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So. I'm new and totally lost.Follow

#1 Jun 18 2011 at 6:19 PM Rating: Decent
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I hated FFXI with a seething passion by the time I quit. I had a 60 WAR/35 MNK/35 NIN, had all classes -- 15 at the time -- open and leveled to 20+, 54 Goldsmithing with over 1mil gil and a stock of gold and plat ore/bars that I was getting ready to sell, when two things happened:

1) The Scorpion Harness that I'd been trying to save up for went from 3 mil, to 8 mil, to 20 mil in the span of about two weeks, and,
2) The LS I ran (a social one, but still) ditched me over one Christmas break because of drama I hadn't even been aware of until I logged on to find them all gone.

I raged, I deleted everything, and I moved onto WoW. I tried going back to FFXI 5-6 months later, but go figure, SE basically said, "lol thats wut u get 4 deletin ur charz thx 4 teh money tho!" Which is true, I'll grant, never the less. I tried rerolling again, got to level 30, and the thought of doing all those job quests over again made me want to puke, so I put it up for good.

Flash forward to a few days ago. I saw FFXIV on sale for $15, and figured, "Eh, what the ****? It's a month of WoW that I'm currently not playing." Now, I tried the FFXIV open beta, and remembered it as a bug-ridden, quarter-finished mess, but thus far, I'm actually somewhat enjoying myself. There are nice little quality of life things that make it more enjoyable than FFXI, such as action bars (though I guess macros do the same thing), faster-paced combat (because nothing says heart-pounding like auto-attacking your way to level 10, punctuated by the odd WS here and there), the ability to regen on the move (because having to heal after every kill made me want to commit suicide after a while), and the ability to change classes/jobs on the fly based on what weapon you're equipped with. Oh yeah, and the ability to solo with something that could be considered success without being a BST or RDM of some variety.

However, while the combat/gathering/crafting in and of themselves are more fun for me -- it's more action oriented without being the OMFGBUTTONSPAM that WoW/Rift/Aion/WAR all were (maybe it's just because I can actually play with a joypad without gimping myself to ****) -- it seems to be missing...well, pretty much everything else. There's no mail system as far as I can tell, this "fatigue" system I'm hearing about sounds daunting (though I haven't hit it, yet...I think), FFXIV is still continuing the time-honored tradition of "Wtf is this item for?" and the overall fear of vendoring anything because that may be an expensive, rare piece to some insanely high end craft. What are mats of the +1-3 variety for? Why are there level 77 crabs in a newbie zone? (I got hit for 4667 damage on my level 11. It made me giggle.) Where the **** is everybody? :( I'm on Selbina, seen on my screen as the highest pop server, and it feels so incredibly barren and lonely -- no chat of any kind -- and it makes me sad. :(

I have a point in this, believe it or not. Basically put, there's no point asking if this game is worth the money, because as far as I'm aware, it's still essentially free until Squeenix gets their crap straight, so if nothing else, it's a fun little romp so far, but...well, does it drastically improve at some point? At least in FFXI, the zones were pretty straight forward in their progression -- at least, at first they were. Here, I'm seeing mobs range from level 1 to 19 to 77 (at least I can see levels now, though, I guess), and I'm not exactly sure where the **** I'm supposed to go after Nublet Central. Moreover, I'm afraid to ask any of the people that I see roaming around because I don't like showing off my complete lack of knowledge about, well, anything, and all of this feels like my first foray into FFXI, but worse, because FFXIV is like FFXI's mutated, malformed cousin that I can almost recognize, but is too disfigured for me to get any kind of bead on.

I like the game so far, but I'm getting so many mixed signals about everything. Is the game worth it, in any way shape or form? Or should I just swallow my bad memories of FFXI and try that again after...God, five years, now? Six? Something like that.

Edited, Jun 18th 2011 8:20pm by WFSilverKnight
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#2 Jun 18 2011 at 6:53 PM Rating: Decent
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Sadly there is no forced zone progression... you could go 1-50 in your starting area... but ***** that. Travel every few weeks to keep things fresh.

Things get better sorta... depends what time you're on and which city you're at in game. People still horde around Ul'Dah so that's your best bet for team play.

As to items, honestly the RMT (and possibly soured players) are in full force already and undercutting a lot of the items (why I have no clue)... but there's no monopolies and the low prices are great for crafting... which is where I'd suggest spending most of your effort. Fighting jobs are due a major change here shortly, dunno about you but I like to level/rank a class to learn it. Sorry, back to items... wings are in demand for arrows and horns and moraines are usually good sellers. Everything else you'll have to research as the markets fluctuate based on needs.

Hope that kinda helps?
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#4VitaminD2112, Posted: Jun 18 2011 at 7:40 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Cool story bro
#5 Jun 18 2011 at 7:58 PM Rating: Good
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Well, whatever they change with the combat classes, I hope they do something about the insane combat lag. I can solo perfectly fine...so long as I don't actually watch anything that's on my screen and try to predict what the mob is going to do and when. I appreciate the rest of the info, though. I didn't realize Ul'dah was the de facto trade city, but that would explain why LL is so bereft of life.
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#6 Jun 18 2011 at 8:04 PM Rating: Decent
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WFSilverKnight wrote:
Why are there level 77 crabs in a newbie zone?


Good question, and the answer is twofold: 1) to give some people some small reason to possibly frequent a zone later in the game instead of mechanically guiding players from point to point; and 2) to root out players who, for one reason or another, are unable to figure out how to look a monster's level or avoid a dangerous monster.

If you actually need a "newbie zone" in order to play a game, then you may not be bright enough to cut it in a game that doesn't hold your hand every step of the way. Try a strategy; die occasionally; experiment; learn from your mistakes. This is how we should learn, not by watering down the harshness of the environments until trying to find something difficult is the only challenge that remains.

Plus, it's not like dying is much of an inconvenience, anyway.
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#7 Jun 18 2011 at 8:10 PM Rating: Decent
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WFSilverKnight wrote:
Well, whatever they change with the combat classes, I hope they do something about the insane combat lag. I can solo perfectly fine...so long as I don't actually watch anything that's on my screen and try to predict what the mob is going to do and when. I appreciate the rest of the info, though. I didn't realize Ul'dah was the de facto trade city, but that would explain why LL is so bereft of life.


Supposedly when they implement auto-attack in 1.18 it's going to help the lag a lot. I'm not expecting a huge improvement (just for the sake of not being hugely disappointed if there isn't one) in the lag, because regardless of whether or not you're spamming your basic attacks right now there is still a terrible lag for all weaponskills right now. Hopefully it cuts out at least a bit of the lag though.
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#8 Jun 18 2011 at 8:24 PM Rating: Good
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I'll answer stuff relating crafting.

Quote:
"Wtf is this item for?" and the overall fear of vendoring anything because that may be an expensive, rare piece to some insanely high end craft. What are mats of the +1-3 variety for?


I got that too initially, but don't worry, if you begin crafting or look around the recipe in the database it'll make you more item-savvy. The +1 to +3 are item quality. +3 being extremely high quality, and no pluses being NQ (normal quality) If you use higher quality items in a craft, you will have additional Durability and Quality in the beginning. Making high quality items often require high quality ingredients. Strangely kinda like in real life. Though be warned you may find all the pluses clogging up your inventory at a very fast rate, so decide which quality to keep and then vendor the rest.

Everyone is in Ul'dah, reason being is because

1) It's in the middle between Gridenia and LL, making traveling between them relatively easy
2) Everything you need in a city is better organized, and you don't have to run very far
3) It's a city-like area that people feel more at home with, compared to the mystical forest Gridenia or the port-like LL. This one is more about aesthetics, really.

Edited, Jun 18th 2011 10:25pm by Enfid

Edited, Jun 18th 2011 10:27pm by Enfid
#9 Jun 18 2011 at 8:37 PM Rating: Good
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If you actually need a "newbie zone" in order to play a game, then you may not be bright enough to cut it in a game that doesn't hold your hand every step of the way. Try a strategy; die occasionally; experiment; learn from your mistakes. This is how we should learn, not by watering down the harshness of the environments until trying to find something difficult is the only challenge that remains.

Plus, it's not like dying is much of an inconvenience, anyway.

I meant "newbie zone" insofar that it's the first zone you walk out of when you exit the city you end up in. Ergo, most newbies will be there. Regardless, all I meant was that seeing level 77s about 35 yards away from level 1-5s struck me as odd, considering that I don't remember that ever being the case in FFXI -- that is to say, possibly due to the heavily zone-structure nature of FFXI, having super high level mobs right next door to baby mobs might not have been feasible.

Concerning the lag, I don't see how auto-attack is going to magically make my spells go off sooner than 2-5 seconds after I hit the particular button, unless they're tossing in some network optimization in there, too. Granted, I know the servers are located in Japan, so NA is getting a taste of what Brits and Aussies have to put up with in MMOs were the servers are based in a different hemisphere. Given that it's been several years, I don't remember if FFXI's lag was as blatant, but I guess, given that FFXI's combat was much slower, it might not have mattered nearly as much. It's jarring, anyway.

Thanks for the tips with the HQ mats. I figured it had something to do with making HQ items, but I couldn't be sure. I guess that makes HQ proccing a little less RNG than it was in XI, which is good. :D
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#10 Jun 18 2011 at 9:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Welcome to the game.
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#11 Jun 18 2011 at 9:01 PM Rating: Good
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WFSilverKnight wrote:
I like the game so far, but I'm getting so many mixed signals about everything. Is the game worth it, in any way shape or form? Or should I just swallow my bad memories of FFXI and try that again after...God, five years, now? Six? Something like that.


Well, let's take a look at each option:

Option A: FFXIV- On the positive side, this game has a LOT of potential. Regardless of how horribly designed the UI, battle system, or anything else were initially, there were some pretty awesome design ideas. For instance: changing classes on the fly, allowing all classes to solo, making classes almost COMPLETELY customizable, making crafting a more important and interesting facet of the game (no it might not be there now, but they could totally rework crafting and make it fun), and even the idea of guildleves. In principle, guild leves are a brilliant idea. Go to a camp, get this really unique quest, and gain tons of SP and gil. They just forgot the unique part. It also has MUCH improved direction and focus, and although the progress is slow, if they can fix some systems and add some content we might have us a game here.

Option B: FFXI- Ok, you played it before. Got sick of it pretty fast. So clearly you didn't like the grindy nature of the game. Understandable. But, there is this magical land in ffxi now. Where scorpions **** experience and bunnies crap out +2's. It's called Abyssea. A glorious land of massive xp gains (up to 400k an hour from what I here!) and magean trials (like a grind, but different... because, uh, theres... pop items?). Outside of Abyssea, apparently a lot of the old content at 75 becomes very easy to low man at 90. You can go solo sky now, or go do some solo limbus runs. Or even do some of the old 75 stuff like ENM99's (heck, they even drop triggers to Faf, Ada, and Behemoth, NQ's guaranteed and HQ's drop from that), or dynamis which can now be low manned, and oh yeah, is free. You can get that AF2 you always dreamed of. My point is... THIS GAME HAS FREAKIN CONTENT!!!!! It's very healthy, the servers are all bustling with activity, and it has become much less grindy.

So really, it just comes down to a simple question. Are you playing to be happy NOW, or are you playing a game that you can grow with. I'd say FFXIV is a really high risk right now, and FFXI is very low risk. But with great risk comes great reward...

Edited, Jun 18th 2011 11:07pm by BartelX
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#12 Jun 18 2011 at 9:46 PM Rating: Decent
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Actually, I played FFXI religiously for a little over two years, so I wouldn't necessarily call that getting sick of it pretty fast, personally. XD The sound of scorpions farting experience sounds...odd, but I may have to look into it. I know they'd made massive changes (heard they upped the level cap to 99), but the thought of going through the Dunes again still makes me a bit nauseous. Insofar as content is concerned, there's really nothing to do at endgame in any other MMO out, anyway (WoW's endgame is very stale, Rift's endgame is WoW but worse, and lolAion), so I'd likely be just as bored at 50 here as I would be via anything else. At least I'm fairly enjoying leveling thus far.
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#13 Jun 18 2011 at 10:28 PM Rating: Good
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You wouldn't have to do the Dunes if you don't want. At low levels, they added these things called FoV's. Basically, you get one, it gives you a couple of different mobs 2 kill like: 2 lizards, 5 crabs. You kill those, and then when finished, you automatically gain a set amount of xp. There are some really good areas for them at almost all levels. Or, you can stay in korroloka tunnel and just farm worms there if you're near Bastok.

Also, level cap is 90 now, but will eventually go up to 99 and a lot of players assume there will be a 2nd set of "endgame" activities at that level.
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#14 Jun 19 2011 at 12:01 AM Rating: Decent
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WFSilverKnight wrote:
I'm on Selbina, seen on my screen as the highest pop server, and it feels so incredibly barren and lonely -- no chat of any kind -- and it makes me sad. :(


I'm on Selbina and ya lately I've noticed that it's a little more quiet than normal but I suspect that a lot of people are taking a break before the patch is released. Population will pick back up as I've seen in the past after patches. Do Behest runs when you're in your low levels when you're not doing your leves and in the mid 20's you should be starting to link with people doing r30 leve runs and you'll start to fly through the sp. Good Luck and hope to see ya 'round!
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#15 Jun 19 2011 at 9:41 AM Rating: Decent
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Nausious Dunes, Selbina, hmmm

Don't forget to register your Retainers at the Adventurer guild - they are your fat chocobo, and will increase your item capacity by 200. With 300 item spaces, you shouldn't have to worry about throwing out rare dropped items for a while, until you get the feel for what you need to keep. In general: keep everything HQ, I have never found much use for food items such as peas and leaves or sensible cheep items like worms/pebbles, some things you will get a LOT of and you will want to keep these for ranking crafts.

Raw items like Grass/Cotton, Ore, Hide/Skin, and Logs will be used for leveling crafts (levequests are good to, and free). Consequently you will want to have many of these items on hand in inventory so as to repair gear (although gear wear is much better now than previously.)
To put your mind at rest though, the truth right now is that crafting those rare items generally just uses common items + a special levequest item. In the worst case that you need something which you vendored, there is likely a lot of that item for sale because if you weren't collecting it, someone else has been. And for crafting those special items, you will want all HQ common items anywhay.
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#16 Jun 19 2011 at 9:41 AM Rating: Decent
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Dup Post

Edited, Jun 19th 2011 11:42am by WolfOak
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#17 Jun 19 2011 at 10:38 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
I like the game so far, but I'm getting so many mixed signals about everything. Is the game worth it, in any way shape or form? Or should I just swallow my bad memories of FFXI and try that again after...God, five years, now? Six? Something like that.


If you liked FFXI you will probably love it now, it's easier to level than ever, you can solo to cap if you want to doing unlimited leav system as shown in FFXIV (which took it from ffxi), endgame stuff is very inclusive and you don't have to kiss someones *** to get gear (can do everything in the game with 3-4 friends). It's easy to come back, build a char to cap in a matter of a few months.

FFXI is right now enjoying a resurgence with many players coming back, it has around 16 servers with very high populations still, around 3-4k on at peak times, it just had a major change to the entire game and the level cap is going upto 99. Exciting time to return to the game and it's honestly right now at it's best. A lot of the rage stuff has been taken out.

FFXIV? Well it's losing players incredibly fast, I don't know how many it has left but it's not that many compared to most MMOs and certainly laughable considering it's free to play and cheap as dirt to buy. Even the hardcore whitenights are fading out which is a major sign of immenent implosion.

Which is to be considered more worth it? Idk but I know which I'm glad to playing as my main and which I think is the safer bet and that's the one with the much bigger playerbase and thats so good you have to pay to play it, FFXI.

If you can't decide, buy and play both, the decision will be made for you to which you enjoy the most.
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#18 Jun 19 2011 at 1:33 PM Rating: Decent
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WFSilverKnight wrote:
There are nice little quality of life things that make it more enjoyable than FFXI, such as action bars (though I guess macros do the same thing), faster-paced combat (because nothing says heart-pounding like auto-attacking your way to level 10, punctuated by the odd WS here and there)


Then you'll probably hate the patch arriving in about two weeks. They are implementing auto-attack.

Edit: Also Gil in this game is pretty easy to come by and most things can be bought with a little effort. I've yet to see anything equivalent to a Scorpion Harness.


Edited, Jun 19th 2011 3:36pm by CupDeNoodles
#19 Jun 19 2011 at 4:32 PM Rating: Good
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I appreciate all the feedback I've gotten. Honestly, while FFXIV has a very long way to go before I could really call it complete (no mail, no transportation system, Market Wards being a really ghetto and unnecessarily clunky version of an AH, etc.), a lot of what I enjoy about it so far are the things that drove me insane in FFXI. Crafting feels less like a dice roll (where upon losing, your competitor walks up and Rochambeau's you with spiked boots), being able to "hotkey" abilities without requiring macros is nice, being able to see mob levels/aggro status without trying to memorize it...little quality of life things that makes playing much less painful at really no cost to the gameplay itself.

It might sound dumb to list those as positive enough reasons to play XIV over XI, I suppose, but really: having to buy/quest for every map and spell scroll, having no minimap (the compass never did anything except get me even more lost ><), having to buy the right set of gear/furniture/buffs and be facing the right direction, at the right time of day, at the right time of month, to get a higher chance at completing a craft that may or may not give you one-tenth of a point, having to buy several stacks of mining picks/hatchets, and...yeah, like I said, little quality of life things. I know they were all meant as gilsinks, but Jesus tapdancing Christ, even now, thinking on FFXI crafting brings back memories of making a mad dash for Bastok so I could be there on Firesday of the Waxing Moon (or was it Waning Moon?) so I could get a big boost on my crafting success rate. Oh, the hairpins that I made. My poor moogle.

Anyway, maybe it's just because I'm new, and the hope hasn't been sucked out of me like so much orange juice to be packaged and shipped off, but I can really see the potential in this game. And, I'm sure, because I haven't seen the snails pace at which they've been improving the game, AND because I didn't bother trying to play it when it was in its incredibly crappy release state. (Those who actually had the gumption or masochism to go through with it have my respect and/or pity.) I'm sure I'll become bitter and jaded in time. XD
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#20 Jun 19 2011 at 7:54 PM Rating: Good
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Great to see you coming in with a great attitude. Hope you have fun!
#21 Jun 20 2011 at 6:36 PM Rating: Decent
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Don't be afraid to ask around, the japanese mentality for MMO's is left kind of unexplained intentionally the same way FFXI was.

Once you get the hang of the leve's, behests, and while dry, the steady expansion of abilities you'll start to realize that this game does stand a decent chance of separating from the herd and picking up a substantial amount of niche players that don't feel the whole american mmo/wow scene.

I will say this though, its less frustrating then every other MMO i've played and the grind model is set up like exercise instead of working. The game rewards you for playing consistently over playing excessively.

but yeah its good that you have a positive outlook, I can't fully explain it but i find it hard to believe the game has nothing special about it considering i've made it to 40 w/o incentive and have never made it past mid game in any MMO. I also notice i have a surprising amount of nostalgia for my starting area when i visited limsa the other day to cash in some marauder marks.
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