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#52 Aug 07 2011 at 1:29 PM Rating: Excellent
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3,530 posts
FilthMcNasty wrote:
Almost everyone I talk to or see post about returning to XI has the exact same issue you have. They have fond memories, they remember the good experiences they had and friendships they made along the way, but when it comes down to it they didn't enjoy it enough to do it again. Replay value{Can I have it?}


If a game lasts me 3,360 hours, I think it surpasses the need to have a "replay value."

*(140 days playtime)
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"... he called to himself a wizard, named Gallery, hoping by this means to escape the paying of the fifteen hundred crowns..." (Machen 15)

"Thus opium is pleasing... on account of the agreeable delirium it produces." (Burke para.6)

"I could only read so much for this paper and the syphilis poem had to go."
#53 Aug 07 2011 at 1:40 PM Rating: Excellent
Edited by bsphil
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21,739 posts
KaneKitty wrote:
FilthMcNasty wrote:
Almost everyone I talk to or see post about returning to XI has the exact same issue you have. They have fond memories, they remember the good experiences they had and friendships they made along the way, but when it comes down to it they didn't enjoy it enough to do it again. Replay value{Can I have it?}


If a game lasts me 3,360 hours, I think it surpasses the need to have a "replay value."

*(140 days playtime)
Yeah, no kidding. I'm up to 20,647 hours...
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His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#54 Aug 07 2011 at 2:51 PM Rating: Decent
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Woofdram wrote:
What's your point? Should we go set the SE building on fire for this as well or should we just accept the fact that for a wonderful game like FFXI - a game that demands interaction with other human beings, planning and hundreds of hours - the replay value is low?

Did you read the post that my comment was a response to? It's not a call to arms to defeat the evil XI developers. I was simply pointing out that someone who probably didn't even read the post in this thread is pounding nails for me. Nails that someone was bashing me about being wrong for trying to pound myself.

KaneKitty wrote:
If a game lasts me 3,360 hours, I think it surpasses the need to have a "replay value."

I apologize if you misunderstood, but that isn't quite what I meant. In context, the post was a response to someone talking about starting over from scratch, not logging back on to an already seasoned character. I hate to use hypotheticals, but humor me for a moment...

Imagine for a few minutes that you could only level one job in XI beyond 50. Sorta like the cap on crafting, but with jobs. You could only have one main job, but you could support it with any sub up to 50. Would you still have all those hours logged on your character? If you had to 'reroll' another character for every separate job you wanted to have at cap, would you do it? Would you still have put those thousand hours (or in my case, thousand days) into it?

I'm just curious.

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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#55 Aug 07 2011 at 3:39 PM Rating: Excellent
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3,530 posts
FilthMcNasty wrote:
Imagine for a few minutes that you could only level one job in XI beyond 50. Sorta like the cap on crafting, but with jobs. You could only have one main job, but you could support it with any sub up to 50. Would you still have all those hours logged on your character? If you had to 'reroll' another character for every separate job you wanted to have at cap, would you do it? Would you still have put those thousand hours (or in my case, thousand days) into it?

I'm just curious.


Honestly, I certainly wouldn't have. The ability to change jobs and try new things without re-doing every prerequisite and chain quest along the way held (and still holds) huge appeal for me.
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"... he called to himself a wizard, named Gallery, hoping by this means to escape the paying of the fifteen hundred crowns..." (Machen 15)

"Thus opium is pleasing... on account of the agreeable delirium it produces." (Burke para.6)

"I could only read so much for this paper and the syphilis poem had to go."
#56 Aug 07 2011 at 5:13 PM Rating: Decent
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4,144 posts
I was talking to an old friend of mine who used to play XI. He wanted to return, but SE couldn't restore his account. He was pretty bummed and I offered to let him have all my crap if he rerolled, but he couldn't do it. Same reasons as most people that it was too much effort even with all the adjustments and that it wouldn't be the same. I asked him basically the same thing and told him my theory about people not really enjoying the game, but enjoying the other experiences that they tied to it. He laughed and said "Yeah, I was married to that ***** but I didn't love her. We just stayed together for the kids."

I just think it's odd that people place such a high value on all the time and effort they put in to a character, but it isn't something they would do again if they had to. /shrug
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#57 Aug 07 2011 at 5:41 PM Rating: Excellent
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3,530 posts
FilthMcNasty wrote:
I just think it's odd that people place such a high value on all the time and effort they put in to a character, but it isn't something they would do again if they had to. /shrug


You find that odd?

Try being taken by passionate inspiration, taken by a whim to try something new. Try creating a painting while you're thus filled with wonder. Every brushstroke is new and interesting, everything feels unpredictable. You grow with your art and, after many weeks of diligent (but intensely enjoyable) effort, you decide that the art is finally finished. Stand back, look at it, allow yourself to absorb the feeling of accomplishment as it mixes with the recollection of that dizzy passion. Now smash it all to pieces. Burn the canvas. Paint the same picture again.

It's not the same the second time, is it?


Edited, Aug 7th 2011 7:42pm by KaneKitty
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"... he called to himself a wizard, named Gallery, hoping by this means to escape the paying of the fifteen hundred crowns..." (Machen 15)

"Thus opium is pleasing... on account of the agreeable delirium it produces." (Burke para.6)

"I could only read so much for this paper and the syphilis poem had to go."
#58 Aug 07 2011 at 8:50 PM Rating: Decent
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3,599 posts
FilthMcNasty wrote:

I just think it's odd that people place such a high value on all the time and effort they put in to a character, but it isn't something they would do again if they had to. /shrug


If I could do it again with no knowledge of having done it, yes. I would.

It's not like a mass effect or soemthing where you could make different choices, see the story change. But in an MMO setting, it doesn't make much sense to start over. Especially in a game where you can play EVERY class on one character. I made multiple characters in WoW and Rift, to experience a different class.

And yes, we did it over and over in FFXI. Start from the bottom with a new job, grind to the top, or to 37/40/45/49 for subjob, repeat. Last I checked, I had something like 250 days played.... I think the elder scroll series (all games combined) is the only game that would even come remotely close to time played.

Replay value does not literally mean "To Re-play."
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#59 Aug 07 2011 at 10:00 PM Rating: Good
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1,636 posts
I would say that because of how quests/missions etc chain the way they do in FFXI and the nature of grouping definitely killed my motivation the last time I tried to start up again. You don't just need to find someone willing to help you do the hard missions, you need to find people to help you do every mission.

I mean yeah you can skip it, but it was like why get involved with a game when I'm likely to miss out on most of the stuff in there.
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#60 Aug 07 2011 at 10:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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9,526 posts
Eh, I dunno. I rerolled... but then again I never had a char to cap before. They have done a lot to make it more painless to start from the bottom. I never would have returned otherwise. I mean, you can solo or at worst, duo all of COP now. That should say it all. The stuff that requires grouping nowadays is generally new (abyssea) or retuned (dynamis) or not really necessary to do (assault)
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lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#61FilthMcNasty, Posted: Aug 08 2011 at 12:15 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Would you be more open to starting again if level caps were lifted on missions or if they were nerfed a bit so that you could do something with half the usual group size? Solo?
#62 Aug 08 2011 at 5:31 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
FilthMcNasty wrote:

Louiscool wrote:
If I could do it again with no knowledge of having done it, yes. I would...

Replay value does not literally mean "To Re-play."

That isn't a reroll Louis. Erasing your memory MIB style isn't part of the deal. You don't get to take a colored pill and forget everything :P

What does 'replay value' mean to you? For some I guess it means each and every successive time you play, but for me, especially regarding FF games, it means to start again from the beginning. I've cleared many of the FF titles multiple times so that's what I was getting at. If this has a different meaning then I already apologized for misunderstanding above.

Would you be more open to starting again if level caps were lifted on missions or if they were nerfed a bit so that you could do something with half the usual group size? Solo?

It's tough to think of a single MMO that I would play again from scratch in a fashion similar to a single player FF title. It's just a different style. It's sweat and tears sometimes, and my main motivation to play FFXI was my friends.

So, if suddenly they all woke up one day and thought "Lets start FFXI again" I might be inclined to do it again. But everything in FFXI is riddled with time sinks because of it's age, so if you're looking for me to say that not every moment was full of joy, yes, ok. There's some things I'm happy to never redo.

Edited, Aug 8th 2011 7:32am by Louiscool
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#63 Aug 08 2011 at 10:17 AM Rating: Excellent
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1,636 posts
FilthMcNasty wrote:


KujaKoF wrote:
I mean yeah you can skip it, but it was like why get involved with a game when I'm likely to miss out on most of the stuff in there.

Would you be more open to starting again if level caps were lifted on missions or if they were nerfed a bit so that you could do something with half the usual group size? Solo?



Honestly, probably not. to me it'd be the equivalent to god-mode or cheat codes. FFXI was pretty much designed to achieve group goals, or level up (which thankfully has a few achievable methods to it). I think its more the nature of how FFXI was designed, to basically be progression over here, interesting content over there. modern games allow and encourage you to do the interesting stuff while you're progressing. the idea of leveling up and then going back to do a bunch of missions that I'd steamroll just feels like a game I don't want to be involved with.
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#64 Aug 08 2011 at 3:31 PM Rating: Decent
5 posts
play the new story line mission and watch the last CS and you'll forget about all your worries and want to play on.
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