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To POP, or not to POP?... That is the question.Follow

#1 Mar 26 2012 at 4:56 PM Rating: Decent
Lets take a vote!
Who wants competitive NMs that POP and drop the best gear?
Yes or No?

Mind you... the rest of the gear would still exist for the casual crowd.
#2 Mar 26 2012 at 5:30 PM Rating: Decent
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Nope. It's the single reason why I left FFXI back in CoP. Instancing can be as challenging, if not moreso, without the necessity of breeding unfriendly competition between LS's, not to mention that there are plenty of players whose lives do not allow them to schedule playtime around respawn timers. Instancing solves all of these problems.

And honestly, if the goal is still to make FFXIV viable and spread popularity, this isn't going to do anything to help.
#3 Mar 26 2012 at 5:32 PM Rating: Decent
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Nope.
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#4 Mar 26 2012 at 5:42 PM Rating: Decent
MMOs are fashion shows... It's all about having cooler gear than the guy next to you.
The more ways you can tell at first glance who has the bigger E-Peen the better.

Extreme competition between LS's is only possible if there is equally extreme cohesion within each.
That level of teamwork and comradery is only forged in the fires of competition.

POPs also help solve the "what now" part of endgame.
#5 Mar 26 2012 at 5:43 PM Rating: Good
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ashuriancandidate wrote:
Lets take a vote!
Who wants competitive NMs that POP and drop the best gear?
Yes or No?

Mind you... the rest of the gear would still exist for the casual crowd.


Your idea has some merit, but we all know how the implementation worked in practice in FFXI: It turned into a competition of who could cheat the best. It's really not the spirit of competition I'd like to see. There must be better ideas for a competitive event between linkshells for worthy prizes that don't reward dirty tricks and sleepless nights. Like, the shell who kills Ifrit the fastest is granted a sweet privilege, or things like that.

In the meantime, instanced mobs are a much better solution, in my opinion, especially since the "old guard" has limited playtime and the "new kids" have no attention span. Smiley: lol

Edited, Mar 26th 2012 7:48pm by Xoie
#6 Mar 26 2012 at 5:54 PM Rating: Decent
Good points... However I think alot of the cons are pros...
ex:
The feeling of being completely lost/overwhelmed is awesome to me
The feeling I will NEVER get an item... <-love


All those negatives make success feel real to me...
Otherwise i'm just another guy Qing for a handout.
#7 Mar 26 2012 at 5:58 PM Rating: Good
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Like pimples, popping NMs may give momentary satisfaction and relief but could ultimately lead to scarring and infection.
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#8 Mar 26 2012 at 6:03 PM Rating: Good
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Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous drop-rates...

(edit: I forgot to say that I like open-world NMs.)


Edited, Mar 26th 2012 8:04pm by KaneKitty
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#9 Mar 26 2012 at 6:42 PM Rating: Decent
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NMs that pop in open-world and drop the best gear? Sure, if it's in a faction leve or something and points or a key item is used to spawn it.

As long as it's not a free-for-all cheat/bot fest.
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#10 Mar 26 2012 at 6:42 PM Rating: Default
Or to take arms against a sea of NMs
And by opposing end them.... for loot ;)
#11 Mar 26 2012 at 6:43 PM Rating: Good
UltKnightGrover wrote:
NMs that pop in open-world and drop the best gear? Sure, if it's in a faction leve or something and points or a key item is used to spawn it.

As long as it's not a free-for-all cheat/bot fest.


The real problem appears to be "cheaters/bot fest" Not the open-world NM itself.
#12 Mar 26 2012 at 7:05 PM Rating: Good
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ashuriancandidate wrote:
UltKnightGrover wrote:
NMs that pop in open-world and drop the best gear? Sure, if it's in a faction leve or something and points or a key item is used to spawn it.

As long as it's not a free-for-all cheat/bot fest.


The real problem appears to be "cheaters/bot fest" Not the open-world NM itself.


Right... but as a rule, you can't have one without the other. I absolutely HATED pop NM's in FFXI. They started implementing quests that took the place of certain items, which was nice, shortly before I stopped playing. You can also argue that pop NM's have a big influence on RMT, which i also despise.

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#13 Mar 26 2012 at 8:36 PM Rating: Decent
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I know I've already said this, but it bears repeating: If you want to limit your player base, world pop NMs are a great start. I may be off base here, but I think the majority of players would prefer to for FFXIV to retain the feel, atmosphere, and storytelling of FFXI, but to give it the modern conveniences of other major current generation MMOs. That means instances.

No one should be excluded from end game content merely because they can't be awake at 4:00 a.m. People have jobs and lives. I loved it in college when I didn't give a ****, but it's just not doable for most people.
#14 Mar 26 2012 at 8:58 PM Rating: Decent
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Pfft... Silly Op...we don't have lives >.>; Our life is gaming...duh! *sarcasm u kan haz eet*
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#15 Mar 26 2012 at 9:54 PM Rating: Excellent
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I would like to see a mixture of both....I miss fighting the world NMs for drops. Frankly I am pretty disappointed we haven't seen any new ones added. The ones we have now are fun but most of the gear you get from them is garbage ------> Mosshorn Scale Mail which looks fantastic but its best bonus attribute is GATHERING +16....which makes all the sense in the world because we all like to look good while gathering ><
#16 Mar 27 2012 at 12:19 AM Rating: Excellent
I rarely ever did open-world pop NM camping... just couldn't stomach standing around for hours, knowing the NM would eventually be claimed by whichever ls had the most expensive bot.

However, I do wish they could be a part of FFXIV. There's definitely a hardcore NM-hunting sect of gamers who really enjoy waiting around for hours on end, in hopes they may be the lucky ones to get that gear with the .01 percent chance of dropping in any given week.

If there's a market for that playstyle -- even if it's very small -- then I say feed it. Introduce some gear drops that have stats comparable with gear found in instanced raids. This adds more variety of gear to the game, and also more ways to gear up your character.

That kind of thing isn't for me, but that doesn't mean others shouldn't enjoy hardcore NM camping.
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#17 Mar 27 2012 at 12:20 AM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
Mind you... the rest of the gear would still exist for the casual crowd


as long as I am not considered LOL GIMP for not having that ludicrous to obtain gear, then I say let the hardcore players have at it. (ffxi OLD thief knife lol) Let them have their "fun" and camp. A huge time sink for gear obsessed people. I like to run into the occasional person in town that is showing off his epeen I like to look at it (no ****) even if I'll never get it.

Maybe one the hardcore players will be in my party someday. If they have that pop gear, then I consider myself to "have it" if only for a moment. Someone's 36 hours of camping helps me get what I want = a small win on my part.

Also I like randomly running into rare NMs, a good suprising WTF IS THAT?!!? moment makes your bland 186th trip to camp skull valley a memorable one.

/ls "Oh **** guys! I was on my way to camp skull valley when the SKULLF**8ER popped and pwned my newb ***, you know the one that drops that ultra rare peeni.... er.. sword that xxxseferothxxx wanted?

Edited, Mar 27th 2012 2:24am by klooste8
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#18 Mar 27 2012 at 12:57 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'm going to go with no, personally. The classic FFXI style open world NM competition has too much going against it for me to support it. It involves a great deal of waiting around, is heavily botted if botting is an option, suggests that people plan their time around the game rather than the other way around, and the most difficult part of competitive open world NMs (claiming it) usually isn't even related to the stats on the gear (which are usually to help you perform better in PVE content, not claiming).

In FFXI, I saw people who had unlimited free time get decked out in the best equipment (talking pre-Abyssea, more so the earlier days). I also saw people who didn't have quite as much free time, but were just amazing at doing their jobs and could put most other players to shame, such as the mage who kept on top of every single buff/debuff, or the ninja whose utsusemi management was unparalleled. You other FFXI players probably know people like this yourselves. Ideally I'd to see this divide abolished. Give the players who are good enough the opportunity to get the best gear without forcing them to plan their day around the game's world spawn. Let everyone obtain the best gear by participating in activities and collectively playing well enough to pull it off. No ridiculous spawn times, no crazy currency requirements, just an entrance to a high level area with enemies who will smash your face if you're not careful (not talking ridiculous elitist levels, just something that requires proper strategy and teamwork). By completing challenging content, that makes you deserving of having the best that combat classes can obtain.

On a side note, I'm alright with crafting being involved in the best equipment at times too. If crafting is to remain important, and with some classes focusing primarily on the creation on weapons and armor, it needs to have some highly desired stuff to remain relevant and balanced.
#19 Mar 27 2012 at 2:48 AM Rating: Good
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If they make those very special NM drops exclusive then I do not see why it would attract RMT. That was the problem with FFXI in the first place: to be able to sell your leaping boots, emperor's hairpin, peacock charm etc.

Leaves me with this issue:

klooste8 wrote:
as long as I am not considered LOL GIMP for not having that ludicrous to obtain gear, then I say let the hardcore players have at it. (ffxi OLD thief knife lol)


And indeed... I'm afraid that before you know it we will have to have this and that gear in order to be invited or not be replaced by someone who did have the time to camp NM X for weeks. IF SE does introduce those NM's with special drops, then please make their drops not Ithat much better than the best obtainable gear elsewhere or indeed, let specific NM's drop exactly the same gear you can only get with the help of an alliance. That way people who aren't able to join alliances for some reason can at least have a shot at it as well.

Something like that should work fine I guess.
#20 Mar 27 2012 at 4:38 AM Rating: Decent
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Thayos wrote:
I rarely ever did open-world pop NM camping... just couldn't stomach standing around for hours, knowing the NM would eventually be claimed by whichever ls had the most expensive bot.

However, I do wish they could be a part of FFXIV. There's definitely a hardcore NM-hunting sect of gamers who really enjoy waiting around for hours on end, in hopes they may be the lucky ones to get that gear with the .01 percent chance of dropping in any given week.

If there's a market for that playstyle -- even if it's very small -- then I say feed it. Introduce some gear drops that have stats comparable with gear found in instanced raids. This adds more variety of gear to the game, and also more ways to gear up your character.

That kind of thing isn't for me, but that doesn't mean others shouldn't enjoy hardcore NM camping.


I agree fully with this. Personally I am one who loves NM camping and everything about it, sure the wait can be tedious, but oh so worth the wait when it spawns. Like you say though the gear doesn't have to be better than what you can get in instanced raids, if anything make it comparable or exactly the same, but maybe with a different look? Like you say it gives the opportunity for variety which is never a bad thing and it also gives something to both sides. The ones who don't want to camp don't have to and the ones who do can. The way I see it this would be win-win.
#21 Mar 27 2012 at 4:46 AM Rating: Decent
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Wasting hours of sleep for a 4 am pop?
That's about 10 years behind me.
#22 Mar 27 2012 at 5:56 AM Rating: Decent
It seems pretty split... how about a sub-question?

Would you approve of the world NM's dropping unique crafting supplies?
Perhaps all the ingredients for a unique item would be spread across multiple NMs?
All the items would have to be unsellable, to discourage the bottling/gil selling crowd.

The Items wouldn't be that much better than the "casual best".
I feel the hardcore player deserves post endgame content, just as the fringe gamer deserves the eye candy to spark aspiration.
#23 Mar 27 2012 at 7:42 AM Rating: Excellent
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Now I will say I am not for this sort of camping. However I do know people like doing this... Gluttons for punishment if you ask me.

If they add this, I would expect them to add these NMS that you can fight kind of bcnmish and get the same item just as a rare/Ex item. Again, I'm for balancing the various play styles.

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#24 Mar 27 2012 at 8:58 AM Rating: Decent
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The Brown and black Belt quests were a great series of open world NMs, and included three of the first Mega-NMs (King Behemoth, Adamantiose, and was it Fafnir? I can never remember the third) introduced to the game.

None of them could be soloed, and while the Brown Belt NMs could be killed by 2-3 ppl, they still required a level of focus and skill (especially if you tried for them at level), and well, mobs like King Behemoth were insanely viscous, as I remember a time when someone MPKed every HNMLS on carbuncle for over an hour in a completely blood-bath of no control.

These were fun fights, that while, there are obvious concerns about RMT claims, I can't imagine any team of bots surviving a fight like those. And while bot claiming would still be an issue, there would still be a competitive edge.

Right now, there is nothing in 14 to be competitive about. Everything worth getting is incredibly rare, random chance of obtaining items that take more patience then skill.

Some good HNM Open World NMs with drops that people want would definitely go a long way towards changing that.

Think of how long people had been farming Kirin's drops, or went for the kill of king Arthro, or that stupid beetle Lumber Jack, or the Axe Beak. These mobs were never over-farmed (ok, in the very beginning), but they were still a fun fight, and I had helped people with them from time to time.

While Kirin was less of an Open World NM, it was controlled by first fighting Open World NMs, then moving to Kirin, in a chain that kept people killing for years.

And yes, while there were the Serkets, and the Cockatrice (forgot his name, right out in Saramounge, on the ledge), the Tonberry for the Fuma Katana, and a few others, where the competition was as high as the resale of the item, it still allowed for people to get their own, or people to profit off their time dedicated to getting it.

Without the ability to do something like that, there is less sense of reward. The game just is missing that need to get things.

I have been working on crafting my own sword, and it's probably a good thing, since I have spent less time working on getting my blacksmith up, than killing ifrit, and while I am only one level away from attempting my sword, I only have one ifrit drop, and it's a weapon I will most likely never use (but at least it means I never have to get/craft a weapon for that class/job).

I see the issue that Yoshi has with this, everyone claims that they don't want open-world NMs because they don't want botters to control their ability to get the item, but at the same time, people want something to aspire to, something to go into the game and do.

I enjoyed sitting for hours waiting for spawn windows to open so I could help my wife get her Smn thingy from the invisible Weapon mob.

I liked sitting out and camping my spelunker's hat (which I never got in the 3 years of camping that dang mob).

And when I quit the 11, people still hadn't solved the mystery of how to get the king apkallu thing to pop (or at least I couldn't find anyone who knew).

I think the Open World NM option creates competition, but, at the same time, it also gets people to band together for a common goal. It takes away the Linkshell elitism, as you can now have you and a couple friends go out and kill, rather than be bound by your linkshell schedule vs real-life schedule.

And mostly, it gives people something to do. The Emp hairpin, while one of the most annoying camps in all of 11, was one of the most rewarding items to get. It had a horribly random drop rate, and typically had 8-10 people camping it. If you could pull off a kill life was good, if you could get a drop, life was great.
#25 Mar 27 2012 at 9:43 AM Rating: Decent
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rfolkker wrote:
The Brown and black Belt quests were a great series of open world NMs, and included three of the first Mega-NMs (King Behemoth, Adamantiose, and was it Fafnir? I can never remember the third) introduced to the game.

None of them could be soloed, and while the Brown Belt NMs could be killed by 2-3 ppl, they still required a level of focus and skill (especially if you tried for them at level), and well, mobs like King Behemoth were insanely viscous, as I remember a time when someone MPKed every HNMLS on carbuncle for over an hour in a completely blood-bath of no control.

These were fun fights, that while, there are obvious concerns about RMT claims, I can't imagine any team of bots surviving a fight like those. And while bot claiming would still be an issue, there would still be a competitive edge.

Right now, there is nothing in 14 to be competitive about. Everything worth getting is incredibly rare, random chance of obtaining items that take more patience then skill.

Some good HNM Open World NMs with drops that people want would definitely go a long way towards changing that.

Think of how long people had been farming Kirin's drops, or went for the kill of king Arthro, or that stupid beetle Lumber Jack, or the Axe Beak. These mobs were never over-farmed (ok, in the very beginning), but they were still a fun fight, and I had helped people with them from time to time.

While Kirin was less of an Open World NM, it was controlled by first fighting Open World NMs, then moving to Kirin, in a chain that kept people killing for years.

And yes, while there were the Serkets, and the Cockatrice (forgot his name, right out in Saramounge, on the ledge), the Tonberry for the Fuma Katana, and a few others, where the competition was as high as the resale of the item, it still allowed for people to get their own, or people to profit off their time dedicated to getting it.

Without the ability to do something like that, there is less sense of reward. The game just is missing that need to get things.

I have been working on crafting my own sword, and it's probably a good thing, since I have spent less time working on getting my blacksmith up, than killing ifrit, and while I am only one level away from attempting my sword, I only have one ifrit drop, and it's a weapon I will most likely never use (but at least it means I never have to get/craft a weapon for that class/job).

I see the issue that Yoshi has with this, everyone claims that they don't want open-world NMs because they don't want botters to control their ability to get the item, but at the same time, people want something to aspire to, something to go into the game and do.

I enjoyed sitting for hours waiting for spawn windows to open so I could help my wife get her Smn thingy from the invisible Weapon mob.

I liked sitting out and camping my spelunker's hat (which I never got in the 3 years of camping that dang mob).

And when I quit the 11, people still hadn't solved the mystery of how to get the king apkallu thing to pop (or at least I couldn't find anyone who knew).

I think the Open World NM option creates competition, but, at the same time, it also gets people to band together for a common goal. It takes away the Linkshell elitism, as you can now have you and a couple friends go out and kill, rather than be bound by your linkshell schedule vs real-life schedule.

And mostly, it gives people something to do. The Emp hairpin, while one of the most annoying camps in all of 11, was one of the most rewarding items to get. It had a horribly random drop rate, and typically had 8-10 people camping it. If you could pull off a kill life was good, if you could get a drop, life was great.


You can create competition and a sense of accomplishment without having to sit mindlessly staring at a screen, spamming a macro, hoping to pull a mob that 10+ other people are trying to pull. I know the feeling you're talking about, and it's great, but the problems it creates vastly outweigh the benefits. The kind of problems it creates drive people to other games.

And for those who are saying that NM camping is some kind of post-end game content, to that I say just add more meaningful endgame content. I don't consider farming to be endgame content. It's farming. If you're that desperate for something to do, perhaps level another class, or play another game while you wait for more content. I will say that if all of these items are rare/ex or otherwise not saleable, then I have much less of a problem with open world NMs.

In the first two years of FFXI, I watched things like the Peacock Necklace go from 1,000,000 gil to 25,000,000 due to RMT and botting. I know SE took steps to correct this in later years, but by then, it was too late for a lot of us. It wrecked the economy and drove a lot of players away. At best, the idea of open world NMs is controversial amongst just the players in this thread. Hence, if the goal is still to salvage this game and bring in a broad enough player base to keep it alive, this idea should not be implemented anytime soon, if at all.

On the bright side for you would-be campers, if everything goes well and the FFXI masses flock to FFXIV, you could always play FFXI and have those mobs all to yourself. :D

Edited, Mar 27th 2012 11:44am by StasisKorial
#26 Mar 27 2012 at 11:53 AM Rating: Good
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Pop HNM or NMS should never drop the best gear of the game Period. This is 2012 not 1996, we have moved far far away from those mechanics, also take in consideration that back in the day, HNM where a joke as far as the battle was concerned, the hardest part was actually getting a claim on the mob, not the mob itself, also the LS used to have a monopoly on this mobs, and would sell the loot for gil, there also where the RMT problems etc etc.

So on today's MMO, they have no place as being the main drop of best gear, that should be left to instanced bosses, where everybody has the same chance at getting them, that is not to say Pop HNM have no place in the game, but not dropping the best gear, they can drop other stuff, like mounts, rare mats, or stuff like that, but top tier gear is a big NO NO!
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#27 Mar 27 2012 at 3:23 PM Rating: Decent
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Ostia wrote:
Pop HNM or NMS should never drop the best gear of the game Period. This is 2012 not 1996, we have moved far far away from those mechanics, also take in consideration that back in the day, HNM where a joke as far as the battle was concerned, the hardest part was actually getting a claim on the mob, not the mob itself, also the LS used to have a monopoly on this mobs, and would sell the loot for gil, there also where the RMT problems etc etc.

So on today's MMO, they have no place as being the main drop of best gear, that should be left to instanced bosses, where everybody has the same chance at getting them, that is not to say Pop HNM have no place in the game, but not dropping the best gear, they can drop other stuff, like mounts, rare mats, or stuff like that, but top tier gear is a big NO NO!


This is a very fair compromise. I agree with you that the reality of MMOs today does not include NM camping for gear. It would be running in the opposite direction of every other major MMO out there when FFXIV already has an uphill battle to climb against the competition.
#28 Mar 27 2012 at 11:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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ashuriancandidate wrote:
It seems pretty split... how about a sub-question?

Would you approve of the world NM's dropping unique crafting supplies?
Perhaps all the ingredients for a unique item would be spread across multiple NMs?
All the items would have to be unsellable, to discourage the bottling/gil selling crowd.

The Items wouldn't be that much better than the "casual best".
I feel the hardcore player deserves post endgame content, just as the fringe gamer deserves the eye candy to spark aspiration.


I wouldn't mind if pop NMs are in the game but I don't think they should have any of the best equipment. Competitive pop NMs in the forms we've seen them keep you waiting for extended periods of time doing nothing by design. Why would such an activity reward the best equipment over activities that involve actual gameplay the majority of the time?

I'd prefer to see world spawns drop aesthetic items or titles/achievments. Swords with flames, skulls, or whatever people are finding cool these days, that have roughly the same stats if not the exact same stats as end game alternatives. But I don't think it should be at all statistically better. Competitive world spawns are a niche that not everyone enjoys and I see no reason to encourage players who have zero interest in playing the waiting game in order to have the statistically best equipment available.
#29 Mar 28 2012 at 1:29 AM Rating: Decent
Susanoh wrote:
ashuriancandidate wrote:
It seems pretty split... how about a sub-question?

Would you approve of the world NM's dropping unique crafting supplies?
Perhaps all the ingredients for a unique item would be spread across multiple NMs?
All the items would have to be unsellable, to discourage the bottling/gil selling crowd.

The Items wouldn't be that much better than the "casual best".
I feel the hardcore player deserves post endgame content, just as the fringe gamer deserves the eye candy to spark aspiration.


I wouldn't mind if pop NMs are in the game but I don't think they should have any of the best equipment. Competitive pop NMs in the forms we've seen them keep you waiting for extended periods of time doing nothing by design. Why would such an activity reward the best equipment over activities that involve actual gameplay the majority of the time?

I'd prefer to see world spawns drop aesthetic items or titles/achievments. Swords with flames, skulls, or whatever people are finding cool these days, that have roughly the same stats if not the exact same stats as end game alternatives. But I don't think it should be at all statistically better. Competitive world spawns are a niche that not everyone enjoys and I see no reason to encourage players who have zero interest in playing the waiting game in order to have the statistically best equipment available.



I think we are on to a solution...

You mention the world NMs dropping items with the same stats as endgame gear... with an alternative and unique look.

However... I feel there needs to be an additional benefit

Ex: cooldown for calling a unique mount or anything special... like a teleport to a hard to get to location.


Furthermore...
To make up for the mindless camp for those who's internal clocks aren't put to bliss by the amazing soundtrack... They could have the NM pop near a fishing area or somewhere people could occupy themselves.

That way people who aren’t even interested or aware of world NMs could get a glimpse at the spectacle... or help raise the dead... or join the fight....ect

Edited, Mar 28th 2012 3:30am by ashuriancandidate
#30 Mar 28 2012 at 3:06 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
To make up for the mindless camp,...

...no need to make up for a stupid mechanic that isn`t in the game.
#31 Mar 28 2012 at 5:17 AM Rating: Good
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It is funny to see how the people who want the world pops don't mind them not dropping anything that is better than other gear from instanced battles, but comparable or the same as long as the mechanic is in the game.

At the same time a few of the people who don't want these world pops seem to not want them in the game at all because they think it is a dated or stupid mechanic just because they themselves don't enjoy it (Several people here have said they don't like to do it, but think it would be okay to have in some way anyway, but a few just seem to be against in no matter what... at least that is how I read some posts here, but maybe I misunderstood).

Personally I really don't see any reason whatsoever as to why it would be a bad thing to have world pop HNMs/NMs that drop the exact same gear that is obtainable via instanced battles and have them be rare/ex. To me it seems like everyone gets what they want, unless what you want is for others to not get what they want. I would just like to hear the argument for the people who think it shouldn't be in the game no matter how it is implemented, what is the reasoning behind it.
#32 Mar 28 2012 at 5:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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Belcrono wrote:
Personally I really don't see any reason whatsoever as to why it would be a bad thing to have world pop HNMs/NMs that drop the exact same gear that is obtainable via instanced battles and have them be rare/ex.



Hey, that's basically what I wrote yesterday!

*wondering if he is finally onto something for a change*

Edited, Mar 28th 2012 9:46am by Woofdram
#33 Mar 28 2012 at 8:52 AM Rating: Good
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LillithaFenimore wrote:
Now I will say I am not for this sort of camping. However I do know people like doing this... Gluttons for punishment if you ask me.

If they add this, I would expect them to add these NMS that you can fight kind of bcnmish and get the same item just as a rare/Ex item. Again, I'm for balancing the various play styles.



Absolutely agree. There is some thrill to coming across an NM wandering around with no one around, but while I am not one that would like to sit there with my thumb up my *** for hours on end camping for one to spawn, I do understand there are people that do. Having both NM's and a BCNM-type event would appease both sides. Also agree with Ostia, the "best end all gear" should not come from pop HNM's.
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#34 Mar 28 2012 at 9:10 AM Rating: Excellent
33 posts
ashuriancandidate wrote:
I think we are on to a solution...

You mention the world NMs dropping items with the same stats as endgame gear... with an alternative and unique look.

However... I feel there needs to be an additional benefit

Ex: cooldown for calling a unique mount or anything special... like a teleport to a hard to get to location.


Furthermore...
To make up for the mindless camp for those who's internal clocks aren't put to bliss by the amazing soundtrack... They could have the NM pop near a fishing area or somewhere people could occupy themselves.

That way people who aren’t even interested or aware of world NMs could get a glimpse at the spectacle... or help raise the dead... or join the fight....ect

Edited, Mar 28th 2012 3:30am by ashuriancandidate


I am 100% for this compromise, and if there is a way to petition/submit it to SE, I'll gladly join. So long as the HNM gear does not affect RMT (make it rare/ex) and does not give statistical advantages to those who could get the same stats through BCNMs, instances, etc., but still gives world NM farmers a special, useful bonus of some sort for their accomplishments and time spent, I say go for it.

This way, endgame players are penalized in party effectiveness for not camping the gear, because they'll be able to get the same gear under a different name or with a different look to it through alternative endgame content. At the same time, those who camp get to look extra badass by having the rare-looking version, or they get a special bonus such as faster travel, unique mounts, titles, achievements, etc., so they still get rewarded for their efforts, still get the sense of accomplishment, but do not affect RMT or the overall game market as they did in FFXI. ****, I'd probably take part in NM farming under those conditions if I had some spare time to do it every now and then.

It really is the best of both worlds. And to be honest, some of the coolest moments I had playing FFXI were those times when you'd run across an HNM out of nowhere that you weren't expecting to be there, and I would miss that element of the game if it were gone. Shortly after Jormungar was added, we were going to an xp party at a camp near him and none of us knew he was there. I went on auto walk for about 20 seconds to quickly grab a drink. Everyone else in the group saw him and turned the other direction. When I got back to my computer he was coming straight at me. Freaked me out a little bit, and was completely hilarious. Maybe you had to be there, but it was one of the funniest things that happened while playing. The LS never let me live it down.
#35 Mar 28 2012 at 10:18 AM Rating: Excellent
***
2,214 posts
I think I would be happy if they had NMs that dropped items that could either get materia attachments, or was crafted into gear that could get materia, but had unique stats that other gear didn't have in the game.

That way, it's not the *best* gear in the game, but it has the potential to become equal or better to other gear if someone gets lucky.

This allows for farming, doesn't create an intrinsic value, and allows for crafters to join in the fun, and benefit from the items.

Would you farm an item endlessly for 100k? Probably not (some would, most wouldn't), however, if you were trying to craft it into something potent, you may need to get a dozen of them so you could try and get one that was worth 1m+.

But, that's my 2cents.
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