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#1 Dec 07 2011 at 11:01 PM Rating: Good
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So, here's a thread that I hope Square sees.

I love you guys. I remember way back playing FF7 and thinking ****, what an awesome game.

Actually, my best friend handed me this game once I bought a PS1 and said play this. I did...for about an hour when I drove back to his house with it telling him that it was boring. He said try giving it a little more time so I did. Have to say, I played from 7 the next morning until 3 the morning after that. Not sure exactly what happened that day but I fell in love with a video game. After that I had to buy and play them all as well as preorder FF8 which I loved too unlike a large portion of the FF community. I pretty much loved all of them until FF13 which I haven't finished yet and am going to be forced to because of FF13-2 and my promise to play every FF regardless.

Anyway, FF12 was my favorite. Mainly because of the guy who made Vagrant Story and the way you could set up parties for big fights. And how it was based off of FFTactics...and judges...and gambits....and Penelo.

What I'm getting at is Square changed my life and I am going to put my full faith behind them because I really love them. I want this game to succeed and I'll throw every idea I have at them because I know someone is reading them and they all want this game to be to our liking.

Support is extremely helpful.

Goodnight. I'm drunk.
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#2 Dec 08 2011 at 12:31 AM Rating: Good
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I'm actually with you on 8 and 12, I'm one of the few who liked those games as well.
#3 Dec 08 2011 at 2:40 AM Rating: Excellent
Oh man, I absolutely hated Final Fantasy 12.

That said, I was a huge fan of FFIX, which is one a lot of people don't like.
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#4 Dec 08 2011 at 2:51 AM Rating: Good
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I agree with you guys. My top 4 favorite FF games are 7, tactics, 8, and 9. From 10 and on, I just didn't feel like they were worth playing through multiple times. Those 4 games I've played through atleast 4 or 5 times each.
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#5 Dec 08 2011 at 3:00 AM Rating: Default
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I loved all of the Final Fantasy games except for 8, 10, and 13. Too story oriented and not enough gameplay.

14 will probably get good in time. I just don't know (still don't know) what the original team was thinking and how they managed to get that out to the market thinking we'd like that.
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#6 Dec 08 2011 at 3:15 AM Rating: Excellent
UltKnightGrover wrote:
I loved all of the Final Fantasy games except for 8, 10, and 13. Too story oriented and not enough gameplay.

14 will probably get good in time. I just don't know (still don't know) what the original team was thinking and how they managed to get that out to the market thinking we'd like that.

They used to know what they were doing, but then they took an arrow to the knee.
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#7 Dec 08 2011 at 8:45 AM Rating: Excellent
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StateAlchemist of Amestris wrote:
UltKnightGrover wrote:
I loved all of the Final Fantasy games except for 8, 10, and 13. Too story oriented and not enough gameplay.

14 will probably get good in time. I just don't know (still don't know) what the original team was thinking and how they managed to get that out to the market thinking we'd like that.

They used to know what they were doing, but then they took an arrow to the knee.


I do believe that "arrow" is called Enix. In pretty much every discussion about when the games started their downward spiral, it's pretty much agreed upon in every single one that the games have declined ever since square merged with enix.
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#8 Dec 08 2011 at 8:50 AM Rating: Default
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1, 2, 3, 5, 7, 9, 10, 11, 12, 14 are the greats from FF. I couldn't handle 8, or x-2, or 13. x-2 was playable, but i lost interest, 8 made me want to walk into an airplane propeller, and 13 I didn't care for the gameplay style. I wish they'd bring back 7 style combat. I clocked by far the most hours in that game, minus ffxi and ffxiv of course. FFXI i had over 300 days on 2 characters...
#9 Dec 08 2011 at 9:42 AM Rating: Decent
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I know opinions are like ********, but putting 14-10-1 with the greats of FF ******* is just stupid :/

Anyways as for Square, yeah they used to make good games, they also had the greats make said games, but like everything else that we have come to love about Square, they have this tendency to just focus on their main ******* Final Fantasy! That's been their downfall, if you take every IP that square has under their belt, and you have the top 5 slots open for hall of fame games, they will all be square ******* and not every single one a Final Fantasy ******* they have Chrono trigger/cross, Xenogears, Secret of mana, Vagrant Story, Final Fantasy Tactics, Romancing Saga, Treasure of the Rudras, Front Mission, Brave Fencer Musashi.

All of those IP's are Classics, hall of fame quality games, now the question is what have they done with them ? Nothing, and when they do something with them, they give them the xenogear treatment, "Well sure make a game, but we are really pushing for this FF ******* so if we need resources we cutting you ;)" Honestly who here thinks that if they give the Final Fantasy treatment to any of those IP'S, it would not be a Instant Classic, Final Fantasy Tactics 2, Xenogears 2, Secret of mana 4, Front mission 6, Chrono trigger 3 etc etc ?

Also just for kicks, FFVII was not that great :/
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#10 Dec 08 2011 at 10:37 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Goodnight. I'm drunk


LOL. I laughed. Also, decently written for being drunk I must say.
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#11 Dec 08 2011 at 11:00 AM Rating: Excellent
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I don't think the downfall came with them merging with Enix. Sometime between VII and VIII, different development teams started forming to handle the different Final Fantasy games.

Yoshinori Kitase started directing his own vision of what Final Fantasy should be, and Hiroyuki Ito started directing his vision of what Final Fantasy should be.

Kitase likes having a rich story and has this belief that letting the character explore too much take away from the immediacy feel of the story. You can see this in FFVI, FFVIII, FFX, FFXIII, the games he produced or directed.

Ito likes creating a good gameplay experience and wants a RPG to be entertaining and fun for the player, even if it has an expense in story. You can see this in FFIII, FFV, FFVI, FFIX, and FFXII. It's been disclosed that he's working on directing a new un-released big project for Square-Enix. But they're probably holding it off on purpose to get the games they have out now up to snuff.

Note that both of these people co-directed FFVI. It was a nice mix of good storytelling and good gameplay systems. What Square-Enix needs is not for different creative people to work apart, but these people to work together to create something fun and entertaining and create a good story. Just like the old days.

Anyway, if you guys are interested in game development philosophy, you can check it out here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoshinori_Kitase#Game_design_philosophy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiroyuki_Ito#Game_design_philosophy

It explains why a lot of the newer Final Fantasy games are the way they are.
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#12 Dec 08 2011 at 11:23 AM Rating: Good
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OP, I feel the same way. Final Fantasy Adventure is my favorite, because it was my first <3 (and I'm not drunk)
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#13 Dec 08 2011 at 12:37 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
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nakuMARMADUKE wrote:
I pretty much loved all of them until FF13 which I haven't finished yet and am going to be forced to because of FF13-2 and my promise to play every FF regardless.

Anyway, FF12 was my favorite.
FFXII is my favorite FF in the core series (not counting tactics games, dissidias, etc). FFXIII is close behind. This helped convince me that Nobuo's era was over, by the way. FFXIV's music has been disappointing at best. I can't recall one memorable track, and I've had 72 of them ripped from the game files since the Alpha. I'm sure there have been songs added since that I haven't heard.

Overall I think people tend to hate the more recent FF games because it doesn't fit into their idea of what a FF game should be. I still think people would've enjoyed 12 and 13 more if they weren't part of the franchise.

Edited, Dec 8th 2011 12:46pm by bsphil
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#14 Dec 08 2011 at 2:42 PM Rating: Excellent
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I never thought I would learn so much about FF from drinking and posting.

I'm enjoying reading these posts a lot!
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#15 Dec 08 2011 at 3:54 PM Rating: Default
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bsphil wrote:
nakuMARMADUKE wrote:
I pretty much loved all of them until FF13 which I haven't finished yet and am going to be forced to because of FF13-2 and my promise to play every FF regardless.

Anyway, FF12 was my favorite.
FFXII is my favorite FF in the core series (not counting tactics games, dissidias, etc). FFXIII is close behind. This helped convince me that Nobuo's era was over, by the way. FFXIV's music has been disappointing at best. I can't recall one memorable track, and I've had 72 of them ripped from the game files since the Alpha. I'm sure there have been songs added since that I haven't heard.

Overall I think people tend to hate the more recent FF games because it doesn't fit into their idea of what a FF game should be. I still think people would've enjoyed 12 and 13 more if they weren't part of the franchise.

Edited, Dec 8th 2011 12:46pm by bsphil


FFXII is the best FF ****** of the entire franchise, closely followed by VI-VII.

It has a perfect score on Famitsu, the only main ****** of FF to ever get a perfect score.

P.D: SE!! Please hire mitsuno back, beg him if you must, the guy delivered you 2 perfect score games, why would you even let him leave ?
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#16 Dec 08 2011 at 6:55 PM Rating: Good
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Ostia wrote:

FFXII is the best FF ****** of the entire franchise, closely followed by VI-VII.

It has a perfect score on Famitsu, the only main ****** of FF to ever get a perfect score.

P.D: SE!! Please hire mitsuno back, beg him if you must, the guy delivered you 2 perfect score games, why would you even let him leave ?



Matsuno got sick and left from the development of XII (and Square Enix) because of that. He works for another company now.
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#17 Dec 08 2011 at 7:38 PM Rating: Excellent
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Ostia wrote:
FFXII is the best FF ****** of the entire franchise, closely followed by VI-VII.

It has a perfect score on Famitsu, the only main ****** of FF to ever get a perfect score.


So, on par with Nintendogs, and one point better than Ridge Racer Revolution; I'll keep that in mind, Famitsu.
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#18 Dec 08 2011 at 8:48 PM Rating: Excellent
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I should probably note that I'm a content kind of person. Story is great and all and you get to know the characters but what I really desire is what you get to do in the game. I love XII so much because it reminded me of XI. You choose a char to direct and the others act on their own.

I don't involve XI in my "favorite" (even though I played to 7 years) list because it was a game that kept going. Usually when I finish a console game I play it one more time to explore deeper more refined content. Basically getting all the abilities and weapons and max levels and so on. That's it.
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#19 Dec 09 2011 at 2:30 AM Rating: Excellent
You guys can't be serious that FFXII is one of the best games in the series. I mean, really? Vaan is the most useless protagonist in any of the FF games. What does he do? What is his point? Also, the storyline of this game was shallow and needlessly complex... kind of reminded me of how "The Phantom Menace" starts out.

I guess I just don't see why anyone liked this game so much? I was overjoyed when the game was finally over, because I knew I wouldn't have to play it ever again.
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#20 Dec 09 2011 at 6:58 AM Rating: Excellent
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Thayos wrote:
You guys can't be serious that FFXII is one of the best games in the series. I mean, really? Vaan is the most useless protagonist in any of the FF games. What does he do? What is his point? Also, the storyline of this game was shallow and needlessly complex... kind of reminded me of how "The Phantom Menace" starts out.

I guess I just don't see why anyone liked this game so much? I was overjoyed when the game was finally over, because I knew I wouldn't have to play it ever again.

Are you sure you haven't confused XII and XIII? You may have confused "Vaan" and "almost the entire cast of XIII" though Vaan was pretty crappy. I played XIII before XII so I'm afraid every time I saw Vaan he looked just like Hope which meant I hated strongly disliked him right from the start.

Edited, Dec 9th 2011 7:59am by MrTalos
#21 Dec 09 2011 at 7:55 AM Rating: Default
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Both XII and XIII sucked IMO. I don't see how anyone liked those two games.
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#22 Dec 09 2011 at 8:56 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'd have to agree that the merge with Enix (Sakaguchi stepping down) was the beginning of the end. IX is my all time favorite and the last one he was involved in, and I'm in the same boat with Thayos. I don't understand why so many didn't care for it. It was a great story that actually had a lot of sadness and depth, and for the first time I wasn't completely annoyed by the lead male (i.e., he wasn't an emo crybaby with a chip on his shoulder).

All the games since seemed forced, and they sacrifice story for pretty graphics. They lost something along the way.

I want Final Fantasy back.
#23 Dec 09 2011 at 9:00 AM Rating: Decent
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Thayos wrote:
You guys can't be serious that FFXII is one of the best games in the series. I mean, really? Vaan is the most useless protagonist in any of the FF games. What does he do? What is his point? Also, the storyline of this game was shallow and needlessly complex... kind of reminded me of how "The Phantom Menace" starts out.

I guess I just don't see why anyone liked this game so much? I was overjoyed when the game was finally over, because I knew I wouldn't have to play it ever again.


Well i would agree that i dint enjoy vaan as the protagonist either, but he was not originally meant to be in the game, basch was gonna be the protagonist, but you know SE, they wanted a young male leading man to attract the younger crowd :/ Either way when you ask what did he do ? you mean in CG concept or what ? Because he was just a thief when the game started and by the end of it, he whopped 3 judges, 13 Espers, 32 NM, 18 HNM, a lot of imperial soldiers, whopped a Cid, whopped vayne, whopped vayne combined with a god etc etc.

I mean sure he dint kill a mama's boy demi god, or some random last boss ala IX, either way, story wise he was very lackluster, but again he was not meant to be the protagonist in the first place, matsuno wanted basch to be the protagonist, and the only part i really hated about the game, was how the story seemed incomplete, you have this gods, manipulating the world of ivalice, yet at the end of the game, it feels like "Really this is it?" IMO i think matsunu meant for the game to be longer, more story driven and darker like all his games, but he left the production early, and from his previous games, all classics(FFT,OGBT,VS) it kinda feels unfinished :/
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#24 Dec 09 2011 at 9:03 AM Rating: Good
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Torrence wrote:
I'd have to agree that the merge with Enix (Sakaguchi stepping down) was the beginning of the end. IX is my all time favorite and the last one he was involved in, and I'm in the same boat with Thayos. I don't understand why so many didn't care for it. It was a great story that actually had a lot of sadness and depth, and for the first time I wasn't completely annoyed by the lead male (i.e., he wasn't an emo crybaby with a chip on his shoulder).

All the games since seemed forced, and they sacrifice story for pretty graphics. They lost something along the way.

I want Final Fantasy back.


You know i loved FFIX, the firs cd of the game, to me is the best early game FF gameplay i seen, i dont mind just playing that first part of the game, running around maxing AP, stealing from bosses to have strong items ahead of time etc etc, the ending however was just stupid in my opinion, and i dont mean the ending, just the end boss, it was like "Hi i'm the last boss, first time you seen or heard from me, but w/e lets fight".
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#25 Dec 09 2011 at 9:50 AM Rating: Excellent
Edited by bsphil
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Thayos wrote:
needlessly complex
Time compression.
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His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
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#26 Dec 10 2011 at 10:53 AM Rating: Excellent
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Thayos wrote:
You guys can't be serious that FFXII is one of the best games in the series. I mean, really? Vaan is the most useless protagonist in any of the FF games. What does he do? What is his point? Also, the storyline of this game was shallow and needlessly complex... kind of reminded me of how "The Phantom Menace" starts out.

I guess I just don't see why anyone liked this game so much? I was overjoyed when the game was finally over, because I knew I wouldn't have to play it ever again.


Vaan wasn't really the protagonist, but hes was set to be the players POV character I guess. I read something about it a while back how they actually wanted the story to focus on Basch but someone in SE or test marketing or whatnot said players wanted another androgynous teenage boy to be the "main guy". I think thats partially why Vaan fits so horribly in the game, it was kinda forced.

But anyways, I didn't much care for 12 either. I thought the story was kinda meh, it was a bit shallow and very forgettable. My huge issue was the gameplay. Just wasn't for me. It was too hard to setup optimal gambits (IE stealing from something only once), and it was a pain to manually use some abilities. Magic system was terrible, and by the end of the game, it felt too easy to just use quickenings on bosses. pretty ok game, but i felt i was fighting the game itself more than I was playing it.
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#27 Dec 10 2011 at 10:56 AM Rating: Good
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Ostia wrote:
Torrence wrote:
I'd have to agree that the merge with Enix (Sakaguchi stepping down) was the beginning of the end. IX is my all time favorite and the last one he was involved in, and I'm in the same boat with Thayos. I don't understand why so many didn't care for it. It was a great story that actually had a lot of sadness and depth, and for the first time I wasn't completely annoyed by the lead male (i.e., he wasn't an emo crybaby with a chip on his shoulder).

All the games since seemed forced, and they sacrifice story for pretty graphics. They lost something along the way.

I want Final Fantasy back.


You know i loved FFIX, the firs cd of the game, to me is the best early game FF gameplay i seen, i dont mind just playing that first part of the game, running around maxing AP, stealing from bosses to have strong items ahead of time etc etc, the ending however was just stupid in my opinion, and i dont mean the ending, just the end boss, it was like "Hi i'm the last boss, first time you seen or heard from me, but w/e lets fight".


I have to agree with this too, FF9 was my favorite for the longest time. Felt like they'd taken the best of every game up to that point and put it all together. Kuja sat between somewhere between kefka and Sephiroth in terms of having actual motives and just being evil for the sake of it, but it worked pretty well. Then yeah, that whole ending with a new evil boss just cause happened, I just try and forget that part.
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#28 Dec 10 2011 at 9:28 PM Rating: Default
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SE did a lot for the gaming industry. I'm hoping FFXIV does the same for the MMO world, cause this dark age of WoW clones really isn't working out for anyone. I think FF's job switching idea really fits in with MMO's and the materia system while poorly executed tries to advance the game. I still think yoshi-P is struggling to pick out what ideas are good and what ideas are bad but i think the time frame he set up to 2.0 is enough for him to sort it out.

While i prefer some FF's over others i can't say i really HATED any of them. The final fantasy franchise was built on a hail Mary idea after all, they've gotten the luck of the draw once maybe they'll get it again...

I feel you though TC, i know what your going through. *bro hug*
#29 Dec 10 2011 at 11:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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KenJammin wrote:
SE did a lot for the gaming industry. I'm hoping FFXIV does the same for the MMO world, cause this dark age of WoW clones really isn't working out for anyone.


Yeah... no WoW-clonin' going on here... T_T
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#30 Dec 11 2011 at 12:01 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
SE did a lot for the gaming industry. I'm hoping FFXIV does the same for the MMO world, cause this dark age of WoW clones really isn't working out for anyone.


This quote shocks me for a couple reasons. These days we're seeing more and more MMOs move away from the EQ and WOW styles, and they tend to do terrible. People don't like em, or they're based on awful ideas that don't mesh well with the MMO styles. The other thing that surprises me, is that most of the features that keep showing up in games that "came from wow" (aside from the many features that actually started in games before wow) were features that players wanted, wrote addons for or just kept making suggestions. Which is why refusing to put them in a game simply because they came from wow, is pretty stupid.
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