrote:
Tankue wrote:
The increase in SP has not changed fatigue at all. It is still a percentage, so it has the same decline in SP and expected time to level..

You hit it quicker now, but it won't stop anyone who wants to brute force a class to 50 from doing so. All in all, ineffective gating is ineffective.


Except for the fact that they eventually brute force their way into a wall with "0 SP gain" spray painted on it.


thats what im thinking

as is right now, you need roughly 1.8mil to cap at 50
you can earn up to 800k sp a week until you hit 0% fatigue
so 3 weeks minimum....but on those last levels of fatigue, when your getting 10% total SP....yeah your not gonna wanna do that lol.

so right now, lets look at how i used to play, cuz im pretyt bad about playtime and overdoing it

i used to hit 30% on my conjurer, and thats not even trying hard under the old system. yes fatigue was there, it was annoying, but it didnt hurt much or seem to slow me down at all cuz it took so long to come into effect at each tier.

now under the new system, given the same ammount of time, i could easily go to tier 6-7 fatigue, -60-70%, by that point im gonna stop, **** ill stop closer to 40% just cuz by that time its more about needing to do something else. If i didnt get any fatigue, What may have been 6-7 levels would easily turn into 9-10 levels. Which can be too fast under the games standards.


People need to remember its not a race to endgame. If you make it too easy and too fast to level, all lower levl gear is essentialy worthless. Why make level 10 gear anymore if you make it to level 20 on day 1 with no effort.


Fatigue as it was, didnt make sense(pre patch)
fatigue as it is now, makes ALOT of sense.

And as usual, people will hate it just because its fatigue. But look at the full picture and not at the "im selfish picture" and we will come to understand its intent.
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#10 Feb 08 2011 at 10:52 PM Rating: Default
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I am confused. Wat is fatigue and how dose it work? In WOW you get more XP when you kill mobs rested. I s it something like that?
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#11 Feb 08 2011 at 10:54 PM Rating: Decent
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Bodger wrote:
I am confused. Wat is fatigue and how dose it work? In WOW you get more XP when you kill mobs rested. I s it something like that?


Fatigue is when you get penalized 10% SP for doing too much in a week on a single job
being logged off reduces fatigue

so think of it along the lines of the samr thing but in reverse, where you start off fatigued in wow until you rest
in FF your rested until you play too much(resets weekly and goes off automaticaly regardless)

Edited, Feb 8th 2011 8:57pm by Vedis
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#12 Feb 08 2011 at 11:12 PM Rating: Decent
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That is why my XP sucks! I have been staying logged in to build up my anima. I was running out. well live and learn:)
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#13 Feb 08 2011 at 11:15 PM Rating: Decent
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Bodger wrote:
That is why my XP sucks! I have been staying logged in to build up my anima. I was running out. well live and learn:)


you dont need to stay logged in to build anima

also its based on SP earned, not time spent online for fatigue
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#14 Feb 08 2011 at 11:50 PM Rating: Default
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what is SP?
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#15 Feb 08 2011 at 11:52 PM Rating: Decent
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Bodger wrote:
what is SP?


Skill points
its what ranks up your jobs
EXP(which doesnt really matter) is for your physical level

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#16 Feb 09 2011 at 3:24 AM Rating: Decent
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Fatigue is SE punishing you for playing their game. Rate me down if you want but my statement is true. SE has given us a shell of a game with almost no content and because we are dumb enough to play it and play it hard we must be punished.
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#17 Feb 09 2011 at 3:30 AM Rating: Good
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UncleRuckusForLife wrote:
Fatigue is SE punishing you for playing their game. Rate me down if you want but my statement is true. SE has given us a shell of a game with almost no content and because we are dumb enough to play it and play it hard we must be punished.


From what I understand, Fatigue is S-E's way of balancing the playing field between the casual gamer and the hardcore gamer and is meant to encourage the full utilization of the armoury system as well as exploring the use of classes we might otherwise not have given a second thought about. Hence, the limited amount of leves, and the ease with which someone grinding purely on one class would reach fatigue whereas someone grinding multiple classes will find it harder to reach fatigue.

Of course in theory and in practice is two different things, and the system really falls apart in practice. Although as the OP suggested, perhaps the Fatigue system is now functioning as it was intended with the new SP boost.
#18 Feb 09 2011 at 4:09 AM Rating: Default
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It's funny to see how Vedis rationalizes fatigue, since it fits his playstyle.
"It will keep people from really overdoing it", oh come on! Just look at his
profile. Even the dumbest milkmaid will understand at a glance that he's a
130% game addict, so clearly fatigue will do *nothing* to stop people from
overdoing anything.

Stop fooling yourself, Vedis.
#19 Feb 09 2011 at 6:15 AM Rating: Excellent
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Rinsui wrote:
It's funny to see how Vedis rationalizes fatigue, since it fits his playstyle.
"It will keep people from really overdoing it", oh come on! Just look at his
profile. Even the dumbest milkmaid will understand at a glance that he's a
130% game addict, so clearly fatigue will do *nothing* to stop people from
overdoing anything.

Stop fooling yourself, Vedis.


I nicknamed him Thevbot because he's always crafting, heh.

But to be fair, he's been working on all of them for months, and he specifically wants to max out all the crafting jobs at the least, if not all classes in the game, and in a specific timeframe.

Does fatigue stop him from "overdoing" anything? Perhaps not, but that's because he levels all the jobs, not just one, and that's his choice, and in line with what the dev team wanted people to do: level lots of classes, not just zerg one to max rank in a week or two.
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#20 Feb 09 2011 at 6:33 AM Rating: Decent
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i still hate fatigue, i hit it last night for the first time ever and its really annoying. i dont want to level anything else yet.... ugh. i like the new SP gains but id rather have a steeper leveling curve than rush for a few hours then have to change jobs....
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#21 Feb 09 2011 at 7:26 AM Rating: Good
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Am I the only one who figures "okay, I'm gonna need skills from these other jobs sooner or later, so if I level them while my main has fatigue I won't be missing out on SP I could be using on other classes"?
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#22 Feb 09 2011 at 7:40 AM Rating: Decent
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No. Everybody does right that.
The question is: Is it fun?
#23 Feb 09 2011 at 9:31 AM Rating: Decent
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its a feature that exists solely to make the game take longer, its not a good thing. If people plow through to cap, that's their choice. If they get bored at 50 with nothing to do, its their 'fault'.
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#24 Feb 09 2011 at 9:57 AM Rating: Good
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If I ever hit fatigue it would represent the most SP I've ever gained in one sitting.

What's happening is now Fatigue is effecting mid-core gamers, rather than just hardcore. As a casual I'm not sure I'm entitled to an opinion on this.

Edited, Feb 9th 2011 10:58am by RufuSwho
#25 Feb 09 2011 at 9:57 AM Rating: Decent
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Ok so now that im reading last nights responses as I slept I come to 1 conclusion

you people dont read whats written, you look at the word "Fatigue" and post the same thing in every thread that even mentions it....


As to my level, yes, I get around fatigue by changing jobs...oh wait no i dont! I grind everything down into the dirt on a daily basis, its people like me that this system was meant to prevent from hitting 50 in 1 week(which im pretty sure i woulda done many times over already if i focused on 1 job, but i didnt cuz of fatigue)

before the SP patch people could go from 1-20 in a solid day. Now they can go from 1-30. And that is with fatigue, imagine what they woulda done without?

I am not saying fatigue is some great thing, I am posting based on past conversation where people did nothing but talk about how its a useless system, and how it serves no purpose. But in fact it does server a purpose and that purpose is to keep people from capping in a single week.

If you are a casual player, you obviously wont care about this. You may hit fatigue easily now too(under the new SP cuz its so **** easy) but whats 10%? its nothing thats what it is. The people who should really care about fatigue are the ones hitting 30-40-50%. I am one of those people, and I still dont see the system as something that "sucks cuz it affects me and needs to go"
Under the old SP system? oh yeah, it was annoying as ****, when its hard to get SP, you shouldnt penalize people. When it is this easy? How can you not!
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#26 Feb 09 2011 at 11:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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Fatigue is not really an issue, nor does it really slow you down much on your road to 50. You can easily bulldoze right through it and still get good exp.

I think its the thought of fatigue that bothers a lot of people. But really, it aint that bad. It takes a ton of exp to get to the 0SP fatigue. Right now I am on the 4th or 5th rank of fatigue and am still easily able to get 400-700sp a kill when linking leves and still able to get 200+ when soloing.



Edited, Feb 9th 2011 12:36pm by Scape13
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#27 Feb 09 2011 at 11:35 AM Rating: Decent
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Scape13 wrote:
Fatigue is not really an issue, nor does it really slow you down much on your road to 50. You can easily bulldoze right through it and still get good exp.

I think its the thought of fatigue that bothers a lot of people. But really, it aint that bad.

Edited, Feb 9th 2011 12:33pm by Scape13


alot of truth to this
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#28 Feb 09 2011 at 11:38 AM Rating: Good
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Scape13 wrote:

I think its the thought of fatigue that bothers a lot of people.


I bet if they took the different colored numbers out of the UI less people would be bothered by it. ****, take the system message out and people would be blaming the occasion low SP on moon-phase and the direction the mob is facing when it dies.

Edited, Feb 9th 2011 12:39pm by chopstx
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#29 Feb 09 2011 at 11:38 AM Rating: Decent
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chopstx wrote:
Scape13 wrote:

I think its the thought of fatigue that bothers a lot of people.


I bet if they took the different colored numbers out of the UI less people would be bothered by it.


and remove the message

out of site, out of mind
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#30 Feb 09 2011 at 12:06 PM Rating: Excellent
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UncleRuckusForLife wrote:
Fatigue is SE punishing you for playing their game. Rate me down if you want but my statement is true. SE has given us a shell of a game with almost no content and because we are dumb enough to play it and play it hard we must be punished.


Your level 50 I see. At least it seems you're taking your punishment in stride :P
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#31 Feb 09 2011 at 12:16 PM Rating: Good
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#32 Feb 09 2011 at 12:53 PM Rating: Good
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KujaKoF wrote:
its a feature that exists solely to make the game take longer, its not a good thing. If people plow through to cap, that's their choice. If they get bored at 50 with nothing to do, its their 'fault'.


By that definition levels are solely there to make the game take longer. So is EXP/SP curves. There is more to it than increasing the duration of the game, and while it is annoying (like repair, and mobs with really strong TP moves, and elemental resistance, and accuracy, and damage rating, and defense...) The list of things meant to balance the game is long, and is pretty much everything about the combat engine. The idea is to balance game play with combat. Since the gameplay is missing, all that is left is combat.

For some people that is ok, and they want more and more of it. Others just want the highest level game play, and nothing else matters, so they want to push to that, then experience all of it. Then you have the competitive people who's only desire is to be the first with the greatest, and have/be the greatest at whatever.

And it's the later two that tend to have issues with anything that limits their ability to play. For them fatigue is a bane, and for the last group, the new exp gain rate is also a bane. Since now, without the end-game worth playing, the ones who got to the top first just got to stand at the top of the hill with nothing worth proving, and nothing to set them apart from the people that are now making it there.

The irony is many of them have quit because they no longer can prove themselves. Others have started taking other jobs up, and well, at the end of the day, unless something is put into place soon so that they can feel a sense of accomplishment before they either feel crowded, or under-appreciated, they will continue to drop out of the game.

As for the more mild mannered players, most of us just want something to do. And while the exp gain helps in giving us a sense of purpose (to join those at the top), it still doesn't actually satisfy the need for SOMETHING.

So, my theory is, that at this point, the fatigue and the fast exp gain are just red-herrings for the fact that people just want something to do. While leveling is nice, the sense of accomplishment behind it is far more fleeting than having the next big baddy to defeat, or the next epic quest to complete. No amount of levels can fill that gap.

So, no matter how fast they make it, or how much they penalize us, the real problem isn't fatigue, or more exp, it's that there is nothing to do with the million + gil and exp we have.
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