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S-E feels the backlash from FFXIII with FFXIII-2 sales.Follow

#52 Dec 22 2011 at 5:10 PM Rating: Good
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yfaithfully wrote:
Somewhat apropos for this thread:

Anyone buying the $99 USD Square Enix package on Steam?


lol @ $712.42 $99.99!

As though anyone was ready to pay $712.42 in the first place; ah, marketing... XD
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#53 Dec 22 2011 at 5:31 PM Rating: Good
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after whats happened with 13 (less than stellar reviews) and 14 (terrible reviews) people are afraid to waste more money. i personally enjoyed 13, but only after it became explorable. the first 11 chapters were trash, or wherever it started gett8ing good.

square has done story telling very well in the past, (except for 8, people are still on the fence about what the *$^% the story was about) and they need to go back and really think about what made them so successful in the first place.

final fantasy has evolved well over the years always adding more goodness to mix while trying to keep things fresh. the games have always had RPG elements to it but the way they have been going about it is genius. there was regular leveling, then materia, then junction, then weapon leveling, the sphere grid, and the liscence board. they came up with a lot of different ways to progress which always made things feel fresh. the crystarium grid was terrible as it gave little room for customization, and merely gave the illusion of it.

there are 3 things that i believe square needs to really reflect on.
1) story
2) exploration
3) game mechanics

now the game doesnt neccessarily need to be revolutionary every single time, because they will run out of ideas eventually, but they need to keep it fun. 13 as i said i liked, but it definatley was on the bottom of my "order of my favorite final fantasy". even when there was exploration, the only thing there was to do was track down and kill the different marks and upgrade weapons. what 13 has to be acknowleged for however, is how real the bond between the characters were. beyond that it was just a generic RPG.

you have to give square credit though, they did make many, many good games. only a few out of a lot have been only "ok" and i don't think square plans to let their biggest franchise go down. they will bring the franchise back. it won't be with 13-2 or 14, because they will need to rebuild consumer confidence, but hopefully now square knows they can't just feed us anything.
#54 Dec 22 2011 at 5:35 PM Rating: Good
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Kachi wrote:
Is it a pure port or did they make some changes? As I recall they originally rushed the ending of the game. I always kind of hoped they'd go back and make changes according to the original plan.


Pretty sure it is a pure port - part of their "PS1 Classics" series, which seem to generally be direct ports.
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#55 Dec 22 2011 at 6:16 PM Rating: Decent
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Keysofgaruda wrote:
square has done story telling very well in the past


No, they haven't. Yes, I've played Tactics. Yes, I've played Xenogears. No, neither story was all that great.

Square-Enix's stories are mundane and very plain. They try to do "twists" that ultimately make no sense because of their lack of conveyance in their mediums. Yes, FF stories are bounds and leaps above pretty much anything the Dragon Quest series has put out (though they have gotten better at trying since 8) but that's not a good metric to judge by. Tri-Ace, Namco, and Bioware easy trump anything SE's ever put out for story, the last two especially.

The allure of Final Fantasy titles (NOT ********* I MEAN ******* OSTIA) has always been the entire package. The hokey story is offset by a (usually) compelling set of characters. The combat is usually enjoyable, there's traditional RPG elements of character growth through gear, pure levels, and usually one or two "other" mechanics. Staple iconic figures show themselves and you get to compare them to previous games and see how they've been given a new twist.

The problem is they've been systemically cutting down and gutting the "packages" until you get what we have now: Final Failure XIII. You get a ton of grinding for cash/levels, no optional growth for power, zero freedom to explore (sorry FFXIII fans -- having *ONE* area in the game with 64 repeatable boring kill quests isn't 'freedom' or 'exciting'), and lately not even a coherent story or enjoyable cast. ****, they don't even bother letting you choose who you wish to take with you at any point in time until near the end of the game anymore. You used to have a fairly cinematic ending that attempted to tie a resolution to the story and leave an emotional impact (especially when the Final Fantasy: Prologue theme comes out to tie it home), but now it's just a JPOP song out of left field while staring at a list of credits.

The fact that it takes them so long to even push this drivel out is pretty telling of the state of affairs at SE.

Edited, Dec 22nd 2011 7:17pm by Viertel
#56 Dec 22 2011 at 7:41 PM Rating: Good
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Name me a Tri-ace game that is a better overall game than Xenogears, or name me a game from namco or tri-ace that has a better story than Chrono Chross.

The only game IMO from tri-ace that even comes close to touching xenogears is Star ocean 2, as for namco.... well tales is a good series but you play one, you have pretty much played half of them, except once in a while, where they actually make something new, like tales of destiny, abyss etc etc.
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#57 Dec 22 2011 at 11:23 PM Rating: Good
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I was stunned when I heard the news of there would be a sequel to FFX and I couldn't wait to play it, but it turned out to be a dissapointment for my part. I didn't like the new music at all, it was too bright and cheerful and I was thinking I was playing Spyro when I heard the music in the airship. The villains were rather dumb and I felt rather embarrassed while playing through the massage scene. The new Yuna looked too much like Lara Croft and most of the dress spheres must have been made by perverted designers to make the game more appealing for male audiences. I don't have anything against good looking armor on women, but I feel a bra and a thong is not much of armor on Rikku. Most of the models from the first game returned so there was a ton of familiar faces while playing it so I felt that I had sometimes deja vu when I went to some places and fought the same monsters all over again. I didn't like the alternative endings as I rarely replay a Final Fantasy game. Maybe it's because of I got the worst possible ending, but I rarely replay a FF game. After 40-60 hours of playing through the game once I feel I've had enough of the random encounters which makes me throw the controller into the wall even to this very day. The sheer epicness of everything else is what kept me going, but it's not as fun when I know everything the second time around.

I did enjoy however how unlinear it was as I could go where I wanted and still get the story with me. The job system was fun, but I never got the hang on the dress sphere system so I mostly just changed between different roles when I needed to. I recall the animations taking a long year even with the animations put on "short". Some of the dialogue were cheesy enough to be funny, but not as solid gold cheesy as the laughing scene in FFX. THANK GOD for the ability to skip scenes though! It was bloody irritating in the first game to mash the X - button to skip a very long cut scene before a difficult boss fight which you just wiped on. But overall I don't think I'll play this game anytime soon.

Final Fantasy IV the after years was a huge dissapointment as it was basically FFIV all over again but in a different order for 38€ on the Wii. I could count on my hand how many new sound tracks and enemy sprites there were in this game. The mysterious girl theme plus the battle theme was pretty good though. I'm aware of it's supposed to take place in the same world 17 years after, but I really did expect more changes during that time period. I guess SE went green for eco friendliness by introducing recycled content which they did with FFX-2 plus FF11's events, reskins of armor and monsters every year. I really liked how fast the menus were loading, no fancy transitions or animations to slow down the menu navigation which seems to plague the newer titles. I think the FFX-2 menu were running at like 10 fps or something.

Basically my thoughts about FFXIII-2 is that it recycles a lot of elements from FFXIII, a game that I didn't really enjoy as it was "run through a corridor for 40 hours while mashing X - button". From my earlier experiences of Final Fantasy "sequels" is that they do not live up to their predecessors. I don't feel like paying full retail price for a game I already own the half of.

#58 Dec 22 2011 at 11:36 PM Rating: Excellent
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On the subject of tutorials, I love the way it's done in Civilization 4. Everything you need to know is there.....IF you want to look at it. If you don't need/want it, you can ignore it.

I agree with the post about old players. We're jaded. I'm 45 and seen every type of game evolve. Shiny graphics are nice.....but I'd rather have a game that is fun to play. I'm really enjoying Skyrim at the moment. The world seems so alive. Random events happen around me, NPC's go about their business whether I interact with them or not. Thing is, while I'm playing Skyrim, I'm crafting using my toe to hit X on my controller in FFXIV, not even looking at the screen....that just feels wrong. FFXIV seems less alive, and it has real people running around in it.

There's a lot of competition out there....even though most games are just like every other. I think attention spans have dropped too. Most games now can be rushed through in 10 hours or less. I prefer games you can take time to enjoy.

I do think SE missed a trick not redoing VII though. Most of those 100,000 people that bought it on PSN (me included) would rebuy it. Instead they choose to remake FFX, which not so many people enjoyed.

And I hated FFXIII. Stopped playing part way through, as did my friends, so we're dubious about buying FFXIII-2 until we see how it pans out. Wasn't a huge fan of FFXII either, though did finish it.
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#59 Dec 23 2011 at 12:45 AM Rating: Excellent
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[quote=Kachi]Not doing a proper remake of FFVII and/or ChronoTrigger are perpetually stupid business decisions. It would be incredibly easy to squeeze some cash out of those games. ****, they could probably turn a quick buck by porting Xenogears to a portable.

That is exactly the problem that has tarnished the SE/Final Fantasy name. They need to stop trying to squeeze out cash from the series and get back to focusing on innovating and immersive gameplay.
#60 Dec 23 2011 at 2:17 AM Rating: Good
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I loved XIII. I thought it was too different to be a proper FF game, but I thought it was a great game on its own merits. I have over 100 hours on it. FFXIII-2 is the game I've most looked forward to in quite a while.

Different strokes for different folks, obviously, but I know I'm stoked about it, and eagerly awaiting reviews.
#61 Dec 23 2011 at 2:27 AM Rating: Excellent
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LebargeX wrote:
Yup... kinda just feels like every game I turn on, the first thing I think is: "I've seen this all before." I guess FF XIV was trying to turn that thought around, but just went about it the wrong way.

I'll probably still pick up FF XIV, if for no reason other than that's probably going to be the only option I'll have by then for a decent game.....if they actually release it for PS3. I know they keep saying they will, but I'm still skeptical.


Fun fact: When you put up any modern FPS against each other it's hard to tell the difference.

In fact, most games I've played over the last years all uses the take-cover-behind-chest - high-walls formula. I think SE should implement it in one of their FFs just for the **** of it.
#62 Dec 23 2011 at 7:19 AM Rating: Good
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Solonuke wrote:
LebargeX wrote:
Yup... kinda just feels like every game I turn on, the first thing I think is: "I've seen this all before." I guess FF XIV was trying to turn that thought around, but just went about it the wrong way.

I'll probably still pick up FF XIV, if for no reason other than that's probably going to be the only option I'll have by then for a decent game.....if they actually release it for PS3. I know they keep saying they will, but I'm still skeptical.


Fun fact: When you put up any modern FPS against each other it's hard to tell the difference.

In fact, most games I've played over the last years all uses the take-cover-behind-chest - high-walls formula. I think SE should implement it in one of their FFs just for the **** of it.


Hard Reset, Serious Sam and Space Marine don't have cover :)

If the game is good, sale will increase. Skyrim just shipped a total 10m right after the first month when they thought 7m would have been their record.

Edited, Dec 23rd 2011 8:30am by Khornette
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#63 Dec 23 2011 at 11:10 AM Rating: Good
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Khornette wrote:
Solonuke wrote:
LebargeX wrote:
Yup... kinda just feels like every game I turn on, the first thing I think is: "I've seen this all before." I guess FF XIV was trying to turn that thought around, but just went about it the wrong way.

I'll probably still pick up FF XIV, if for no reason other than that's probably going to be the only option I'll have by then for a decent game.....if they actually release it for PS3. I know they keep saying they will, but I'm still skeptical.


Fun fact: When you put up any modern FPS against each other it's hard to tell the difference.

In fact, most games I've played over the last years all uses the take-cover-behind-chest - high-walls formula. I think SE should implement it in one of their FFs just for the **** of it.


Hard Reset, Serious Sam and Space Marine don't have cover :)

If the game is good, sale will increase. Skyrim just shipped a total 10m right after the first month when they thought 7m would have been their record.

Edited, Dec 23rd 2011 8:30am by Khornette


Yeah, Skyrim was pretty cool. I wound up with about 80 hours on it and am level 50 with all my pertinent stats capped for my 1st playthrough. I completed pretty much all the achievements except for the $100,000 gold, and definitely feel I got a long play time and value for my money. As for FFXIII I did enjoy parts of it. What drove me nuts was that I wasn't able to enjoy it once the "story" was over. I mean, I know you can cap out your crystal thingy or w/e, and do all the stone missions, but it was SO boring to go through all that stuff that I couldn't do it. I didn't feel that way with other FF games. I mean, I have got my characters to level 99 (or capped them) on pretty much all of them before that, and it was fun to do it.

As for FPS I would definitely agree they're pretty much all the same as well. On top of which, I don't really enjoy them.
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#64 Dec 23 2011 at 12:22 PM Rating: Good
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XIII-2 is pretty **** fun, I don't see how it's doing too badly with perfect scores or the fact pretty much everyone I know has it and trying for all endings). It's not only still a new title but people are forgetting that this year, let alone last month seen the release of a ton of games to be occupied with.

Re: FFVII
No remakes, this was one of the worst FFs in the bunch. It was a good playthrough once sure, but it was nothing special, none of the characters were great. People say XIII's characters were bland, but guess what? They were the most "human" characters to be shown in a FF game in a long time.

What they should remake, however, is FFV and FFIX.

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#65 Dec 23 2011 at 12:27 PM Rating: Good
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Viertel wrote:
Keysofgaruda wrote:
square has done story telling very well in the past


No, they haven't. Yes, I've played Tactics. Yes, I've played Xenogears. No, neither story was all that great.

Square-Enix's stories are mundane and very plain.

Edited, Dec 22nd 2011 7:17pm by Viertel


WTF?! All I can say is play a little known game by Square called Vagrant Story. Far and away one of the best story's in an RPG! Play that and tell me the story is mundane and very plain!
#66 Dec 23 2011 at 12:44 PM Rating: Good
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I'm kinda glad FFXIII-2 sales figures are dissappointing or at least a lot less than its predecessor, cause I didn't like XIII one bit. So what does one do when one likes jrpgs? I don't know. I just finished playing Dark Souls. I didn't like the style necessarily, I like the FF flavour; I hated the first 15 hours which were grueling without easing me into the gameplay, which resulted me into dying so many time the moment my attention was distracted for one reason or another...

Yet, once I got the gameplay figured out and once I got past the dying every other second and found myself alive after crossing a few areas, I really enjoyed the gameplay. I got to love the immense difficulty of the game and bosses that seemed to drive me crazy because I could not defeat them. It usually took me about an hour to figure out their attack pattern and learn how to anticipate them and eventually defeat them. I learned to live longer and die less the further I progressed in the game, apart from the bosses ofcourse. There also is no pause option, other than quitting the game and making yourself a cup of coffee. No tutorials, no holding hands, no easy gameplay features, no excuses, no, you had to rely on your own wits and if you died, it was all your fault. And eventually I began to love this game. Just because of the pure gameplay, and the areas towards the end of the game and how rewarding each victory was over every difficult boss or area. It's been a while since a game blew me out of the water, but this one surely did.

The point I'm trying to get across is, THIS is what I missed for so long in FF games (apart from FFXI bosses before the 75+ cap raise). Emerald Weapon anyone? "Hey, what's that underwater?? Looks kinda big, let's try it, I feel confident." Bam! Dead.... (Holy crap!). Ruby weapon? Dark Aeons? They presented a challenge, and not the challenge of XIII bosses "Only if you use these specific paradigm sets, you can win." That's not a challenge, that's a leash. Dark Souls is fair, you can dodge blows or block them with your shield and rings, if you can figure out what boss does what damage. Fire boss? Equip fire-resistant armor and rings. High physical dmg? Equip physical rings and armor that can suck up most of the blows, or find yourself a shield that blocks all attacks as long as you got stamina.

I want a FF title with a high difficulty, a lot of optional areas, some kind of World map and towns please! Lost Odyssey was the last RPG I truly liked, apart from the dated system. If SE makes more of these types of JRPGs I will be the first to buy them again. Until them I just /shakes head.
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#67 Dec 23 2011 at 1:20 PM Rating: Decent
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Theonehio wrote:

Re: FFVII
No remakes, this was one of the worst FFs in the bunch. It was a good playthrough once sure, but it was nothing special, none of the characters were great. People say XIII's characters were bland, but guess what? They were the most "human" characters to be shown in a FF game in a long time.

What they should remake, however, is FFV and FFIX.



Right, well, As I disliked XIII alot, I can see where you coming from....you dislike the game I loved the most :p, for all the same opposing reasons. And I couldn't play FFIX anymore, it was just too boring for me to replay, though Vivi and the kupos were very enjoyable. It's like me talking to a Tales of fan, I really don't like Tales of, and they mostly don't like Star Ocean ;)

It's really up or down on XIII and XIII-2 I guess for most people. Is there anyone who likes XIII, XIII-2(once it's released), and the old style FFI-FFVI, FFIX, but on the other hand FFVII and FFX too? Or is that person just an SE fanboy in general?:p
#68 Dec 23 2011 at 5:16 PM Rating: Decent
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I liked 4, 6, 12, and 13.

It seems like fewer and fewer people will enjoy future FF titles due to unrealistic expectations and nostalgia goggles.
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#69 Dec 23 2011 at 5:18 PM Rating: Excellent
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bsphil wrote:
I liked 4, 6, 12, and 13.

It seems like fewer and fewer people will enjoy future FF titles due to unrealistic expectations and nostalgia goggles.


I'm glad I'm not the only one that liked 12. I played the bejeezus out of that game.
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#70 Dec 23 2011 at 5:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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LebargeX wrote:
I'm glad I'm not the only one that liked 12. I played the bejeezus out of that game.


You are not alone, I liked it too.
#71 Dec 23 2011 at 6:29 PM Rating: Excellent
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Sethern79 wrote:
WTF?! All I can say is play a little known game by Square called Vagrant Story.


can also DL this on PSP


Edited, Dec 23rd 2011 5:34pm by Olorinus
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#72 Dec 23 2011 at 7:06 PM Rating: Excellent
Final Fantasy XII was interesting, but was one of those love it or hate it games for sure. I just wasn't able to get into the story or get interested in any of the characters. Most FF games I play through, I can remember the story, the plot, the characters, XII...I really don't remember much of anything.

I just remember playing through and getting to what I assume is the last dungeon which is floor, after floor after floor of utter boredom. It just seemed to never end, and I never picked up again. I can definitely see with the battle system and little side quests and certain huge NM's how some would of enjoyed it though. Of 3 of my friends that also played it though, we all got to the same point and quit. Which leads me to believe, most people didn't care enough about the story to finish it. FFXIII kind of drew the same reactions, you just don't care, and you don't even want to bother finishing. That's the thing with games though, opinions will vary, and you just play what you enjoy.
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#73 Dec 23 2011 at 7:44 PM Rating: Decent
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ive played every final fantasy game (main title at least) except for 12. i just started playing it today because i realised i could use an emulator to run my ps2 game i have.

the first hour of ff12 made me remember my time as a noob playing 11 and not knowing wtf is going on. (seriously i find the game a little difficult but ive played tales games so the gambit system isn't new to me. the AI is a LOT better than tales AI though. at least they do what i want them to do.(Estelle is such a dumbass))

if i had to pick a FF title to remake it would have to be 6. 7 isn't a bad choice to remake, but 6 was my favorite and the one i found very entertaining. imagine that game with 13's graphics. that would be sick.
#74 Dec 24 2011 at 1:21 AM Rating: Decent
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Count me in as one of the people that fully enjoyed 12. While 13 may have not been my favorite FF game, I still enjoyed it and am looking forward to 13-2's release next month.

Out of all the Final Fantasy games that I've played, 8 is the only one that I really didn't like. I still have yet to finish it and probably never will.
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#75 Dec 24 2011 at 9:56 AM Rating: Good
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a remake of anything is typically a sign of "lets remake something easy to squeeze some more money out of it".

I like pretty much every FF up to and including 11

- have not played 12
- 13 was the first I didn't care enough to finish, it felt like there was too much FMV and not enough actual game.
- 14 isn't atrocious but I don't buy games "because they aren't bad enough for me not to buy"

I would like to fiddle around and pretend I can make suggestions but they already have talented developers and producers, I believe they just get lost in the whizbang rather than focusing on firstly designing a great game and then adding some glitz and glam.
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#76 Dec 24 2011 at 2:04 PM Rating: Decent
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GiftedChild wrote:
Come on guys, I was just waiting for the perfect opportunity to bring this into discussion.

The only way Square can redeem itself is:

Remake

Final Fantasy VII

Period


This is simply put, an idiotic statement.
#77 Dec 24 2011 at 6:13 PM Rating: Excellent
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<productive internet discussion>

I liked Final Fantasy [insert Roman numerals] but hated Final Fantasy [insert different Roman numerals]. I think that the series died with [insert a Roman numeral between I and XIV].

</productive internet discussion>
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#78 Dec 24 2011 at 6:39 PM Rating: Good
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je355804 wrote:
GiftedChild wrote:
Come on guys, I was just waiting for the perfect opportunity to bring this into discussion.

The only way Square can redeem itself is:

Remake

Final Fantasy VII

Period


This is simply put, an idiotic statement.


Maybe, but you know what? i'm a PC gamer, have been for years now, the last consoles i ever got were the XboX and the PS2, after that i have put my money to upgrade my computer, which i have done three times now: AMD 1.4GHz -> Celeron 2.7GHz -> Core2Duo 2.5GHZ, i have been saving money to make yet another upgrade, maybe an i5 (i7 is too expensive for me), but... if SE suddenly says "Hey, FFVII remake for the PS3!!!" i'm going to get up from my computer, get the money i have been saving for my computer upgrade, and i'm going to go buy me a PS3 and the remake of FFVII, just like that.

Some people says that FFVII was the worst of the series and that's fine, that's your opinion and i respect that, but if SE makes the remake of FFVII i'm telling you, it's going to sell like hot bread.

Happy Holidays everyone!
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#79 Dec 24 2011 at 7:16 PM Rating: Good
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Suucat wrote:
Maybe, but you know what? i'm a PC gamer, have been for years now, the last consoles i ever got were the XboX and the PS2, after that i have put my money to upgrade my computer, which i have done three times now: AMD 1.4GHz -> Celeron 2.7GHz -> Core2Duo 2.5GHZ, i have been saving money to make yet another upgrade, maybe an i5 (i7 is too expensive for me), but... if SE suddenly says "Hey, FFVII remake for the PS3!!!" i'm going to get up from my computer, get the money i have been saving for my computer upgrade, and i'm going to go buy me a PS3 and the remake of FFVII, just like that.

Some people says that FFVII was the worst of the series and that's fine, that's your opinion and i respect that, but if SE makes the remake of FFVII i'm telling you, it's going to sell like hot bread.

Happy Holidays everyone!


Just a side note, but since you're building a machine for gaming anyway you'd be better served with the i5 2500K model. It doesn't have the virtual cores since most games don't handle those well. A lot of benchmarks show a slight improvement with an i5 2500K versus the i7 2600K because of this fact. If you were doing a lot of other tasks aside from gaming (heavy music composition, video editing, "photoshop"-esque work, etc.) then the i7 would easily be better.

So, you'll be saving ~$100 USD and getting better gaming performance in the long run. Pretty sweet deal.




Edited, Dec 24th 2011 8:17pm by Viertel
#80 Dec 24 2011 at 9:23 PM Rating: Good
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I've been waiting since 2005 when they used FFVII to introduce the PS3.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVCYy8C5Av4
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#81 Dec 24 2011 at 10:27 PM Rating: Default
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Remake Final Fantasy VII!

Stop making all these nice graphic garbages such as FFX, FFX-2, FFXIII, FFXIII-2 and sorry guys, Tanaka's FFXIV. I will not buy FFXIII-2. We deserve better.
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#82 Dec 24 2011 at 11:57 PM Rating: Excellent
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Golophei wrote:
Remake Final Fantasy VII!

Stop making all these nice graphic garbages


"... and start updating graphics!"
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"Thus opium is pleasing... on account of the agreeable delirium it produces." (Burke para.6)

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#83 Dec 25 2011 at 4:22 AM Rating: Excellent
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I honestly don't believe people really want remakes or sequels. People want a new Final Fantasy. I'm not talking about a radically new Final Fantasy, I'm talking about a new game which actually has some non-progressive, classical elements we expect and love from the franchise.

Memorable characters or enemies that have a lasting comedic impact. Lone Wolf, Gilgamesh, Ultros?

Areas that aren't linear, optional dungeons, bring back the world map, summon sequences, randomized battles, memorable music with an appropriate ending theme created just for the game. (Sorry, FFXIII. I'm calling you out on that.)

The development team seems to think we want something extremely new and different in all aspects of the sort in every new game. Sure, new characters, new enemies, new story, new world is great. But expand and develop the features that work, don't try to rebuild a foundation every **** time.
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#84 Dec 25 2011 at 10:56 AM Rating: Decent
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Golophei wrote:
Remake Final Fantasy VII!

Stop making all these nice graphic garbages such as FFX, FFX-2, FFXIII, FFXIII-2 and sorry guys, Tanaka's FFXIV. I will not buy FFXIII-2. We deserve better.


So wait...

"Stop making nice graphic garbage such as FFX-XIII-2"...yet remake one of the worst FFs to come around....? I mean FFVs story was more coherent than VII's and V's story was pretty out there at times. (though it was still a good story.)

I still don't see whats so wrong with XIII (or XIII-2), both games are basically built exactly the same as every other FF game that's been released, you just never seen it because the overworld gave an illusion of freedom.

All FFs are broken down into:

- Dumped into a role of a character you have no idea who it is.
- Learn who it is
- Gather allies
- Learn who bad guy/gal is
- Lose an ally (or many allies)
- Revive an ally or lose em again.
- Explore the overworld but can't do much till you progress to x point in a story
- Push to final boss or side track to side quests for ultimate crap, then push to final boss
- Happy end

This is what all FFs, including X-XIII-2 were like, XIII was more linear than it should be in terms of exploring, and XIII-2 has just way too many variables than it should (but that makes it an actual RPG, since the ending is purely determined by your choices, unlike most other FF games.)

UltKnightGrover wrote:
But expand and develop the features that work, don't try to rebuild a foundation every **** time.


I think what happens here is the fact people complain "It's the same **** thing every time", yet people gobble up Modern Warfare each time like it's a new piece of candy.



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#85 Dec 25 2011 at 3:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Suucat wrote:
if SE suddenly says "Hey, FFVII remake for the PS3!!!" i'm going to get up from my computer, get the money i have been saving for my computer upgrade, and i'm going to go buy me a PS3 and the remake of FFVII, just like that.

Emulate on PC, or buy a physical copy (it'll play on your PS2). You don't have to pay $200+ to play a game that's fourteen years old.

Really.
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#86 Dec 25 2011 at 3:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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or... lol (sounding like a broken record here)

Download it for 10 bucks onto your PSP. I think (dunno cause I don't have a tv) you can even wire it to your TV and play it on the TV if you want a bigger screen.

I am also pretty sure you can DL it on PS3 if you have one too.

I still haven't played it (or downloaded it even - HERESY)

Honestly, you know what game I'd like SE to remake? Dragon Warrior Monsters 2. They should give it the treatment newer pokemon games get - with upgraded features - BUT NOT the ugly as sin (hurts my eyes) monstrosity type thing they did with DWM DS... that game sucked. I mean seriously why did they make the main character some kind of unlikeable psycho and give it blocky pseudo 3d graphics that look like sh*t?
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When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#87 Dec 25 2011 at 4:19 PM Rating: Excellent
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ugh they already made a remake for 1+2 and only released in Japan >.> for serious man... they need to get their crap together.
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lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#88 Dec 25 2011 at 4:30 PM Rating: Good
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Olorinus wrote:
I am also pretty sure you can DL it on PS3 if you have one too.


Actually you can buy quite a few FF classics through the PSN store. IIRC they'll run you $10 a pop. I could do without a remake to be honest. I like the feel of the game without them, but maybe I'm old.

Off topic: My lil sister got me a 2600 for christmas. Graphics so old you'd be hard pressed to guess what you're looking at unless you know which game you're playing XD
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HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#89 Dec 25 2011 at 5:03 PM Rating: Excellent
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I am not a huge fan of remakes - though I don't mind a little clean up. Like, I actually dig what SE did to FF II for PSP - they "remade" it enough to smooth out the edges of the graphics and speed it up a little, and made it so you could save not just at an inn - and that was enough for me. The PSP one has slightly nicer graphics than the GBA version (which I also have) but either one is fine.

I might be just old fashioned but I actually generally prefer older style rpgs with 2d sprites and top down look. Like I said above, I hate the Dragon Quest monsters release on NDS because they replaced the simple graphics with hideous "upgraded" graphics - they really ought to have followed on what pokemon has done - with not trying to "improve" the game by changing the graphic style entirely - but making things more functional and smoother looking.

Like I am playing heart gold right now, and they improved the pokemon boxes (though I miss the duplication trick!) and ADDED stuff like personalities to the pokemon, but they didn't try to make it that ugly as sin fake 3d type thing that some DS games try to pull. Why, I cannot fathom. Nothing looks worse that terribad fail non-3d DS sprites

eh, I think I am just olde.

Edited, Dec 25th 2011 3:11pm by Olorinus
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lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#90 Dec 25 2011 at 6:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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Olorinus wrote:
I am not a huge fan of remakes - though I don't mind a little clean up. Like, I actually dig what SE did to FF II for PSP - they "remade" it enough to smooth out the edges of the graphics and speed it up a little, and made it so you could save not just at an inn - and that was enough for me. The PSP one has slightly nicer graphics than the GBA version (which I also have) but either one is fine.

I might be just old fashioned but I actually generally prefer older style rpgs with 2d sprites and top down look. Like I said above, I hate the Dragon Quest monsters release on NDS because they replaced the simple graphics with hideous "upgraded" graphics - they really ought to have followed on what pokemon has done - with not trying to "improve" the game by changing the graphic style entirely - but making things more functional and smoother looking.

Like I am playing heart gold right now, and they improved the pokemon boxes (though I miss the duplication trick!) and ADDED stuff like personalities to the pokemon, but they didn't try to make it that ugly as sin fake 3d type thing that some DS games try to pull. Why, I cannot fathom. Nothing looks worse that terribad fail non-3d DS sprites

eh, I think I am just olde.


I couldn't agree more: the graphics on the new Pokemon (B/W) are so very, very bad. It's like they took smooth, well-coloured sprites, and then magnified them randomly and animated them only intermittently and inconsistently.

There's something beautiful about a skillfully made sprite. Every single pixel, every colour needs to be placed with a deliberate hand. When the sprite turns to the left, it looks how the artist wanted it to look; when they jump, each frame is drawn to convey the motion. With 3-D graphics, especially those we get to see on many DS games, it's more a matter of slapping a texture on a bad model or, sometimes worse, a bad 3-D plane, and then animating the object in question.

And think of the difficulty of good sprites! Sometimes nothing more than a few pixels need to look like a hand, a few frames convey emotion, a few colours seem like a world! We don't need 3-D, we never did; but, since it's here, it would be nice if games used it well, rather than used it just to save time and effort.
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#91 Dec 25 2011 at 8:17 PM Rating: Decent
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There was some talk about SE might be outsourcing the FF franchise to a western company after the reception of the newer FF titles. I wonder if that'll gain some speed after the salesnumbers of both XIV and XIII-2.
#92 Dec 25 2011 at 10:41 PM Rating: Good
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Capcom did that method with their "Devil May Cry" series. I'm still kind of skeptical about that. S-E should keep their main franchise in-house, and I hope that's just a rumor. What else would they develop by outsourcing Final Fantasy?

Dragon Quest is only really popular in Japan, and they seem very hesitant on making another Chrono game. (And rightfully so, I suppose. Want to take a guess at who produced Chrono Cross?)
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#93 Dec 25 2011 at 11:33 PM Rating: Decent
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UltKnightGrover wrote:
Capcom did that method with their "Devil May Cry" series. I'm still kind of skeptical about that. S-E should keep their main franchise in-house, and I hope that's just a rumor. What else would they develop by outsourcing Final Fantasy?

Good question. Makes you wonder why a lot of XIV was outsourced...
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HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#94 Dec 25 2011 at 11:40 PM Rating: Good
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Was it? I don't remember them ever saying that.
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#95 Dec 26 2011 at 1:17 AM Rating: Excellent
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I completely agree 13 was sold on brand devotion alone. 12, whether it was your cup of tea or not story wise, was a pretty solid game. Good to most, good to me, fell short for some. I can respect that. 13.... was pretty horrible. On rails game play, really shoddy battle system. It was completely HORRIBLE, and they decide to give THIS a sequel. I am not surprised at all.

I think 14 had nothing to do with the slump in sales. The fact is that not too many people liked 13 from the get go.
#96 Dec 26 2011 at 2:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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KaneKitty wrote:


I couldn't agree more: the graphics on the new Pokemon (B/W) are so very, very bad. It's like they took smooth, well-coloured sprites, and then magnified them randomly and animated them only intermittently and inconsistently.


awww that's a shame, I haven't picked up B/W yet, but I always held pokemon up as a series that did a good job not messing with a good thing. I wished SE hadn't ffed up FF III with the crappy "3D" look that just detracts from the elegance of the game. I just seemed like such a failboat waste. I hope they didn't do something similar with chrono trigger for DS - never played it but I have it coming in the mail. If they took away the sprite look I will be a sad panda.

KaneKitty wrote:

There's something beautiful about a skillfully made sprite. Every single pixel, every colour needs to be placed with a deliberate hand. When the sprite turns to the left, it looks how the artist wanted it to look; when they jump, each frame is drawn to convey the motion. With 3-D graphics, especially those we get to see on many DS games, it's more a matter of slapping a texture on a bad model or, sometimes worse, a bad 3-D plane, and then animating the object in question.

And think of the difficulty of good sprites! Sometimes nothing more than a few pixels need to look like a hand, a few frames convey emotion, a few colours seem like a world! We don't need 3-D, we never did; but, since it's here, it would be nice if games used it well, rather than used it just to save time and effort.


I couldn't agree more. I wish they used the increased brainpower of the newer systems to produce more complex, large games with more sound/voice acting with simple, pretty graphics - than gone this route of shtty games with supposedly "better" graphics (sorry but why does almost everything look like sh*te on the DS?) - have to say in general PSP games are miles ahead of DS games - not just because it is a more powerful system but it seems like ppl developing for it put more effort into using the resources of the system effectively.

Been playing Persona Portable 3 lately - most compelling RPG I've played in awhile - it is almost fully voice acted! I was stunned - I mean just stunned by the quality of it - the graphics themselves are stills of the characters over backgrounds - nothing splashy - but well done and nice to look at. When the chars are moving through the world they aren't particularly awesome looking but definitely clean looking and not horribly blocky.... but what makes the game is the design of it (it is just awesome) the music, the story and the voice acting.

I guess what I am getting st is I wish that more companies would focus on making fun games vs 3d games, or gfx heavy games.

Also the sprites in Ogre Battle PSP are fantastic. Probably the best game SE has put out in awhile.


Edited, Dec 26th 2011 12:15am by Olorinus
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lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#97 Dec 26 2011 at 2:52 AM Rating: Good
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UltKnightGrover wrote:
Was it? I don't remember them ever saying that.

Not completely, but much of XIV was outsourced to china. It isn't something they would admit to, but shortly after launch they had some emergency maintenance to fix some problems stemming from it.


Edited, Dec 26th 2011 3:57am by FilthMcNasty
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#98 Dec 26 2011 at 7:27 AM Rating: Excellent
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
UltKnightGrover wrote:
Was it? I don't remember them ever saying that.

Not completely, but much of XIV was outsourced to china. It isn't something they would admit to, but shortly after launch they had some emergency maintenance to fix some problems stemming from it.


Edited, Dec 26th 2011 3:57am by FilthMcNasty


There was also a major furor from Japanese players who were constantly finding quest text written in Chinese, which is when it fist came to light that S-E did in fact outsource to a Chinese company.
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#99 Dec 26 2011 at 7:45 AM Rating: Excellent
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I had no clue they outsourced to China. If they had the idea to outsource it, they should have outsourced to a company who knows what they are doing >_<;
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#100 Dec 26 2011 at 9:56 AM Rating: Excellent
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LillithaFenimore wrote:
I had no clue they outsourced to China. If they had the idea to outsource it, they should have outsourced to a company who knows what they are doing >_<;


They largely don't seem to know what they're doing, so giving it to the company they chose makes a weird sort of sense.
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#101 Dec 26 2011 at 10:34 AM Rating: Excellent
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Whoa, I totally thought you guys were trolling when you said it was outsourced to China, I didn't think it was actually true.

As for my Devil May Cry franchise statement, it's not what I mean though. There's an actual development team in Europe that's doing the new one rather than Capcom's Japanese studio. That's different than saying FFXIV being developed in Japan and being programmed in China.
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