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#52 Mar 07 2011 at 8:24 PM Rating: Good
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I actually haven't gotten any personal attacks for voicing my opinions... nor have I personally attacked anyone for their opinion. I try to respect the views and opinions of others, and so far (knock on wood), people have respected my views and opinions.

Perhaps the people who suffer from this are the people who do personally attack others for their opinions.

Just a random thought...
#53 Mar 07 2011 at 9:07 PM Rating: Good
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cdteurosport wrote:
I completely agree with the OP. The amount of flaming for the sake of it is insane, and I sincerely agree that the admins should have stepped in. The forums have become so hostile with people making personal attacks on anyone who posts an opinion that goes against the mob. I love to think that by saying I am all for constructive criticism that I would get a little bit of credibility from some of the more dissatisfied player base but so may troll just put blinders on and do not pay attention to things that are being said. The truth is the people on this forum are just **** bent on venting whenever they get the opportunity. Everyone should have the right to vent unfortunately the admins should step in when the ******** and negative feedback have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the original post intended conversation.

Quote:
Get real man if its not for negative posters this game has no direction...the polls SE is taking is a direct result of everyone's negativity combined. Fact of the matter is there is nothing other than issues to talk about when it comes to FFXIV, barely anything else anyway. If I'm wrong and there is, please start a thread and open a new convo.


This for example is nothing more than an attempt to completely derail this thread. Im sure SolidMac will try to back up his comment by saying that the negative feedback is what resulted in the player poll but that is not what this thread is about. The OP simply was simply saying why he can no longer deal with the unfortunate backlash to every post on this forum. He was not looking to start a conversation about the importance or consequences of negative feedback. He has been on the forums for some time and has undoubtedly formed some communal relationships with some other posters here, and wished to let them know that he is leaving, why he is leaving, and to thank people who have contributed to his experience.

This happens in almost every post on here and I hope that eventually we do get a more productive and enjoyable FFXIV form (be it the official forum or when the game goes p2p finally flushing out some trolls). With some more active moderating in terms of making sure people aren't discouraged form posting or making sure a threads can stay on topic there can still be plenty of rooms forums like "so how long do you guys think this game will take to fail?" and not push away many of the people who aren't looking to complain.


So... where are they exactly? We know they're not playing because look at the server populations.
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#54ViKtoricus, Posted: Mar 07 2011 at 9:25 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) It's time for another thread of mine to balance this all out...
#55 Mar 07 2011 at 11:31 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
This for example is nothing more than an attempt to completely derail this thread.


Yes. I was trying to derail this topic by staying on topic. I'm sorry I hurt your feelings man but again, honestly, if you guys have something better to talk about other than everything wrong with the game, lets talk about it. Go ahead, lets make a few new topics about something better and the negativity will most likely disappear.
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#56 Mar 07 2011 at 11:39 PM Rating: Good
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Onionthiefx wrote:
Hi,

Many of you probably don't care, but I just wanted to say I will no longer be posting on or reading these forums (which I have been doing since I started playing XI). The fact of the matter is that the majority of the discussion held here has very little to do with the actual game anymore (if it ever did), but instead focuses on incessant, redundant, complaints and prophecies of doom and gloom. We all know what state this game is in. I, for one, don't need to be reminded of it every thread-- I'd rather focus on more positive aspects of the game, including things like CONSTRUCTIVE criticism, instead of things along the lines of "so how long do you guys think this game will take to fail?". I'm also tired of seeing people post very fair and valid thoughts about the positive aspects of this game, and seeing them mobbed for it.

No, I'm not burying my head in the sand and choosing to ignore the flaws of this game, I've just reached my negativity threshold.

Unlike many of you, I hope this game does eventually succeed-- I'm judging this based on responses I saw in the "would you be mad if this game failed" thread. I think SE has already learned a pretty serious lesson from this whole ordeal, and I would be absolutely floored if they repeated the same mistake in the future.

But since I'm saying farewell, allow me to also say thanks. Thanks to those of you who posted constructive thoughts and ideas. Thanks to those of you who provided knowledge about the game to help others. Thanks to those of you who recognize that in the end this is still a video game, and kept things light by making some funny threads and posts. And last but no least, my sincerest thanks to those of you who helped me along over the years, by directly answering my questions or, in one thread, even helping me choose my character name. I really, truly, did appreciate it.

Perhaps I'll see some of you on the official forums, where hopefully the griefing will be at a much more tolerable level.

Sincerely,

OT

Edited, Mar 7th 2011 4:43pm by Onionthiefx


I'd like to take this moment to point out that the official forums will be far, FAR angrier and hateful toward the game than ZAM ever was. I always regarded ZAM as a very pro-FFXIV community.

FFXIV core is ALSO going to be coming to the official forums, and I've no doubt that the negativity you see here will be like a kitten's mew compared to the lion's roar you'll get on the official forums.

You might consider staying...
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#57 Mar 07 2011 at 11:40 PM Rating: Decent
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SolidMack wrote:
Quote:
This for example is nothing more than an attempt to completely derail this thread.


Yes. I was trying to derail this topic by staying on topic. I'm sorry I hurt your feelings man but again, honestly, if you guys have something better to talk about other than everything wrong with the game, lets talk about it. Go ahead, lets make a few new topics about something better and the negativity will most likely disappear.



"Hey how how awesome were those qu---Oh, no... Hmm, hey, the input la----Right, okay... um... that alternate adv---Hmm.... let's go ring some bells."
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#58 Mar 07 2011 at 11:51 PM Rating: Excellent
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Hmm. I've been following this thread for most of today off-and-on with a great deal of amusement. Not that someone is leaving these forums, as I view that as a loss, but the reasoning behind it. And the responses. Most especially the responses.

So let me preface this with the fact that I don't like reading posts that contain nothing but rampant flaming. Nor, do I enjoy reading posts that voice blind and unfailing loyalty. Moreover, though I have my own ideas on all the FFXIV subjects of the day, I usually manage to restrain myself.

That said, OP where do you get off quitting ZAM based on the fact that you don't like the negativity being posted, when you yourself post a....well, not a ragequit thread, but an emoquit thread?

You seem to be working under the assumption that the New and Shiny Lodestone Forums will filter out all the Troll Posts, and that everything will be sunshine and lollipops. But exactly what has SE done recently (and by recently, I mean since open beta) to deserve that assumption?

Are you honestly of the opinion that, with Yoshi-P's announcement that the new Lodestone forums will be watched by FFXIV people, that it's going to be any less of ********** proclaiming loud and wide how full of fail this game, and every subsequent patch has been? (And I base my judgements on the fact that aside from a select few (And you know who you are) every patch has been widely recieved as "underwhelming" at best)

Are you hoping that the poor sorry souls whose job it will be to police said forums will just ban anyone who (rightfully) has anything negative to say about the game?

Well, let's think about this:

Option A: They will ban the naysayers. And, as someone above me posted, enjoy the other 5 posters.

Option B: As long as there are no outright personal attacks, they will monitor only. At which point, this emoquit thread was probably a waste of time, as we will no doubt see you back here ******** about the "trolls on the lodestone forums" because you won't be able to get away with it there.

But fear not. You are in good company. You are not the first person to emorage and quit ZAM only to be posting a week (day? hour?) later.

Oh. And one more thing.
ViKtoricus wrote:
It's time for another thread/forum/badly-made website of mine to die in a fire.

Fixed that for you.
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#59 Mar 08 2011 at 12:57 AM Rating: Good
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Its sad to see people want to go after all the negativity, but I think looking for help on the new official forums isn't likely. If its anything like the beta boards were... you might end up quitting the game even if you enjoy it from the posters stupidity. I mean a content iD is just as free as it was during beta testing after all. Loved to be proven wrong though :).

As for this board... negativity isn't the issue, there are people with legitimate concerns, but there are clearly a ton of people that consider this game stillborn, have no hope for a future and they act like it no matter the positives that come. They have invested so strongly in this opinion that there is no way they will back down from it and wish to give other people the same feeling in hopes it comes true. That is down right trolling and childish and I wish it was moderated more. But this forum doesn't have the normal mod system, its more like populous mod and unfortunately the doom sayers are more abundant then the more constructive posters are right now. That will hopefully change a bit when we get closer to the PS3 release. The game only needs that release to make it a success; the PC group could be at 10k users at that release and as long as the PS3 release is successful the game will have a flourishing future anyways. With that in mind you won't hear me have any doom saying :P I just think the current game is pay to get into beta at the moment anyways.

Edited, Mar 8th 2011 3:21am by croythegreat
#60 Mar 08 2011 at 1:00 AM Rating: Good
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hexaemeron wrote:
Vedis wrote:
hexaemeron wrote:
What strategy or gameplay is there to even discuss in this game? THERE IS NO CONTENT.


This does not justify the ammount of "F U I hope this game fails" posts we see nonstop, or the fact that the mods dont seem to be doing a thing about them

There are ways to be constructive about whats wrong, and no one here seems to understand that point and instead jump on the "I hope it fails" bandwagon looking for troll attention


It absolutely is justified. If there were actually lots of varied things to do, or a few to do that were really engaging, interesting or involved, people would be playing the game instead of complaining.

There is nothing to do that is varied, engaging, interesting or involved, so after six long months, yes, people are just fed up.


Valid complaints venting and frustration yes, justified. Troll posts and forum shenanigans never, no matter how you paint it.
#61 Mar 08 2011 at 1:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/441-Final-Fantasy-XIV-is-perfect-as-is-why-change-anything

precursor of what's to come. 12 posts in and forums gets its first troll.
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#62 Mar 08 2011 at 9:57 AM Rating: Default
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This!

omegaalpha619 wrote:
I'm still waiting for PS3 release lol! And as far as the game goes, just watch this will be a sweet mmo after alot more patches. And it wont fail, many more people playing the game and enjoying it RIGHT NOW than are on forums complaining. ^_^


To be honest, on the Zam FFXI forums it was exactly the same kind of community, with the exception that you had to get through the gutter to get to the Palace, so to say. There are/were about 40% of informative, kind and helpful threads. With these forums, it's about well, let's say 10% atm. Give it a year and you should see a lot more fun posts in comparison to the complain posts.
Gotta have a lot of interesting things to write about before you will get more appealing posts to read. In regards to this forum, I did see enough fun threads tho, otherwise I wouldnt be reading anymore :p

To the OP: I hope you have a better experience at the official forums! Though I think it's highly unlikely.
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#63 Mar 08 2011 at 10:24 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:
At least the FFXIV official forums should launch tomorrow, hopefully it will be a constructive place.

Especially with the devs supposedly posting direct feedback!
I don't think anyone here really wants the game to fail, I just think some people have lost hope, and may never get it back. If the people here didn't care, they'd well, be on the Rift forums instead.


Just an fyi I do visit the official rift forums and this one. They are just as full of the same thing as here allbeit in a different way. Mainly people trying to make it completely wowlized. IMO the only way to get away is to avoid forums and visit them sparingly.

Even when I used to goto the FFXI forums it took away from my "fun". What I see on forums and what I exeperiance in game are usualy completely different. People ingame are nice and helpful, on forums ...
#64 Mar 08 2011 at 10:24 AM Rating: Good
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Ahh the great circle of whine..

people whine about a game on a forum, others stop using a forum and whine about the whiners, and I whine about the whiners who whine... my head hurts.. think i'll drink some wine... eww its cheap wine... what a crime!

Over time.. we'll all whine.. fine.. see you next time!
#65 Mar 08 2011 at 10:29 AM Rating: Good
The forums over there seem to have a lot more constructive criticism without bashing the game non-stop. Only thing is, most seem obsessed over the linkshell functions at the current time above anything else. Which, I suppose makes sense if you like the game as it. So if that's what people are worried about over there, that may be the forum for the more positive game users.
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#66 Mar 08 2011 at 10:48 AM Rating: Good
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Montsegurnephcreep wrote:
The forums over there seem to have a lot more constructive criticism without bashing the game non-stop. Only thing is, most seem obsessed over the linkshell functions at the current time above anything else. Which, I suppose makes sense if you like the game as it. So if that's what people are worried about over there, that may be the forum for the more positive game users.


Oh I'd definitely say there are positive game users over on the official boards. I posted a thread detailing my thoughts on merging FFXI and FFXIV into one game which would ultimately benefit both games (one game needing a severe dose of content and the other game needing a severe dose of graphical overhaul)... and it's been ripped five ways from Sunday by what I can only describe as "overly optimistic zealots". There's been some good posts (even if the posts disagree with the idea, at least they were worded as such as to be respectful of another person's ideas), but there's quite a few posts that are not so respectful.

Some standouts that jump to my attention:

Quote:

Having two seperate games would probably make more money for SE. Plus the fact that they have to reallocate resources within their company into merging the two games. It's just not economically feasible.


Quote:

There is a reason i stopped playing ffxi, if youre not a real hardcore gamer, you get bored, fast. I dont have the time to wait 5 hours for a party so i can level from 20 to 21. Ffxiv is made for more casual gamers , those who got a job, school etc. And please dont say: well, wanna merge with wow instead? As wow is annoying in the opposite way, to easy.


Quote:

Although I wouldn't mind seeing a few more elements brought from FFXI into FFXIV, merging the two would be counter productive and all around irritating. There is a reason SE made FFXIV instead of remaking FFXI. They are doing a fine job fixing the game issues - I am feeling confident they will continue on fixing the rest of the problems to make this a sublime game that can truly stand alone without tottering over.


Quote:

You must be kidding because Final Fantasy XI did a lot better then FFXIV. There is also so much more contents in FFXI versus FFXIV being FFXI is 6 or so year old. Square - Enix is also making some income from FFXI while not in FFXIV. The 2 game also structure way too different to make into one game. Merging FFXI into FFXIV would not work because both game are different and different graphic and coding.


Quote:

This request is unrealistic .
Please ask for stuff that matters.


Quote:

Nah, they should merge FFXIV with Hello Kitty Online.


So, at least judging from the assorted posts in my thread, I'd say the o-boards is a paradise for the FFXIV connoisseur. If it stays that way (and it looks like it may very well if S-E holds people to the forum TOS), I'll gladly retract my earlier assessment about the o-board attracting anyone with an axe to grind with S-E in the hopes of an S-E rep reading their post.
#67 Mar 08 2011 at 11:03 AM Rating: Decent
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Montsegurnephcreep wrote:
The forums over there seem to have a lot more constructive criticism without bashing the game non-stop. Only thing is, most seem obsessed over the linkshell functions at the current time above anything else. Which, I suppose makes sense if you like the game as it. So if that's what people are worried about over there, that may be the forum for the more positive game users.


No this forum also has a lot of constructive criticism but everyone blows everything out of proportion. This topic was a result of what?? one topic bashing the game, boo freakin hoo...big deal, we're all big boys and girls, so what, don't enter and partake in the topic if it hurts your feelings.
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#68 Mar 08 2011 at 11:23 AM Rating: Decent
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Man after reading all this...I need a stiff drink.
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#69 Mar 08 2011 at 11:33 AM Rating: Good
M0RZA wrote:
Over time.. we'll all whine


No doubt about that!
#70 Mar 08 2011 at 11:33 AM Rating: Good
Whoops, too much coffee FTW!

Edited, Mar 8th 2011 12:37pm by SmashingtonWho
#71 Mar 08 2011 at 11:38 AM Rating: Decent
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Browsing the official forums for about an hour or so I have yet to see any hate filled post, let alone an entire thread that are so rampant here at ZAM. Add in the much better organization (topic tags), the requirement of having an active FFXIV account, the lack of "Karma", and of course the fact that devs are already commenting in user threads pretty much obsoletes ZAM for me.

Of course I'll still come here if I need a chuckle. :)
#72 Mar 08 2011 at 11:57 AM Rating: Default
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Hydragyrum wrote:
Browsing the official forums for about an hour or so I have yet to see any hate filled post, let alone an entire thread that are so rampant here at ZAM.

So you missed this?
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#73 Mar 08 2011 at 12:31 PM Rating: Default
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yfaithfully wrote:
Hydragyrum wrote:
Browsing the official forums for about an hour or so I have yet to see any hate filled post, let alone an entire thread that are so rampant here at ZAM.

So you missed this?


One thread that's already been pushed down to page three? I think you just proved my point.

Edited, Mar 8th 2011 12:31pm by Hydragyrum
#74 Mar 08 2011 at 12:34 PM Rating: Default
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Hydragyrum wrote:
yfaithfully wrote:
Hydragyrum wrote:
Browsing the official forums for about an hour or so I have yet to see any hate filled post, let alone an entire thread that are so rampant here at ZAM.

So you missed this?


One thread that's already been pushed down to page three? I think you just proved my point.

Edited, Mar 8th 2011 12:31pm by Hydragyrum

Sure, but it's the type of thread that would have been locked or deleted here or on FFXIVCore.com.
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#75 Mar 08 2011 at 12:40 PM Rating: Good
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yfaithfully wrote:


Sure, but it's the type of thread that would have been locked or deleted here or on FFXIVCore.com.


Hahahahaha, yeah right.

Edit: I found the same exact topic on ZAM and guess what? It's not locked at all.
http://ffxiv.zam.com/forum.html?forum=152&mid=1294396948237244327

Edited, Mar 8th 2011 1:43pm by TerraSonicX
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#76 Mar 08 2011 at 1:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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It seems like no matter what the admins do, people complain. On one hand, you have the people who think there is "too much censorship" and that threads shouldn't get locked at all because everyone is somehow entitled to say whatever the **** the want. On the other hand you have the people who think that the admins "aren't doing their job" because they feel that more threads should locked whenever they start getting negative.

I think that the moderation could maybe be a little heavier, but I think that overall the admins do a good enough job of locking the really obvious troll stuff most of the time.
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#77 Mar 08 2011 at 1:05 PM Rating: Default
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TerraSonicX wrote:
yfaithfully wrote:


Sure, but it's the type of thread that would have been locked or deleted here or on FFXIVCore.com.


Hahahahaha, yeah right.

Edit: I found the same exact topic on ZAM and guess what? It's not locked at all.
http://ffxiv.zam.com/forum.html?forum=152&mid=1294396948237244327

Edited, Mar 8th 2011 1:43pm by TerraSonicX

It's not so much the topic, but the flame-war that it descended into.
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#78 Mar 08 2011 at 1:19 PM Rating: Decent
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Page one.

Note that I wouldn't consider this trolling, nor any of the responses trolling, but this seems to be the kind of thing you want to avoid.

As far as I can tell, the majority of threads on the English forum are complaints.
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#79 Mar 08 2011 at 1:36 PM Rating: Decent
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yfaithfully wrote:
Page one.

Note that I wouldn't consider this trolling, nor any of the responses trolling, but this seems to be the kind of thing you want to avoid.

As far as I can tell, the majority of threads on the English forum are complaints.


I never said anything about complaints. Complaints are fine when they're done in a productive and respectful manner. Constructive criticism is what is responsible for everything that as improved with FFXIV. I'm happy that many of the threads are constructive complaints. Hopefully the devs realize just how much we DO want this game to succeed. But I specifically said that I haven't seen any hate filled posts, that is; flame wars, insults, trolling, and so on. While ZAM used to be fun and filled with excitement, the failed expectations of FFXIV have jaded ZAM posters so much that it has devolved into incredible negativity. The official forums are helping to increase my enthusiasm for the game, not decrease it like ZAM does.
#80 Mar 08 2011 at 1:43 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
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Hydragyrum wrote:
yfaithfully wrote:
Page one.

Note that I wouldn't consider this trolling, nor any of the responses trolling, but this seems to be the kind of thing you want to avoid.

As far as I can tell, the majority of threads on the English forum are complaints.


I never said anything about complaints. Complaints are fine when they're done in a productive and respectful manner. Constructive criticism is what is responsible for everything that as improved with FFXIV. I'm happy that many of the threads are constructive complaints. Hopefully the devs realize just how much we DO want this game to succeed. But I specifically said that I haven't seen any hate filled posts, that is; flame wars, insults, trolling, and so on. While ZAM used to be fun and filled with excitement, the failed expectations of FFXIV have jaded ZAM posters so much that it has devolved into incredible negativity. The official forums are helping to increase my enthusiasm for the game, not decrease it like ZAM does.
...where is that happening in these forums? The few trolling threads that have been made lately have been locked (#1 #2 #3 #4) shortly after their creation and the more reasonable threads have been allowed.

What about the rabidly pro-ffxiv trolling threads that don't get locked?



Edited, Mar 8th 2011 1:55pm by bsphil
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#81 Mar 08 2011 at 3:17 PM Rating: Decent
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[sarcasm]
The official forums are way too busy. Read a thread on the front page and 5 mins later its 4 pages back. At least here you have threads with "last post" dated a few days back on the first page. So much easier to follow the quality topics and conversations around here.
[/sarcasm]

Deuces.

Edited, Mar 8th 2011 5:18pm by jedipimp
#82 Mar 08 2011 at 4:09 PM Rating: Decent
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bsphil wrote:
...where is that happening in these forums?


bsphil wrote:
Sounds like you have no idea what you're doing? ... We get it, you're delusional. You don't need to keep explaining yourself. ... Thanks for playing.


[sarcasm]Nope, no negativity at all.[/sarcasm]

Not that I think trying to reason with you will get me anywhere besides defaulted. Just answering your question. I haven't seen the level of condescending, insulting, and back-and-forth that I always see on ZAM.
#83 Mar 08 2011 at 4:16 PM Rating: Good
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Hydragyrum wrote:
bsphil wrote:
...where is that happening in these forums?


bsphil wrote:
Sounds like you have no idea what you're doing? ... We get it, you're delusional. You don't need to keep explaining yourself. ... Thanks for playing.


[sarcasm]Nope, no negativity at all.[/sarcasm]

Not that I think trying to reason with you will get me anywhere besides defaulted. Just answering your question. I haven't seen the level of condescending, insulting, and back-and-forth that I always see on ZAM.
In a thread about how 50 million PS3's are going to be the saving grace of FFXIV turning it into a more popular game than WoW? Yes, those comments were absolutely fair to make.
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His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#84 Mar 08 2011 at 4:57 PM Rating: Excellent
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bsphil wrote:
Hydragyrum wrote:
bsphil wrote:
...where is that happening in these forums?


bsphil wrote:
Sounds like you have no idea what you're doing? ... We get it, you're delusional. You don't need to keep explaining yourself. ... Thanks for playing.


[sarcasm]Nope, no negativity at all.[/sarcasm]

Not that I think trying to reason with you will get me anywhere besides defaulted. Just answering your question. I haven't seen the level of condescending, insulting, and back-and-forth that I always see on ZAM.
In a thread about how 50 million PS3's are going to be the saving grace of FFXIV turning it into a more popular game than WoW? Yes, those comments were absolutely fair to make.


Indeed, there are times when being condescending and insulting isn't called for and there are times when it is.

What is the proper response to "50 million PS3 users are going to make FFXIV more popular than WoW!"? Is it "You're totally right!"? Is it "I know, those silly PC people just can't appreciate an awesome game!"? The thread started out calm enough, but the OP of that thread is delusional as ****. Politely explaining why he's mistaken has been unsuccessful.
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Tyapex: 393 posts of utter crap...
Mikhalia: Sounds about right.
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