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Sidequests: not very goodFollow

#102 Mar 04 2011 at 2:40 AM Rating: Default
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I think people are hurt by the expectations they held S-E to, and rightfully so.


Seriously, if people had some kind of expectations from SE's MMO's after September 2010 it's their own ******* fault. What justifies those expectations exactly?

They are working on million issues at once, not on content exclusively. There were either going to be 2 quality quests or 20 poorly implemented quests and anyone expecting more needs to take a good hard look at the reality and suck it up. They don't have the manpower for your content expectations, if you can't deal with it, don't play.
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#103 Mar 04 2011 at 2:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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Maybe it's just me, but I actually don't think the quests are that bad. It's a great start to content, and I'm hoping that these quests are pre-requisites to more that will be added in the future.

I say "keep it up, Yoshida". Game is not quite worth paying yet, but it's getting close.
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#104 Mar 04 2011 at 2:58 AM Rating: Good
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AkumaOokami wrote:
Verecund wrote:
This game can only get better.




Unless they introduce a chocobo mini-pet store.

Then it might actually pass up FFX-2.


Choco mini-pet store?
I'm totally in...



I'll pay monthly sub for that!
#105 Mar 04 2011 at 3:09 AM Rating: Excellent
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Mistress Theonehio wrote:
I say "keep it up, Yoshida". Game is not quite worth paying yet, but it's getting close.

Close to being playable and only going on 6 months after release =/

Just out of curiousity, for the people waving the 'expectations' flag... what exactly should someone come to expect from a seasoned game development and production company like Square Enix? A neatly packaged ball of *****? It's pretty comparable to what you've got at the moment with XIV.
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#106 Mar 04 2011 at 3:30 AM Rating: Decent
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
Mistress Theonehio wrote:
I say "keep it up, Yoshida". Game is not quite worth paying yet, but it's getting close.

Close to being playable and only going on 6 months after release =/

Just out of curiousity, for the people waving the 'expectations' flag... what exactly should someone come to expect from a seasoned game development and production company like Square Enix? A neatly packaged ball of *****? It's pretty comparable to what you've got at the moment with XIV.


But FFXI was also bad when it launched so SE should get time to transform this neatly packaged ball of ***** in a beautiful butterfly like they did with FFXI! They already had 5 years and 6 months I know but it takes time to make butterflies man its like really hard
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#107 Mar 04 2011 at 3:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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Why was the NO CSs during quests-thread locked? It had far more relevant info on the quality of the quests than this one.
#108 Mar 04 2011 at 3:34 AM Rating: Good
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Just out of curiousity, for the people waving the 'expectations' flag... what exactly should someone come to expect from a seasoned game development and production company like Square Enix?


Pre-September or Post-September? These complaints would have made sense if we were still in Beta. SE released their MMO, it was not even nearly up to expectations, so where does this sudden faith stem from? You make absolutely no sense.

It's like you are let down, then your brain forgets the earlier disappointments and you're back up expecting a polished product for every update thereafter for no good reason (except that they were good before, something they already proved wrong in September).

Can't really say it any better than this. Although I'm not sure if this is worth the effort trying to explain since some of you seem to live in a world of your own where no failure ever happened and where you're still expecting something grand, only to be woken up to reality for a while every time a new patch hits.

It's almost scary.
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#109 Mar 04 2011 at 3:35 AM Rating: Excellent
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TheMoreYouKnow wrote:
Just because people didn't want WoW quests doesn't mean they wanted something that serves no purpose whatsoever. Leves cover the generic EXP quests from WoW just fine, but that's no excuse for wasting development time on sidequests that are basically leves without the rewards.
Not quite. Leves cover what daily quests cover in WoW. As in, the quests that are there to give you something to do after you hit level cap because your money for flasks and repairs between raids/PvP matches had to come from somewhere. Killing moles and dodos every 18 hours is no different than killing 10 agents of the scourge or doing "Thrusting Hodir's Spear" every 24.

Concept-wise the intent was different (due to lore reasons), but implementation is a carbon copy of dailies, simply placed on upon the player's lap at the beginning of the game.

XI made the mistake of making things so convoluted or disproportionate (in terms of effort:reward) that barring the quests for certain scrolls and maps there was little point to it outside of those "no events going on and I have nothing to do" moments. I simply don't want to see questing devalued like that again. Now whether XIV should take up any part of the actual questing system from WoW (as in, full storylines told over several quests that are relevant to the zone you're in and tasking you with different things for different purposes, all while progressing your character and getting an upgrade or three) is a completely different matter. I do know someone who won't return to XIV until they implement exp-gained-through-quests. A tall order, IMO, but something tells me he's not alone in feeling that way.
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#110 Mar 04 2011 at 4:00 AM Rating: Excellent
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Close to being playable and only going on 6 months after release =/

Just out of curiousity, for the people waving the 'expectations' flag... what exactly should someone come to expect from a seasoned game development and production company like Square Enix? A neatly packaged ball of *****? It's pretty comparable to what you've got at the moment with XIV.


If people are still playing they will obvious have high expectations after every update, it's human nature. People that can't take it anymore have left to play other things, mroe time that goes by the less chance theywill be willing to give the game another go when they do bring it up.

The problem this game obviously now has (aside from everything else) is that although they do want to fix it, they have a really small staff working on it. How long do you think one guy working 9-5 would take to make 15-16 quests?

They added NMs, everyone was excited, it was a handful and implemented badly.
They added Quests, everyone was excited, it was a handful of quests and implemented badly.

They add landmark bits of content and they end up being terribad, the money men are hovering on what they want to do. They want to fix it but they aren't allowed to have the amount of staff to do the things they are adding properly. From what I've read the amount and quality of these quests is laughable, this was not some small starter quests like in other MMOs(which you can forgive)' this was landmark updates 6 months late adding quests which everyone was waiting for and was touted. Big fail, what a shock.
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#111 Mar 04 2011 at 4:51 AM Rating: Decent
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Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
I think people are hurt by the expectations they held S-E to, and rightfully so.


Seriously, if people had some kind of expectations from SE's MMO's after September 2010 it's their own ******* fault. What justifies those expectations exactly?

They are working on million issues at once, not on content exclusively. There were either going to be 2 quality quests or 20 poorly implemented quests and anyone expecting more needs to take a good hard look at the reality and suck it up. They don't have the manpower for your content expectations, if you can't deal with it, don't play.


I can't tell if you support the game or not.

Surely, the only thing worse than a half-assed quest system is silence from the remaining players over said system. And the biggest problem for FFXIV right now is a lack of players.

So, what else can I conclude from your admonishments to cease playing against those who wish to vocalize dissatisfaction but that you desire to see FFXIV completely destroyed? If so, I can only salute your crafty villainy in this matter.

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 5:51am by ForceOfMeh
#112 Mar 04 2011 at 7:58 AM Rating: Excellent
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Alright I tried going through two quests in Uldar. The Desert Shade dodo-killing quest, and the insomnia-related quest involving marmots (which I believe have a funny lampshading).

I found at least what they say interesting. It makes me feel like I'm saying "Oh ok I'll help your cause of helping Thanalan return to being a lush forest" instead of "I don't care about your **** problem, hunter, just tell me what I need to kill so I can get xp/loot/gold".

I think the aim of these quests, as Yoshida had said I believe, is to flesh out the world a bit more. Kinda like quests in FFXI. I don't think it's intended to be a source of leveling or real rewards like in most MMOs. As a content patch, it can be considered lacking, but these SIDEquests may be space for developers to give quests that make the players who seek know more about the FFXIV world whenever they can spare time to develop as a SIDE thing. Say in the future they have an expansion about the Empire invasion, so some NPC soldier can give you a quest to kill some Empire scouts while explaining what we know about the Empire military.

Kinda like "Expository Quests", if you will. A quest for you while having exposition.

So my conclusion: sidequests seem like a long-term placeholder project, not anything substantial. The development team seem to be working mainly on rehauling the main system (battle, crafting, etc), and that takes time. This is a 'something' to show progress or at lest to show that something is happening. There's complaint, but I think there will be more if they go quiet for a month or two for bigger stuff.

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 9:00am by Enfid
#113 Mar 04 2011 at 8:09 AM Rating: Good
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Enfid wrote:

I think the aim of these quests, as Yoshida had said I believe, is to flesh out the world a bit more. Kinda like quests in FFXI. I don't think it's intended to be a source of leveling or real rewards like in most MMOs.


See to me it looks like the 'aim' of these quests was to say "hey we added quests like you wanted". The tried to copy from other games,the most basic sense of what a quest is, without letting it disrupt their game in any way.
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#114 Mar 04 2011 at 8:40 AM Rating: Decent
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I'm wondering if perhaps this initial offering of quests is designed to gauge community reaction so that they can make adjustments to future quests. Just go to the forums on Tuesday and ***** your hearts out about it.

Edit: Also, what's the issue with the rewards? Are they too low-level for the rank required or something?

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 9:41am by Quanta
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#115 Mar 04 2011 at 9:18 AM Rating: Good
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Quanta wrote:
I'm wondering if perhaps this initial offering of quests is designed to gauge community reaction so that they can make adjustments to future quests. Just go to the forums on Tuesday and ***** your hearts out about it.

Edit: Also, what's the issue with the rewards? Are they too low-level for the rank required or something?

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 9:41am by Quanta



I really hope that's not the case or it would mean SE is looking to us to see with just how little they can get away with.
#116 Mar 04 2011 at 9:22 AM Rating: Good
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seiferdincht wrote:
Quanta wrote:
I'm wondering if perhaps this initial offering of quests is designed to gauge community reaction so that they can make adjustments to future quests. Just go to the forums on Tuesday and ***** your hearts out about it.

Edit: Also, what's the issue with the rewards? Are they too low-level for the rank required or something?

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 9:41am by Quanta



I really hope that's not the case or it would mean SE is looking to us to see with just how little they can get away with.


There's not a lot they can do to gauge community reaction without a PTR...or a big enough playerbase to support a PTR, for that matter. :P
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#117 Mar 04 2011 at 9:30 AM Rating: Decent
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How easily people seem to forget we are still in beta. Given, it is the last phase of beta(or gamma, or whatever the smart-mouthed technical know-it-alls are going to call it). SE has said the game is unplayable in it's current state, are holding polls to figure out what people want the game to be, are with-holding content that defines the game before it has found its identity, and not adding things that would make the game more difficult to balance due to it already unbalanced state. We are not paying a subscription, we paid an initial price which can be viewed as an open beta key(not trying to justify or make an excuse because it was a lot of money in comparison to others).

My main point: Shut your angry and pretentious mouths until your paying a sub. Because right now, you are only yelling at someone who is agreeing with you. NEWS FLASH: SE KNOWS THE GAME IS NOT ENJOYABLE FOR THE MASSES!!! ZOMG REALLY? They don't need everyone with a finger and a keyboard telling them so. Yea, that's how they figured it out, but they are aware NOW.

And yes, I would also prefer if they moved it along a little faster. They cannot, however, throw everything they have at us due to it's major affects on every aspect of the game. Imagine you are laying tiles on a floor. Do you simply throw out all the tiles you have until the floor is covered? No, you need to place and measure each tile carefully so it is square, straight, secure, and unbroken. This takes time, but much less than picking up the mess you just made and redoing it correctly.

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 10:33am by AtryxEtair
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#118 Mar 04 2011 at 9:40 AM Rating: Excellent
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I fear that SE is so far behind that they will never catch up.

By that I mean, they are just now, after many months, implementing quest style that most mmos are trying to get away from...
The "Go get me X piece of Y" quest are not "content" they are filling for uninspired game designer.
Replace X and Y by your favorite mobs and piece of mobs and voila... you have 8 billion new quest......

Not very interesting, and no, I don't find it interesting in any other game either.

The one good thing is that at that pace, once the game is worth playing, it will run on every computer you can find. (if we still call them computers in that era).


Very disapointed about what SE has offered in the past few years.
#119 Mar 04 2011 at 9:43 AM Rating: Good
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AtryxEtair wrote:
How easily people seem to forget we are still in beta. Given, it is the last phase of beta(or gamma, or whatever the smart-mouthed technical know-it-alls are going to call it). SE has said the game is unplayable in it's current state, are holding polls to figure out what people want the game to be, are with-holding content that defines the game before it has found its identity, and not adding things that would make the game more difficult to balance due to it already unbalanced state. We are not paying a subscription, we paid an initial price which can be viewed as an open beta key(not trying to justify or make an excuse because it was a lot of money in comparison to others).

My main point: Shut your angry and pretentious mouths until your paying a sub. Because right now, you are only yelling at someone who is agreeing with you. NEWS FLASH: SE KNOWS THE GAME IS NOT ENJOYABLE FOR THE MASSES!!! ZOMG REALLY? They don't need everyone with a finger and a keyboard telling them so. Yea, that's how they figured it out, but they are aware NOW.

And yes, I would also prefer if they moved it along a little faster. They cannot, however, throw everything they have at us due to it's major affects on every aspect of the game. Imagine you are laying tiles on a floor. Do you simply throw out all the tiles you have until the floor is covered? No, you need to place and measure each tile carefully so it is square, straight, secure, and unbroken. This takes time, but much less than picking up the mess you just made and redoing it correctly.

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 10:33am by AtryxEtair


I think everyone understands why the whole floor isn't covered yet. It seems the cheap quality of the tile chosen by the interior designer that's the thing most seem to have a problem with. Also SE is trying to make people move from an old house that has much thicker and nicer tiles so the new residents know quality when they see it.

#120 Mar 04 2011 at 9:45 AM Rating: Decent
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All they'd have to do to make quests worth while is add SP/EXP to them. Not that hard.

Give me something to do that will move me forward, gear I don't need isn't going to help fun new and different ways to gain SP will.

I did two rank 35/45 quests got rewards I didn't need because I did them @ 50 and wouldn't have needed because they weren't right for my other class.

The quest itself wasn't to bad I fought different mobs than I'm used to and took me to some spots I wouldn't have gone to.

Then I realized the time spent walking and anima spent for rewards I wont use and have no SP/XP to show for it. (not that it matters I'm capped @ 50/50)

Dissapointed. I hope they adjust these down the road cause better rewards or simple SP would make these AMAZING.
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#121 Mar 04 2011 at 9:51 AM Rating: Good
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Hydragyrum wrote:

Don't expect every quest to be of CoP quality. While this is not an excuse for all quests to be lackluster, you also cannot expect every quest to be epic.


People keep coming back with this strawman argument: nobody asked for "epic CoP-quality cutscenes!"

I always thought people asked for little quests like FFXI - in fact they did! - they (we) asked for (hoped for) "small-scale, non-voice-acted, sell-some-hats-to-the-Windurstians" style quests, or for "several lines of dialogue and a Star Onion Brigade" style quests.

See the difference? While the latter are certainly less than CoP, they're better than anything FFXIV added in. People wanted FFXI-like quests, not barely-even-the-low-WoW-standard quests. Not expansion-quality cutscenes... just some actual quests outside of the skippable, generic confirmation menu and a random reward slapped on at the end.
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#122 Mar 04 2011 at 9:59 AM Rating: Good
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seiferdincht wrote:
AtryxEtair wrote:
How easily people seem to forget we are still in beta. Given, it is the last phase of beta(or gamma, or whatever the smart-mouthed technical know-it-alls are going to call it). SE has said the game is unplayable in it's current state, are holding polls to figure out what people want the game to be, are with-holding content that defines the game before it has found its identity, and not adding things that would make the game more difficult to balance due to it already unbalanced state. We are not paying a subscription, we paid an initial price which can be viewed as an open beta key(not trying to justify or make an excuse because it was a lot of money in comparison to others).

My main point: Shut your angry and pretentious mouths until your paying a sub. Because right now, you are only yelling at someone who is agreeing with you. NEWS FLASH: SE KNOWS THE GAME IS NOT ENJOYABLE FOR THE MASSES!!! ZOMG REALLY? They don't need everyone with a finger and a keyboard telling them so. Yea, that's how they figured it out, but they are aware NOW.

And yes, I would also prefer if they moved it along a little faster. They cannot, however, throw everything they have at us due to it's major affects on every aspect of the game. Imagine you are laying tiles on a floor. Do you simply throw out all the tiles you have until the floor is covered? No, you need to place and measure each tile carefully so it is square, straight, secure, and unbroken. This takes time, but much less than picking up the mess you just made and redoing it correctly.

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 10:33am by AtryxEtair


I think everyone understands why the whole floor isn't covered yet. It seems the cheap quality of the tile chosen by the interior designer that's the thing most seem to have a problem with. Also SE is trying to make people move from an old house that has much thicker and nicer tiles so the new residents know quality when they see it.



Let's not pick apart every aspect of an analogy, especially after applying it incorrectly. Cheap can still look good, and expensive can still look bad. But that isn't what was being discussed here. The idea was that no matter the expense of said resources, unless adequate time and effort is put into them, they will not look presentable or function properly. Everyone here knows SE has the resources. The game looks and sounds great but it functions poorly(to put it nicely). The quality of a piece of work can only be measured after when more of it ha been completed than not. Even then it is subject to change.

This game has much more to do than it has done. I'm not talking about in terms of content because then no MMO is "done." I'm talking about foundation and mechanics.

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 11:02am by AtryxEtair
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#123 Mar 04 2011 at 10:09 AM Rating: Excellent
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I really like the sidequests for 2 reasons:

1. I had low expectations
2. They have brought life to an otherwise lifeless city.
#124 Mar 04 2011 at 10:32 AM Rating: Excellent
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Kirutaru wrote:
You will get used to recognizing people just based on their appearance - just like real life!


Until they change gear and/or wear gear that covers their hair.

Seriously, the character customization in this game is already not the best. Telling players apart without names would be hellish...

As for the sidequests, why don't the mobs at least give us SP? That makes no sense to me...
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#125 Mar 04 2011 at 10:36 AM Rating: Decent
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I just read the interview from ZAM, and was very happy with the clarity of his directions for the game. These side quests are only the beginning of a "very long roadmap". These are not designed to be character builders but instead, world builders. Now that he clearly states some direction for the game and end game goals being incorporated, as well as low level NM's, multi-stage artifact type armor with multiple avenues of access. WOW is my impression!

Edit: Feel the need to clarify that wow is a feeling not a reference to the devil lol

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 11:39am by Antharl
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#126 Mar 04 2011 at 11:10 AM Rating: Excellent
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I would be more then happy to give ffxiv all the time in the world, but when some new kid on the block releases a game and the launch goes smoovly, it only points out how glaring the problems are. Say what you want, hate what you want, like what you want, but if some unheard of company can do what SE could not In the same time frame Its hard to see how they will ever measure up. No names need to be said, but content, quest, endgame are all there for you from day one.
#127 Mar 04 2011 at 11:17 AM Rating: Good
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Is there a list of new quests found so far? I'd like to make sure I don't miss any, even if they do suck :P
#128 Mar 04 2011 at 11:29 AM Rating: Good
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If you look on Zams threads, they were full of people saying "ZOMG PLEASE DONT LET QUESTS GIVE EXP"
Well Yoshi listened. Thanks jackasses.

Mediocre rewards if your rank 50, text box spam instead of CS, no exp ... its like WoW quests but without the advancement in the game.

Still, I'm glad something else was added. Mediocre content is still content right?

As for the agro icon, I like that there is one, but I don't like how it looks. Still, that's just graphics, and they can adjust it later. I'm glad the groundwork is there now. I think it'd be nicer if the names were just colored red or something.

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 12:36pm by Eadieni
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#129 Mar 04 2011 at 11:39 AM Rating: Decent
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Instead of saying "Quest Sucks" how about you provide some actual feedback. What do you like and what do you hate about them? Simply stating something sucks does help developers make it better. If you want a good game then do your part and provide honest feedback.
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#130 Mar 04 2011 at 11:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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The only part of this game that literally requires it (in order to not be a jackass) is when you are doing Behest so you don't target the wrong mobs and kill people's SP.

Considering that the thing keeping a lot of people playing at this point is the people they are playing with, I think it's a pretty key part of the game to be able to recognize your friends when they walk by.

Saying "If you don't like one kind of overhead marker, then you can turn them ALL of" is a somewhat baby-with-the-bathwater approach. It doesn't take a programming genius to make a toggle for individual interface elements.

But then, even after years and years of both FFXI and FFXIV, I still don't have the option of turning only my own name off. I know who *I* am...
#131 Mar 04 2011 at 12:36 PM Rating: Default
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dyvidd wrote:
Instead of saying "Quest Sucks" how about you provide some actual feedback. What do you like and what do you hate about them? Simply stating something sucks does help developers make it better. If you want a good game then do your part and provide honest feedback.


I do not agree, saying it sucks ( or not ) is the only relevant part of player feedback.
Having polls and player suggestion is not a good replacement for a good and creative game designer.
Anyway, with player feedback, you usually have as many people for and against every single idea out there.

Hire a game designer with a good idea and let him create it's master piece. ( Altho that should have been done a few years ago )

No, I have no suggestion, and no I did not apply for the game designer position either.

My feedback : I don't like the game because I have nothing interesting to do in it. ( aka it sucks )
My suggestion : Hire someone with new ideas.
#132 Mar 04 2011 at 12:41 PM Rating: Decent
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ElFrereDeLautre wrote:

Hire a game designer with a good idea and let him create it's master piece.


Look how that turned out on September release.
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#133 Mar 04 2011 at 12:50 PM Rating: Default
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Goshzilla wrote:
ElFrereDeLautre wrote:

Hire a game designer with a good idea and let him create it's master piece.


Look how that turned out on September release.



You forgot the other part of the sentence that is actually the important part.

#134 Mar 04 2011 at 12:56 PM Rating: Good
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ElFrereDeLautre wrote:
Goshzilla wrote:
ElFrereDeLautre wrote:

Hire a game designer with a good idea and let him create it's master piece.


Look how that turned out on September release.



You forgot the other part of the sentence that is actually the important part.


That leads us to the next question: How does a designer know if he has a good idea until he actually gets the position of lead game designer? The previous lead game designer also believed he had a good idea. Not only him, but the majority of the previous team ignored the community back in beta testing that the game was not ready whatsoever because they thought they had a, "good idea," for us all. What I put in bold suggests is to create this game yet again without listening to the feedback of the community; just like the beta phase.

And that is why we have Nobuaki Komoto and a new team.

Edit: I hate to deteriorate our discussion to subjective topics in this thread so I'll go ahead and end it here or you can PM me about what makes a competent game designer or not.

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 2:00pm by Goshzilla
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#135 Mar 04 2011 at 12:59 PM Rating: Decent
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If you look on Zams threads, they were full of people saying "ZOMG PLEASE DONT LET QUESTS GIVE EXP"
Well Yoshi listened. Thanks jackasses.


Just as it should be. Now they need to justify the fact that there is no EXP reward, not just add an exp reward and be done with it. Of course now it's not good enough, but the solution is not to just add the EXP reward so that we'll do the quests because of that, but to make the quests fun enough and tell us about the lore so that we'll do them because of that (and get rewarded with gear or something).

Maybe that's just me, but to me the way to solve the problem is not to make the quests revolve around getting EXP but around entertaining stories that flesh out the world we reside in. This is not the way, but neither is adding an EXP reward.
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We really want to compete against World of Warcraft and for example the new Star Wars MMO.

#136 Mar 04 2011 at 1:03 PM Rating: Good
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Hyanmen wrote:
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If you look on Zams threads, they were full of people saying "ZOMG PLEASE DONT LET QUESTS GIVE EXP"
Well Yoshi listened. Thanks jackasses.


Just as it should be. Now they need to justify the fact that there is no EXP reward, not just add an exp reward and be done with it. Of course now it's not good enough, but the solution is not to just add the EXP reward so that we'll do the quests because of that, but to make the quests fun enough and tell us about the lore so that we'll do them because of that (and get rewarded with gear or something).

Maybe that's just me, but to me the way to solve the problem is not to make the quests revolve around getting EXP but around entertaining stories that flesh out the world we reside in. This is not the way, but neither is adding an EXP reward.


AMEN!!! That's what I'm talking about. This is the FF way. The only thing I'd add is to put in item rewards. Like the Rare/Ex harness quest you had to get the subligars off of fomors for in XI.
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#137 Mar 04 2011 at 1:03 PM Rating: Default
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Goshzilla wrote:

That leads us to the next question: How does a designer know if he has a good idea until he actually gets the position of lead game designer? The previous lead game designer also believed he had a good idea. Not only him, but the majority of the previous team ignored the community back in beta testing that the game was not ready whatsoever because they thought they had a, "good idea," for us all. What I put in bold suggests is to create this game yet again without listening to the feedback of the community; just like the beta phase.

And that is why we have Nobuaki Komoto and a new team.

Edit: I hate to deteriorate our discussion to subjective topics so I'll go ahead and end it here.


Goshzilla wrote:
How does a designer know if he has a good idea until he actually gets the position of lead game designer?

He can't he has to try and either succeed or fail... life is a *****.

It is not because SE failed with FFXIV that suddenly polls will be the way of making great games.
IMHO, great game come from great designer with great vision.
Clearly SE had neither.
Better luck next time.
#138 Mar 04 2011 at 1:11 PM Rating: Good
Over time, the new Quests will amount to a considerable amount more content for new players joining at a later date.

If you start an MMO at release and have 8+ hours to play everyday, expect to run out of content before the first expansion.
#139 Mar 04 2011 at 1:15 PM Rating: Decent
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I dunno. Maybe just end this beta. Shut the servers down. Dissapear for a year or two.

Then, throw the doors open in Spring of 2013 and announce that FFXV will be released in time for the 2013 holiday season. It will be the same game just different stuff. Auction houses, male mithras, player search function, snappy interfaces, mini quests, side quests, epic quests, missions, roaming NMs of all levels, instanced content, open-world content, chocobos, airships, companies, attributes that do soemthing, food that does something, gear that wears out pretty damned slow, HQ gear with unhidden stats, AF, JSE, RSE, Summoners, Beastmasters, and of course the ability to check bazaars while moving.

Also, the game would be able to run on an e-machine by then... as well as the PS4 and xbox720.





Edited, Mar 4th 2011 1:17pm by Mithsavvy
#140 Mar 04 2011 at 1:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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Mithsavvy wrote:
I dunno. Maybe just end this beta. Shut the servers down. Dissapear for a year or two.

Then, throw the doors open in Spring of 2013 and announce that FFXV will be released in time for the 2013 holiday season. It will be the same game just different stuff. Auction houses, male mithras, player search function, snappy interfaces, mini quests, side quests, epic quests, missions, roaming NMs of all levels, instanced content, open-world content, chocobos, airships, companies, attributes that do soemthing, food that does something, gear that wears out pretty damned slow, HQ gear with unhidden stats, AF, JSE, RSE, Summoners, Beastmasters, and of course the ability to check bazaars while moving.


You do know they can do all that without taking the servers down, right? Taking the servers down would be such a bad PR move that even if they were able to turn it into the perfect MMO they wouldn't be able come back.

If you don't want to play right now, don't. You can wait until the holiday season of 2013 to resubscribe and pretend that the servers were down the whole time. Everyone's happy. :)
#141 Mar 04 2011 at 1:25 PM Rating: Decent
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Mithsavvy wrote:
I dunno. Maybe just end this beta. Shut the servers down. Dissapear for a year or two.

Then, throw the doors open in Spring of 2013 and announce that FFXV will be released in time for the 2013 holiday season. It will be the same game just different stuff. Auction houses, male mithras, player search function, snappy interfaces, mini quests, side quests, epic quests, missions, roaming NMs of all levels, instanced content, open-world content, chocobos, airships, companies, attributes that do soemthing, food that does something, gear that wears out pretty damned slow, HQ gear with unhidden stats, AF, JSE, RSE, Summoners, Beastmasters, and of course the ability to check bazaars while moving.

Also, the game would be able to run on an e-machine by then... as well as the PS4 and xbox720.

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 1:17pm by Mithsavvy


Honestly, I think this is a really good idea. Keeping the game on life support, reinforcing the fact it's a nearly dead game for months on end isn't great. But taking it down, giving it a full ***** and polish and then unveil it to the world again when it's actually ready. Then people will be ENTIRELY curious and open to checking it out again.


Edited, Mar 4th 2011 2:26pm by hexaemeron
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#142 Mar 04 2011 at 1:36 PM Rating: Decent
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I dunno. Maybe just end this beta. Shut the servers down. Dissapear for a year or two.

Then, throw the doors open in Spring of 2013 and announce that FFXV will be released in time for the 2013 holiday season. It will be the same game just different stuff. Auction houses, male mithras, player search function, snappy interfaces, mini quests, side quests, epic quests, missions, roaming NMs of all levels, instanced content, open-world content, chocobos, airships, companies, attributes that do soemthing, food that does something, gear that wears out pretty damned slow, HQ gear with unhidden stats, AF, JSE, RSE, Summoners, Beastmasters, and of course the ability to check bazaars while moving.

Also, the game would be able to run on an e-machine by then... as well as the PS4 and xbox720
What's the difference? You guys act like you are paying $15 a month or something. It's free to beta test as is. You'll get your relaunch when PS3 goes for sell because it has to be reviewed by all the major gaming site again.
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#143 Mar 04 2011 at 1:37 PM Rating: Excellent
This has been suggested a number of times, with generally very negative repsonse. I have to admit though, I've been thinking that if this did happen, I would surely be in-line to check it out at the re-release. I think PR wise this would be a nightmare. It's unprecedented, no?

If you and I are thinking it, then surely SE has considered that option by now and have no intention of going that route.
#144BoltSavior, Posted: Mar 04 2011 at 2:22 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Lack of Cut-Scenes period... Immersion for FF sake!
#145 Mar 04 2011 at 2:38 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't think this game is going to survive much longer.

when they removed Tanaka and replaced him with Yoshi, people started to get hope, and from the date they started to rework on the game, they fixed very few things, things that does not make people stick to the game or get back people.

now many lost faith in the game in Jan/Feb and stopped playing waiting for the new patch that has new Quests, most people waited just to see how FFXIV quests will look like, most of us thought it will be epic, not just a click, enter, accept quests with no voice chat or cut-scene, or at least not go to x kill y and come back.

after this patch, the people that waited for it will try it and won't like it and might not look back it again, and the people that are still playing it just waiting to see how the quests look like will hate it and quit and might not look back.

this patch is a mistake, at least they should not have included quests like this, even if they have a plan for greater quests in the upcoming patches, they should have started with the best they got to show people what they can do.



Edited, Mar 4th 2011 3:40pm by daour
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#146 Mar 04 2011 at 2:48 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think some people are overreacting to the initial group of quests we were given. Lets look at some things.

1) There are supposedely new quests coming in every patch.
2) There will be more main story quests coming(you know the kind with cut scenes that everyone is complaining about not getting right now)
3) There will be more class quests(also known to have cut scenes)

So lets say we get 10-15 quests per update...thats 20-30 per month, that can add up real quick.

All this info was told to us way ahead of time, and people just did not listen to it, and now that its here, and we dont have "tons" of quests to do right from the start of it, they want to complain about it like it wasnt known info.


It isnt a bad idea for some people to take a break and come back later when all the quests will be ncie and lined up waiting for them to do. It will happen but you can not expect everything to come all at once in 1 patch. Only so much can be coded at any 1 time.
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#147 Mar 04 2011 at 2:53 PM Rating: Decent
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http://bit.ly/e166xA
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Don't play that game anymore. :P
#148 Mar 04 2011 at 3:01 PM Rating: Good
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AtryxEtair wrote:
How easily people seem to forget we are still in beta. Given, it is the last phase of beta(or gamma, or whatever the smart-mouthed technical know-it-alls are going to call it). SE has said the game is unplayable in it's current state, are holding polls to figure out what people want the game to be, are with-holding content that defines the game before it has found its identity, and not adding things that would make the game more difficult to balance due to it already unbalanced state. We are not paying a subscription, we paid an initial price which can be viewed as an open beta key(not trying to justify or make an excuse because it was a lot of money in comparison to others).

My main point: Shut your angry and pretentious mouths until your paying a sub. Because right now, you are only yelling at someone who is agreeing with you. [b]NEWS FLASH: SE KNOWS THE GAME IS NOT ENJOYABLE FOR THE MASSES!!! ZOMG REALLY? They don't need everyone with a finger and a keyboard telling them so. Yea, that's how they figured it out, but they are aware NOW.[/b]

And yes, I would also prefer if they moved it along a little faster. They cannot, however, throw everything they have at us due to it's major affects on every aspect of the game. Imagine you are laying tiles on a floor. Do you simply throw out all the tiles you have until the floor is covered? No, you need to place and measure each tile carefully so it is square, straight, secure, and unbroken. This takes time, but much less than picking up the mess you just made and redoing it correctly.

Edited, Mar 4th 2011 10:33am by AtryxEtair


Don't know about you, but most people paid an entry fee to get into this beta. So no, nobody is shutting their mouths for you.
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#149 Mar 04 2011 at 3:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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I just don't get it.
I'm starting to realize that no matter what they do to improve this game, some people are just going to complain regardless.

I'm in a pretty good LS. Very top-end heavy, organized, and productive. People from previous MMO's that have seen all, done all, and gotten all.
Not one member complained about the side quests. They all ran around happily going from one to the next, and no one complained the rewards were not super-mega- gundam awesome.
Believe it or not, a few were actually challenging to 1-2 man parties!

They are sidequests. They reveal a little more world lore, introduce you to new or seldom used areas, perhaps introduce you to NPCs you should be familiar with, etc.
Just like sidequests in any other game.

We screamed for sidequests, and even defined and compared them in MANY threads as the fun meaningless quests that XI offered us.

I suggest find some more, because there's more than 4 quests givers/quests. Guess what? The ones from this update won't be the only ones we ever get either.

Can't someone say something positive about this game already?
Targetting update is pure win, leve menus are much better, crafting menus are streamlined to a whole new level of convenience, and yes, some of the quests ARE fun.


Edited, Mar 4th 2011 4:12pm by Restyoneck
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"Don't take it personally man, white knights would eat a can of **** if the label said SE on it. If anyone dared mention that it was not a good product, they'd just argue if someone can't appreciate the subtle nuances in the ****, they should just go back to eating lolrealfood, cuz the devs prolly know more about canning food than they do."
#150 Mar 04 2011 at 3:10 PM Rating: Good
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Hydragyrum wrote:
Mithsavvy wrote:
I dunno. Maybe just end this beta. Shut the servers down. Dissapear for a year or two.

Then, throw the doors open in Spring of 2013 and announce that FFXV will be released in time for the 2013 holiday season. It will be the same game just different stuff. Auction houses, male mithras, player search function, snappy interfaces, mini quests, side quests, epic quests, missions, roaming NMs of all levels, instanced content, open-world content, chocobos, airships, companies, attributes that do soemthing, food that does something, gear that wears out pretty damned slow, HQ gear with unhidden stats, AF, JSE, RSE, Summoners, Beastmasters, and of course the ability to check bazaars while moving.


You do know they can do all that without taking the servers down, right? Taking the servers down would be such a bad PR move that even if they were able to turn it into the perfect MMO they wouldn't be able come back.

If you don't want to play right now, don't. You can wait until the holiday season of 2013 to resubscribe and pretend that the servers were down the whole time. Everyone's happy. :)


In my mind there's a huge difference. This game won't get "re-reviewed" or get anyone's attention at all if it gradually gets better over the course of years.

In effect, SE is planning a mini version of what I posted above by utilizing the PS3 release as their "throwing open the doors" re-release so to speak. However, if they wait too long to do the PS3 launch, it will not have the intended effect. Of course it also will not have the intended effect without some special content. The PS3 release is, afterall, a re-release of FFXIV. It's not going to be accepted as a completely "new game" by the reviewers and casual gaming consumers.

Not to mention the current costs of maintaining the servers and keeping them going for us non paying "customers" could actually be constraining potential development funds. I would certainly stop playing for awhile if it meant the fixes and content could be delivered sooner.



Edited, Mar 4th 2011 3:14pm by Mithsavvy
#151 Mar 04 2011 at 3:13 PM Rating: Good
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Restyoneck wrote:
I just don't get it.
I'm starting to realize that no matter what they do to improve this game, some people are just going to complain regardless.

I'm in a pretty good LS. Very top-end heavy, organized, and productive. People from previous MMO's that have seen all, done all, and gotten all.
Not one member complained about the side quests. They all ran around happily going from one to the next, and no one complained the rewards were not super-mega- gundam awesome.
Believe it or not, a few were actually challenging to 1-2 man parties!

They are sidequests. They reveal a little more world lore, introduce you to new or seldom used areas, perhaps introduce you to NPCs you should be familiar with, etc.
Just like sidequests in any other game.

We screamed for sidequests, and even defined and compared them in MANY threads as the fun meaningless quests that XI offered us.

I suggest find some more, because there's more than 4 quests givers/quests. Guess what? The ones from this update won't be the only ones we ever get either.

Can't someone say something positive about this game already?
Targetting update is pure win, leve menus are much better, crafting menus are streamlined to a whole new level of convenience, and yes, some of the quests ARE fun.


Edited, Mar 4th 2011 4:12pm by Restyoneck


Bravo! great post.
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