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A few thoughts regarding 2.0 and beyondFollow

#102 Feb 18 2012 at 8:22 PM Rating: Default
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hexaemeron wrote:
I don't believe you are familiar with coding so much at this level if you're saying this. Assets can be ported. Not a fundamentally redesigned engine.


Yes, and coding/scripts are assets, and they're very much portable. I don't know where talk about the engine got brought into this, but it wasn't me.

Xoie wrote:
If I thought for a second you had any interest in being reasonable or learning something new from the input you received, we could talk. But it's clear that this is some sort of testing ground for you to constantly practice being "right" when you're oh so bat-sh*t-crazy-obviously wrong. It is not wrong to say the game has coding issues even if the problem is traced back to design, the engine, or what's built on the engine.

And I'm not going to play your game. You want to be right so bad? Fine.

You are absolutely correct, Blynk. You sure got me good there. I've have disproved at every turn by your cunning use of twisted language and illogical undermining. I will never go up against your superior intellect again.

Happy now?


It's because you're too obsessed over proving me wrong about something. You're getting mad because I'm calling the coding "functional".

Edited, Feb 18th 2012 9:25pm by BlynkTheSneak
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Blynk [Gilgamesh] Blynk [Bodhum]
#103 Feb 18 2012 at 9:02 PM Rating: Good
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I like blynk, he is a funny guy, with his crazy over optimism and crazy logic. But dont try to prove him wrong, he will post links, to some unrelated stuff that proves your point.......

True story.
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#104 Feb 18 2012 at 9:27 PM Rating: Default
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Ostia wrote:
I like blynk, he is a funny guy, with his crazy over optimism and crazy logic. But dont try to prove him wrong, he will post links, to some unrelated stuff that proves your point.......

True story.


I thought you were mad at me because I was pessimistic over SWTOR.
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Blynk [Gilgamesh] Blynk [Bodhum]
#105 Feb 19 2012 at 12:15 AM Rating: Good
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Nah, why would i ? I find fun in debating.
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#106 Feb 19 2012 at 3:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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BlynkTheSneak wrote:
As for SWTOR, your conclusion that it's a success because it sold a lot of copies is incredibly naive. Something isn't a success because it sold more than it's competitors, money just doesn't work like that. Even if you're a loyal Bioware customer, you should be able to agree that the SWTOR failure is a very popular opinion. ****, look at what investors think about it.


I didn't actually say that SWtoR was successful, although I believe it is if you want my honest opinion.

I compared SE's definition of the success for XI which was based on the number of active subscriptions and retention of said subscriptions vs. their development and maintenance costs. XI's goal was to reach and retain 200k subs over the course of 5 years iirc. They exceeded that and reached a point where they actually started making money on the project after just over 3 years. SWtoR on the other had has such a large subscriber base that it's likely they will break that threshold in a matter of months. Budget for SWtoR is estimated to be nearly 10 times that of XI...

I'm not sure if you were trying to read into what I posted, but nowhere in what you quoted did I suggest that SWtoR is more successful than XI because it sold more copies. I was referring to the goals of the developers.

There very well be some shakiness going on for Bio and SWtoR, but it's a far cry from the mass exodus XIV experienced. I understand that you want to be optimistic about XIV, but don't abandon reality in the process.


Edited, Feb 19th 2012 4:49am by FilthMcNasty
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#107 Feb 19 2012 at 7:02 AM Rating: Good
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Having a debate with Blynk is like me trying to reason with my two year old. The only difference is I can reason with her, ya can't reason with him >_<.

However, trying to do so I find quite entertaining and great exercise for the brain... Xoie, view him as a brain teaser and it will make sense :D
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#108BlynkTheSneak, Posted: Feb 19 2012 at 11:39 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) We haven't really had a debate about anything. It's more me trying to defend off the nit-picking, and people constantly falling on their faces trying to prove me wrong about something.
#109 Feb 19 2012 at 12:26 PM Rating: Good
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Sweetie,

What you think of as nit-picking, they are actually debating. And tbh, they aren't falling on their faces to prove you wrong...The flat out proved you wrong :/.

Look TBH, none of us wanted FFXIV to turn out the way it did. The thing is when you have a company who spends 5-6 years on just an engine and barely any content, a failed launch is what you will receive.

Now, will this game be a complete and utter failure with no hopes of ever making a come back...IDK. That is really all up to SE.

And again, might I suggest not only frequenting the Zam forums. Again, many of the poster here are very cynical and agitated with SE. I promise you will find like minded people who are extremely optimistic about FFXIV becoming a success. Definately don't stop posting here, but also, maybe post your points on Zam or maybe start threads and such there. The Lodestone community is quite forgiving with this game than many of the Zam posters.
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"I've never watched a nuclear explosion myself. That's a couple of degrees of stupid above my limit"- Old Man Harris
#110BlynkTheSneak, Posted: Feb 19 2012 at 12:50 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) The only thing I've been proved wrong about was that XI never reached 1 million subscribers. Your judgement for whether or not I was proved wrong on the rest of this stuff is probably being decided by karma or community opinion, and sorry, it just doesn't work like that.
#111 Feb 19 2012 at 12:51 PM Rating: Good
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Okay I give up...the kid is hopeless...Back to reasoning with my toddler.
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#112BlynkTheSneak, Posted: Feb 19 2012 at 1:09 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Just keep falling back on that ad hominem to prove me wrong, I'll give up eventually.
#113 Feb 19 2012 at 3:19 PM Rating: Good
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There is nothing to prove you wrong about, because all you have done is talk about speculation, and opinion based statements, we can back our statements up, you cant, because all you do is "Well it could be" but is not. wish is out point lol
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#114 Feb 19 2012 at 3:40 PM Rating: Decent
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Some people needs a game to play haha
#115BlynkTheSneak, Posted: Feb 19 2012 at 4:07 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Like what? Where are these 'backed-up statements'? It seems to me like all anyone is talking about is opinions and speculation, because that is all there is to talk about.
#116 Feb 19 2012 at 4:39 PM Rating: Good
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It seems to me like all anyone is talking about is opinions and speculation, because that is all there is to talk about.

Yep, that pretty much sums up FFXIV.
#117 Feb 19 2012 at 4:41 PM Rating: Good
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Oh, I forgot that one:
;)

By the way: even if many posters here are quite cynical,
I believe most hope that 2.0 actually is worth the wait.
Against all reason.

Thing is: Deep down inside, FFXIV is little more than a
Korean grinder in disguise (at the moment). Fights against
bosses are dead boring (after doing them for the ump-tenth
time due to crappycrappycrappyinsane ridiculous drop rates),
fights against normal enemies are lolAFK, and don't even dare
to mention my-thumb-went-numb crafting or autorun harvesting.

The reason I quit not earlier than this winter? Because I had
a faint hope that this might actually be part of some sort of
master plan. And SE might at least provide some believeable,
living, breathing story once I reached that magical 50. It did
not. Personal opinion: after one and a half year, I am simply
no more interested in the motivations behind the invasion of
the yet-another-evil-empire. I simply stopped caring. And given
the hilarious pile of cliches and unexplained, unexplored, and,
in consequence, less than captivating "mysteries" (power to see
the past anyone? What the **** was that meant to be for in the
first place?), I perhaps should have been wiser and never have
started.

FFXIV (at the moment) is a shame to the gaming industry. It is
an evil concoction of first-generation MMO grindyness, brand
name abuse and lots of re-inventing the wheel. As squares. Or
triangles. To give it the credits it deserves: the armory system
*was* new in 2010(*). However, the world has moved on, and already
two games (Rift and Swtor) managed to improve on the original formula.
There's little "new" left in FFXIV atm. And I am doubtful the 2.0
re-launch will bring enough "new" to the table to attract more than
a half-page update (rather than a full re-review) by IGN or Gamespot.

(*) Personal opinion: two of the current armoury system's drawbacks (imo) are that a) it pretty much forces you to play classes you never wanted to for considerable lengths of time, because you need their abilities to tap into the full potential of your chosen class. Not really an alluring prospect for newcomers. b) I always felt I was just another mixed-up Frankenstein of abilities. Just like everyone else in my party.

P.S.: Did you ever play stuff like The Witcher or Skyrim? Neither game is perfect (although, I have to say, 20 hours into the game Skyrim still is pretty **** close), but man, you can feel both were lovingly crafted by designers and programmers who had personal pride in their work (like it was with Squaresoft two decades ago). And you can feel the respective game worlds breathing, as all of their inhabitants are actually talking with each other or *doing something* apart from standing around, twitching on the spot until some nerdy all-50 "adventurer" (don't make me laugh!) briefly lifts the veil of their motionless agony to skip through some hastily written quest dialog. Which actually is a monolog, because you pretty much never have a say in how things turn out. THAT is the future.


Edited, Feb 19th 2012 7:13pm by Rinsui
#118 Feb 19 2012 at 5:40 PM Rating: Good
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Rin, very true.
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#119 Feb 19 2012 at 6:25 PM Rating: Default
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Quote:
FFXIV (at the moment) is a shame to the gaming industry. Did
you ever play stuff like The Witcher or Skyrim? Neither of them
is perfect, but man, you can feel both games were lovingly crafted
by designers and programmers who had personal pride in their work.
You can feel the game world breathing, as all of it's inhabitants
are actually *doing something* apart from standing around, twitching
on the spot until some nerdy all-50 "adventurer" (don't make me laugh!)
briefly lifts the veil of their motionless agony to skip through some
hastily written quest dialog. Which actually is a monolog, because you
pretty much never have a say in how things turn out.


I've never heard someone mention the words "lovingly crafted" and "breathing world" in the same sentence as Skyrim. It's a great game, but it's about as generic as a game can get. The world is stale, and assets/terrain are re-used to a degree that would shame FFXIV. The more you play, the more you can tell how incredibly scripted everything is. I don't see any love or passion, just long crunch hours.

I also can't see what you mean by the inhabitants are "doing something". They're basically puppets whose entire lives are controlled by you. You aren't living in some amazing, fantastical world filled with incredibly powerful and interesting people. You are the puppet-master pulling strings on a bunch of generic NPCs who exist only to fool the majority long enough for them to tell all of their friends about the game.

I've never played TW2, though, so I don't know about that one. Regardless, there's no point in comparing these games to an MMO unless you're just looking for rage material. They're fundamentally different types of games, which both serve very different purposes.
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#120 Feb 19 2012 at 6:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:

I've never heard someone mention the words "lovingly crafted" and "breathing world" in the same sentence as Skyrim. It's a great game, but it's about as generic as a game can get. The world is stale, and assets/terrain are re-used to a degree that would shame FFXIV.


Hmm. Somehow Skyrim has managed to capture me. I even read most of the (500+, I was told) books in the game, because some of the stories are actually (lovingly) well-written. A lot better than "Imp ACT has broken out of the Gridania prison. AGAIN. And changed into a ladybug. AGAIN. Re-capture it. AGAIN.". And while there's naturally lots of assets that are re-used (for example, all wolves look alike, and many trees do), I somehow didn't even realize until you mentioned. Maybe because I was immersed.

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The more you play, the more you can tell how incredibly scripted everything is.


Well, at least there is a script for NPC movement. Unless you call the FFXIV twitch-on-the-spot a script. ;)

Quote:
I also can't see what you mean by the inhabitants are "doing something".


Well... as far as I witnessed, they go to sleep at night, wake up in the morning, make breakfast, sit down on the table, eat, go outside, tend to their crops or patrol routes, talk with their neighbors, complain about the rain, go back in (or to the inn) for the night and sleep. Rinse, repeat... unless they get eaten by a dragon, wolf, bear, or me.

Quote:
You are the puppet-master pulling strings on a bunch of generic NPCs who exist only to fool the majority long enough for them to tell all of their friends about the game.


Each of those "generic" NPCs seems to have it's own agenda apart from waiting to meet me, though... and up to now, I didn't tell any of my friends about Skyrim. No need to.

Quote:
Regardless, there's no point in comparing these games to an MMO unless you're just looking for rage material. They're fundamentally different types of games.


Why not? Are you implying something similar could not be done in a MMO? Humans have no wings, so they can't fly, eh? As far as I know, WoW even managed to change the outlook of some game eras according to your personal storyline progress (something called "phasing" or so). I think I'm really not asking too much when I say: give me less zombies and more movement. Give me NPC interactions. It has been done before, hasn't it?
#121 Feb 19 2012 at 7:10 PM Rating: Good
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Rinsui wrote:
Hmm. Somehow Skyrim has managed to capture me. I even read most of the (500+, I was told) books in the game, because some of the stories are actually (lovingly) well-written. A lot better than "Imp ACT has broken out of the Gridania prison.


Majority of the interesting books in Skyrim has already been present since Morrowind/Oblivion. The quests, on the other hand, are mostly generic and swapping a Helm with a Ring, a Cave with a Tomb or something like that *coughs* Radiant system *coughs*. As always, most of the interesting quests are Thieves, Dark Brotherhood and the Daedric. Others, including main-story, are incredibly bland and grindy like. If you want interesting quests, you may want to have a look at Fallout: New Vegas. It is super buggy, more so than Bethesda's, but the stories are the best you would have ever seen, and your decisions do impact the game world.

Edited, Feb 19th 2012 8:12pm by Khornette
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#122 Feb 19 2012 at 7:12 PM Rating: Default
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Rinsui wrote:
Each of those "generic" NPCs seems to have it's own agenda apart from waiting to meet me, though... and up to now, I didn't tell any of my friends about Skyrim. No need to.


You might not be telling your friends, but you're still talking about it around people who you feel comfortable talking about it with.

Rinsui wrote:
Why not? Are you implying something similar could not be done in a MMO? Humans have no wings, so they can't fly, eh? As far as I know, WoW even managed to change the outlook of some game eras according to your personal storyline progress (something called "phasing" or so). I think I'm really not asking too much when I say: give me less zombies and more movement. Give me NPC interactions. It has been done before, hasn't it?


Do you know how much it would annoy people to be unable to find an NPC because he's asleep? What about the NPCs who are like "Please! You have to save my daughter!"? Do they just keep the same 24/7 schedule, both before and after you save them? What about the ones who die half-way through the plot of a story? I mean you can't just kill him off, everyone else still needs to do that quest.

Just take a look at Ul'dah and imagine how difficult it would be to have all of those NPCs moving around in real time. This is possible in a video game on the scale of Skyrim, but when you try to do this with a game on the scale of FFXIV, it's just not worth the work. The data storage alone would be killer.
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#123 Feb 19 2012 at 8:04 PM Rating: Good
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BlynkTheSneak wrote:
FilthMcNasty wrote:
I'm not sure if you were trying to read into what I posted, but nowhere in what you quoted did I suggest that SWtoR is more successful than XI because it sold more copies. I was referring to the goals of the developers.


No, I definitely did read what you're saying. I'm actually pretty sure I'm the only one here who is reading what people say, because most people tend to pay attention to the latest 1-2 posts and completely forget about where the conversation has stemmed.

Here is where what you're saying is wrong: You responded to a post about me talking about XIV vs SWTOR subscription, brought XI in this yourself (which was brought up for entirely different reasons beforehand, and I was wrong about those), and forgot about XIV. You substituted XI for XIV. What you're saying just doesn't make sense in context right now.

No, I responded to a post that was filled with fabricated numbers and brought the truth. It's probably hard for you to keep track of all the false statements you've made, but you did quite a bit of talking about XI before I responded to this thread. It's fair for you to say "I don't get" it though.

BlynktheStink wrote:
We haven't really had a debate about anything. It's more me trying to defend off the nit-picking, and people constantly falling on their faces trying to prove me wrong about something.


I don't have to debate you. You were clearly wrong and that was pointed out by several people. I'm not sure why you'd try to defend yourself. When most people make a mistake they apologize or retract their statement.

You're welcome to your opinion, but people will never respect what you're saying if you support it with false claims and bogus numbers you made up.

Edited, Feb 19th 2012 9:08pm by FilthMcNasty
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#124 Feb 19 2012 at 8:14 PM Rating: Default
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Wait, what was this thread about again? Reading through what I come up with is a bunch of people who don't even play FFXIV any longer still hanging out to complain about the game, scolding anyone who disagrees with them and borderline insulting anyone who dares state that they happen to enjoy it. Come to think of it that's what most of these threads become, regardless of the OP's topic. And it's usually the same 4 or 5 rays of sunshine haha.

It's still so baffling why anyone who quit a video game 4-6 months earlier would feel the need to come justify their decision day after day on a forum whose purpose is for people who actually play the game to come and discuss said game. Not how the game was 18 months ago... but how it is now. Do you people really have nothing better to do than post 15+ times a day on a video game forum OF A GAME YOU DON"T EVEN @#%^ING PLAY? I lol at your sad, sad lives.

Edited, Feb 19th 2012 9:15pm by ChaChaJaJa
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You can always take a screen shot of the 1017 error and set it to your desktop background, its like playing FFXIV from work
#125 Feb 19 2012 at 8:54 PM Rating: Good
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ChaChaJaJa wrote:
Wait, what was this thread about again? Reading through what I come up with is a bunch of people who don't even play FFXIV any longer still hanging out to complain about the game, scolding anyone who disagrees with them and borderline insulting anyone who dares state that they happen to enjoy it. Come to think of it that's what most of these threads become, regardless of the OP's topic. And it's usually the same 4 or 5 rays of sunshine haha.

It's still so baffling why anyone who quit a video game 4-6 months earlier would feel the need to come justify their decision day after day on a forum whose purpose is for people who actually play the game to come and discuss said game. Not how the game was 18 months ago... but how it is now. Do you people really have nothing better to do than post 15+ times a day on a video game forum OF A GAME YOU DON"T EVEN @#%^ING PLAY? I lol at your sad, sad lives.

Edited, Feb 19th 2012 9:15pm by ChaChaJaJa


Talking about the game in forums, is actually more enjoyable than playing it, since well there are a whole lot more people probably talking about it than playing it, and is not as Boring.

Also, there have been no fundamental changes in a long time, they added a boss fight, and a search feature, welcome to 2008.
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#126 Feb 19 2012 at 9:14 PM Rating: Decent
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Ostia wrote:
ChaChaJaJa wrote:
Wait, what was this thread about again? Reading through what I come up with is a bunch of people who don't even play FFXIV any longer still hanging out to complain about the game, scolding anyone who disagrees with them and borderline insulting anyone who dares state that they happen to enjoy it. Come to think of it that's what most of these threads become, regardless of the OP's topic. And it's usually the same 4 or 5 rays of sunshine haha.

It's still so baffling why anyone who quit a video game 4-6 months earlier would feel the need to come justify their decision day after day on a forum whose purpose is for people who actually play the game to come and discuss said game. Not how the game was 18 months ago... but how it is now. Do you people really have nothing better to do than post 15+ times a day on a video game forum OF A GAME YOU DON"T EVEN @#%^ING PLAY? I lol at your sad, sad lives.

Edited, Feb 19th 2012 9:15pm by ChaChaJaJa


Talking about the game in forums, is actually more enjoyable than playing it, since well there are a whole lot more people probably talking about it than playing it, and is not as Boring.

Also, there have been no fundamental changes in a long time, they added a boss fight, and a search feature, welcome to 2008.


Generous. I would have said 2002.
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#127 Feb 19 2012 at 9:23 PM Rating: Default
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
No, I responded to a post that was filled with fabricated numbers and brought the truth. It's probably hard for you to keep track of all the false statements you've made, but you did quite a bit of talking about XI before I responded to this thread. It's fair for you to say "I don't get" it though.

I don't have to debate you. You were clearly wrong and that was pointed out by several people. I'm not sure why you'd try to defend yourself. When most people make a mistake they apologize or retract their statement.

You're welcome to your opinion, but people will never respect what you're saying if you support it with false claims and bogus numbers you made up.


Here's an image of how terrible you are at following a conversation. That should explain everything, I think.

Ostia wrote:
Talking about the game in forums, is actually more enjoyable than playing it, since well there are a whole lot more people probably talking about it than playing it, and is not as Boring.

Also, there have been no fundamental changes in a long time, they added a boss fight, and a search feature, welcome to 2008.
It's posts like these that show me that you haven't really played this game in awhile.

ChaChaJaJa wrote:
Wait, what was this thread about again? Reading through what I come up with is a bunch of people who don't even play FFXIV any longer still hanging out to complain about the game, scolding anyone who disagrees with them and borderline insulting anyone who dares state that they happen to enjoy it. Come to think of it that's what most of these threads become, regardless of the OP's topic. And it's usually the same 4 or 5 rays of sunshine haha.

It's still so baffling why anyone who quit a video game 4-6 months earlier would feel the need to come justify their decision day after day on a forum whose purpose is for people who actually play the game to come and discuss said game. Not how the game was 18 months ago... but how it is now. Do you people really have nothing better to do than post 15+ times a day on a video game forum OF A GAME YOU DON"T EVEN @#%^ING PLAY? I lol at your sad, sad lives.


I totally agree. It's really odd that I need to defend my subscription on this website. There's this small handful of people who refuse to let any possible comment about XIV having potential slip through.

Edited, Feb 19th 2012 10:31pm by BlynkTheSneak
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#128 Feb 19 2012 at 9:56 PM Rating: Good
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You can't judge Skyrim as a stand alone game. Skyrim is just a chapter in the TES series. You actually should be judging the series as one. The series goes from province to province. Main lore does not change, races don't change, race abilities don't change. Bethesda has created a very lifelike world and is constantly building on it. It's as if you are playing a history book in video game format. And from chapter to chapter the world of Nirm is changing from 6th House return with Dagoth Ur to Mankar Cameron and Mehrunes Dagon's evil plot to break through from his realm onto Nirn, and then the civil war in Skyrim taking place while a time rift was broken through due to The Elder Scroll.

Skyrim may have its issues, but stale and reused terrain is not one of them, especially compared to the broken and convoluted plot of FFXIV. I am on my third run through of Skyrim. While it isn't the best out of TES: III-V, it certainly is better and more in depth in story and things to do than FFXIV.
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#129 Feb 19 2012 at 10:57 PM Rating: Decent
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Lmao! The last time i logged on in FFXIV was in December 11/011, because that very day i started Swotor early release. Yeah its been SUCH A LONG WHILE!!!
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#130 Feb 19 2012 at 11:29 PM Rating: Default
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LillithaFenimore wrote:
You can't judge Skyrim as a stand alone game. Skyrim is just a chapter in the TES series. You actually should be judging the series as one. The series goes from province to province. Main lore does not change, races don't change, race abilities don't change. Bethesda has created a very lifelike world and is constantly building on it. It's as if you are playing a history book in video game format. And from chapter to chapter the world of Nirm is changing from 6th House return with Dagoth Ur to Mankar Cameron and Mehrunes Dagon's evil plot to break through from his realm onto Nirn, and then the civil war in Skyrim taking place while a time rift was broken through due to The Elder Scroll.
lol
LillithaFenimore wrote:
Skyrim may have its issues, but stale and reused terrain is not one of them, especially compared to the broken and convoluted plot of FFXIV. I am on my third run through of Skyrim. While it isn't the best out of TES: III-V, it certainly is better and more in depth in story and things to do than FFXIV.

You back your argument up for Skyrim having good terrain with "it certainly is better and more in depth in story and things to do than FFXIV.". That is a terrible argument, and I think you might not understand what terrain even is.
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#131 Feb 19 2012 at 11:59 PM Rating: Good
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If you really like the game the best thing you can do is never read the forums for anything more than update information, or how to play your job/class better. People are bitter and it just ruins anything that you like to do.

Personally I just don't see the appeal in the game atm. With some really classy games around the corner my eye will have a hard time looking at 14 seriously. I still keep up on the forums hoping that I'll see something interesting but most know that deep down... it probably isn't going to happen. I'll happily eat my words when/if it happens but it has been over a year and the game is more or less the same dismal little mess I saw when I first played. I can't feel psyched about the same questing, mob grinding, guildleve system when I see an entire market of people looking towards dynamic, get up and go, join whenever event play. I can't get psyched about a new hotkey combat system when most games are now switching to action rpgs. This game just won't have what the new games are offering.

The main issue(if not the worst) is that the dev team doesn't seem all that interested except for 1-2 guys. You look at the devs for gw2 and see a totally different atmosphere. I want a whole crew of devs who want to be there working on the project and not simply for a paycheck.
#132 Feb 20 2012 at 12:35 AM Rating: Default
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MippsCat wrote:
Personally I just don't see the appeal in the game atm. With some really classy games around the corner my eye will have a hard time looking at 14 seriously. I still keep up on the forums hoping that I'll see something interesting but most know that deep down... it probably isn't going to happen. I'll happily eat my words when/if it happens but it has been over a year and the game is more or less the same dismal little mess I saw when I first played. I can't feel psyched about the same questing, mob grinding, guildleve system when I see an entire market of people looking towards dynamic, get up and go, join whenever event play. I can't get psyched about a new hotkey combat system when most games are now switching to action rpgs. This game just won't have what the new games are offering.


Just keep in mind that most of the changes that will actually make the game seem fundamentally different are all being held off until 2.0. It takes blind faith to keep yourself interested in this title after all of this time, given what little content we have been (like pointless auction house fixes).

I like their vision for this game, and it's nothing like I've heard before. The failure of FFXIV 1.0 will probably be a better thing for us players in the long run, if only to see some of the more riskier MMO concepts put into practice.
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#133 Feb 20 2012 at 12:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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ChaChaJaJa wrote:
Wait, what was this thread about again? Reading through what I come up with is a bunch of people who don't even play FFXIV any longer still hanging out to complain about the game, scolding anyone who disagrees with them and borderline insulting anyone who dares state that they happen to enjoy it. Come to think of it that's what most of these threads become, regardless of the OP's topic. And it's usually the same 4 or 5 rays of sunshine haha.

It's still so baffling why anyone who quit a video game 4-6 months earlier would feel the need to come justify their decision day after day on a forum whose purpose is for people who actually play the game to come and discuss said game. Not how the game was 18 months ago... but how it is now. Do you people really have nothing better to do than post 15+ times a day on a video game forum OF A GAME YOU DON"T EVEN @#%^ING PLAY? I lol at your sad, sad lives.


Chasing away anyone who has any interest in FFXIV but who does not currently play is the absolute best way to ensure the 2.0 launch fails miserably. Just keep giving the impression that the few thousands of FFXIV players left are reclusive, anti-social, and they want everyone else to "Keep Out!" and when the time comes for the hundreds of thousands needed to play your game to keep it alive, you'll make sure no one wants to bother.

Congratulations, you're killing FFXIV!
#134 Feb 20 2012 at 1:33 AM Rating: Good
Ostia wrote:

Also there are plenty of JRPG that are far superior to anything SE has done since the start of the Ps2 age, for example Persona 3 & 4 are way superior than anything SE dropped on the PS2 & PS3, Infinite space & Black sigil for the DS are great example of good old JRPG that are far superior to anything SE has dropped in that console, the only things that SE has released are old remakes of classics like FFTWOTL, and OGBTLUSCT.


Just thought I'd be a bit technical and point out that Final Fantasy IX was released after the launch of the PS2. It's widely considered by many to be as good as Final Fantasy VII. Unfortunately since it was released for the PS1 after the launch of the PS2, it was overshadowed.

Also unfortunately it was the last time Square seemed to follow their classic formula. Nowadays they seem far too interested in creating a soap opera and leaving you to guess what or who you're really fighting. I miss the days when the bad guy would kill everyone and leave a blood trail behind, or destroy the world and remake it in his own vision. Made it so much easier to know who you were fighting and what you were fighting for.

Edited, Feb 20th 2012 3:38am by UnknownSoldier
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#135 Feb 20 2012 at 2:12 AM Rating: Good
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BlynkTheSneak wrote:
Here's an image of how terrible you are at following a conversation. That should explain everything, I think.


Again, XI was 'substituted' because you spoke previously about it and because it is relevant to how SE would define their MMO as being a success. There are a lot of words you could use to describe XIV, but successful is not one of them. Obvious reason to leave it out of the discussion completely.

Although I read and remembered each of those posts, thanks for the lining them all up like that. It's like a chronological recount of how you continue to make an *** of yourself. /bravo




Edited, Feb 20th 2012 3:13am by FilthMcNasty
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#136 Feb 20 2012 at 8:08 AM Rating: Default
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Xoie wrote:
ChaChaJaJa wrote:
Wait, what was this thread about again? Reading through what I come up with is a bunch of people who don't even play FFXIV any longer still hanging out to complain about the game, scolding anyone who disagrees with them and borderline insulting anyone who dares state that they happen to enjoy it. Come to think of it that's what most of these threads become, regardless of the OP's topic. And it's usually the same 4 or 5 rays of sunshine haha.

It's still so baffling why anyone who quit a video game 4-6 months earlier would feel the need to come justify their decision day after day on a forum whose purpose is for people who actually play the game to come and discuss said game. Not how the game was 18 months ago... but how it is now. Do you people really have nothing better to do than post 15+ times a day on a video game forum OF A GAME YOU DON"T EVEN @#%^ING PLAY? I lol at your sad, sad lives.


Chasing away anyone who has any interest in FFXIV but who does not currently play is the absolute best way to ensure the 2.0 launch fails miserably. Just keep giving the impression that the few thousands of FFXIV players left are reclusive, anti-social, and they want everyone else to "Keep Out!" and when the time comes for the hundreds of thousands needed to play your game to keep it alive, you'll make sure no one wants to bother.

Congratulations, you're killing FFXIV!


Actually, the "rays of sunshine" I mentioned in my post are the ones who are actively trying to chase people away from a game THEY DON'T EVEN PLAY. Have you read the posts on here over the past few months? Every single time someone inquires about the game you get the following:

Players who have either returned or just started playing for the first time say things like this: "The game is pretty fun. It still needs some work, but it's definitely entertaining at this point. Graphics are beautiful. And it's really cheap to play right now. Give it a shot. I am enjoying myself"

Players who quit sometime last year and really don't know the current state of the game FIRSTHAND chime in and pretend to be experts with comments like this: "RUN AWAY. This game is doomed. It's no fun. You can't get a party. There is no functioning AH. 2.0 will fail. Anyone who plays is stupid." etc.

You have to understand the context of my point here. I've had run ins with both Hex and Lillitha for their relentless negativity about a game they haven't played in over half a year. Maybe their comments are accurate about how the game WAS, but I actually play it NOW. Read that agian- I ACTUALLY PLAY THE GAME NOW. And guess what. It's not that bad. It's pretty fun.

Yesterday as a matter of fact I was in a static with 6 friends from XI (Midgardsormr) who have all recently resubscribed. We had a BLAST. And most of those people had subs at start, quit because it sucked THEN, and just recently came back because it's GOTTEN MUCH BETTER. It's still not what XI was, but for those who can't get into WoW or SWTOR, or who want a Final Fantasy feel, XIV works just fine.

So, no, I am not killing XIV. It's the people who have no idea what they are talking about when they discuss a game they don't play are damaging XIV by poo pooing on anyone who attempts to say anything good about it. By trying to steer people away from a game that has improved vastly since the last time they played. Please don't list the arguments again, I know what they are. But I, who actually play the game, also know that it is fully functional, and quite enjoyable if you can grow up a bit let go of the resentment you hold for how the game was at launch.
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#137 Feb 20 2012 at 8:23 AM Rating: Default
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
BlynkTheSneak wrote:
Here's an image of how terrible you are at following a conversation. That should explain everything, I think.


Again, XI was 'substituted' because you spoke previously about it and because it is relevant to how SE would define their MMO as being a success. There are a lot of words you could use to describe XIV, but successful is not one of them. Obvious reason to leave it out of the discussion completely.

Although I read and remembered each of those posts, thanks for the lining them all up like that. It's like a chronological recount of how you continue to make an *** of yourself. /bravo




Edited, Feb 20th 2012 3:13am by FilthMcNasty


1. No one is trying to define FFXIV as a success. This is why you nothing you say is making sense.

2. You can't take two conversations about completely different things and meld them together to fit your argument.
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#138 Feb 20 2012 at 8:42 AM Rating: Good
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BlynkTheSneak wrote:
LillithaFenimore wrote:
You can't judge Skyrim as a stand alone game. Skyrim is just a chapter in the TES series. You actually should be judging the series as one. The series goes from province to province. Main lore does not change, races don't change, race abilities don't change. Bethesda has created a very lifelike world and is constantly building on it. It's as if you are playing a history book in video game format. And from chapter to chapter the world of Nirm is changing from 6th House return with Dagoth Ur to Mankar Cameron and Mehrunes Dagon's evil plot to break through from his realm onto Nirn, and then the civil war in Skyrim taking place while a time rift was broken through due to The Elder Scroll.
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LillithaFenimore wrote:
Skyrim may have its issues, but stale and reused terrain is not one of them, especially compared to the broken and convoluted plot of FFXIV. I am on my third run through of Skyrim. While it isn't the best out of TES: III-V, it certainly is better and more in depth in story and things to do than FFXIV.

You back your argument up for Skyrim having good terrain with "it certainly is better and more in depth in story and things to do than FFXIV.". That is a terrible argument, and I think you might not understand what terrain even is.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/terrain
Merriam-Webster's definition of terrain.

And I never said the terrain in Skyrim was good. I never even insinuated that in my post. I said it wasn't a reused terrain.

There are five types of terrain in Skyrim. "Skyrim features many different terrain types, including tundra plains, forests, highlands and mountainous regions. It is the most rugged region in the continent; not only containing five of the highest peaks in Tamriel, Skyrim is also very snowy and cold. Only in the western reaches are there some measure of flat land, where most of the population resides. The rest of Skyrim is vertical; mountains, cliffs, and deep valleys." - http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Skyrim

The terrain of Skyrim, if you have even played it at all, is different from region to region and from hold to hold. If you are possibly referring to the mountainous regions being "reused", I havn't really seen much evidence of that other than it's snowy...all the time... High Hrothgar is snowy, Labrythia area *sp?* snowy and annoying due to frost trolls...I hate frost trolls, The Tomb of Ysgramor, snowy area, and also situated right next to a body of water where there is a sunken boat :D *Still havn't explored the underwater terrain of Skyrim yet. If you are near White Run, I have yet to see it snow there. Same in Riften...now snow there...

And the story in the TES series, is far better and more connected than that of FFXIV. Again, you can't judge Skyrim story as a stand alone since it is one part in a series of chapters in the history of Tamriel. The Nord province is known for it's harshness and ruggedness. This is even prevenlent in the attitudes of the nordic people found in Morrwind and Cyrodill with their very proud and boisterous sound of their greetings.

If you read any of the books found in the games, you will see that there are books that typically predate that game. For example Starlover's Log is a book found in Morrowind that is in reference to TES: Battlespire. http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Books The same goes for Oblivion, there is reference of the Nerveraine amongst chattering folk in Cyrodill, and the same goes for Skyrim, there is a book referencing the Oblivion Crisis.

So, to say the world of Skyrim is stale, you might as well be calling the entire TES series, stale, and to many who do play, that clearly isn't the case. However, I have heard that this isn't their favorite game in the series, and is definately not the best segment of TES:III-V, but to call Skyrim stale, just isn't there.

However, from someone who probably doesn't follow the TES series well, you might want to go here to check it out. http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Skyrim That site has a ton of information of the lore of not only Skyrim, but of ALL the TES chapters. For me to type it up here a synopsis of the entire lore of Nirn would just give me a headache cause you probably won't even appreciate the work I put into writing it. So go to that link. And if you want to read EVERY SINGLE BOOK in the series without having to look at the games...http://www.imperial-library.info/ We have a link for that too :D.

Now...I know FFXIV can't say the same when it comes to storyline, especially across the FF series since each one is a new game with absolutely no connectivity what so ever.

So again...I know Skyrim may have it's issues...but to reiterate...re-used terrain and stale world...is not one of them...
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#139 Feb 20 2012 at 9:10 AM Rating: Good
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Perrin, ****** Superhero wrote:
The Official PS Mag has had XIV in the top 3 of the most wanted games for the last 5 or 6 issues, so there's definately alot of people out there that want it at least.


There is no point posting facts as they are all to busy arguing amongst themselves about swtor.
#140 Feb 20 2012 at 10:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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Picomaan wrote:
Perrin, ****** Superhero wrote:
The Official PS Mag has had XIV in the top 3 of the most wanted games for the last 5 or 6 issues, so there's definately alot of people out there that want it at least.


There is no point posting facts as they are all to busy arguing amongst themselves about swtor.


This is definitely a case of PODIH. There is honestly no way I could believe this when even famitsu doesn't have 14 as a top wanted game on their 25. Or mind you... anyone else. Maybe you were reading a magazine from a year and a half ago?
#141 Feb 20 2012 at 1:38 PM Rating: Default
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MippsCat wrote:
Picomaan wrote:
Perrin, ****** Superhero wrote:
The Official PS Mag has had XIV in the top 3 of the most wanted games for the last 5 or 6 issues, so there's definately alot of people out there that want it at least.


There is no point posting facts as they are all to busy arguing amongst themselves about swtor.


This is definitely a case of PODIH. There is honestly no way I could believe this when even famitsu doesn't have 14 as a top wanted game on their 25. Or mind you... anyone else. Maybe you were reading a magazine from a year and a half ago?


I don't know how they voted for that list on Famitsu, but if it's user-voted than I wouldn't look into those results very much. The DQX hype is overshadowing XIV hard in Japan right now. If you stuck those two in a room together and asked the fanbase to pick, 99 out of 100 would pick DQX. That doesn't mean people aren't also excited about XIV.
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#142 Feb 20 2012 at 1:50 PM Rating: Default
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Everyones bad mouthing XIV no one seems to realize all XI is now is a relic grind fest, theres not even any substance anymore to enjoy your relic after achieving it.

I have a farsha and was half way to guttler before i quit, xi was just a relic grind, thats all itll be until its dead and buried, or at least turns into the next diablo 2 f2p.

XI was a fun game for 8 years but TBH i enjoy 14 a lot more now. and i was one to install the game and go wtf is this **** (during beta). then proceed to hop on the XI train again.
#143 Feb 20 2012 at 2:10 PM Rating: Good
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I don't hate xiv. I just personally feel terminally bored and indifferent to it. Seriously, if the most I can muster is "...", then that's absolutely worse than hatred. At least with hatred, there's some sort of feeling being evoked.

Every time I logged in, it just felt so bland, empty, flat and pointless. Nothing was interesting. Nothing had a point. It was just... very poorly executed milquetoast.

Edited, Feb 20th 2012 3:12pm by hexaemeron
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#144 Feb 20 2012 at 2:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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BlynkTheSneak wrote:
MippsCat wrote:
Picomaan wrote:
Perrin, ****** Superhero wrote:
The Official PS Mag has had XIV in the top 3 of the most wanted games for the last 5 or 6 issues, so there's definately alot of people out there that want it at least.


There is no point posting facts as they are all to busy arguing amongst themselves about swtor.


This is definitely a case of PODIH. There is honestly no way I could believe this when even famitsu doesn't have 14 as a top wanted game on their 25. Or mind you... anyone else. Maybe you were reading a magazine from a year and a half ago?


I don't know how they voted for that list on Famitsu, but if it's user-voted than I wouldn't look into those results very much. The DQX hype is overshadowing XIV hard in Japan right now. If you stuck those two in a room together and asked the fanbase to pick, 99 out of 100 would pick DQX. That doesn't mean people aren't also excited about XIV.


I am seeing that too.. something tells me Square Enix is close to letting FFXIV die in the event DQX becomes wildly successful.. There is no way FFIV can redeem itself, by the time 2.0 goes live, old players would've already abandoned ship and new players would read the old reviews and completely passed up on even trying the game..

Super ultra hard core fans will still be playing no doubt, but I just can't realistically see new players joining in for 2.0.. A few new giant game release during the release of 2.0 can very well make FFXIV game update go completely unnoticed.. PS3 release won't save FFXIV, you are delusional if you believe it will.. Just look at the current FFXIV population, it has about the same numbers of people playing as Dungeon defenders on steam...

Let's take this in to perspective.. compare FFXIV population to
http://store.steampowered.com/stats/

Won't even make top 20 on steam most played games.. those aren't even MMOs..

Makes me wonder how square enix is sustaining server cost :\

Call me pessimistic, but I see FFXIV as a lost cause... the 2.0 patch has to completely reform the entire game, the landscape has to completely be remixed, and gameplay be completely changed.. **** FFXIV can't even play the graphics card anymore.. Look at tera online... I won't be surprised if Square enix drops FFXIV and port DQX to pc.. and transfer all old FFXIV to DQX.. That would seem more logical and financially sound then trying to medically revive a dead horse.
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#145 Feb 20 2012 at 3:14 PM Rating: Excellent
Quote:
Call me pessimistic, but I see FFXIV as a lost cause... the 2.0 patch has to completely reform the entire game, the landscape has to completely be remixed, and gameplay be completely changed.. **** FFXIV can't even play the graphics card anymore.. Look at tera online... I won't be surprised if Square enix drops FFXIV and port DQX to pc.. and transfer all old FFXIV to DQX.. That would seem more logical and financially sound then trying to medically revive a dead horse.


It's so hard to say at this point. Everything rides on 2.0. Really, if the revised game is totally awesome, I think enough people will come back/start up to make the game at least as viable as FFXI.

Also, I've said this before, and I'll keep on saying it: Never underestimate the power of marketing. We have no insider information on how SE plans to market the re-release of this game, and the company's marketing efforts have been slim in the past... but a smart, well-planned marketing effort could easily recreate the excitement this game had going into its original launch.

From the outside looking in, though, I'd say the odds are certainly stacked against SE.

EDIT: Another thing to consider is that FFXIII-2 has actually received pretty good reviews, which can be used to promote a perception that SE is turning things around.

Edited, Feb 20th 2012 1:15pm by Thayos
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#146 Feb 20 2012 at 4:31 PM Rating: Good
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RippedApart wrote:
Everyones bad mouthing XIV no one seems to realize all XI is now is a relic grind fest, theres not even any substance anymore to enjoy your relic after achieving it.

I have a farsha and was half way to guttler before i quit, xi was just a relic grind, thats all itll be until its dead and buried, or at least turns into the next diablo 2 f2p.

XI was a fun game for 8 years but TBH i enjoy 14 a lot more now. and i was one to install the game and go wtf is this sh*t (during beta). then proceed to hop on the XI train again.
The problem is some want FFXIV to be that all over again instead of realizing you can make a game with gear that you can work towards without it taking years and years. I think Yoshida is trying his hardest to please everyone, and that has a high chance of success, but also a high chance of blowing up in his face.
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#147 Feb 20 2012 at 5:13 PM Rating: Excellent
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RippedApart wrote:
Everyones bad mouthing XIV no one seems to realize all XI is now is a relic grind fest, theres not even any substance anymore to enjoy your relic after achieving it.

I have a farsha and was half way to guttler before i quit, xi was just a relic grind, thats all itll be until its dead and buried, or at least turns into the next diablo 2 f2p.

XI was a fun game for 8 years but TBH i enjoy 14 a lot more now. and i was one to install the game and go wtf is this sh*t (during beta). then proceed to hop on the XI train again.


FFXI is an aging game. In fact, it's nearing 10 years since Japanese release (9 for North America). It might not receive significant content any more such as new zones or a full fledged campaign storyline, which might make it less appealing for people who've been playing since release and done it all, but honestly, that's alright. I don't expect to play a good game for my entire life time, and I don't expect the developers to make it their top priority for that long either. It's ok to play a good game for some months or years, enjoy all the content it has to offer, and quit the game feeling good about the experience it gave you when it was in its prime.

Edited, Feb 20th 2012 6:15pm by Susanoh
#148 Feb 20 2012 at 7:46 PM Rating: Decent
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BlynkTheStink wrote:
1. No one is trying to define FFXIV as a success. This is why you nothing you say is making sense.


Yet several people including yourself have discussed the topic. Relevant discussion is relevant?

BlynkTheStink wrote:
2. You can't take two conversations about completely different things and meld them together to fit your argument.


I don't argue with people who try base their opinions on **** they made up. No point in it. I tried to give you the benefit of the doubt that you would be able to follow the posts since they're simple, but I guess I overestimated you. Shame on me.
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Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#149 Feb 20 2012 at 11:45 PM Rating: Excellent
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ChaChaJaJa wrote:
Actually, the "rays of sunshine" I mentioned in my post are the ones who are actively trying to chase people away from a game THEY DON'T EVEN PLAY. Have you read the posts on here over the past few months? Every single time someone inquires about the game you get the following:

Players who have either returned or just started playing for the first time say things like this: "The game is pretty fun. It still needs some work, but it's definitely entertaining at this point. Graphics are beautiful. And it's really cheap to play right now. Give it a shot. I am enjoying myself"

Players who quit sometime last year and really don't know the current state of the game FIRSTHAND chime in and pretend to be experts with comments like this: "RUN AWAY. This game is doomed. It's no fun. You can't get a party. There is no functioning AH. 2.0 will fail. Anyone who plays is stupid." etc.

You have to understand the context of my point here. I've had run ins with both Hex and Lillitha for their relentless negativity about a game they haven't played in over half a year. Maybe their comments are accurate about how the game WAS, but I actually play it NOW. Read that agian- I ACTUALLY PLAY THE GAME NOW. And guess what. It's not that bad. It's pretty fun.

Yesterday as a matter of fact I was in a static with 6 friends from XI (Midgardsormr) who have all recently resubscribed. We had a BLAST. And most of those people had subs at start, quit because it sucked THEN, and just recently came back because it's GOTTEN MUCH BETTER. It's still not what XI was, but for those who can't get into WoW or SWTOR, or who want a Final Fantasy feel, XIV works just fine.

So, no, I am not killing XIV. It's the people who have no idea what they are talking about when they discuss a game they don't play are damaging XIV by poo pooing on anyone who attempts to say anything good about it. By trying to steer people away from a game that has improved vastly since the last time they played. Please don't list the arguments again, I know what they are. But I, who actually play the game, also know that it is fully functional, and quite enjoyable if you can grow up a bit let go of the resentment you hold for how the game was at launch.


I'm sure you're just doing what you think is right. But the bottom line is, there's one extremely powerful reason why I think you're wrong that FFXIV is so awesome:

They are merging the servers.

If the game was so great, this would be completely unnecessary. They'd be adding servers, not reducing their number. FFXIV is better than it was from the start, this is true, but the issue is it was so very bad in the beginning that even the significant improvements made are still not enough to be a competitive MMO.

What makes FFXIV good are friends who will stick it out and hope things get better in the future in the face of some trying times.

That said, you shouldn't blame people who want to talk about the "fail launch." New players and old players are going to want to assess whether or not to return to the game based on how badly it started and what they've done about it since. If people ward others from joining now, it's probably for the best. You'll just tell everyone to play now, which means there needs to be some sanity check to say, "Maybe 2.0 would be more to your liking. Have some patience." If people start too soon, they may be too disappointed to ever come back again (server merge, remember?). And least as long as people are talking about the game, there's interest in it.

Edited, Feb 21st 2012 12:46am by Xoie
#150 Feb 20 2012 at 11:52 PM Rating: Decent
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Xoie wrote:
I'm sure you're just doing what you think is right. But the bottom line is, there's one extremely powerful reason why I think you're wrong that FFXIV is so awesome:

They are merging the servers.


Unfortunately it is very very hard to find any MMO that has not merged server. Finest example from 2011 would be Rift, one that people (including Trion) called successful, 2nd biggest MMO in the West, one that had gone through server merge twice reducing their capability to 1/3 of their launch. By no means they had failed launch, mind you.
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#151 Feb 21 2012 at 2:12 AM Rating: Good
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Khornette wrote:
Xoie wrote:
I'm sure you're just doing what you think is right. But the bottom line is, there's one extremely powerful reason why I think you're wrong that FFXIV is so awesome:

They are merging the servers.


Unfortunately it is very very hard to find any MMO that has not merged server. Finest example from 2011 would be Rift, one that people (including Trion) called successful, 2nd biggest MMO in the West, one that had gone through server merge twice reducing their capability to 1/3 of their launch. By no means they had failed launch, mind you.


Rift had a good start, but their premise was a risky one. They set out to steal WoW players, and for a time, they did. But getting WoW players is one thing, keeping them is another. It's foolish to think you can steal WoW players and not consider Blizzard would try to steal them back.
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