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...I think I can rival this book.Follow

#1 Mar 16 2011 at 4:18 AM Rating: Sub-Default
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http://www.amazon.com/Guild-Leaders-Handbook-Strategies-Battle-Scarred/dp/1593272588



Anyone who knows me in Eorzeapedia, the game itself, and in here will know what I am capable of and how bold I can really be.

I was wondering, if I were to write a book about the social and political aspects of MMORPGs in general, would you buy it?

Edited, Mar 19th 2011 10:14pm by Osarion Lock Thread: OT
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#2ViKtoricus, Posted: Mar 16 2011 at 4:21 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) The book seems to have some great reviews and positive things about it, but we'll see about mine. :)
#3 Mar 16 2011 at 4:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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If you can't make money off your crappy website maybe you can make some money off a crappy book, the only downfall is people actually have to see value in it and buy it. So chances are you won't make money off either.
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#4 Mar 16 2011 at 5:10 AM Rating: Excellent
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preludes wrote:
If you can't make money off your crappy website maybe you can make some money off a crappy book, the only downfall is people actually have to see value in it and buy it. So chances are you won't make money off either.


seconded.

But I for one would really like to know what he is truly capable of exactly..... besides leeching.
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#5ViKtoricus, Posted: Mar 16 2011 at 5:50 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I have yet to even start my website. I've done alot of procrastinations, and you can't really blame me after working for 9 days straight, no days off.
#6 Mar 16 2011 at 6:20 AM Rating: Excellent
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to be honest, I'm not sure the market for it is there. Most information on running guilds is not specific to MMO guilds, its the same as every other organization. Also, what few blogs/websites that do cover those topics are free.

But having said that, clearly one guy already wrote a book on the topic, and if you can convince a publisher that you can do better, I would say go for it.
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#7 Mar 16 2011 at 6:41 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
I have yet to even start my website. I've done alot of procrastinations, and you can't really blame me after working for 9 days straight, no days off.


As someone that created and ran a fairly big website I can tell you don't bother, creating, maintining, updating, dealing with webhosts, fixing loopholes etc took up a disgusting amount of my time. If you don't have the time to do something well or are trying to make money from that position don't bother.
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#8 Mar 16 2011 at 8:28 AM Rating: Excellent
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My two opinions on the matter:

1) There's enough free resources out there on how to run a successful linkshell/guild/clan/company/organization/whatever that not many people are going to be willing to pay money to get the same information they could get for free elsewhere.

2) If you need to buy a book to tell you how to lead your [online gaming organization] then perhaps you should consider not leading one. A lot of the qualities of successful leadership are intuitive character traits. Leadership, social interaction, impartiality, these are things that you're either good at or you're not. While there may be a tiny fraction of people that could perhaps learn these things from a book, the vast majority of people can not. If you are not a good leader, if you don't know how to maintain your calmness, then reading a book isn't going to be the magical solution you need.
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#10 Mar 16 2011 at 9:00 AM Rating: Good
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AkumaOokami wrote:
Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
My two opinions on the matter:

1) There's enough free resources out there on how to run a successful linkshell/guild/clan/company/organization/whatever that not many people are going to be willing to pay money to get the same information they could get for free elsewhere.

2) If you need to buy a book to tell you how to lead your [online gaming organization] then perhaps you should consider not leading one. A lot of the qualities of successful leadership are intuitive character traits. Leadership, social interaction, impartiality, these are things that you're either good at or you're not. While there may be a tiny fraction of people that could perhaps learn these things from a book, the vast majority of people can not. If you are not a good leader, if you don't know how to maintain your calmness, then reading a book isn't going to be the magical solution you need.


This.


Seconded.

If you are a person that wants to be a leader, you are wrong. Experience is what makes a person who they are; and it shows whether you are a worthless dirtbag, or a someone that people will believe in.
Video games gives everyone the false persona that you are instantly the "Hero" that everyone is looking for and needs. Go out in RL and talk to a military Vet. Listen to the stories of the things that they have been through, and if you really, really listen... You will learn what a leader is, and you will understand that its not about being a hero.
#11 Mar 16 2011 at 9:06 AM Rating: Excellent
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#12 Mar 16 2011 at 10:12 AM Rating: Excellent
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Stop encouraging him with real responses.
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#13 Mar 16 2011 at 10:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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I find it funny that no one's brought up the fact that it's really difficult to write a book. Even a bad one.
#14 Mar 16 2011 at 11:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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Or that even if you do write a good book, it's hard to get it published, and that even if you get it published, it costs money to distribute it, and that even if you get it distributed, there's no guarantee your book won't be selling for $5 a copy in the bargain bin (of which the author sees less than a dollar).

If one were to try to publish a book, e-books are the way to go nowadays for less overhead, but there's still no guarantee your book will sell well at all.
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#15ViKtoricus, Posted: Mar 16 2011 at 1:27 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I understand that leadership is a fairly universal concept, but there are certain things about specific types of leadership positions that vary. For example, Barack Obama will need a slightly different set of skills as opposed to... the King of some monarchist government.
#16 Mar 16 2011 at 2:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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ViKtoricus wrote:
XainVeliki wrote:
AkumaOokami wrote:
Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
My two opinions on the matter:

1) There's enough free resources out there on how to run a successful linkshell/guild/clan/company/organization/whatever that not many people are going to be willing to pay money to get the same information they could get for free elsewhere.

2) If you need to buy a book to tell you how to lead your [online gaming organization] then perhaps you should consider not leading one. A lot of the qualities of successful leadership are intuitive character traits. Leadership, social interaction, impartiality, these are things that you're either good at or you're not. While there may be a tiny fraction of people that could perhaps learn these things from a book, the vast majority of people can not. If you are not a good leader, if you don't know how to maintain your calmness, then reading a book isn't going to be the magical solution you need.


This.


Seconded.

If you are a person that wants to be a leader, you are wrong. Experience is what makes a person who they are; and it shows whether you are a worthless dirtbag, or a someone that people will believe in.
Video games gives everyone the false persona that you are instantly the "Hero" that everyone is looking for and needs. Go out in RL and talk to a military Vet. Listen to the stories of the things that they have been through, and if you really, really listen... You will learn what a leader is, and you will understand that its not about being a hero.


I understand that leadership is a fairly universal concept, but there are certain things about specific types of leadership positions that vary. For example, Barack Obama will need a slightly different set of skills as opposed to... the King of some monarchist government.


you picked a bad example. A "good" king would actually lead the exact same way, earning the populations respect and trust. Unfortunately for most of history, a Monarch doesn't have to lead that way, when they can easily lead by force and bullying. Yes its different, but its not the "good" leadership that our society considers ideal.
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#17 Mar 16 2011 at 3:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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“The answer is that one would like to be both the one and the other; but because it is difficult to combine them, it is far safer to be feared than loved if you cannot be both.” -Machiavelli, The Prince

There's a difference between "leading" and "ruling". In an LS, there is rarely an initial leader selection process, and there is rarely a process to nominate a replacement leader. Sack holders/officers may come and go but the leader rarely gets replaced by a new leader unless there is a very good reason for it.

Unlike actual law based governments, wherein the leadership is appointed and eventually rotated (either by death or by election), the head leadership of a linkshell/guild is very frequently permanent. People are far more likely to leave (whether individually or en masse) than oust the leader. And the main important thing to remember is that in a game, there are no mandatory requirements to even have such a group, nor to be governed by one, and that anyone is free to create their own group and governance at their leisure.

I don't have the luxury of deciding "I don't like Obama, so I'm starting my own new country". It doesn't work that way. Even if enough people do dislike their government enough to overthrow it, the leader must maintain order to prevent this to preserve his own safety and security. If a group of people decide they don't like their LS leader, the worst they can do to them typically is to just leave them without an LS to lead. They can't just decide to loot his mog house, take his stuff, and delete his character (Well, in most cases, they can't).

So leading what is ultimately still a social gathering of friends has far different criterion than leading a country with an economy, taxes, social policies, etc.
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#18ViKtoricus, Posted: Mar 16 2011 at 3:46 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Either way, whatever the consequences or lack thereof that you get from being a bad leader, you will never succeed unless you start doing things the right way. (And rate up to you for quoting Machiavelli. I have read his book before.)
#19 Mar 16 2011 at 3:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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ViKtoricus wrote:
Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
“The answer is that one would like to be both the one and the other; but because it is difficult to combine them, it is far safer to be feared than loved if you cannot be both.” -Machiavelli, The Prince

There's a difference between "leading" and "ruling". In an LS, there is rarely an initial leader selection process, and there is rarely a process to nominate a replacement leader. Sack holders/officers may come and go but the leader rarely gets replaced by a new leader unless there is a very good reason for it.

Unlike actual law based governments, wherein the leadership is appointed and eventually rotated (either by death or by election), the head leadership of a linkshell/guild is very frequently permanent. People are far more likely to leave (whether individually or en masse) than oust the leader. And the main important thing to remember is that in a game, there are no mandatory requirements to even have such a group, nor to be governed by one, and that anyone is free to create their own group and governance at their leisure.

I don't have the luxury of deciding "I don't like Obama, so I'm starting my own new country". It doesn't work that way. Even if enough people do dislike their government enough to overthrow it, the leader must maintain order to prevent this to preserve his own safety and security. If a group of people decide they don't like their LS leader, the worst they can do to them typically is to just leave them without an LS to lead. They can't just decide to loot his mog house, take his stuff, and delete his character (Well, in most cases, they can't).

So leading what is ultimately still a social gathering of friends has far different criterion than leading a country with an economy, taxes, social policies, etc.


Either way, whatever the consequences or lack thereof that you get from being a bad leader, you will never succeed unless you start doing things the right way. (And rate up to you for quoting Machiavelli. I have read his book before.)


Honestly, there's one major thing that nearly all good leaders have in common, whether IRL or ingame: Good help.

If you think you can do everything, you're setting yourself up for failure. Find people you trust to help you with the things you can't do and don't surround yourself with people who will agree with everything you say.
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#20 Mar 16 2011 at 4:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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Mikhalia the Picky wrote:



Honestly, there's one major thing that nearly all good leaders have in common, whether IRL or ingame: Good help.

If you think you can do everything, you're setting yourself up for failure. Find people you trust to help you with the things you can't do and don't surround yourself with people who will agree with everything you say.



...And that's why the best guilds or LSes are run by a close group of friends/people who've played together before. Not just one person with an ego trip demanding a tithe for "guild expenses."

Edited, Mar 16th 2011 6:17pm by Kierk
#21 Mar 16 2011 at 5:59 PM Rating: Excellent
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Kierk wrote:
Mikhalia the Picky wrote:



Honestly, there's one major thing that nearly all good leaders have in common, whether IRL or ingame: Good help.

If you think you can do everything, you're setting yourself up for failure. Find people you trust to help you with the things you can't do and don't surround yourself with people who will agree with everything you say.



...And that's why the best guilds or LSes are run by a close group of friends/people who've played together before. Not just one person with an ego trip demanding a tithe for "guild expenses."

Edited, Mar 16th 2011 6:17pm by Kierk


Indeed, this. But of course the pitfall of that is also that if you have a group of friends who all have the wrong mindset, then you end up with a LS where all the sackholders and shellholder only schedule the events -they- want to do and the lowly pearlholders not only have no room for promotion/advancement, but once they get all their look from %NM% and they move on to a new one, you're screwed.

Been in one of those LSes on two occasions. Sucks.
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Mikhalia: and FWIW, my posts are 95% helpful, informative, or funny.
Mikhalia: only 5% or less of my posts are utter crap.
Tyapex: 393 posts of utter crap...
Mikhalia: Sounds about right.
#22 Mar 16 2011 at 10:25 PM Rating: Default
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Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
ViKtoricus wrote:
Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
“The answer is that one would like to be both the one and the other; but because it is difficult to combine them, it is far safer to be feared than loved if you cannot be both.” -Machiavelli, The Prince

There's a difference between "leading" and "ruling". In an LS, there is rarely an initial leader selection process, and there is rarely a process to nominate a replacement leader. Sack holders/officers may come and go but the leader rarely gets replaced by a new leader unless there is a very good reason for it.

Unlike actual law based governments, wherein the leadership is appointed and eventually rotated (either by death or by election), the head leadership of a linkshell/guild is very frequently permanent. People are far more likely to leave (whether individually or en masse) than oust the leader. And the main important thing to remember is that in a game, there are no mandatory requirements to even have such a group, nor to be governed by one, and that anyone is free to create their own group and governance at their leisure.

I don't have the luxury of deciding "I don't like Obama, so I'm starting my own new country". It doesn't work that way. Even if enough people do dislike their government enough to overthrow it, the leader must maintain order to prevent this to preserve his own safety and security. If a group of people decide they don't like their LS leader, the worst they can do to them typically is to just leave them without an LS to lead. They can't just decide to loot his mog house, take his stuff, and delete his character (Well, in most cases, they can't).

So leading what is ultimately still a social gathering of friends has far different criterion than leading a country with an economy, taxes, social policies, etc.


Either way, whatever the consequences or lack thereof that you get from being a bad leader, you will never succeed unless you start doing things the right way. (And rate up to you for quoting Machiavelli. I have read his book before.)


Honestly, there's one major thing that nearly all good leaders have in common, whether IRL or ingame: Good help.

If you think you can do everything, you're setting yourself up for failure. Find people you trust to help you with the things you can't do and don't surround yourself with people who will agree with everything you say.


I cannot emphasize enough how right you are.

Your words will be my signature, and I believe that you and I have...

Be honest with me here, have you read the 48 laws of power? Either that your brain is jacked up with wisdom.
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#23 Mar 16 2011 at 10:37 PM Rating: Default
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Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
Kierk wrote:
Mikhalia the Picky wrote:



Honestly, there's one major thing that nearly all good leaders have in common, whether IRL or ingame: Good help.

If you think you can do everything, you're setting yourself up for failure. Find people you trust to help you with the things you can't do and don't surround yourself with people who will agree with everything you say.



...And that's why the best guilds or LSes are run by a close group of friends/people who've played together before. Not just one person with an ego trip demanding a tithe for "guild expenses."

Edited, Mar 16th 2011 6:17pm by Kierk


Indeed, this. But of course the pitfall of that is also that if you have a group of friends who all have the wrong mindset, then you end up with a LS where all the sackholders and shellholder only schedule the events -they- want to do and the lowly pearlholders not only have no room for promotion/advancement, but once they get all their look from %NM% and they move on to a new one, you're screwed.

Been in one of those LSes on two occasions. Sucks.


I also would like to add that if everyone is your friend, you are bound to get betrayed.

Believe it or not, you are actually better off having lots of friends, and lots of enemies. When you have an enemy, you will most likely be aware of his actions and you will prepare a defense. You must learn how to trust no one...

And as much as I know that these kinds of posts are going to leave me in the land of sub-defaultiness, I am satisfied with the fact that I have given everyone the kind of wisdom and knowledge that is worth the read if they are actually willing to believe it. I admit that it hurts my feelings to be flamed and thrashed in most of my threads in which I have put forth great effort in writing, but that's just the way things are... No one likes to hear the truth.
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#24 Mar 16 2011 at 11:32 PM Rating: Decent
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ViKtoricus wrote:


I also would like to add that if everyone is your friend, you are bound to get betrayed.

Believe it or not, you are actually better off having lots of friends, and lots of enemies. When you have an enemy, you will most likely be aware of his actions and you will prepare a defense. You must learn how to trust no one...

And as much as I know that these kinds of posts are going to leave me in the land of sub-defaultiness, I am satisfied with the fact that I have given everyone the kind of wisdom and knowledge that is worth the read if they are actually willing to believe it. I admit that it hurts my feelings to be flamed and thrashed in most of my threads in which I have put forth great effort in writing, but that's just the way things are... No one likes to hear the truth.


usually one acquires these so called friends because you have something they do not. a skill, a job, a toy. these are not friends. A friend is someone who has nothing to gain by being with you, who will pick your *** off the ground when you are knocked down. a Friend never will never take, they will only give.

in 28 years of my life i have only acquired 2 true friends. the other 18 so called friends were more like Socialization Tools. if i needed something to talk too they where there.

Edited, Mar 17th 2011 1:33am by FelixValmont
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#25 Mar 17 2011 at 1:41 AM Rating: Good
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Reminds of the American Idol contestants who go up and sing in front of the judges, get quick unanimous thumbs down on a laughable scale, but still leave with the belief that the judges have no clue, and don't really know what good singing is.
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