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Feeling less confident about the future of XIVFollow

#102 Feb 19 2011 at 4:29 PM Rating: Decent
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alcide wrote:
...If he really wants to gather informations from the players he has to be sure that those infos are coming from peaple that are actually playing... something like the private forum that we had back in closed beta would be great.


If I remember correctly... weren't the beta forums an EPIC FAIL you can't argue otherwise, or else FFXIV wouldn't have even been in this mess.

Edited, Feb 19th 2011 5:35pm by legendof7th
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#103 Feb 19 2011 at 4:29 PM Rating: Excellent
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Monday I hope is the big patch for Feb..


Honestly folks, don't get your hopes up on this. I'd love it if it were, but this is very likely not going to be the case. I'm as disappointed as the rest of everyone at 1.15b, but they seem to be pretty clear that it's a security upgrade coming Monday.
#104 Feb 19 2011 at 4:30 PM Rating: Good
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Sounds like it might be worth playing soon

Keep up the good work Yoshi-P
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#105 Feb 19 2011 at 5:13 PM Rating: Decent
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KujaKoF wrote:
Omena wrote:
Ggrab wrote:
you should check out "DC universe online" it all about endgame & raid

it a shining light in this wow clone mmorpg market we live in today

How is that not exactly like WoW and all its clones? Quick easy mode leveling to cap where the actual game begins.


You can make the argument that any MMO is a "wow clone". Much like any platformer is a "mario clone" and any shooter is a "Doom/Halo/Call of duty clone"


Mm...not really.
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#106 Feb 19 2011 at 5:24 PM Rating: Excellent
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So meanwhile, players like me, that genuinely enjoy the game as it is


Unfortunately, there isn't a whole lot of people who like the game as it is. Most people I know think that it has a lot of problems and is unfinished. I mean when I played the other day I had to ask someone how to take a screen shot (which should be simple) because square got the stupid idea that you need to hold scroll lock of all keys in order to take one. So even of the features that are in are, some were made in a freaky manner. I mean here we are 5 months after the game has come out and the producer is asking us if the anti-grind ideas are a bit too much.

I honestly admit it is a chore to even get the game turned on for me currently.
#107 Feb 19 2011 at 5:39 PM Rating: Decent
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KingWinterclaw wrote:
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So meanwhile, players like me, that genuinely enjoy the game as it is


Unfortunately, there isn't a whole lot of people who like the game as it is. Most people I know think that it has a lot of problems and is unfinished. I mean when I played the other day I had to ask someone how to take a screen shot (which should be simple) because square got the stupid idea that you need to hold scroll lock of all keys in order to take one. So even of the features that are in are, some were made in a freaky manner. I mean here we are 5 months after the game has come out and the producer is asking us if the anti-grind ideas are a bit too much.

I honestly admit it is a chore to even get the game turned on for me currently.


Dont you know ? if you hold scroll lock to take a screen shot that is skills right there, just like grinding mediocre monsters for exp is skills <.< where you been all this years ? every MMORPG does it like that <.<
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#108 Feb 19 2011 at 5:51 PM Rating: Good
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Mistress Theonehio wrote:
KujaKoF wrote:
Omena wrote:
Ggrab wrote:
you should check out "DC universe online" it all about endgame & raid

it a shining light in this wow clone mmorpg market we live in today

How is that not exactly like WoW and all its clones? Quick easy mode leveling to cap where the actual game begins.


You can make the argument that any MMO is a "wow clone". Much like any platformer is a "mario clone" and any shooter is a "Doom/Halo/Call of duty clone"


Mm...not really.


I dislike it when people say clone this, clone that, blah, blah, blah. Please look up the word clone.

What's actually happening is that, as much as I hate to admit, some games like WoW, or Mario, or Doom, just to name a few, have set a standard for their genre and that all those that follow conform to meet those standards or else fall short of meeting everyone's expectations. But meeting standards =/= cloning.

*My statement seems to be misleading here. I am no way advocating for FFXIV to fully imitate WoW.

Basically, you take things that "work" and build on it. That's how the world is run. You don't reinvent the wheel, you make improvements on it and one day you have a car. If everyone reinvents the wheel, you will probably never get the car. We'd all be skiing everywhere.

Edited, Feb 19th 2011 6:52pm by legendof7th

Edited, Feb 20th 2011 12:47am by legendof7th
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#109 Feb 19 2011 at 6:09 PM Rating: Decent
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The 10 hr maintenance is probably preparation for the official forums. The beta for the forums is supposed to start next month.
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#110 Feb 19 2011 at 7:44 PM Rating: Excellent
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Olorinus the Vile wrote:
well I am tired of it - tired of being taken for granted - because although I haven't paid a monthly fee yet, my time is a currency in itself - and without the people that are currently playing - even for free - SE WOULD HAVE NOTHING - NO HOPE FOR THIS GAME - yet the people who are actually holding this game together - and GIVING NEW PLAYERS A REASON TO BUY THE BOX are being treated like mushrooms - kept in the dark and fed bullsh1t.

I think that people who love this game should have a greater voice at the table than people who badmouth it... but instead it seems like the opposite - and I know the haters will come out and say "well they need to get us people to play" and I would say NO - they need to get more people to play - but they should be reaching out to those who haven't already decided they hate everything about the game as it is.


Seems to me, anyone who blew their 60-ish dollars on this travesty has contributed as much as you have to the "cause."

Most people know instantly when a dish tastes bad, and most people know to stop eating it when it does. Some people will keep eating because they don't want to hurt the chef's feelings (especially if it's Mom), but feigning that this is a good meal isn't going to pack the restaurant.

If you want people to come back, you have to listen to why everyone left.

You've "threatened" to go back to FFXI or WoW. I suggest you do. Re-learn what it takes to make a good MMO by actually playing one for awhile. Then you'll see, for the first time, why most people have given up on FFXIV.
#111 Feb 19 2011 at 8:23 PM Rating: Default
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I wouldn't personaly call WoW a good MMO, they have done certain things right but it's design caters directly to a crowd I want nothing to do with.
The saddist part is that every acts like they need to compete with WoW, rushing to release befor WoW does thier next big thing and whatnot... That mindset has ruined enough games, it's time to stop worrying about WoW and just makeing a good game.

IMO FFXIV has all the groundwork to be a verry good game, they don't need to ***** it up by makeing it more like WoW. Finishing the game they have would help more than mucking up the code by retrofitting it with garbage.
#112 Feb 19 2011 at 9:13 PM Rating: Excellent
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zurinadrg wrote:
I wouldn't personaly call WoW a good MMO, they have done certain things right but it's design caters directly to a crowd I want nothing to do with.


But that doesn't mean you can't learn anything from it.

What makes WoW good?

1. Easy, intuitive interface. You don't even need to read instructions pick up the game and play; it's that simple.

2. Perfectly balanced gameplay. It has the right mix of challenge and reward to make it fun. You might not enjoy WoW's everything-comes-easy style, but for those that do, there's no MMO out there that does it better.

3. Accessible. You didn't need a fancy computer to play the game when it came out 7 years ago, and even the crummiest PCs can play it now. Anyone can play WoW.

Then look at FFXIV and you'll see that fails on all three counts. You'd soon rather stab yourself with a spoon than use a mouse in FFXIV, and a huge complaint for newcomers is not having any idea what to do (like... even the moment they got past the opening fight). As for gameplay, it gets tedious fast, and while it tries to cater to both casual and hardcore players at once, it does neither particularly well. And since it needs a powerhouse comp to even play, you're very limited in the type of person who can even give the game a chance.

You don't need to make a WoW clone to make FFXIV good. But you can't ignore the elements of success, either, in the effort to distinguish yourself.
#113 Feb 19 2011 at 9:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Quanta wrote:
Ggrab wrote:
you should check out "DC universe online" it all about endgame & raid

it a shining light in this wow clone mmorpg market we live in today


I think you're doing the game an injustice by merely pimping its endgame. I think the main thing to take away from DCUO is that it's got one of the best and most action-oriented combat systems of any MMO currently available; you aren't standing still while you and the mobs do a back-and-forth with attacking, and there is no auto-attack because they're using a combo system for the bread-and-butter basic melee and ranged attacks. It's like playing an MMO version of Arkham Asylum. That's the thing I'm expecting (hoping?) to become a staple of the genre in the coming years.



Although I have not played DCUO or Arkham Asylum, but combos remind me of Phantasy Star Online for the Dreamcast and all of its incarnations thereafter... those were the days... No auto attack and it was impossible to button smash especially in melee as not pressing your attack buttons with the right rhythm caused you to not attack at all.

On topic: Although the game is in bad shape I still believe in this game's potential, even if I don't necessarily agree with all the changes that may go into place, so far they're changes I can live with.
#114 Feb 19 2011 at 10:33 PM Rating: Good
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Your point #2 is comletely opinnion, WoW's complete claim to chalenging game play is either grind or PvP.. However the amount of players helps to distract from the grind. Even the "hard" encounters and boss fights come down to learning to follow thier script and grinding to get key people high enough level gear to make the "difficulty" go away so they can start farming the bosses. There is this great illusion of difficulty but it only realy exists for those who are new or people interested in PvP. Unfortunately the whole concept of diffculty in MMOs has been reduced to this and very few are willing to try a system that breaks away from this mold.

What you didn't mention about WoW is a team that has successfully fixed almost every noticable bug and continues to maintain an almost , visably at least, bugfree game with enough content and general fluff to keep peoples attention. These two things are what so many new MMOs lack at luanch, including FFXIV.
#115 Feb 19 2011 at 10:33 PM Rating: Good
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Torrence wrote:
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Trion,

Olo has been posting on here obviously longer than you...and has played this game since open beta...I think s/he and every other fan who feels the same as him/her, have a right to feel the way they feel :/


Of course - but you can't refute the fact that the minority isn't what will save this game and that was his point. Right now, you have the folks like me who are maintaining our multiple FFXI subs to thank for your game even still running at this point. It's certainly not running on its own revenue generation, and whatever they made back in those box sales is long gone. It's all about the almighty dollar, not being the niche of the niche cause we're ARTISTS and unique snowflakes! If this was SE's first try and they didn't have XI's revenue - it would be over. They would have had to shut down the servers.

The problem that I have with threads like this is it gives the impression that everything is ok in the game and all the planned changes to bring it into the standards of 2011 are going to destroy it. It's already on life support. It's already the laughing stock of the industry.

It NEEDS these changes. It needs to be turned around. Arguing against basic features is as good as saying you want the game to fail. Those who are its most steadfast supporters are in reality its weakest link.



Yea to be honest with everyone here I don't get it either. Not much is really attractive about this game apart from its graphics and these have even become a bore after seeing the same areas for so long because nothing has me moving forward. Every time I log into the game I ask myself why they rushed it out the door when it was supposed to be the game that re-defined online games all together. Its funny that they said they "didn't want to compete with WoW or the next Star Wars MMO", well if you didn't want to compete why not just take what worked best in FFXI and expand on it instead of taking everything throwing it out the door and starting all over from scratch. The battle system alone, if it was similar to FFXI in that you used teamwork to level up with battle tactics and strategies depending on situations, that alone would've given plenty more people incentive to play the game - I know with me personally all I did in FFXI was level up and it was fun...this game is boring to its very core, and you guys should all be welcoming any changes they make because obviously their goal is to make the game better.
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#116 Feb 19 2011 at 10:36 PM Rating: Good
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TerraSonicX wrote:
The 10 hr maintenance is probably preparation for the official forums. The beta for the forums is supposed to start next month.


So they're closing down the game so they can prep official online forums? doubtful.
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#117 Feb 19 2011 at 10:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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Olorinus the Vile wrote:
I know a lot of people voted for radical change in the first poll, but then again - most of the people who voted don't play. Truth be told, I am skeptical even half of them would EVER play this game again, even if Yoshi turns this game into the mutant child of WoW and XI that it looks like it is shaping up to be.


If this is in response about the first poll he created, you *had* to at least linked a FFXIV account in SE management in order to even see the poll. I know this personally as I was merely interested in seeing what the entire poll options were when I unlinked the account, and it refused to even direct me to the pool until I re-linked FFXIV service.

So no, unless there was some backdoor entry, people that didn't play weren't submitting opinions.
#118 Feb 19 2011 at 10:52 PM Rating: Excellent
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ForceOfMeh wrote:
But that doesn't mean you can't learn anything from it.

What makes WoW good?

1. Easy, intuitive interface. You don't even need to read instructions pick up the game and play; it's that simple.

2. Perfectly balanced gameplay. It has the right mix of challenge and reward to make it fun. You might not enjoy WoW's everything-comes-easy style, but for those that do, there's no MMO out there that does it better.

3. Accessible. You didn't need a fancy computer to play the game when it came out 7 years ago, and even the crummiest PCs can play it now. Anyone can play WoW.

Then look at FFXIV and you'll see that fails on all three counts. You'd soon rather stab yourself with a spoon than use a mouse in FFXIV, and a huge complaint for newcomers is not having any idea what to do (like... even the moment they got past the opening fight). As for gameplay, it gets tedious fast, and while it tries to cater to both casual and hardcore players at once, it does neither particularly well. And since it needs a powerhouse comp to even play, you're very limited in the type of person who can even give the game a chance.

You don't need to make a WoW clone to make FFXIV good. But you can't ignore the elements of success, either, in the effort to distinguish yourself.


Extremely well put.

The interface in FFXIV still boggles my mind on many fronts. The idea of binding various skills to three action bars which I then need to scroll up and down through via the arrow keys (which only works maybe half the time) still makes me wonder what they were thinking when they designed it.

ThePacster wrote:
Although I have not played DCUO or Arkham Asylum, but combos remind me of Phantasy Star Online for the Dreamcast and all of its incarnations thereafter... those were the days... No auto attack and it was impossible to button smash especially in melee as not pressing your attack buttons with the right rhythm caused you to not attack at all.


I would LOVE to have a PSO-like combo system in FFXIV, and it makes PERFECT sense for a controller as well.

Rather than drag the players down with hundreds of skills, most of which do very little, give them 10-15 amazing useful skills and allow them to choose 6 to bind to their controller.

zurinadrg wrote:
Your point #2 is comletely opinnion, WoW's complete claim to chalenging game play is either grind or PvP.. However the amount of players helps to distract from the grind. Even the "hard" encounters and boss fights come down to learning to follow thier script and grinding to get key people high enough level gear to make the "difficulty" go away so they can start farming the bosses. There is this great illusion of difficulty but it only realy exists for those who are new or people interested in PvP. Unfortunately the whole concept of diffculty in MMOs has been reduced to this and very few are willing to try a system that breaks away from this mold.


This is true to an extent, but WoW's instances were actually quite challenging. In most of the 5 man content, not performing perfectly resulted in a wipe. Pull an extra mob? Wipe. Didn't pull all 4 lesser mobs off the healer? Wipe. One wrong step in an instance was generally a wipe, and I've not seen many MMOs since that have the same level of performance-based difficulty.

For example, Aion's instances were dirt easy...
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#119 Feb 19 2011 at 11:01 PM Rating: Good
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SolidMack wrote:
TerraSonicX wrote:
The 10 hr maintenance is probably preparation for the official forums. The beta for the forums is supposed to start next month.


So they're closing down the game so they can prep official online forums? doubtful.


Well considering that you need to use your SE Account to log into the game, it's not doubtful, especially if they decide to link forum logins to your SE Account. Also you won't be able to login to the Lodestone either. Anyway I should have been clearer, they told us they're enhancing login security, but this also could be prep work for the official forums.
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#120 Feb 19 2011 at 11:23 PM Rating: Excellent
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You know, I never quite got the whole concept behind being patriotic to an MMO and wanting to be 100% different from every other MMO. It's something that's alien to almost every other genre. You don't see strategy players say "dang it, why did Blizzard let me select multiple units? I don't want another Total Annihilation clone" or "dang it, why did Valve give my gun a melee attack? I don't want another Halo clone". Players in other genres actively look at other games, take features from them, and pass them on to their developers as suggestions for features to be implemented because they make the game better.

The biggest reason most of you pick an MMO over another is the game world/story and the people/friends that you find in the game, not how the game itself plays; so please don't pretend like you want and enjoy having obtuse and inaccessible gameplay. Your game is not going to be ruined if the developers draw some inspiration from another game. Some mechanics, features and UI elements are cool, and some make your game more fun and more intuitive.
#121 Feb 19 2011 at 11:34 PM Rating: Default
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Wolfums wrote:
You know, I never quite got the whole concept behind being patriotic to an MMO and wanting to be 100% different from every other MMO. It's something that's alien to almost every other genre. You don't see strategy players say "dang it, why did Blizzard let me select multiple units? I don't want another Total Annihilation clone" or "dang it, why did Valve give my gun a melee attack? I don't want another Halo clone". Players in other genres actively look at other games, take features from them, and pass them on to their developers as suggestions for features to be implemented because they make the game better.

The biggest reason most of you pick an MMO over another is the game world/story and the people/friends that you find in the game, not how the game itself plays; so please don't pretend like you want and enjoy having obtuse and inaccessible gameplay. Your game is not going to be ruined if the developers draw some inspiration from another game. Some mechanics, features and UI elements are cool, and some make your game more fun and more intuitive.


Please don't claim to know how I feel or what I think or why I do things. You don't know me and I do not know you. Thanks.

I play for new experiences, that includes both how a game plays and the lore behind it. Sorry you can't understand that.
#122 Feb 20 2011 at 2:12 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
This is true to an extent, but WoW's instances were actually quite challenging. In most of the 5 man content, not performing perfectly resulted in a wipe. Pull an extra mob? Wipe. Didn't pull all 4 lesser mobs off the healer? Wipe. One wrong step in an instance was generally a wipe, and I've not seen many MMOs since that have the same level of performance-based difficulty.



"Was" actually challenging, now a PLD can solo most of the normal instances till 60 and even then.
3 ppl can trio all of them easy as cake.
WoW is now a joke and a can be played till 85 within 2 weeks and less.
A young child can play it all...
Back in the days it was somewhat hard but not as challenging as FFXI.

We were one of the first to attein sea access on our server and believe me, the road was hard and VERY challenging.To a point that most ppl would'nt be able to kill Ultima/Omega on the airship fight. Even at Diabolos ppl stuck for months. Now thats challenge and very rewarding and the only piece of gear obtained through the entire expantion "Missions" was an awsome ring.

Gear doesn't have to be the only reward, the story for me is the reward. Man did we have the most awsome fun ever doing Chains of Promathia (expansion). Learning about its lore was the greatest reward ever, the CS were just amazing and the depth of emotions was at its peek.
I embrace SE for making FFXI the best MMO i have ever played and i sure hope they make FFXIV just like FFXI !


FF Fanboy Bolt !!!!

Edited, Feb 20th 2011 3:14am by BoltSavior

Edited, Feb 20th 2011 3:16am by BoltSavior
#123 Feb 20 2011 at 2:15 AM Rating: Excellent
Quote:
Quoted Text


Nailed it!

Edit: Aww, you fixed it.

Edited, Feb 20th 2011 12:16am by Thayos
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#124 Feb 20 2011 at 2:17 AM Rating: Decent
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LOL i saw your post right after i fixed it XD. Learning more and more about posting~ luving it!

#125 Feb 20 2011 at 2:31 AM Rating: Excellent
Ha, no worries, I've made that mistake before! I just thought it was funny, and I'm feeling kind of tired and loopy.

Time to stop watching old-school Batman and get some sleep.
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#126 Feb 20 2011 at 8:52 AM Rating: Good
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TheRealDestian wrote:
[quote=ForceOfMeh]
The interface in FFXIV still boggles my mind on many fronts. The idea of binding various skills to three action bars which I then need to scroll up and down through via the arrow keys (which only works maybe half the time) still makes me wonder what they were thinking when they designed it.


That's what happens when you try to design a game for both PC and Consoles. I even picked up a new USB console controller to see if my in-game experience would be different. It hardly made a difference overall. Personally I would think most console owners would have some sort of USB keyboard. It just boggles my mind that someone would be willing to play a MMORPG 100% through a console controller.
#127 Feb 20 2011 at 9:17 AM Rating: Good
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BoltSavior wrote:
Quote:
This is true to an extent, but WoW's instances were actually quite challenging. In most of the 5 man content, not performing perfectly resulted in a wipe. Pull an extra mob? Wipe. Didn't pull all 4 lesser mobs off the healer? Wipe. One wrong step in an instance was generally a wipe, and I've not seen many MMOs since that have the same level of performance-based difficulty.



"Was" actually challenging, now a PLD can solo most of the normal instances till 60 and even then.
3 ppl can trio all of them easy as cake.
WoW is now a joke and a can be played till 85 within 2 weeks and less.
A young child can play it all...
Back in the days it was somewhat hard but not as challenging as FFXI.

We were one of the first to attein sea access on our server and believe me, the road was hard and VERY challenging.To a point that most ppl would'nt be able to kill Ultima/Omega on the airship fight. Even at Diabolos ppl stuck for months. Now thats challenge and very rewarding and the only piece of gear obtained through the entire expantion "Missions" was an awsome ring.

Gear doesn't have to be the only reward, the story for me is the reward. Man did we have the most awsome fun ever doing Chains of Promathia (expansion). Learning about its lore was the greatest reward ever, the CS were just amazing and the depth of emotions was at its peek.
I embrace SE for making FFXI the best MMO i have ever played and i sure hope they make FFXIV just like FFXI !


FF Fanboy Bolt !!!!

Edited, Feb 20th 2011 3:14am by BoltSavior

Edited, Feb 20th 2011 3:16am by BoltSavior


A PLD cannot solo istance's of his or over his level, can a lvl 85 PLD solo a istance designed for lvl 40? yeah he can, but so can my rogue :)

Also different game concepts are different, leveling was a core concept in FFXI, in WOW is a secondary concept, is just a means to an end, the game does not start until cap level(While still dishing out content), even blizzard states it so, as for the difference in difficulty, well that's subjective :)
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#128 Feb 20 2011 at 9:35 AM Rating: Good
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I also heard that WoW battles are rather on the easy side - then again, I never played it.
But according to what friends told me, there is by far more variation in the boss battles
themselves (like, having to avoid certain spots, having to work switches and gears during
the fight etc.)...?
#129 Feb 20 2011 at 9:48 AM Rating: Good
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Rinsui wrote:
I also heard that WoW battles are rather on the easy side - then again, I never played it.
But according to what friends told me, there is by far more variation in the boss battles
themselves (like, having to avoid certain spots, having to work switches and gears during
the fight etc.)...?


Yes there is a lot of boss fight mechanics besides the usual tank & spank, almost in every fight you have to avoid a certain AOE or a spot, some fights are healer fights, some other dps race, some other tank fights etc etc, as for being on the easy side, depends on what fight we are talking about, some fight's are way easier than others, while some others are way harder than one's, it all depends, basically entry level raid bosses, are not hard by design, while the middle and top tier, are beyond what most guilds can take on, before they are geared or overgeared
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#130 Feb 21 2011 at 3:33 AM Rating: Good
Redscare wrote:
To all the people saying this game needs more content: You're absolutely right. However, FFXIV is like a castle built on top a foundation of sand. There's little point in investing all your time and efforts into adding more towers when your entire structure is weak at its core. I'm pulling figures out of my *** but I don't think it is a long shot to say that WoW has as many subscribers as every other MMO on the market has put together. It's not because WoW does anything new or exciting - **** it's a 6 year old game that essentially recycles content over and over again. It's because WoW is built on a system that is incredibly easy to understand that people of all ages, new to online games or not, can jump right into; something that FFXI and now FFXIV still lack. But enough about WoW.

Auto-attack. In my most humble of opinions, this is needed. In fact, I don't see any reason for it NOT to be included. Granted, some of you may derive immense pleasure from hammering your 1 key into oblivion but for me it is an unnecessary hassle that actually detracts from the battle experience. I find no enjoyment in constantly pressing my basic attack on top of all of the other abilities that need to be used. Rather, it is more beneficial to not have to worry about the basic attack and focus more on communicating with party members (does anyone even remember what a battle regimen is?), moving around to get in/out of position, surveying the battlefield, etc. A lot of people during the alpha and beta, most of which were FFXI veterans, demanded a faster battle system and the current system is what we got. Hopefully SE will go with a compromise in which the stamina system is still in place with an auto attack that uses no stamina. Skills will require much greater stamina consumption (2-3 skills will deplete your bar completely) but still retaining the same stamina regeneration rate. The result is balanced battle gameplay where the player is using a skill every 5-10 seconds rather than every second. This eliminates both the slow combat of XI and the buttonmash fest of the current system.

Marking quest NPCs. I am against marking NPCs as it takes away from the immersion factor but honestly, there are people like me who talks to every NPC I see regardless of what they have to offer. There are people who don't bother with this at all and that's fine too. If putting a little marker next to an NPC name (similar to a LS emblem) helps players identify which NPCs offer quests I would not mind at all. It will not in anyway stop me from talking to every other NPC as well. I would much rather play an MMO where there marked NPCs and enough players to quest with than an MMO where there are unmarked NPCs and no one to play with. SE has already gone so far as to mark quest objectives on your map, adding in NPC markers would simply be icing on the cake.

Instances. Nothing I love more than open world bosses - running by and seeing a giant behemoth being engaged by a large group of players is always exhilarating even if one is not directly participating. The competition to claim said beasts are also fun as it adds a heightened sense of anticipation and makes victory all the sweeter. That being said, instances do have their place. FFXI had instances as well and I see no problems with adding a few instanced dungeons to the game. Instanced dungeons allow for potentially less lag and allows players and their group to focus without unneeded distraction from other players. Given what SE has done so far, I wouldn't be surprised if you need 1000 levepoints or some other ridiculous requirement to enter an instanced dungeon but that's neither here nor there.

TL;DR
The proposed changes, while almost certainly going to change the way the game plays, are needed should this game hope to become a successful MMO.



This post could have been written by me...
The game is not anywhere near what it is supposed to be and I am so happy they are addressing some of the most important things (at least to me).
I enjoy the game too, but not to the point where I would start feeling depressed for the changes. CHANGE IS GOOD!

What comes to the physical level being removed... go ahead, I never really saw what was the point of it anyway Smiley: rolleyes
____________________________

#131 Feb 21 2011 at 3:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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16,959 posts
LeilaniWildfire, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
What comes to the physical level being removed... go ahead, I never really saw what was the point of it anyway Smiley: rolleyes
It gave some players the opportunity to be a bit creative with how their character performs in battle.

Like my Archer. It has 100 STR, 100 DEX, 100 VIT, 79 MND and 79 PIE. Surely I would be doing more damage, evading more attacks, taking less damage and have more HP if I didn't bother to put points into MND and PIE.

I wanted my Archer to be able to successfully debuff mobs in small groups, and duos, seeing as the people I play with don't often play on Conjurer or Thaumaturge.
I also enjoy having a decent amount of magic defense and resistance, and being able to keep up my MP flow with Siphon MP (Piety being a major attribute).

I prefer flexibility and versatility when I play. Others may not. The point is, we were given a choice on how we play.
I hope SE implements Option #2 on this particular issue.
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#132 Feb 21 2011 at 4:04 AM Rating: Good
***
3,416 posts
Just one thing to think about here- something that I doubt many have even realized since it's not an issue at the moment.

Casuals in this game are going to be at a great disadvantage with the proposed changes. Unlike in XI, where you could only change your job in very specific circumstances, here the only pre-requisite as far as I know is that you are not engaged.

While it was easy to see that the people with only one or two jobs leveled in XI could not be as flexible as the people with multiple jobs, the fact that job changing was so limited made up for that fact. When you went into the instance or event or whatever, it hardly mattered whether you had six jobs leveled or just one, since you could only access one job on any given event. Therefore it wasn't such a disadvantage to focus on one job and people could get by without being considered second-class players. This was enforced with the fact that many events were locked once started, so you couldn't just warp back to town to change or log to an alt.

Here, though? The only feature keeping single-class characters at least somewhat competitive was the physical level system. It wasn't perfect, but it was close to being that way with few small changes to close the gap between evenly distributed and specialized player. Right now they are going to strip that only advantage single-class players had in this game, making it even clearer that if you focus on only one class, you are going to be inferior. It is logical that someone who puts enough time into his character to level more than one class should be a stronger player than someone with only one class, but it's not always simply an issue of time- some people simply want to focus on a single class or playstyle.

With the proposed changes in place, there is no reason to ever invite someone with just one class over someone with more than one class. There is no such safety net in place like in XI where it didn't matter how many jobs you had during the event itself. Here it does matter.

The only way to keep things fair is to implement an alternative system that keeps single class builds at least competitive in theory, or the dev team needs to restrict our access to the classes. The latter option sounds like such a fail that it's not even funny, so I hope they can come up with something better. Otherwise we may as well call this the Hardcore Fantasy XIV.
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Quote:
We really want to compete against World of Warcraft and for example the new Star Wars MMO.

#133 Feb 21 2011 at 4:12 AM Rating: Excellent
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To the OP: I'm not really sure how to say this without soundly slightly rude (which isn't my intent), but SE is a for-profit company. They've sunk millions upon millions of dollars into this game. They've spent untold man hours getting this thing done. Then they release an unfinished product and it bombs. Ultimately they don't answer to you or I, they answer to the stockholders.

SE has taken a beating releasing the game in the state they did. And frankly, they didn't have a whole of support except for the most ardent FF fans. FF12 and FF13 didn't do so well. FFXI is showing its age and (as far as we can tell) the player base is dwindling away. They NEED NEED NEED FFXIV to be a hit.

In its current state, that will not happen.

Granted, adding content is something that has to be done. And preferably soon. However, there are LOTS of other issues to be dealt with as well. Yoshi-P is doing what he can to keep the Titanic from sinking. And, frankly, he's doing an amazing job. If anyone can save this game, its him.

Sorry you're not happy with things as they are. Ultimately, SE has to get more people buying the game so they can turn a profit. While they can try to keep current players happy, they need to change the game so that most gamers find it enjoyable. If they don't, you won't have a game to play at all.
____________________________
WoW -- Zaia -- Dragonmaw -- Mage 80 BABY! Alchemy 450
Also... Hunter 62, Rogue 52, Warrior 66, Warlock 43, Death Knight 70, Shaman Who Cares? ;)

FFXI -- Caia -- Retired/Deleted -- Blm 75, Alchemy 97
Pandimonium server - Rank 10 - Bastok

Zaela Rdm -- 35, Alchemy 45 -- Forced into retirement because I didn't have the right kind of credit card. Hope it was worth 18 bucks a month, SE.

#134 Feb 21 2011 at 4:28 AM Rating: Good
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3,416 posts
Quote:
Granted, adding content is something that has to be done. And preferably soon. However, there are LOTS of other issues to be dealt with as well. Yoshi-P is doing what he can to keep the Titanic from sinking. And, frankly, he's doing an amazing job. If anyone can save this game, its him.


OP is saying that he doesn't think that Yoshi-P is doing an amazing job, and you really said nothing to counter that. Except that you think he's doing an amazing job.

This whole thread exists because some people don't think he can save this game, and the concerns are not without any validity.

It makes me question how long some people here have been around. It's like we have these same topics we had last year, and back then any sign of negativity was met with rate downs and ridiculing. And you can see where it got us. Hating commens brought fanboy comments. Fanboy comments brought hating comments. It was a vicious cycle.

And now it's happening again. With less rate downs and trolls which is good, but the blind faith is still there, and it is not helping the game at all. If there is something wrong with Yoshida's plans and something can be done about it, we should not stay silent and simply take what's coming to us. The man has a lot of good changes coming, and a lot of questionable changes coming. And we need to question those questionable changes before it's too late to do so.

Edited, Feb 21st 2011 1:29pm by Hyanmen
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We really want to compete against World of Warcraft and for example the new Star Wars MMO.

#135 Feb 21 2011 at 4:52 AM Rating: Good
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9,043 posts
The main issue for me is that they need to get the game back into a playable state until April-May time.

This is when SW:TOR is (roughly) set to be released. And considering the lure of:

a) The Star Wars franchise;
b) Bioware, the people who made Mass Effect and Dragon Age;
c) After years of waiting, a conclusion to KOTOR 1 and 2.

Lots and lots of people will be looking to pick it up. And if it's polished, has things to do, and is fun to play (from what I hear and what I see, it looks very, very good), then SE could be in even more trouble.

The thing with MMO's is that once you get into a game, you won't leave. People who played XIV, quit, then picked up another game and have invested some time into it, and are getting somewhere and having fun, probably won't want to come back.

And you can't blame them. Why would they, after all?

Me, I'm not playing any MMO's right now. I'm reserving my judgement. XIV doesn't run that great on my laptop. It's passable, but the graphics are basically PS1 standard with delusions of grandeur. And I'm not buying a new computer. Yet.

This next patch (whenever it may be? I thought it was meant to be this week, but I've heard nothing?) is important. Very, very important...
____________________________
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Asura Server, FFXI. Adventurer Extraordinaire.
#136 Feb 21 2011 at 5:22 AM Rating: Decent
Kirby the Eccentric wrote:
LeilaniWildfire, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
What comes to the physical level being removed... go ahead, I never really saw what was the point of it anyway Smiley: rolleyes
It gave some players the opportunity to be a bit creative with how their character performs in battle.

Like my Archer. It has 100 STR, 100 DEX, 100 VIT, 79 MND and 79 PIE. Surely I would be doing more damage, evading more attacks, taking less damage and have more HP if I didn't bother to put points into MND and PIE.

I wanted my Archer to be able to successfully debuff mobs in small groups, and duos, seeing as the people I play with don't often play on Conjurer or Thaumaturge.
I also enjoy having a decent amount of magic defense and resistance, and being able to keep up my MP flow with Siphon MP (Piety being a major attribute).

I prefer flexibility and versatility when I play. Others may not. The point is, we were given a choice on how we play.
I hope SE implements Option #2 on this particular issue.


Well, I guess that is a valid point. In my opinnion however I think Archer is not a mage and should not be able to debuff mobs like a mage would do...
Annnnnd, imo if you wanted to customize your character a little bit more than with just abilities, then you should be able to do it by using different kind of gear sets - not stats.

Call me old fashioned, but I always have voted for more defined jobs and this would be a move to the right direction! ^_^
____________________________

#137 Feb 21 2011 at 5:48 AM Rating: Good
*****
16,959 posts
LeilaniWildfire, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Kirby the Eccentric wrote:
LeilaniWildfire, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
What comes to the physical level being removed... go ahead, I never really saw what was the point of it anyway Smiley: rolleyes
It gave some players the opportunity to be a bit creative with how their character performs in battle.

Like my Archer. It has 100 STR, 100 DEX, 100 VIT, 79 MND and 79 PIE. Surely I would be doing more damage, evading more attacks, taking less damage and have more HP if I didn't bother to put points into MND and PIE.

I wanted my Archer to be able to successfully debuff mobs in small groups, and duos, seeing as the people I play with don't often play on Conjurer or Thaumaturge.
I also enjoy having a decent amount of magic defense and resistance, and being able to keep up my MP flow with Siphon MP (Piety being a major attribute).

I prefer flexibility and versatility when I play. Others may not. The point is, we were given a choice on how we play.
I hope SE implements Option #2 on this particular issue.


Well, I guess that is a valid point. In my opinnion however I think Archer is not a mage and should not be able to debuff mobs like a mage would do...
Annnnnd, imo if you wanted to customize your character a little bit more than with just abilities, then you should be able to do it by using different kind of gear sets - not stats.
Well, until SE gives us more gear to play with, my stats and abilities will be the only thing I can play around with.

LeilaniWildfire, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Call me old fashioned, but I always have voted for more defined jobs and this would be a move to the right direction! ^_^
It was a great thing in FFXI, but I'm really liking how varied you can set up each character.

As long as they still let me customize (more than my gear, preferably), I won't be too put off by SE trying to give the classes more specialized roles. I just didn't think FFXIV was going that route when I first picked it up.

Edited, Feb 21st 2011 4:48am by Kirby
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#138 Feb 21 2011 at 7:37 AM Rating: Default
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2,202 posts
Hyanmen wrote:
Just one thing to think about here- something that I doubt many have even realized since it's not an issue at the moment.

Casuals in this game are going to be at a great disadvantage with the proposed changes. Unlike in XI, where you could only change your job in very specific circumstances, here the only pre-requisite as far as I know is that you are not engaged.

While it was easy to see that the people with only one or two jobs leveled in XI could not be as flexible as the people with multiple jobs, the fact that job changing was so limited made up for that fact. When you went into the instance or event or whatever, it hardly mattered whether you had six jobs leveled or just one, since you could only access one job on any given event. Therefore it wasn't such a disadvantage to focus on one job and people could get by without being considered second-class players. This was enforced with the fact that many events were locked once started, so you couldn't just warp back to town to change or log to an alt.

Here, though? The only feature keeping single-class characters at least somewhat competitive was the physical level system. It wasn't perfect, but it was close to being that way with few small changes to close the gap between evenly distributed and specialized player. Right now they are going to strip that only advantage single-class players had in this game, making it even clearer that if you focus on only one class, you are going to be inferior. It is logical that someone who puts enough time into his character to level more than one class should be a stronger player than someone with only one class, but it's not always simply an issue of time- some people simply want to focus on a single class or playstyle.

With the proposed changes in place, there is no reason to ever invite someone with just one class over someone with more than one class. There is no such safety net in place like in XI where it didn't matter how many jobs you had during the event itself. Here it does matter.

The only way to keep things fair is to implement an alternative system that keeps single class builds at least competitive in theory, or the dev team needs to restrict our access to the classes. The latter option sounds like such a fail that it's not even funny, so I hope they can come up with something better. Otherwise we may as well call this the Hardcore Fantasy XIV.


You brought up a great point, i was thinking something similar to that, but more focused on end game raiding or W/E is the = on FFXIV, as to people with more jobs, would have better chances to drop a boss, since hence they would have more stats, more skills, etc etc. Can that be the case ?
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MUTED
#139 Feb 21 2011 at 7:53 AM Rating: Decent
Hyanmen wrote:
Just one thing to think about here- something that I doubt many have even realized since it's not an issue at the moment.

Casuals in this game are going to be at a great disadvantage with the proposed changes. Unlike in XI, where you could only change your job in very specific circumstances, here the only pre-requisite as far as I know is that you are not engaged.

While it was easy to see that the people with only one or two jobs leveled in XI could not be as flexible as the people with multiple jobs, the fact that job changing was so limited made up for that fact. When you went into the instance or event or whatever, it hardly mattered whether you had six jobs leveled or just one, since you could only access one job on any given event. Therefore it wasn't such a disadvantage to focus on one job and people could get by without being considered second-class players. This was enforced with the fact that many events were locked once started, so you couldn't just warp back to town to change or log to an alt.

Here, though? The only feature keeping single-class characters at least somewhat competitive was the physical level system. It wasn't perfect, but it was close to being that way with few small changes to close the gap between evenly distributed and specialized player. Right now they are going to strip that only advantage single-class players had in this game, making it even clearer that if you focus on only one class, you are going to be inferior. It is logical that someone who puts enough time into his character to level more than one class should be a stronger player than someone with only one class, but it's not always simply an issue of time- some people simply want to focus on a single class or playstyle.

With the proposed changes in place, there is no reason to ever invite someone with just one class over someone with more than one class. There is no such safety net in place like in XI where it didn't matter how many jobs you had during the event itself. Here it does matter.

The only way to keep things fair is to implement an alternative system that keeps single class builds at least competitive in theory, or the dev team needs to restrict our access to the classes. The latter option sounds like such a fail that it's not even funny, so I hope they can come up with something better. Otherwise we may as well call this the Hardcore Fantasy XIV.



Well, in FFXI you had the choice of support jobs.

Also, I think players will define their playstyle no matter what system we have in place. I would actually prefer to fight super tough NMs with a devoted gladiator (just an example) or someone who has half ***** played all jobs to 50.
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#140 Feb 21 2011 at 9:23 AM Rating: Good
44 posts
LeilaniWildfire, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Kirby the Eccentric wrote:
LeilaniWildfire, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
What comes to the physical level being removed... go ahead, I never really saw what was the point of it anyway Smiley: rolleyes
It gave some players the opportunity to be a bit creative with how their character performs in battle.

Like my Archer. It has 100 STR, 100 DEX, 100 VIT, 79 MND and 79 PIE. Surely I would be doing more damage, evading more attacks, taking less damage and have more HP if I didn't bother to put points into MND and PIE.

I wanted my Archer to be able to successfully debuff mobs in small groups, and duos, seeing as the people I play with don't often play on Conjurer or Thaumaturge.
I also enjoy having a decent amount of magic defense and resistance, and being able to keep up my MP flow with Siphon MP (Piety being a major attribute).

I prefer flexibility and versatility when I play. Others may not. The point is, we were given a choice on how we play.
I hope SE implements Option #2 on this particular issue.


Well, I guess that is a valid point. In my opinnion however I think Archer is not a mage and should not be able to debuff mobs like a mage would do...
Annnnnd, imo if you wanted to customize your character a little bit more than with just abilities, then you should be able to do it by using different kind of gear sets - not stats.

Call me old fashioned, but I always have voted for more defined jobs and this would be a move to the right direction! ^_^



And this is a terrible line of thinking which leads to the exact same type of game with different graphics. There is no way to sugar coat it, I'm sorry if I sound rube but you have an archaic line of thinking that belongs helping to code 8bit games.

Gear should not define the character you play, the abilities and how you apply them to each situation should.
#141 Feb 21 2011 at 9:36 AM Rating: Decent
Seikninkuru wrote:
LeilaniWildfire, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Kirby the Eccentric wrote:
LeilaniWildfire, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
What comes to the physical level being removed... go ahead, I never really saw what was the point of it anyway Smiley: rolleyes
It gave some players the opportunity to be a bit creative with how their character performs in battle.

Like my Archer. It has 100 STR, 100 DEX, 100 VIT, 79 MND and 79 PIE. Surely I would be doing more damage, evading more attacks, taking less damage and have more HP if I didn't bother to put points into MND and PIE.

I wanted my Archer to be able to successfully debuff mobs in small groups, and duos, seeing as the people I play with don't often play on Conjurer or Thaumaturge.
I also enjoy having a decent amount of magic defense and resistance, and being able to keep up my MP flow with Siphon MP (Piety being a major attribute).

I prefer flexibility and versatility when I play. Others may not. The point is, we were given a choice on how we play.
I hope SE implements Option #2 on this particular issue.


Well, I guess that is a valid point. In my opinnion however I think Archer is not a mage and should not be able to debuff mobs like a mage would do...
Annnnnd, imo if you wanted to customize your character a little bit more than with just abilities, then you should be able to do it by using different kind of gear sets - not stats.

Call me old fashioned, but I always have voted for more defined jobs and this would be a move to the right direction! ^_^



And this is a terrible line of thinking which leads to the exact same type of game with different graphics. There is no way to sugar coat it, I'm sorry if I sound rube but you have an archaic line of thinking that belongs helping to code 8bit games.

Gear should not define the character you play, the abilities and how you apply them to each situation should.




Well no... it has nothing to do with your so called "8bit games thinking" but all about role playing games thinking. Where I come from you excel in the job you choose to do and not try be a 5 star Michelin chef and a brain surgeon at the same time.... nothing bad about having cooking as a hobby though, since being a brain surgeon can be a bit stressful I would think.

How many point and shoot games there are? How many driving games there are? Or sports games? IMO ice hockey and football is exactly the same game... one is with white ground and one with green, but tell that to a huge FIFA football fan and they will call you a troll lol.

To me.... Final Fantasy party has a tank, DDs, healer, nuker, buffer.... Tank is not the buffer nor the healer... Healer is not the tank etc. you get the point. I know I am not alone with this and you can shove your "I'm sorry if I sound rude" since opinions don't have expiry date.
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#142 Feb 21 2011 at 9:40 AM Rating: Excellent
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3,416 posts
Quote:
To me.... Final Fantasy party has a tank, DDs, healer, nuker, buffer.... Tank is not the buffer nor the healer... Healer is not the tank etc. you get the point.


Not sure I do. Why must the roles be determined by the class instead of the encounter? That limits the party-play so much it makes the whole ordeal a headache to manage. I'm all for there being specific roles for encounters instead of zerg fests where everyone does everything. I'm not for there being specific roles for classes so I'm stuck looking for class X to perform in role Y because the system lacks flexibility for other classes to perform in role Y if needed.
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Quote:
We really want to compete against World of Warcraft and for example the new Star Wars MMO.

#143 Feb 21 2011 at 9:40 AM Rating: Decent
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I am also sooo archaic.
I also want true expert jobs, true "identities" if you will so, and not a wish-wash rag-tag assembly of abilities.

I am even more archaic.
I am all for Roegady having twice the HP of a Lalafel. At least. ^.^/
#144 Feb 21 2011 at 11:28 AM Rating: Good
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9,526 posts
Kirby the Eccentric wrote:
LeilaniWildfire, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
What comes to the physical level being removed... go ahead, I never really saw what was the point of it anyway Smiley: rolleyes
It gave some players the opportunity to be a bit creative with how their character performs in battle.

Like my Archer. It has 100 STR, 100 DEX, 100 VIT, 79 MND and 79 PIE. Surely I would be doing more damage, evading more attacks, taking less damage and have more HP if I didn't bother to put points into MND and PIE.

I wanted my Archer to be able to successfully debuff mobs in small groups, and duos, seeing as the people I play with don't often play on Conjurer or Thaumaturge.
I also enjoy having a decent amount of magic defense and resistance, and being able to keep up my MP flow with Siphon MP (Piety being a major attribute).

I prefer flexibility and versatility when I play. Others may not. The point is, we were given a choice on how we play.
I hope SE implements Option #2 on this particular issue.


Yeah, people who only want to be the best at a very narrow range of things don't like physical level because they want to be the "best" on every job so they hate the skill point attribute cool downs. It is neither right nor wrong but I prefer to choose what I am going to be best at... and how I want to play my job
____________________________
lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#145 Feb 21 2011 at 11:42 AM Rating: Good
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9,526 posts
Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
Granted, adding content is something that has to be done. And preferably soon. However, there are LOTS of other issues to be dealt with as well. Yoshi-P is doing what he can to keep the Titanic from sinking. And, frankly, he's doing an amazing job. If anyone can save this game, its him.


OP is saying that he doesn't think that Yoshi-P is doing an amazing job, and you really said nothing to counter that. Except that you think he's doing an amazing job.


This and...

Yeah, and I do recognize SE is a for-profit company. I just seriously question how they will ever make a profit if they spend all their time pulling apart things that work versus adding content and things that make the game more fun.

And I've bought the box, and I've keyed in 60 bucks worth of crysta (basically I HAVE put in money for all the months I've played). I'm an "investor" in my own way.

I could be wrong, I have no doubt about that. I'm not saying that I'm the only player in the universe that matters or anything.

I just don't see how driving away the people who play will make this game better. I don't see how stripping this game of the things that make it unique in favour of copying other games will make it better.

I think they should be using player feedback to make new content more than rework old content. Current jobs are not unique enough? Make new jobs which are more unique. Gridania is ugly? Make a new forest zone which conforms to player feedback. I would rather have more to choose from than spend another six months having them pull crap apart and put it back together.

Yoshi hasn't done ANYTHING really - I mean, boosting SP was a good idea - but it doesn't really change anything. It doesn't give me content to do with my LS mates. If he has half the dev team working on pulling apart things that WORK already (instead of polishing them and making them work BETTER) then it will take twice as long for this game to be polished and twice as long for it to have fun content.





Edited, Feb 21st 2011 9:43am by Olorinus
____________________________
lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#146 Feb 21 2011 at 12:45 PM Rating: Good
38 posts
I think it ruins the immersion to have to close your window and look up quests.

I also think that in a poll people who have played a lot or a little bit have the right to comment about the state of the game. Most people are not happy with the game as it is. Which is why most of them left. SE had invested a lot of money in this game and is willing to do whatever it takes to bring people back. Since you are in the minority (i.e. one who still regularly plays and enjoys this game) and are playing for free currently, SE has no interest in retaining this small base when they have the opportunity to reach more subscribers by changing the game. It is fine if you do not want the game to change. But SE did not make the game for you but for as many people as possible. After all, they are a business and their expectations were hardly met at release and the following months. I think that making the game more like the popular games out there would be good for SE and for FFXIV. You are being a stick in the mud and cannot see the forest for the trees. You have not realized how poorly this product has impacted the bottom line for SE and how this product failed to meet expectations for the gaming community as a whole. YOU need to stop being so elitist and realize that what you think is great is actually pitifully losing players by the day despite even being free at this point.
#147 Feb 21 2011 at 1:03 PM Rating: Excellent
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1,606 posts
Quote:
If he has half the dev team working on pulling apart things that WORK already (instead of polishing them and making them work BETTER) then it will take twice as long for this game to be polished and twice as long for it to have fun content.

I feel for you but I have had concerns about this since they said they were going F2P until it was ready.. I think this is presently another sort of open beta mode. It's like we are kind of guinea pigs as opposed to actual customers right now. It seems a lot is riding on the PS3 release so we're in the position where if it takes twice as long or three times as long or four times as long to get it to a point that makes it acceptable for PS3 launch then they probably will take that time. People playing right now will just have to wait.

I also have concerns about this being a major time of transition. The game as it was at release and/or is now, may be very different than what will come out on the PS3. I don't just mean additional content but core mechanics.

In the end, I hope it will all work out but getting to that point may be a rough ride.
#148 Feb 21 2011 at 1:24 PM Rating: Good
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4,902 posts
******* finally, I guess we should be thankful the rest of the world isnt as slow to catch on as you. Try WoW, I've been having a blast... Lemme know if you wanna start it and we can do the recruit a buddy thing for triple xp when we xp together okgo.
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#149 Feb 21 2011 at 1:37 PM Rating: Decent
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9,526 posts
JanesAnsible wrote:
SE has no interest in retaining this small base when they have the opportunity to reach more subscribers by changing the game.


Let's be clear. I understand that if this game doesn't get more subscribers, it will go offline. Obviously, given the fact I like the game, I don't want that to happen.

So, now that we have that out of the way, let's get down to brass tacks.

SE needs as many customers as possible, period. They can't afford to sacrifice ANYONE who is playing at this point. They need to get people to pick up the game, and they need to keep the people playing, playing. Anyone who thinks it is a winning business strategy to drive off people who have invested their time and money into this game, is out of their mind. They need to keep people playing.

Yes, they need to bring more people in, but ******* around with things that work will not do that. Polishing the existing content/mechanics while developing new engaging, fun content will bring people in and keep them playing. An in-game casino, tetra-master, chocobo breeding, player-made companies, player/linkshell housing, new jobs, new areas, new equipment, new NMs... these things will get people playing.

Anyone who thinks SE is going to keep this free-to-play for a year or more, is outta their mind. The fact is - if Yoshi-P keeps down this path, and keeps fiddling with what we have instead of giving us MORE... well the game is probably doomed.

I can see it now, they add in auto-attack, it breaks the combat system completely - people quit the game once and for all... and the servers go down.

Frankly if they can't even fix the basic crap we have, I don't have confidence in their ability to remake the whole game on a tight schedule unless they give up on content completely.
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lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#150 Feb 21 2011 at 1:48 PM Rating: Good
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SE needs as many customers as possible, period. They can't afford to sacrifice ANYONE who is playing at this point. They need to get people to pick up the game, and they need to keep the people playing, playing. Anyone who thinks it is a winning business strategy to drive off people who have invested their time and money into this game, is out of their mind. They need to keep people playing.


That's where you are mistaken. Many of those who are playing at the moment are - sorry if this offends - resilient hardcore nerds and FF devotees who invested an unusual lot of their time in a sub-par game and now, naturally, don't want to lose the "advantage" they gained by grinding through a game system that the majority of potential customers considers unappealing. If SE wants to attract new customers, why should it stick to a system that is unappealing to all but a few? Btw, don't you think a significant and hard-to-catch-up advantage for the remaining players would turn off a lot of potential newcomers?
#151 Feb 21 2011 at 1:59 PM Rating: Excellent
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OP, I hear you.... but....

SE really doesn't care if they ailienate the existing play base as long as the capture a larger one.



Besides, stealing some functional features from the most popular MMO in the world isn't the worst thing they could do to FFXIV at this particular point in time. Its like someone who is starving to death turning down a turkey sandwich because it has mustard on it.

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