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Opinions on the Crafting system?Follow

#1 Feb 09 2011 at 4:13 PM Rating: Good
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I was wondering what you lot thought of the current crafting system and how it's been implemented up until now?

Personally I think on the one hand it's great that there's some complexity to the system, that it can take time to create an item and it feels more rewarding for doing so. That being said it's really starting to grate on me just how many menus it takes to begin a craft, and by extension, how long it takes just to produce one material, which then has to be produced repeatedly to then synth the hood, which then has to be put together with a multitude of other items that can take an equal or greater amount of time to make. For example, right now for me to simply produce a piece of yarn from moko grass I need to select Synthesise > Recipe > Hempen Yarn > Confirm > Main Hand > Hempen Yarn > Confirm. Would the casual observer not simply suggest an option to go recipe > hempen yarn > confirm/commence craft?

In addition to this, I think the crafting system itself requires some work, a simple cancel option would help a lot considering how annoying it can be to watch a train-wreck synth slowly fail when you could see what was happening because it took 4 attempts to hit 20%.

Perhaps it's just venting, but I was wondering whether it bothers you guys? Do you find that it's something you've gotten used to and don't mind anymore? What ways do you think it could be improved?

EDIT: I'd also like to add I think that the normal synth option should yield 30% progress and the faster option yield 40%, on simpler items at least. It just seems to be time-wasting for the sake of time -wasting to make it take longer.

Edited, Feb 9th 2011 5:14pm by Dlaqev
#2 Feb 09 2011 at 4:17 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
EDIT: I'd also like to add I think that the normal synth option should yield 30% progress and the faster option yield 40%, on simpler items at least. It just seems to be time-wasting for the sake of time -wasting to make it take longer.


I kinda agree with you on this point. I think once you get X levels above a synth, you "master" it, and are given a quick option to just immediately get a standard quality, with no chance of a break. I think it would help motivate higher level crafters, to make lower level items to keep them in the game.
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#3 Feb 09 2011 at 4:21 PM Rating: Good
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there is a hasty hand ability, there is still chance of breaking but you can synth straight in one go
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#4 Feb 09 2011 at 4:26 PM Rating: Good
I would agree that the menu portion of crafting is um lacking, but I think the crafting itself is fine. As mentioned you have hasty hand for those times when you need to mass produce and don't care about risk. If you want to shoot for HQ then you obviously have to have more patience. The menu's are the only thing that makes me not enjoy crafting.

A repeat synth or repeat leve function would be amazing.
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#5 Feb 09 2011 at 4:49 PM Rating: Good
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My peeve is that some of the crafting abilities don't work as advertised or their effectiveness is so minimal that it's almost unnoticeable. Especially those +Quality skills, they don't seem to provide that much of a difference and it seems like a waste in AP to equip them sometimes. My other peeve is that Bold (and Rapid) seems to have taken a huge hit in effectiveness. There are times when I may succeed in a bold attempt, but unless it crits, it gives less +quality than a Standard. I've always thought that Bold was supposed to give greater quality at the expense of less progression while Rapid was supposed to give greater progression at the expense of less quality, with Standard somewhere in between. As it is now, there's really no reason to spam anything but Standard.
#6 Feb 09 2011 at 4:49 PM Rating: Decent
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Agree on the repeat level item suggestion

Other than that i love the crafting system. So many mmos just use a click one button system and i feel the risk vs reward approach is so much better
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#7 Feb 09 2011 at 5:08 PM Rating: Good
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SylOdinsdottir wrote:
My peeve is that some of the crafting abilities don't work as advertised or their effectiveness is so minimal that it's almost unnoticeable. Especially those +Quality skills, they don't seem to provide that much of a difference and it seems like a waste in AP to equip them sometimes. My other peeve is that Bold (and Rapid) seems to have taken a huge hit in effectiveness. There are times when I may succeed in a bold attempt, but unless it crits, it gives less +quality than a Standard. I've always thought that Bold was supposed to give greater quality at the expense of less progression while Rapid was supposed to give greater progression at the expense of less quality, with Standard somewhere in between. As it is now, there's really no reason to spam anything but Standard.


I don't understand this, unless my Standard crit, it can't get over 6 Quality, whereas my Bold everytime success yield a minimum of 9 Quality. I had stacked an Inspiration + Epiphany once and crit 62 Quality in one Bold, doesn't look so bad. Are you sure you have the correct attribute for the tool?
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#8 Feb 09 2011 at 5:28 PM Rating: Decent
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i love this crafting system. i just think it is to slow. i wish the progress bar would fill up to only 50% and be complete just so we can craft faster. idk im just giving some ideas. o and someone talked about a cancel button that would be nice also.
#9 Feb 09 2011 at 6:20 PM Rating: Good
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Khornette wrote:
I don't understand this, unless my Standard crit, it can't get over 6 Quality, whereas my Bold everytime success yield a minimum of 9 Quality. I had stacked an Inspiration + Epiphany once and crit 62 Quality in one Bold, doesn't look so bad. Are you sure you have the correct attribute for the tool?


When my Standard crits, I usually get 15-20% Progression, 5-10 Quality, on a normal non-crit, I get 10% Progression, 9 Quality. Bold non-crit I get 8-10 Quality 8-10% Progression. I'll try to screen shot it next time. The problem with abilities is I usually DON'T crit when I have it stacked (I blame bad luck) so I usually only get around 30-40 Quality which is really just a slightly upgraded Bold Crit.

I'll try to mess around with the stats to see if that won't help. If it does, thanks for the heads up. If it doesn't I really don't know what's wrong.
#10 Feb 09 2011 at 6:36 PM Rating: Good
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SylOdinsdottir wrote:
Khornette wrote:
I don't understand this, unless my Standard crit, it can't get over 6 Quality, whereas my Bold everytime success yield a minimum of 9 Quality. I had stacked an Inspiration + Epiphany once and crit 62 Quality in one Bold, doesn't look so bad. Are you sure you have the correct attribute for the tool?


When my Standard crits, I usually get 15-20% Progression, 5-10 Quality, on a normal non-crit, I get 10% Progression, 9 Quality. Bold non-crit I get 8-10 Quality 8-10% Progression. I'll try to screen shot it next time. The problem with abilities is I usually DON'T crit when I have it stacked (I blame bad luck) so I usually only get around 30-40 Quality which is really just a slightly upgraded Bold Crit.

I'll try to mess around with the stats to see if that won't help. If it does, thanks for the heads up. If it doesn't I really don't know what's wrong.


Are you sure that's correct, it doesn't make sense if your non-crit Standard can yield even more Quality than crit Standard. There are many things that influence quality like color of the Orb and Elemental unstability (One of the unstability actually boost Quality for Progress penalty if I remember correctly).
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#11 Feb 09 2011 at 6:49 PM Rating: Good
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Khornette wrote:
Are you sure that's correct, it doesn't make sense if your non-crit Standard can yield even more Quality than crit Standard. There are many things that influence quality like color of the Orb and Elemental unstability (One of the unstability actually boost Quality for Progress penalty if I remember correctly).


Yeah, my standard crits look more like what Rapid should be. It's actually kind of aggravating in that regard. My non-crit Standards function more like what I'd imagine Standard should be--average Progression and Quality. I have noticed the Elemental Instability and Colour of the Orb contribute to either a boost in progression or a boost in quality though I have yet to notice a pattern on which instabilities or orb colours will do what.

Like I said, I'll try to post a screen shot to demonstrate my point, and I'll definitely take your suggestion about stats into advisement and see if messing around with that won't help out.
#12 Feb 10 2011 at 4:45 AM Rating: Decent
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Dlaqev wrote:

In addition to this, I think the crafting system itself requires some work, a simple cancel option would help a lot considering how annoying it can be to watch a train-wreck synth slowly fail when you could see what was happening because it took 4 attempts to hit 20%.



^^ This I would love. Sign me up for the CANCEL button.

KujaKoF wrote:
Quote:
EDIT: I'd also like to add I think that the normal synth option should yield 30% progress and the faster option yield 40%, on simpler items at least. It just seems to be time-wasting for the sake of time -wasting to make it take longer.


I kinda agree with you on this point. I think once you get X levels above a synth, you "master" it, and are given a quick option to just immediately get a standard quality, with no chance of a break. I think it would help motivate higher level crafters, to make lower level items to keep them in the game.


I agree with you here, and I like the idea of master crafts +1. It seems a waste to take the time to craft items that give 15sp in order to craft larger items. I would even be game for 0 sp on those craftable items to have that option.
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#13 Feb 10 2011 at 5:00 AM Rating: Decent
I quite like the crafting system but it is way too SLOW Smiley: disappointed
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#14 Feb 10 2011 at 6:52 AM Rating: Decent
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...and bottable, since all you have to do for a standard synth is to press the
same buttons over and over (once you get used to it, no need to look at the screen).

They should have made it a "real" minigame. Like parley. But please, not like parley ;).
#15 Feb 10 2011 at 7:04 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'm torn between wanting it to be faster and yet retaining the feel of taking a while to make one completed product. A haubergeon for example could take around 15 minutes to complete from raw materials. I actually like that as it gives me a sense of accomplishment and a ddegree of rarity over items that don't take as long. However making individual components does seem to take forever since it really doesn't take any skill to spam Standard. The only solution I can think of is to make crafting more interactive, but I don't really know how.
#16 Feb 10 2011 at 8:48 AM Rating: Good
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Hydragyrum wrote:
I'm torn between wanting it to be faster and yet retaining the feel of taking a while to make one completed product. A haubergeon for example could take around 15 minutes to complete from raw materials. I actually like that as it gives me a sense of accomplishment and a ddegree of rarity over items that don't take as long. However making individual components does seem to take forever since it really doesn't take any skill to spam Standard. The only solution I can think of is to make crafting more interactive, but I don't really know how.


I think I'm ok with the crafting process in general.

The preparation of recipes and materials needs to be a lot more efficient tho. Right now it takes as much time to go through all the menus than it takes to actually craft.

I know some will say that a simpler preparation menu will make it easier to bot but that's SE's challenge to deal with it without penalizing honest players
#17 Feb 10 2011 at 3:59 PM Rating: Decent
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I dont like the crafting system as is. I take part in it because I feel I have to.
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#18 Feb 10 2011 at 4:44 PM Rating: Decent
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It's soul crushingly boring and has a terrible interface.
It's rewarding, however, when you are actually making something of worth and it can be nerve wracking at times. It's also infuriating.

It would be nice to get a 'craft all' button. ;D
#19 Feb 10 2011 at 5:10 PM Rating: Good
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Hydragyrum wrote:
I'm torn between wanting it to be faster and yet retaining the feel of taking a while to make one completed product. A haubergeon for example could take around 15 minutes to complete from raw materials. I actually like that as it gives me a sense of accomplishment and a ddegree of rarity over items that don't take as long. However making individual components does seem to take forever since it really doesn't take any skill to spam Standard. The only solution I can think of is to make crafting more interactive, but I don't really know how.


My +2 Lance took a week to prepare + make. Making HQ component is a little bit more than just spamming standard, it starts from getting HQ Ore/Hide etc.
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#20 Feb 10 2011 at 5:26 PM Rating: Decent
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crafting in FFXIV is too repetitive and monotonous and should not be as prominant as it is, that is my opinion.
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#21 Feb 10 2011 at 5:26 PM Rating: Decent
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about crafting, most of items i need to make pieces of gear i have no idea where to get them (it may be simple, but i dont know yet).

And that ignorance make me run all over the town in hope to find them
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