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Players asking for "Jump" - StopFollow

#1 Mar 11 2011 at 7:50 AM Rating: Decent
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Hi guys, after reading some of the new forum posts on loadstone from Yoshi-P I see one other their top things to do in the game is "Jump"

P L E A S E ... Stop asking them to put jump in the game. It's not needed now. it's not a gave saver, and the fact they are spending time to change game code to do this NOW is a waste that this point.

There is sooooooo much more needed as far as this game goes.

I am a fan of having Jump, doing get me wrong, I would like to see it in the game as well... but that's a cherry on top of a melted sundae in my opinion.

Let's get them to focus their energy and time, on overall game improvements.

Regards
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#2 Mar 11 2011 at 7:52 AM Rating: Default
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I'm not a fan of jump at all. People even asking for something irrelevant and useless like that makes me go "wut?"
#3 Mar 11 2011 at 7:52 AM Rating: Good
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Yes, less jump and more Bells!
#4 Mar 11 2011 at 8:00 AM Rating: Good
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But...but...Kris Kross is making me. :(
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#5 Mar 11 2011 at 8:13 AM Rating: Decent
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I wouldn't worry about it. Looks like Yoshida realises most of us don't want WoW-type jumping anyway.

Quote:
3. About jump, his thinking is about to make characters "do not have to bound on earth so much". The considered implementation are: emotion, additional action during moving, and (as a result) passing some little obstacle. He also noticed that many people does not like WoW style "Jump Spamming" and complains about the Jump should belong to DRG for the sake of FinalFantasy tradition. He will take this opinion into consideration.
#6 Mar 11 2011 at 8:19 AM Rating: Good
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Having played nearly 2 decades of FF games I'd welcome jumping. If it slows down running momentarily then people wouldn't spam it like in some adventure games that aren't platformers.
#7 Mar 11 2011 at 8:33 AM Rating: Decent
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Bring on jumping!
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#8 Mar 11 2011 at 8:35 AM Rating: Good
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As someone who also tends to find the proverbial hoping of bunnies irksome, I came in here to post almost the exact same things as the people above me, i.e. that Yoshi-P seems to understand the difference between being able to jump, and being able to jump at the right time.

Then I stopped and read the actual OP. The man actually has a pretty good point, subject line aside. If Yoshi-P has one person on his team looking into implementing jump I don't mind, but I also hope that they are not spending too many resources on the problem. There are plenty of games that have no jump and get along just fine. It's not unreasonable to ask Youshi-P to start with the goal of getting the game to "get along just fine" without jump first.
#9 Mar 11 2011 at 9:08 AM Rating: Decent
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Quanta wrote:
But...but...Kris Kross is making me. :(

Ha, I was going to make a Kris Kross joke but couldn't top this.
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#10 Mar 11 2011 at 10:15 AM Rating: Good
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Quanta wrote:
But...but...Kris Kross is making me. :(


Aw, I was going to make a Kris Kross pun as well... but it looks like I missed the bus...
#11 Mar 11 2011 at 10:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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Jumping is not a bad thing. Stylized implementation is. People spam jump in WoW because they made it look cool, your characters do some kind of trick with it, whether its a flip, or spinning around, or whatever. They didn't make it boring.

Nobody spams jump in EQ2 because the animations look stupid, but that doesn't mean it doesn't add for some cool boss fights.

They SHOULD, and NEED to implement jumping because of the landscape problems. However they can stop spamming by making it take up 1/3 of your stamina bar each jump. That way your limited to 3 jumps in a short period. And they could make it look realistic, not animated.

People need to stop demanding features not be added. That's just stupid. Think about the good they can do with this feature, and good implementation of it could lead to things like Swimming, and special boss fights.
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#12 Mar 11 2011 at 10:37 AM Rating: Decent
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Eadieni wrote:
Jumping is not a bad thing. Stylized implementation is. People spam jump in WoW because they made it look cool, your characters do some kind of trick with it, whether its a flip, or spinning around, or whatever. They didn't make it boring.


Disclaimer: The above only applies to elves, who will get their comeuppance once the drowning chamber is complete.

Also, gnomes are the superior race.
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#13 Mar 11 2011 at 12:04 PM Rating: Good
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In a recently locked thread that had a funny poll who would you choose if they SE added a classes like Bill Clinton or Michael Jordan to this game , in a game without basic jumping Bill Clinton's charm stats and Solid Snake cardboard box beats a classic MJ Dragoon any day.At least the poll picked Clinton before the lock.Smiley: smile
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#14 Mar 11 2011 at 12:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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yes lets not worry about jump because after all should new players come into this game why have such a basic expectation provided by just about any other game out there be gratified.
#15 Mar 11 2011 at 12:45 PM Rating: Good
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Kind of interesting that yoshi said they are working on some ideas whereby players would not always be "anchored to the ground". While one could construe this to mean that a jump feature will be added, other could construe something else... like flying chocobos, for example.


#16 Mar 11 2011 at 12:51 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
P L E A S E ... Stop asking them to put jump in the game. It's not needed now. it's not a gave saver, and the fact they are spending time to change game code to do this NOW is a waste that this point.


Hey you know what, you guys got your punctuation mark thought bubbles over the NPC's heads, so sod off and stick your "stop" right up your backside.



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#17 Mar 11 2011 at 2:39 PM Rating: Good
If they do add this feature they should disable it for caucasian males.
#18 Mar 11 2011 at 2:46 PM Rating: Decent
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I wouldn't mind having a jump feature, or more like a climb feature. What I don't want is people jumping around like a bunch of fools across the map. That would just put the nail in the coffin lol.
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#19 Mar 11 2011 at 3:01 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah, ***** jumping. I loved getting caught on every single ledge and invisible landscape barrier in FFXIV. LOVED IT I TELL YOU.
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#20 Mar 11 2011 at 4:00 PM Rating: Good
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No. This games needs 3 things.
1.Jump
2.Chocobos ( who can also jump)
3.Airships

In that order.

Please keep making threads and sining those petitions! We will get jump in game!
#21Shezard, Posted: Mar 11 2011 at 4:06 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Actually did you play WoW? People never jumped because it looks cool, people jump because they were bored and just hit a **** keyboard key while they wait for the Boss Pull, or w/e. "Looking cool while jumping" never was the reason for overuse of jumping in WoW...
#22 Mar 11 2011 at 4:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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only thing dumber than jumping up and down for no reason is getting upset at people who jump up and down for no reason. I want it because it helps with 2ft ledges. If they want to have the game auto jump at those points fine, but I just don't want my game world with silly invisible walls everywhere.

And frankly I don't care when people ask for it, the dev's aren't dumb enough to feel its priority number one. If they're actually more worried about fixing the jump thing than fixing battle, classes, lack of content, well then they're even less competent than they came off in nov/dec.
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#23 Mar 11 2011 at 5:02 PM Rating: Decent
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Quanta wrote:
Eadieni wrote:
Jumping is not a bad thing. Stylized implementation is. People spam jump in WoW because they made it look cool, your characters do some kind of trick with it, whether its a flip, or spinning around, or whatever. They didn't make it boring.


Disclaimer: The above only applies to elves


Well, and Worgen... >_>

That said - no WoW-style jumping please. I'm just glad Yoshida seems to understand the problems inherent in that kind of design.


Edited, Mar 11th 2011 6:02pm by KaneKitty
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#24 Mar 11 2011 at 5:04 PM Rating: Decent
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KujaKoF wrote:
only thing dumber than jumping up and down for no reason is getting upset at people who jump up and down for no reason.


That, or people who get upset at people who get upset about constant hopping around.

This might go on for a while.
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#25 Mar 11 2011 at 5:34 PM Rating: Good
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jedipimp wrote:
No. This games needs 3 things.
1.Jump
2.Chocobos ( who can also jump)
3.Airships

In that order.

Please keep making threads and sining those petitions! We will get jump in game!


The things that jumping would fix could also be accomplished through terrain redesign. A redesign will almost certainly accompany or follow shortly after implementation of jumping, simply to keep the intended access routes the same; the devs won't let you take massive shortcuts they never intended you to. Jumping does allow for future designs to have a bit more flexibility to them, having the ability to leap a couple feet in the air means you can have your natural rocky staircase without worrying about clipping a poor lalafell to death. It can also allow for personal stylistic flair and additional battle strategy possibilities simply by nature of the game's already implemented hit-box sensitive targeting system. Jumping will never allow you to exploit it to gain an unfair advantage, as the viral nature of cool bugs in MMOs ensure that they will eventually be patched (rusty cap, salvage dupes etc...)

Given this, jumping is more of a neat feature rather than a necessary fix. It will take time to implement correctly given the work that has to go into both the landscape and the mechanics. It is also most definitely not a critical item that needs to be implemented right away, chocobos and airships are part of the critical items simply because transportation is a part of what needs modification in the game, but I'd rather see the battle system, class system, crafting, leves, quests, storyline, economic systems, parties, and linkshell setups worked on before they start adding things like jumping and swimming.

The game is at the very least trying to get overhauled, and there will be lots of changes in the near future I'm sure. Maybe jumping and swimming will find their way into the game, but I don't think it's right or logical to make them a priority over existing systems in need of a working.
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#26 Mar 11 2011 at 5:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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KaneKitty wrote:
KujaKoF wrote:
only thing dumber than jumping up and down for no reason is getting upset at people who jump up and down for no reason.


That, or people who get upset at people who get upset about constant hopping around.

This might go on for a while.


heh, true. I look at it this way, invisible walls and unscalable 6 inch ledges bother me far more than some dude jumping around on the repair guy.
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#27 Mar 11 2011 at 6:31 PM Rating: Decent
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Not having jump makes the game feel very basic. Not being able to fall off a cliff and die also makes the game feel infantile.

If they implemented a jump button, it would have an effect on combat, fight mechanics, and immersion. It's difficult for some people to wrap their heads around a character that is supposed to be a dragon slaying hero, but is foiled by a tree branch on the ground, he just can't make it over.

Someone mentioned a wow type jump, well once again, wow didn't invent the jump button. But I can see them in true FF fashion implementing a jump that is less like WoW, and more like, a menu prompt that asks you if you want to jump, you click yes, then a cut scene of your character taking a few steps back, getting a running start, and jumping.
#28 Mar 11 2011 at 6:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
But I can see them in true FF fashion implementing a jump that is less like WoW, and more like, a menu prompt that asks you if you want to jump, you click yes, then a cut scene of your character taking a few steps back, getting a running start, and jumping.


Don't give them any ideas.....
#29 Mar 11 2011 at 6:43 PM Rating: Good
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KujaKoF wrote:
heh, true. I look at it this way, invisible walls and unscalable 6 inch ledges bother me far more than some dude jumping around on the repair guy.

Invisible walls would prevent you to jump over the ledge too.

People say "I want a jump function" when they really should say is "I want a way to avoid (stupid) obstacles in the collision map."

It would be sorta ironic if Square implemented a jump function, managed to limit it so it can't be spammed, but doesn't allow you to clear any ledges at all. "We gave you the jump function you've been asking, why are you not happy?"
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#30 Mar 11 2011 at 7:30 PM Rating: Decent
ickywoods wrote:
Hi guys, after reading some of the new forum posts on loadstone from Yoshi-P I see one other their top things to do in the game is "Jump"

P L E A S E ... Stop asking them to put jump in the game. It's not needed now. it's not a gave saver, and the fact they are spending time to change game code to do this NOW is a waste that this point.

There is sooooooo much more needed as far as this game goes.

I am a fan of having Jump, doing get me wrong, I would like to see it in the game as well... but that's a cherry on top of a melted sundae in my opinion.

Let's get them to focus their energy and time, on overall game improvements.

Regards

I'd rather have a cherry on top of my melted sundae then someone trying to unmelt my sundae.

Edit...I like cherries.

Edited, Mar 11th 2011 8:30pm by StateAlchemist2
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#31 Mar 11 2011 at 7:41 PM Rating: Good
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i don't mind either way for a jump feature since i'm used to it from playing FF11.

however, a thing as simple as a jump feature could add a new dynamic to the game if done right. they could incorporate better puzzels than what ff11 had, because honestly, i really didn't care for those weight doors in altep.
#32 Mar 12 2011 at 2:48 PM Rating: Good
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Here's why I want a jump button...

Exhibit A:
http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Parradamo_Tor

This is what you have to do to scale this wall:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITQorG_B-6o

This is what it looks like when you try to add a pseudo-platforming element to a game that has no jumping feature. One of the top comments on the video says,

Quote:
"I would have to agree this is definitely one of the more sadistic things they make FFXI players do."


Having done it myself, I heartily agree. This is an example of how SE made things annoying and expected us to call it "challenging".
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#33 Mar 12 2011 at 4:09 PM Rating: Decent
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Ugh really a jump... It looks so gimmicky.
IMHO jumping makes the experience less immersive because it reminds me just how loosely tethered the characters are to their environment. Also seeing the characters in FFXIV jump 2.5x their own body height would just look silly.

The last thing FFXIV needs is gimmicks and i'm very disappointed in everyone who supports such a huge waste of a programmers time.

As long as maps can clearly identify ledges that are dead ends or one way only i'm fine.

FFXIV isn't going to steal wow players, i think the dev team recognizes its direction to go back to its FFXI roots and pick up the modest 1mil niche final fantasy based mmo community.


Also side note, do you guys really think riding on an airship or a chocobo would really make this game more enjoyable and deserves to be a top priority?! Its a method of transportation and hardly an element that expands core game play. I would appreciate airships that aren't a separate zone.
#34 Mar 12 2011 at 4:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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I love how people call it "WoW-type jumping." Do any of you know where the jumping came from? Elder Scrolls. You see in Elder Scrolls you could level just by jumping around. The act of MMO players jumping around like mad got its start in EQ where people could be quoted as asying. "I just got my swiming to 100 now I am going to Level my jumping."

It really was nothing more than a way to pass the time wile a raid was getting setup. But at the same time was a nod to the old days of Elder Scrolls. It has nothing to do with WoW. WoW players did not start it. And in all my time in MMO games I never saw it go much past just a group of people waiting on a raid to start. It was rare to see people just randomly jumping around the world.

All that being said. I would love to see jump in FFXIV. But they do have a lot more stressing matters to get to.
#35 Mar 12 2011 at 4:23 PM Rating: Good
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Still can't believe jump is so controversial, who cares?
#36 Mar 12 2011 at 5:02 PM Rating: Decent
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Actually in wow, there are many fights in wish you need to jump or you wipe :)

So it does serves a purpose :)
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#37 Mar 12 2011 at 5:33 PM Rating: Good
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Yoshida wrote:

Hi everyone, this is Producer/Director Yoshida!

Thanks so much for the lively discussion in regards to jumping.
Since the points that we are currently reviewing in regards to jumping have caused a lot of confusion for the community, I’ll go ahead organize them there.

Jump review:
One form of emotional expression
Additional action-related expression during movement
Able to get over small fences (This is not the main idea)
I believe that jumping as a form of expression, which allows the player to indicate the location of NPCs and also to inform others of meeting locations, will be able to be used in many subtle ways.
However comments such as "Aesthetically, the game will be ruined by everyone jumping around," and "It’s not FINAL FANTASY," and other comments were a bit unexpected, so I decided to add these types of comments into our discussion as well.

Though the idea of jumping was based on wanting to reduce the feeling of being tied to the ground, I will continue to evaluate whether or not this should be implemented by following along with your discussions and comments!

Map Collision Detection Adjustments:
Being unable to descend ledges where it seems you can easily fall off
Feeling of strangeness when you can't climb up a hill that looks to be easily climbable
We have received a lot of feedback pointing these things out from numerous players, but the task of relieving stress during character movement is currently being tested by development in the form of map collision detection adjustments.
If you can think about this separately from the jump implementation discussion it would really help a lot.

With that quote from Yoshida, I don't think we'll be getting a WoW styled jump.
#38 Mar 12 2011 at 6:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think it would be cool to have only parts on the terrain we can. Like in the console games where you come up to a ledge with a gap and the exclamation mark shows up allowing you to jump across.

I am not opposed to a regular jump command though.
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#39 Mar 12 2011 at 8:07 PM Rating: Excellent
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Mugamaga wrote:
I wouldn't worry about it. Looks like Yoshida realises most of us don't want WoW-type jumping anyway.

WoW type jumping as opposed to..?

Are people just blindly against anything that WoW has regardless of how useful, intuitive or fun it might be? (Rhetorical)
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#40 Mar 12 2011 at 8:30 PM Rating: Good
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
Mugamaga wrote:
I wouldn't worry about it. Looks like Yoshida realises most of us don't want WoW-type jumping anyway.

WoW type jumping as opposed to..?

Are people just blindly against anything that WoW has regardless of how useful, intuitive or fun it might be? (Rhetorical)
People want to be able to hang in town and chat with friends/ls or craft with hearing some *** grunt jumping every 2 seconds because he's bored.
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#41 Mar 12 2011 at 10:07 PM Rating: Decent
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Lubriderm wrote:
People want to be able to hang in town and chat with friends/ls or craft with hearing some *** grunt jumping every 2 seconds because he's bored.


Not completely sure about other games, but jumping in WoW didn't make any noise. I think the grunt you're talking about comes from falling far enough to take damage. I guess the visual of someone jumping repeatedly could get annoying, but I'd gladly trade that for having to take an extra 3 minutes running around an 8" ledge I should have been able to walk or hop over in the first place. It wouldn't even have to be a user controlled jump. Just give me a way to get over a ledge that's only a few feet high.


Edited, Mar 12th 2011 11:07pm by FilthMcNasty
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Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#42 Mar 12 2011 at 11:55 PM Rating: Good
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Lubriderm wrote:
FilthMcNasty wrote:
Mugamaga wrote:
I wouldn't worry about it. Looks like Yoshida realises most of us don't want WoW-type jumping anyway.

WoW type jumping as opposed to..?

Are people just blindly against anything that WoW has regardless of how useful, intuitive or fun it might be? (Rhetorical)
People want to be able to hang in town and chat with friends/ls or craft with hearing some *** grunt jumping every 2 seconds because he's bored.


Is it that hard to just get up and move elsewhere? I mean what would be different if they sat there /poking as opposed to jumping, or even sitting, on your character?

I mean really, THAT is why you don't want a jump button? Are people really jush fishing that low for excuses as to why a jump feature would ruin the game? I know WoW has a jump button, we're not talking about WoW, throw that strawman away now. I want to be able to jump over that rock or log that comes up to my ankles. That's just realistic. The world of FFXIV is very detailed and close to realism while retaining fantasy elements. Jumping over a **** log just fits with the other laws of physics in the game. Why is this so bad?

Oh yea, an asshat might annoy you for the 3 whole seconds it takes to turn your camera or move away from that character. ***** physics.
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#43 Mar 13 2011 at 12:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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Without regards to WoW or to FFXIV, I just want to throw this out there:

When maps are -properly- designed around the notion that you can't jump, you don't notice it missing.

That said, FFXIV was not -properly- designed around the notion that you can't jump. There are far too many ankle high obstacles that are magically insurmountable because your feet are glued to the ground.

I don't want to see people hopping around like morons either, but I would probably be a lot less in favor of jump if I didn't have to go minutes out of my way to walk around a small rock like it's freaking kryptonite or something.
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#44 Mar 15 2011 at 10:22 PM Rating: Decent
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Torrence wrote:
Quote:
But I can see them in true FF fashion implementing a jump that is less like WoW, and more like, a menu prompt that asks you if you want to jump, you click yes, then a cut scene of your character taking a few steps back, getting a running start, and jumping.


Don't give them any ideas.....


in FFXI

Your Jumping Skill rises by 0.1

you need at least 120 skill points to make that jump

in FFXIV

(?) it appears you can jump here. (!) a stick appears to be in your way... what do you want to do?

Examine the stick.
Move the stick.
Ignore the stick.


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#45 Mar 16 2011 at 10:30 AM Rating: Decent
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Shezard wrote:

Actually did you play WoW?...
..Jumping never added anything to WoW, neither raid-wise, nor boss tactic wise or anything. It was just there and did nothing.
[/sm][/i]

I have to ask you the same question? cause you obviously never played. Jumping was actually a vital ability in numerous boss fights and even dungeon design.
But I digress. I'll just sit back and let you keep talking out your ***.

Edited, Mar 16th 2011 12:31pm by jedipimp
#46 Mar 16 2011 at 10:37 AM Rating: Excellent
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jedipimp wrote:
Shezard wrote:

Actually did you play WoW?...
..Jumping never added anything to WoW, neither raid-wise, nor boss tactic wise or anything. It was just there and did nothing.
[/sm][/i]

I have to ask you the same question? cause you obviously never played. Jumping was actually a vital ability in numerous boss fights and even dungeon design.
But I digress. I'll just sit back and let you keep talking out your ***.

Edited, Mar 16th 2011 12:31pm by jedipimp


On this board you don't need to be accurate about WOW, if you hate it.
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#47 Mar 16 2011 at 10:51 AM Rating: Decent
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Ah jumping. Unless it's like Zelda OoT or Final Fantasy XIII I do not want it.
#48 Mar 16 2011 at 3:12 PM Rating: Decent
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I think it would be cool if the ability to jump was not allowed in the cities; out in the field, however, it could have like a 5-10 second cooldown or something of the sort. So people aren't able to spam it so easily.

I, for one, don't really care either way for a jump feature, although it would be nice to be able to scale some of those small hills that you otherwise have to walk around.
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#49 Mar 17 2011 at 10:59 AM Rating: Excellent
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I can't even believe that there is a thread asking people to stop requesting basic features.

I want jump. I also want swim. I also want fly. I want to explore obscure locations that are only accessible by these methods. It would mean that the SE team would have to put in a little more effort to create interesting and fun little "easter eggs" for us to discover, but things like this will just open the world up more and make it truly feel like a fantasy adventure.

This game and its predecessor are so.... Grounded right now. Adding some more realistic (and maybe some not so realistic in the case of flying) features could only help the game gain more acceptance. Get over yourselves with the "I don't want to see some idiot jumping up and down" - look away! If other people bother you to the point that you want to deny them even the most basic of terrain traversal features, then you need to go play offline games where there are no other people around to "bother you".

I'll tell you what - at the risk of getting flamed to oblivion - I love swimming and flying in WoW because it was tastefully done. There are quests to explore sunken ships, and dungeons built around fighting on dragonback. It just doesn't get more fun than that. Then I look at a FFXIV levequest that requires me to take a 5 mile detour around a twig because there is only one correct ramp to get to the area I need..... And I have to wonder what the heck is wrong with people to think that's actually good and immersive game esign.

Please stop asking for people to be silent on features that can save the game and make it more welcoming. Please.
#50 Mar 17 2011 at 11:04 AM Rating: Excellent
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Ignore this thread. It was started by a troll. In a thread he started less than 24 hours ago(that has been locked) he talked about how hes playing rift and loving it. One of the few things hes lists as selling points for Rift? Jump. Yep thats right hes a troll. Just move along, nothing to see here.
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#51 Mar 17 2011 at 11:10 AM Rating: Good
Torrence wrote:

This game and its predecessor are so.... Grounded right now.


I do love a good pun. Let me know if you see any! xD Aaaahahahaha. I kid, I kid.

Torrence wrote:
at the risk of getting flamed to oblivion - I love swimming and flying in WoW


Another one?! Ok that was a reach on my part.

Torrence wrote:
I look at a FFXIV levequest that requires me to take a 5 mile detour around a twig


Now that's just funny. Sad too, because it's true. I play a little WoW and rarely use jump because I was so used to not having it in FFXI (which I played for 7 years). They are working on the "invisible walls" and hopefully that takes care of the detours you mentioned. While I do enjoy flying and swimming in WoW, I can personally do without them in FFXIV.
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I started this character at the CE launch, and played for about 2 months. Haven't touched it since.
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