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EDITORIAL: Founder's Day in Eorzea: A Misleading AnniversaryFollow

#52 Sep 20 2011 at 6:47 PM Rating: Decent
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4,153 posts
RamseySylph wrote:
bsphil wrote:
Why do people keep saying the "620k" sales figure?


Because that's how many unit shipped, whether or not that many sold is unknown as far as I am aware.

I'm not sure where your numbers are from, but the 620k figure I use is from SE's last fiscal sales report.
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#53 Sep 20 2011 at 8:00 PM Rating: Good
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1,949 posts
I think bsPhil's point might be that according to vgchartz, there's 520k or so units sold before even considering Japan..

Or did you not follow the link he provided?

Edited, Sep 20th 2011 10:04pm by Docent42
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FFXIV: Cloe Delisle Scholar, officer of the SWAGGER Free company, Sargatanas server.
#54 Sep 20 2011 at 8:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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4,153 posts
Docent42 wrote:
I think bsPhil's point might be that according to vgchartz, there's 520k or so units sold before even considering Japan..

Or did you not follow the link he provided?

I didn't follow the link because the info I have is directly from SE's fiscal report. Those reports are released every quarter so yes, it's a bit dated, but it still makes the point. Proving that there have been more units sold only reinforces the fact that no one wants to play it even though it remains free to play currently...


Edited, Sep 20th 2011 10:21pm by FilthMcNasty
____________________________
Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#55 Sep 20 2011 at 9:56 PM Rating: Good
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465 posts
StateAlchemist of Amestris wrote:
Whens the last time you played? My PC definitely doesnt stand up to some of the ones people have around here and I have zero lag when it comes to synthesis and combat. Z-e-r-o. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hIJCQs-R7X4
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/21655-The-single-biggest-issue-holding-back-FFXIV-needs-to-be-specifically-addressed./page28

I think you're being naive if you don't realize the issue here. Whatever you want to call it, the client/server relationship is awful and is crippling the entire experiance.
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Lodestone
#56 Sep 20 2011 at 10:05 PM Rating: Good
Coyohma wrote:
StateAlchemist of Amestris wrote:
Whens the last time you played? My PC definitely doesnt stand up to some of the ones people have around here and I have zero lag when it comes to synthesis and combat. Z-e-r-o. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hIJCQs-R7X4
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/21655-The-single-biggest-issue-holding-back-FFXIV-needs-to-be-specifically-addressed./page28

I think you're being naive if you don't realize the issue here. Whatever you want to call it, the client/server relationship is awful and is crippling the entire experiance.


The entire experience? I am not being naive. I didn't say there weren't issues. I just stated that in regards to combat and synthesis I didn't experience any lag. If you do, well then I'm sorry, and I hope they clear that up for you. As far as running circles around someone...well that's not really high on my priority list so doubt I would have noticed what was shown in the video.
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#57 Sep 20 2011 at 10:22 PM Rating: Excellent
Quote:
As far as running circles around someone...well that's not really high on my priority list so doubt I would have noticed what was shown in the video.


I don't know about you State, but after seeing that video, I will be crying myself to sleep tonight knowing that I'm never truly running circles around people.
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#58 Sep 20 2011 at 10:35 PM Rating: Good
Thayos wrote:
Quote:
As far as running circles around someone...well that's not really high on my priority list so doubt I would have noticed what was shown in the video.


I don't know about you State, but after seeing that video, I will be crying myself to sleep tonight knowing that I'm never truly running circles around people.

I used to do that in FFXI, but I just haven't done it in FFXIV yet. Maybe THAT is what is really missing in this game...must run more circles! Oh wait... ><
____________________________
Humankind cannot gain anything without first giving something in return. To obtain, something of equal value must be lost.
Data Center: Primal; Server: Ultros; Free Company: The Kraken Club; Grand Company: The Maelstrom; Chocobo: Kweh
#59 Sep 20 2011 at 10:53 PM Rating: Good
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1,949 posts
FFXI was just as bad.

The result seen in the video is a mix of bad net code and a design decision that essentially compromise between "popping" (teleporting) and polished visual. Popping happens because in games that use prediction algorithms; it knows your speed and direction, and until the server/client confirm your new location, the rest of the world will assume you're going the same way. This means that when you run circles like in XIV's video example, instead of running in a triangle, you'd see the character actually run in perpendicular lines and then "pop" or teleport to the corrected position. Bad net code and prediction can lead to VERY ugly and terrible results as well, as anyone who played Vanguard at launch can attest.

On the other hand, the solution SE chose for XI and XIV is having everything on your screen happen 2 or so second late. This way you can do interpolation (player was at coordinates [x1, y1] @ 4:02, now he's at [x2, y2] -- animate the transition smoothly, which leads to that feeling of lag and "broken" circle running.

I'm not saying they did the right choice, but I always approved of it in XI, and I'm not ****** at it in XIV. I do understand that people who care about twitchy reflex-based things might not have the response-time from faster paced games or MMOs, but if that's the deal breaker for you, I can almost guarantee they won't fix it, especially not one year after release. But hey, if they do fix it (which they should, if they're serious about PVP), then I know I'm not going to be ***** at them, either.
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#60 Sep 20 2011 at 11:01 PM Rating: Excellent
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3,962 posts
StateAlchemist of Amestris wrote:
Coyohma wrote:
StateAlchemist of Amestris wrote:
Whens the last time you played? My PC definitely doesnt stand up to some of the ones people have around here and I have zero lag when it comes to synthesis and combat. Z-e-r-o. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hIJCQs-R7X4
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/21655-The-single-biggest-issue-holding-back-FFXIV-needs-to-be-specifically-addressed./page28

I think you're being naive if you don't realize the issue here. Whatever you want to call it, the client/server relationship is awful and is crippling the entire experiance.


The entire experience? I am not being naive. I didn't say there weren't issues. I just stated that in regards to combat and synthesis I didn't experience any lag. If you do, well then I'm sorry, and I hope they clear that up for you. As far as running circles around someone...well that's not really high on my priority list so doubt I would have noticed what was shown in the video.


You must have your PC jacked directly into their server farm. What we're talking about is not clinically "Lag" in the sense that we're experiencing a hiccup or slowdown in our connection, but instead, we're experiencing a huge time delay between what is actually happening in the game world (read: server) and on our screen, as well as a delay in which the server has to check every one of our actions before they can be executed, instead of after.

What are the symptoms of these problems?

Well for one, you will often get hit by a move that fires on your screen, after you've moved out of the way of it. There's no way this hasn't happened to you at some point, unless you simply do not dodge skills, ever. For instance, just yesterday I was doing leves, and I would repeatedly get hit by the Zombie's poison breath attack, after my character had clearly been out of range for upwards of 1-2 seconds. (1-2 seconds seems small, but it's not when you consider how long you have to dodge most moves, and that doing so is based on quick reaction time.)

The symptom of the second problem, where the server has to check everything and tell us it's okay to do it, is the massive delay between transferring items, trading items, hitting okay on a confirm screen, queuing an ability, etc. While the delay seems marginal, if you've played any other game that trusts the client a bit more (Every other online game I've played in recent history?) what happens is you get an immediate reaction, and then the server makes sure what you did was okay. If you managed to do something the server deemed incorrect, it goes back and corrects it after the fact. While this may seem a little more jarring to the user than the game simply saying "No you can't do that" as long as the client is doing a preliminary check, the only time this is really going to even be noticed, is if the user is attempting to cheat the game, or if some weird bug happens.
#61 Sep 20 2011 at 11:07 PM Rating: Excellent
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3,530 posts
StateAlchemist of Amestris wrote:
As far as running circles around someone...well that's not really high on my priority list so doubt I would have noticed what was shown in the video.


While, indeed, simply running in circles is not an extremely important requirement, pretending like the issue is limited only to useless tasks is also a bit of a strawman. Clearly, if this game can't manage an acceptable level of interaction among players with one another and between players and the interface, there's a huge problem. It is this issue that the video illustrates - running in circles is simply a concise and convincing way to demonstrate it.
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"... he called to himself a wizard, named Gallery, hoping by this means to escape the paying of the fifteen hundred crowns..." (Machen 15)

"Thus opium is pleasing... on account of the agreeable delirium it produces." (Burke para.6)

"I could only read so much for this paper and the syphilis poem had to go."
#62 Sep 20 2011 at 11:13 PM Rating: Excellent
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3,962 posts
KaneKitty wrote:
StateAlchemist of Amestris wrote:
As far as running circles around someone...well that's not really high on my priority list so doubt I would have noticed what was shown in the video.


While, indeed, simply running in circles is not an extremely important requirement, pretending like the issue is limited only to useless tasks is also a bit of a strawman. Clearly, if this game can't manage an acceptable level of interaction among players with one another and between players and the interface, there's a huge problem. It is this issue that the video illustrates - running in circles is simply a concise and convincing way to demonstrate it.


This is entirely true, if I wanted to provide a more practical example, I would show you a video of me trying to cover someone who is trying to move to me while I am trying to move to them...

You can imagine the result.... I go to where she is, she goes to where I am, much time is wasted. I literally have to make it clear to people that either they or I move.
#63 Sep 20 2011 at 11:19 PM Rating: Good
Ah using cover as an example gives me a better perspective of practical application. I can see the issue there. As far as noticing it when attempting to dodge a skill, I suppose I have never been in that situation, since I main THM(level 30~31) on state, play lancer(level 36) on my mule and play arc(level 30) on my other mule. two of those i am too far away in a group to need to dodge, and lancer, well i could care less about getting hit by anything i have fought so far. I suppose those who play combat classes a lot more then me would have seen it. i just never have...
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Humankind cannot gain anything without first giving something in return. To obtain, something of equal value must be lost.
Data Center: Primal; Server: Ultros; Free Company: The Kraken Club; Grand Company: The Maelstrom; Chocobo: Kweh
#64 Sep 21 2011 at 12:00 AM Rating: Excellent
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94 posts
Before patch 1.18, this was my life while playing the game. Take notice of the stamina gauge throughout and how I'm unable to perform a skill at around ~:20-:28. Hear how I'm just spamming that confirm key for 8 solid seconds trying to get my attack to go? This happened with pretty much every battle.

Now since they've implemented auto-attack I haven't had to deal with that stupid stamina gauge bug, but there's still the issue of the delay with actions being performed.
#65 Sep 21 2011 at 2:29 AM Rating: Good
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4,153 posts
nekroturkey wrote:
Before patch 1.18, this was my life while playing the game. Take notice of the stamina gauge throughout and how I'm unable to perform a skill at around ~:20-:28. Hear how I'm just spamming that confirm key for 8 solid seconds trying to get my attack to go? This happened with pretty much every battle.

The fact that you even tolerated that makes you a better man than I.

The stamina gauge is only supposed to go down enough to... yeah, well I don't even know how to explain that really. Borked.

@Docent42 and StateAlchemist

In case you were curious about the breakdown(at the time of the report):

190k units JP
210k units NA
230k units EU

This adds up to 630k, but for whatever reason the graphic included with their report listed 620k sales total. I never really had a look at the breakdown before so which is correct is anyone's guess...

Edited, Sep 21st 2011 4:54am by FilthMcNasty
____________________________
Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#66 Sep 21 2011 at 8:18 AM Rating: Good
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52 posts
StateAlchemist of Amestris wrote:
Thayos wrote:
Quote:
As far as running circles around someone...well that's not really high on my priority list so doubt I would have noticed what was shown in the video.


I don't know about you State, but after seeing that video, I will be crying myself to sleep tonight knowing that I'm never truly running circles around people.

I used to do that in FFXI, but I just haven't done it in FFXIV yet. Maybe THAT is what is really missing in this game...must run more circles! Oh wait... ><


If they can't even manage to get running circles around someone right, how are they going to make jumping work? I'll be crying myself to sleep tonight just thinking about that.

Guy - "Monkey what are you doing?"
Monkey - "I'm jumping up and down, duh!"
Guy - "Never mind why, but no you're not. You're just sort of twitching, kind of head bobbing."
Monkey - "Dude I assure you I'm jumping up and down! Fear the vert SON!"
Guy - "Bro, you're standing right in front of me. I can see you plain as day. You look like you can't decide if you're agreeing with me or if you want to have a seizure..."
Monkey - "WTF!!! Aw hail nah I'm not even standing in front of you! I've been running laps around you for ten minutes!"

Seriously though, this is the biggest problem with the game. Everything else would be fine if they could just fix this. Someone else pointed out in this thread that they are slowing taking away the cool stuff about the game that made it unique and replacing it with cookie cutter mmo standards. I'm a little concerned about that, but I'll just wait and see how it turns out. Maybe it will be better maybe worse, who knows. But no matter what they add or change, if they can't fix the delay (maybe I shouldn't call it lag anymore) it won't matter because there wont be enough people playing the game to even make it worth trying to fix, to attract more people.

It's all just really too bad. :(
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#67 Sep 21 2011 at 8:19 AM Rating: Good
I love your character name. :)
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Humankind cannot gain anything without first giving something in return. To obtain, something of equal value must be lost.
Data Center: Primal; Server: Ultros; Free Company: The Kraken Club; Grand Company: The Maelstrom; Chocobo: Kweh
#68 Sep 21 2011 at 9:32 AM Rating: Excellent
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557 posts
M0NKEYSNARF wrote:
The UI would just be really bad, if every action was instant like in other MMOs. The problem is that the lag compounds the fact that there are too many other menus and confirmation clicks everytime you do anything. I know it's easy to get used to, if you don't think about it, but if you play anything else it's a huge problem. It's so unneccessary. Most of the stuff we have to click serveral times for, and wait for the UI lag to bring up the menus, should just be hot-keyed and instant. Your example of retainers is a good one.

This. When it comes to UIs, badness stacks. Is a little lag a gamebreaker? No. Is a poorly designed UI a gamebreaker? No. Are questionable design decisions [e.g., for new players, constantly having to go put new abilities on your bar, take others off, and with very little guidance] that require you to interact with that UI more often than you should a gamebreaker? No. Is a UI designed for use with a controller a gamebreaker for a patient keyboard user? No. But when you combine all four, you get an unholy beast of a UI that has kept me from even considering launching the game for months.

I'm in my 30s. I'm starting to realize I'm not going to live forever. Every second I waste negotiating the painful FFXIV UI feels like an eternity I will never get back, and it CHILLS MY VERY SOUL. I have no idea who designed it, but clearly he or she has some very serious sadistic tendencies and should be evaluated for antisocial personality disorder.

Fix the UI, and I will play the living crap out of this game, I promise.
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#69 Sep 21 2011 at 10:45 AM Rating: Excellent
Sage
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575 posts
RamseySylph wrote:
bsphil wrote:
Why do people keep saying the "620k" sales figure?


Because that's how many unit shipped, whether or not that many sold is unknown as far as I am aware.


They MUST have all sold. I mean, seeing as I can't find a copy of the game on any gaming shelves, must mean they were all sold, right? I bet they are just waiting for SE to ship more and they will sell like hot cakes.

Or maybe not.

Edited, Sep 21st 2011 5:10pm by Vawn43
#70 Sep 21 2011 at 12:52 PM Rating: Good
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3,530 posts
yfaithfully wrote:
I'm in my 30s. I'm starting to realize I'm not going to live forever. Every second I waste negotiating the painful FFXIV UI feels like an eternity I will never get back, and it CHILLS MY VERY SOUL.


( o_o)/ (| /comfort |)
____________________________
"... he called to himself a wizard, named Gallery, hoping by this means to escape the paying of the fifteen hundred crowns..." (Machen 15)

"Thus opium is pleasing... on account of the agreeable delirium it produces." (Burke para.6)

"I could only read so much for this paper and the syphilis poem had to go."
#71 Sep 21 2011 at 1:07 PM Rating: Default
27 posts
First time posting here, What I believe, besides trade/trainerer xchange lag, simply tune down your graphics setting and/or fix ur computer settings(which we all should know by now). Everyone and I meant who ever play this game should know FFXIV is graphics intense. If your rig can't handle it...or you simply complaining about a little lag due to "YOUR" computer's specs...well whose to blame? If you still can't accept that the game has intense graphics, that your computer might not go well with it due to your current computer's configuration, or (the most retarded part of all) unwilling to tune down your in games graphics because you think your rig is all that, except the truth is that it could be a piece of crap.

The point I'm trying to make is, if your computer can run some games well( less lag), it doesn't really mean it will run on others(which we all should by now as well). Do one thing(or maybe a few things) Compare the graphics of this game to others, if you tell me that there is no difference
Then you are just plain lying to yourself. Please tell me if I'm wrong at everything I wrote here because sometimes I don't have a clue to what I'm saying -_-...

last thing..."NO LAG JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE IN ONLINE GAMING"
#72 Sep 21 2011 at 1:37 PM Rating: Good
It doesn't matter if you turn the graphics all the way down to bare minimum, there is still lag when interacting with any storage/shop.
____________________________
Humankind cannot gain anything without first giving something in return. To obtain, something of equal value must be lost.
Data Center: Primal; Server: Ultros; Free Company: The Kraken Club; Grand Company: The Maelstrom; Chocobo: Kweh
#73 Sep 21 2011 at 1:38 PM Rating: Good
Avatar
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852 posts
aznsky wrote:
First time posting here, What I believe, besides trade/trainerer xchange lag, simply tune down your graphics setting and/or fix ur computer settings(which we all should know by now). Everyone and I meant who ever play this game should know FFXIV is graphics intense. If your rig can't handle it...or you simply complaining about a little lag due to "YOUR" computer's specs...well whose to blame? If you still can't accept that the game has intense graphics, that your computer might not go well with it due to your current computer's configuration, or (the most retarded part of all) unwilling to tune down your in games graphics because you think your rig is all that, except the truth is that it could be a piece of crap.

The point I'm trying to make is, if your computer can run some games well( less lag), it doesn't really mean it will run on others(which we all should by now as well). Do one thing(or maybe a few things) Compare the graphics of this game to others, if you tell me that there is no difference
Then you are just plain lying to yourself. Please tell me if I'm wrong at everything I wrote here because sometimes I don't have a clue to what I'm saying -_-...

last thing..."NO LAG JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE IN ONLINE GAMING"


Quoted for myopic stupidity. If you think there's nothing in the client/server relationship of the core engine of this game, then you're a moron. Flame on.
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#74 Sep 21 2011 at 2:20 PM Rating: Good
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3,962 posts
aznsky wrote:
First time posting here, What I believe, besides trade/trainerer xchange lag, simply tune down your graphics setting and/or fix ur computer settings(which we all should know by now). Everyone and I meant who ever play this game should know FFXIV is graphics intense. If your rig can't handle it...or you simply complaining about a little lag due to "YOUR" computer's specs...well whose to blame? If you still can't accept that the game has intense graphics, that your computer might not go well with it due to your current computer's configuration, or (the most retarded part of all) unwilling to tune down your in games graphics because you think your rig is all that, except the truth is that it could be a piece of crap.

The point I'm trying to make is, if your computer can run some games well( less lag), it doesn't really mean it will run on others(which we all should by now as well). Do one thing(or maybe a few things) Compare the graphics of this game to others, if you tell me that there is no difference
Then you are just plain lying to yourself. Please tell me if I'm wrong at everything I wrote here because sometimes I don't have a clue to what I'm saying -_-...

last thing..."NO LAG JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE IN ONLINE GAMING"


Is this sarcasm? Lag -only- makes sense in an online game, seeing as slowdown in an offline game is... well... exactly that... slowdown.

Anyway. None of us are talking about slowdown, which is when the client is running slow due to your machine being unable to keep up. We're explicitly talking about the client/server relationship. Doesn't matter if your PC cost 15,000$ or 500$, you're going to experience the same types of delays, because it has absolutely zero to do with your machine.
#75 Sep 21 2011 at 2:35 PM Rating: Excellent
Sage
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551 posts
aznsky wrote:
First time posting here, What I believe, besides trade/trainerer xchange lag, simply tune down your graphics setting and/or fix ur computer settings(which we all should know by now). Everyone and I meant who ever play this game should know FFXIV is graphics intense. If your rig can't handle it...or you simply complaining about a little lag due to "YOUR" computer's specs...well whose to blame? If you still can't accept that the game has intense graphics, that your computer might not go well with it due to your current computer's configuration, or (the most retarded part of all) unwilling to tune down your in games graphics because you think your rig is all that, except the truth is that it could be a piece of crap.

The point I'm trying to make is, if your computer can run some games well( less lag), it doesn't really mean it will run on others(which we all should by now as well). Do one thing(or maybe a few things) Compare the graphics of this game to others, if you tell me that there is no difference
Then you are just plain lying to yourself. Please tell me if I'm wrong at everything I wrote here because sometimes I don't have a clue to what I'm saying -_-...

last thing..."NO LAG JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE IN ONLINE GAMING"



You are wrong in everything you said because you do not have a clue what you are talking about.

Edited, Sep 21st 2011 4:35pm by Zorvan
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#76 Sep 21 2011 at 3:44 PM Rating: Default
27 posts
Sorry for not being perfect on my explanation due to my lack of English intelligence.

No one understand "NO LAG JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE IN ONLINE GAMING"?

I have to wait til I get home before I can explain my LAME post..
#77 Sep 21 2011 at 3:47 PM Rating: Good
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852 posts
aznsky wrote:
Sorry for not being perfect on my explanation due to my lack of English intelligence.

No one understand "NO LAG JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE IN ONLINE GAMING"?

I have to wait til I get home before I can explain my LAME post..


Oh, I understood you perfectly:

"'No lag' just doesn't make sense in online gaming." -- You're just wrong.
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#78 Sep 21 2011 at 3:50 PM Rating: Good
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4,153 posts
He's trying to say that it's not a lag issue or a UI issue, but a performance issue. Everyone go turn your settings down to the absolute minimum and everything works like it should... until someone pinches you.
____________________________
Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#79 Sep 21 2011 at 6:12 PM Rating: Decent
27 posts
StateAlchemist of Amestris wrote:
It doesn't matter if you turn the graphics all the way down to bare minimum, there is still lag when interacting with any storage/shop.


I mentioned that and that's probably the only "lag" I have.
hexaemeron wrote:
aznsky wrote:
First time posting here, What I believe, besides trade/trainerer xchange lag, simply tune down your graphics setting and/or fix ur computer settings(which we all should know by now). Everyone and I meant who ever play this game should know FFXIV is graphics intense. If your rig can't handle it...or you simply complaining about a little lag due to "YOUR" computer's specs...well whose to blame? If you still can't accept that the game has intense graphics, that your computer might not go well with it due to your current computer's configuration, or (the most retarded part of all) unwilling to tune down your in games graphics because you think your rig is all that, except the truth is that it could be a piece of crap.

The point I'm trying to make is, if your computer can run some games well( less lag), it doesn't really mean it will run on others(which we all should by now as well). Do one thing(or maybe a few things) Compare the graphics of this game to others, if you tell me that there is no difference
Then you are just plain lying to yourself. Please tell me if I'm wrong at everything I wrote here because sometimes I don't have a clue to what I'm saying -_-...

last thing..."NO LAG JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE IN ONLINE GAMING"


Quoted for myopic stupidity. If you think there's nothing in the client/server relationship of the core engine of this game, then you're a moron. Flame on.


Maybe that's just your opinion? I don't think I mentioned about "client/server" issues in my post. But, you can tell if the problem lies within data transfer or your machine. How do I konw?.. well I just do...and there is no way I can prove it.. ^^..maybe do some testing yourself?

Zorvan wrote:
aznsky wrote:
First time posting here, What I believe, besides trade/trainerer xchange lag, simply tune down your graphics setting and/or fix ur computer settings(which we all should know by now). Everyone and I meant who ever play this game should know FFXIV is graphics intense. If your rig can't handle it...or you simply complaining about a little lag due to "YOUR" computer's specs...well whose to blame? If you still can't accept that the game has intense graphics, that your computer might not go well with it due to your current computer's configuration, or (the most retarded part of all) unwilling to tune down your in games graphics because you think your rig is all that, except the truth is that it could be a piece of crap.

The point I'm trying to make is, if your computer can run some games well( less lag), it doesn't really mean it will run on others(which we all should by now as well). Do one thing(or maybe a few things) Compare the graphics of this game to others, if you tell me that there is no difference
Then you are just plain lying to yourself. Please tell me if I'm wrong at everything I wrote here because sometimes I don't have a clue to what I'm saying -_-...

last thing..."NO LAG JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE IN ONLINE GAMING"



You are wrong in everything you said because you do not have a clue what you are talking about.

Maybe you are right..? Or is it just my bad english...?

Edited, Sep 21st 2011 4:35pm by Zorvan


hexaemeron wrote:
aznsky wrote:
Sorry for not being perfect on my explanation due to my lack of English intelligence.

No one understand "NO LAG JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE IN ONLINE GAMING"?

I have to wait til I get home before I can explain my LAME post..


Oh, I understood you perfectly:

"'No lag' just doesn't make sense in online gaming." -- You're just wrong.



Well, I don't think you really understood what I wrote or maybe it's my english AGAIN...
a better translation...

"It doesn't make sense if online gaming doesn't have lag", is that better?

Also, let me put my previous post in another version...


"Lag" issues can be caused from a lot of factors..What are they?..I don't know since I'm not a "PRO" at computers and networks. But, I do know one. Your computer's configuration is one of them and, "I am sure of that" I know it's hard to prove anything here in words. I just wish that someone can come over to my place and see what I'm trying to say(I mean it if you live in NYC). I built my own computer, and I can tell you for sure that it's not perfect. But, I try different things to make the hardwares go with the programs installed. If I'm still getting people confused over anything I write here, maybe I'll just stop reading or replying to anything at all.

Lag happens, but not all the time. If you are lagging full time and others are doing fine, then the issues is not on the servers.
I know what FilthMcNasty is referring to and I'll take it as you intended to...except turning the settings down "actually works". It totally depends on what you refer to the term "lag".

I hope this can clarify any of my mistakes to my previous post and I apologize for that misunderstanding and "hate"? to some people...
#80 Sep 21 2011 at 6:17 PM Rating: Good
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aznsky wrote:

I know what FilthMcNasty is referring to and I'll take it as you intended to...except turning the settings down "actually works". It totally depends on what you refer to the term "lag".

I hope this can clarify any of my mistakes to my previous post and I apologize for that misunderstanding and "hate"? to some people...


I responded to your post without jumping to any assumptions that you were trying to troll (or that you were a complete idiot.) For the record, Filthy was being sarcastic in his statement about lag, I'm fairly positive.

My point wasn't that I'm a nice guy or anything, to be clear, I just think you should take a look at my post again and try to understand that we're talking about how much of the game is handled by the server, and thus the delay that is created for the end user.

It has nothing to do with network or PC speed or performance.
#81 Sep 21 2011 at 6:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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RamseySylph wrote:
you're going to experience the same types of delays, because it has absolutely zero to do with your machine.


Well not if you had a time machine. /thread

Or a portal gun; one of those would work, too, I guess, as long as you made a blue portal near the server and an orange portal right at your modem. Or maybe you could just merge the computer with the server! R-right? Years of video games have left me unable to distinguish between current and fantasy-future technology. >_>
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#82 Sep 21 2011 at 6:41 PM Rating: Excellent
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There is really only one 'lag' and that is related to internet connection. The UI being unresponsive is not related. It is a server issue and is not dependent on what your settings are.

FYI- The UI responsiveness(read: lack of) is most of the reason SE has completely overhauled the battle system.

The first system relied on several bars. One for cooldown that wasn't in sync with the second(actually 3 bars) which was to determine the 'effect' of whatever action you had selected. The second bar(s) used to fill from empty to full and reset back to zero. It was nearly impossible to stop the bar at full effect unless you tried to stop it early because the UI is so unresponsive.

Often what would happen is that you'd barely miss the full effect and catch it just after it had reset to zero. You can imagine the frustration. They tried adjusting it so that the bars would fill and then deplete instead of resetting, but it was still nearly impossible to land a full effect ability.

These are UI issues and are not related at all to your performance. For the sake of the argument I run a hex core processor overclocked to 4.2GHz, 8 GB of RAM and dual GTX 480 GPUs which I only use one of because SLI is guess what... NOT OPTIMIZED!

Edited, Sep 21st 2011 8:42pm by FilthMcNasty
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#83 Sep 21 2011 at 6:50 PM Rating: Good
Quote:
"It doesn't make sense if online gaming doesn't have lag", is that better?


Not really. Any time you use a double-negative, confusion can arise.

Try saying:
"It makes sense if online gaming has lag."

See how easy that is to understand? It's like an equation:
(It doesn't make sense) = (online gaming doesn't have lag)

We can then simplify this by removing equal variables from both sides:
(It doesn't make sense) = (online gaming doesn't have lag)

Rewritten we get this:
(It makes sense) = (online gaming has lag)

And thus the resulting sentence:
"It makes sense if online gaming has lag."

EDIT: For that matter, grammatically speaking, it would sound better written this way: "It makes sense for online gaming to have lag."
EDIT #2: Or even this way: "It doesn't make sense for online gaming to be lag-free."

Edited, Sep 21st 2011 8:59pm by StateAlchemist

Edited, Sep 21st 2011 9:02pm by StateAlchemist
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#84 Sep 21 2011 at 9:15 PM Rating: Excellent
To +1 State,

One of my personal rules when writing is to try to avoid the word "it." Using that word is kind of lazy (although I do the same thing on occasion), but you can almost always rewrite a sentence to get rid of, uh, "it."

Lag is expected in online gaming.

Lag is inherent to online gaming.

Etc.
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#85 Sep 22 2011 at 7:30 AM Rating: Excellent
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StateAlchemist of Amestris wrote:
Quote:
"It doesn't make sense if online gaming doesn't have lag", is that better?


Not really. Any time you use a double-negative, confusion can arise.

Try saying:
"It makes sense if online gaming has lag."

See how easy that is to understand? It's like an equation:
(It doesn't make sense) = (online gaming doesn't have lag)

We can then simplify this by removing equal variables from both sides:
(It doesn't make sense) = (online gaming doesn't have lag)

Rewritten we get this:
(It makes sense) = (online gaming has lag)

And thus the resulting sentence:
"It makes sense if online gaming has lag."

EDIT: For that matter, grammatically speaking, it would sound better written this way: "It makes sense for online gaming to have lag."
EDIT #2: Or even this way: "It doesn't make sense for online gaming to be lag-free."

Edited, Sep 21st 2011 8:59pm by StateAlchemist

Edited, Sep 21st 2011 9:02pm by StateAlchemist

LOL Awesome!! This is the best post on the internet!

Flith just reminded me of something. Remember how tough botany was right after launch? You'd have to try and guess where the actual moving thing would stop once you hit enter. It never stopped right away. Sometimes it would move an additional 1/8 of the arc before it stopped and sometimes it would move another quarter arc, depending on how many people were online at the time. I use to fail all the time. When I came back to the game in July, most of the time the little thing stops right away. So it’s good that SE at least fixed that, although the solution is a bit ironic, “make as poor a game as possible so nobody will play it, the servers will be empty and fewer people will have to compete for system resources.”
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#86 Sep 22 2011 at 1:11 PM Rating: Decent
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I totally agree that when the game just started, it's somehow difficult for players to interact with things. But now, I just don't see where all the lag is coming from. I certainly don't have these lag some players are talking about, except for the trade/trainer/sorting part. UI seems fine for me, good response, I press a button and the "thing" pops out, no lag no thing.
Like I said, if someone is living in NYC, you can come to my place and try it out on my machine yourself. There is no need for me to lie about this and I am not trolling. I just want to give my opinion based on what I've gone through with my machine.

And I read this article...

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lag_(online_gaming)
#87 Sep 22 2011 at 1:42 PM Rating: Good
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aznsky wrote:
I totally agree that when the game just started, it's somehow difficult for players to interact with things. But now, I just don't see where all the lag is coming from. I certainly don't have these lag some players are talking about, except for the trade/trainer/sorting part. UI seems fine for me, good response, I press a button and the "thing" pops out, no lag no thing.
Like I said, if someone is living in NYC, you can come to my place and try it out on my machine yourself. There is no need for me to lie about this and I am not trolling. I just want to give my opinion based on what I've gone through with my machine.

And I read this article...

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lag_(online_gaming)



What is your first spoken language? Maybe someone could attempt to explain what we are talking about better to you.

We're not talking about lag, we're talking about how much of the game is handled by the server, vs. how much is handled by the client.
#88 Sep 23 2011 at 9:54 AM Rating: Excellent
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I think the UI lag is the biggest issue for me. When I refer to UI lag, I mean the fact that when I move the mouse the cursor on screen has a slight delay before it moves as well. If they could make the interface just a tad more snappy I think the game would be much more enjoyable. I recently rebuilt my gaming computer and with the new parts this game looks amazing, I really want to love it more than I do, and I think a UI refresh would go a long way towards doing that.
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#89 Sep 23 2011 at 11:33 AM Rating: Excellent
Wint wrote:
I think the UI lag is the biggest issue for me. When I refer to UI lag, I mean the fact that when I move the mouse the cursor on screen has a slight delay before it moves as well. If they could make the interface just a tad more snappy I think the game would be much more enjoyable. I recently rebuilt my gaming computer and with the new parts this game looks amazing, I really want to love it more than I do, and I think a UI refresh would go a long way towards doing that.

Do you have "Hardware Mouse Cursor" enabled? Because if you don't, enable it. Problem solved.
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#90Axel, Posted: Sep 23 2011 at 11:48 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) What kind of insulting, lowblow, irrelevant question is that anyway? Maybe someone needs to explain to you that it's not illegal to have your own opinion.
#91 Sep 23 2011 at 12:10 PM Rating: Good
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RamseySylph wrote:
What is your first spoken language? Maybe someone could attempt to explain what we are talking about better to you.


Axel wrote:
What kind of insulting, lowblow, irrelevant question is that anyway? Maybe someone needs to explain to you that it's not illegal to have your own opinion.


aznsky wrote:
Well, I don't think you really understood what I wrote or maybe it's my english AGAIN...


As you can see (and clearly didn't read before), aznsky admitted himself that he might have issues explaining himself in English. One could infer he's asian from his nickname, but wether if it's true or not, we don't know his first language.

The reason to ask about someone's first spoken language is because some of us aren't english first speakers, and could try to change the language of the discussion to lower the language barrier. For example, I speak French, and I know Ramsey knows more than English.

I understand why you think asking about this is insulting, lowblow or irrelevant, but I believe you should figure out the context before you explode in a bomb of internet rage

Edited, Sep 23rd 2011 2:11pm by Docent42
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#92 Sep 23 2011 at 8:50 PM Rating: Good
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How about some Formal Logic, b*tches!?

L ⊃ S ≡ O

Done. Aww yeah; was it as good for you as it was for me?

L = Lag
S = makes Sense
O = Online game
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"... he called to himself a wizard, named Gallery, hoping by this means to escape the paying of the fifteen hundred crowns..." (Machen 15)

"Thus opium is pleasing... on account of the agreeable delirium it produces." (Burke para.6)

"I could only read so much for this paper and the syphilis poem had to go."
#93 Sep 23 2011 at 10:36 PM Rating: Decent
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I say there's only one way to solve this language nonsense! 我们都说中文!
#94 Sep 26 2011 at 9:20 AM Rating: Decent
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This is a dangerous attitude toward lag. Doesn't anyone remember the old adage?

"First they put lag in my MMO, but I didn't say anything because the lag made sense.

Then they put anima in my MMO, but I didn't say anything because the anima made sense.

Then they put retainers in my MMO, but I didn't say anything because the retainers made sense.

Then they put fatigue in my MMO, but it was too late to say anything because no one was within shouting distance."
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