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#52 May 15 2012 at 1:17 AM Rating: Decent
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Can anyone name a game where they enjoy the journey from 1 to cap as an example?

Final Fantasy 11 until 2007.
But I guess you were expecting that answer.
#53 May 15 2012 at 1:45 AM Rating: Good
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rfolkker wrote:
The current game does need more, and more is promised, the Welcome back I don't think is geared towards people necessarily subscribing (the lifetime pricing implies otherwise), but rather, a pre-beta experience for people who got tossed by the initial release.


The problem with this is that everyone currently playing(maybe not all of them, but the vast majority) are spending time doing things that people who are eligible for the welcome back campaign can't do. The demographic you're speaking about are players who aren't high enough level to participate in additions made months ago, much less things like Ifrit/Moogle/Garuda. Yes this is all new content for them, but most who play now have moved on from this stuff to bigger and better.

Volta1 wrote:
I for one don't want XI reincarnate.


I agree, but obvious answer is obvious if you ask yourself... "Would SE have been better off making FFXI-2?"

Volta1 wrote:
I really don't get why people beef leveling up in this game. It's really not at all hard anymore, and there's plenty to do should you choose to pursue it. What's the complaint about? Can anyone name a game where they enjoy the journey from 1 to cap as an example?


It's not so much the difficulty as it is the journey. The 'side quests' are fragmented and leve quests don't have any progression to them. It may be a personal preference, but zones seem so much cleaner when there is a clear progression to them.

Example:

Clear a few beginner quests > gain a few levels and new abilities to learn and practice > final quest in that area advances the main story(or just concludes a chapter in that specific area) that then leads you to another area with higher level mobs, more quests, ect.

This might seem like hand-holding and it is to an extent, but it's honestly the best way to have quest chains and give your game a sense of progression. Your actions should have consequences and effect the world you play in. For that to happen, quest progression needs to be somewhat linear; at least to enough of a degree that you can progress a story or build up to an event that has some sort of meaning.

I can't honestly sit here and say I enjoyed any game's leveling process from start to finish. What I can say is that the parts of leveling in any game that were most enjoyable to me personally were those that included character progression as well as story progression. The SJ quest in XI is a good example and I'll expand on that in a bit. If I am able to clear quests that present a story all while gaining experience points, learning and experimenting with new abilities and being able to explore new areas along the way, it clicks. It just feels right.

Not sure if you all played XI, but imagine if you could have progressed through the start of the game solely by completing missions. You complete Rank 1 for your nation and come out pretty close to level 10. By the time you complete Rank 2 you are level 20. Rank 3 missions bring you up to level 25 for your final encounter with the 2-3 dragon BC. Now also imagine that these missions take you through viable camps on the way to attaining those levels. You're gaining exp, you're exploring new areas, you're matched to mobs around your level and you're progressing the main storyline. This is how it should be done at least at the beginning.

Give players the option to explore or to focus only on storyline, exp, farming ect. after that initial introduction. This basically gets players familiar with the game, introduces them to the basics, opens up the story and introduces them to group play and alternate methods of leveling all at the same time.
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#54 May 15 2012 at 2:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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Dizmo wrote:
Seriously though, SE's primary objective was (or should have been) to make a new MMO for FFXI players to move onto. It's the first rule of business to keep your current customers happy before seeking new ones.


If I were head of an SE MMO, I'd have been trying to make a game that taps into the elements that made the Final Fantasy franchise one of the most beloved RPG series' of all time, rather than trying to recreate one specific MMO that was mildly popular before MMOs really took off to the level they're at today. While offline games can't be treated exactly like online ones, creating a world that is fun for a wide variety of players to join and participate in isn't impossible to do in an online game. For example, a few of SWTOR's big selling points are that it has unique quest lines for every one of its classes and a large amount of dialog. Now I'm not saying SE should copy SWTOR instead of FFXI, but only pointing out that bothering to create story, dialog, and a leveling experience can work in a decently successful game. I don't know how many will remember this but when FFXI first came out, it didn't go over all that well with the majority of FF fans. It managed to attract a decent chunk of players, but that was before MMOs were taken to a new level of popularity and there was hardly any competition, and SE was still known as one of the top RPG developers in the industry (actually IIRC, the "SE" merge happened right around FFXI release, most still knew them as Square). I wonder if SE had taken a radically different approach to FFXI, if it could have capitalized on the massive FF fan base and taken the genre to heights not seen before it. I'm getting really off topic now though so I'll quit now. >_>

volta1 wrote:
At the risk of derailing, I really don't get why people beef leveling up in this game. It's really not at all hard anymore, and there's plenty to do should you choose to pursue it. What's the complaint about? Can anyone name a game where they enjoy the journey from 1 to cap as an example?


Edited to sound more opinionated, don't want to speak for everyone. Smiley: nod

In short, I don't want to have plenty to do "should I choose to pursue it." I want to have plenty to do, period. The concept of working through something that you don't find fun in order to get to stuff that you do find fun doesn't fly any more, because I can simply go somewhere else where I'm going to have fun from the start. If a game doesn't have leveling content that I find enjoyable, I'd rather they just abolish the leveling system altogether because it isn't doing the game any favors.

Oh, and as for a game where I enjoyed the journey to cap, I'll say Guild Wars, because I never "grinded" one bit. I did quests that interested me, and played through the story campaign. In doing so, I got experience points from killing monsters, from the quests I decided to complete, and from main storyline missions. I hit the cap without trying to, because the method of leveling up involves playing the game. If you like what the game offers, you play and end up hitting the cap. Experiencing what the game offers and gaining experience points aren't mutually exclusive. I'd imagine I'd have enjoyed the leveling process in SWTOR too, based on the beta and how much I enjoyed SW:KOTOR, but since I haven't purchased the game I can't say for sure.

Edited, May 15th 2012 4:58am by Susanoh
#55 May 15 2012 at 3:19 AM Rating: Excellent
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I've been giving the game another chance with the welcome back campaign and I can tell a few things have improved like the massive menu lag which is no longer crippling but still noticeable. One thing that has persisted which annoys a lot is the random crashes and buggy quests, but hopefully that will be fixed for 2.0. I'm not too bothered by graphics and I can make it pretty enough, though not as nice as FFXI on my laptop, but I would like to see a fullscreen mode that doesn't crash when anything else takes focus.

The revamped skills confused me at first but now I've got used to them it's not that bad, MP was a problem at first for my conjuer before getting auto-refresh but it still seems like MP is a problem during some fights. There are a few guildleves where I have to stand around using blissful mind to restore MP because I used it all in the previous battle and the enemy has run off for reinforcements leaving me in combat and not recovering MP.

Which brings me to guildleves, I actually like them but I'm more of a casual player so being able to log on for a bit and do my daily allowance of leves and go back to the inn to rest is ok with me. What does confuse me is the leve rewards (both the final reward and the treasure cests), I've had lots of disciple of war gear and weapons that I can't use, including a few bows when I haven't even started on the archer, but I've never seen a mage weapon drop from it.

I think my main problem with the game is that the zones are enormous. If I want to do my leves in camp tranquil I either have to teleport or take a chocobo ride that still seems to take forever, and I've noticed already that to do my levels I'm spending 8 anima a day to teleport and only recovering 2, so if I did subscribe then at some point I'll be forced to chocobo to most places which would quickly become boring for me. To compound this problem the developers have also continued with their perverse monster placement (at least in Gridania), since I've noticed that to complete some low level quests I have to get past high level agressive monsters, and confusingly sometimes very low level monsters are placed together with ones that are many levels higher which occasionally catces me out.

Finally one area that's improved a lot but still needs work is the market wards system. Being able to search the whole market from one NPC and buy an item from the search results is handy but the actual search interface could still do with improvement. I'd like to see it with filters for item type/class/level range etc and a more intelligent system to search by name which seems to be standard for any other modern MMO. I don't understand why if I type in "wand" in the search it only shows me results that start with wand, rather than all items containing the word "wand".

Overall I think the game is mostly tolerable, and after 2.0 release I might come back and give it another chance, but at the moment I don't really see any incentive for me to play it over FFXI or many of the free MMORPGs available.

EDIT: in case it's relevant my main class is conjurer level 23, with a bit of dabbling in thaumaturge, but I have very litte interest in the disciples of war.

Edited, May 15th 2012 11:21am by DominiousTaru
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#56 May 15 2012 at 9:55 AM Rating: Excellent
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So, I did a couple leves on PUG last night, but it just ... well... it sucked. I hate the combat changes. Hate. Unfortunately, there is nothing to be done about that. It is just personal preference. I used to love PUG, love the way it played. Now it feels really slow, awkward, clunky and difficult to manage.

After two leves (that, of course, I've already done 1000000X before) - I logged off, and back into EQ2. I then killed some NMs (yay, named monsters I can solo when I am at the level of the surrounding monsters) on my Rat PLD, assigned my AA points (had 10 already at level 10, go me) moved the slider bar, gained a level, then logged into my Frog Warden (30 at the time).

On my warden I completed a questline for a jumping raptor mount, gaining a level in the process. Then, I decided I would gain my next level simply by exploring with my newfound power of jumping and gliding. An hour later, after bounding around many exotic lands (my skill at avoiding aggro that I gained in XI came in handy here), I had another AA point and another level.

I could see myself playing XIV for crafting and gathering because I actually really like those systems, but the combat sucks. And I won't pay a sub just to craft and gather, especially now that they have made the decision not to make DoL/DoH full classes.

It's so sad to play older games like EQ2, which honestly, I never even heard anyone say much about, and to find in them battle systems that are more engaging than those in XIV, questlines more interesting and varied than in XIV, itemization that rocks a billion times more than XIV (sorry but the paucity of armor in XIV is pathetic) - like... I just can't comprehend how a developer like SE could put out such a terrible product that took no note of all the neat systems in other games.

Unless 2.0 tears absolutely everything apart, this game doesn't stand a chance. Especially combat. I don't know how you guys stand it. It's terrible. The pre-1.20 combat was 1000X better. I know that's just personal preference but I don't see how anyone could like the laggy, slow, boring, finicky combat that exists now. I thought thm was bad, PUG was worse. I knew I didn't like the look of the changes. It's nuts that they were worse than I thought.
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lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#57 May 15 2012 at 10:03 AM Rating: Good
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Olorinus wrote:
So, I did a couple leves on PUG last night, but it just ... well... it sucked. I hate the combat changes. Hate. Unfortunately, there is nothing to be done about that. It is just personal preference. I used to love PUG, love the way it played. Now it feels really slow, awkward, clunky and difficult to manage.

After two leves (that, of course, I've already done 1000000X before) - I logged off, and back into EQ2. I then killed some NMs (yay, named monsters I can solo when I am at the level of the surrounding monsters) on my Rat PLD, assigned my AA points (had 10 already at level 10, go me) moved the slider bar, gained a level, then logged into my Frog Warden (30 at the time).

On my warden I completed a questline for a jumping raptor mount, gaining a level in the process. Then, I decided I would gain my next level simply by exploring with my newfound power of jumping and gliding. An hour later, after bounding around many exotic lands (my skill at avoiding aggro that I gained in XI came in handy here), I had another AA point and another level.

I could see myself playing XIV for crafting and gathering because I actually really like those systems, but the combat sucks. And I won't pay a sub just to craft and gather, especially now that they have made the decision not to make DoL/DoH full classes.

It's so sad to play older games like EQ2, which honestly, I never even heard anyone say much about, and to find in them battle systems that are more engaging than those in XIV, questlines more interesting and varied than in XIV, itemization that rocks a billion times more than XIV (sorry but the paucity of armor in XIV is pathetic) - like... I just can't comprehend how a developer like SE could put out such a terrible product that took no note of all the neat systems in other games.

Unless 2.0 tears absolutely everything apart, this game doesn't stand a chance. Especially combat. I don't know how you guys stand it. It's terrible. The pre-1.20 combat was 1000X better. I know that's just personal preference but I don't see how anyone could like the laggy, slow, boring, finicky combat that exists now. I thought thm was bad, PUG was worse. I knew I didn't like the look of the changes. It's nuts that they were worse than I thought.


I agree with just about everything you've said here (as a fellow EQ2 stan) except I find crafting tedious and gathering to be completely too involved for the reward. The combat really is so slow and stilted compared to just about any other MMO out there. I mean, it's especially jarring when you saw the cutscene of the marlboro fight and then you experience the combat here. It's so, so, so far away from that as to be sad.

Also, I saw on the forums there was a thread from "the real players" asking SE to end the Welcome Back Campaign because the servers are apparently so overextended by the meager amount of people returning, lag everywhere has become such an issue. I am not sure why this was done now, if clearly the game cannot put a good foot forward for the audience it's meant to target.
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#58 May 15 2012 at 10:36 AM Rating: Decent
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Olo, I thought the same thing when it changed, but it's actually faster now and I think I prefer it. I'd still like some more streamlining and preferably more abilities to vary things up a bit, but it works great in solo and in party. At least for PGL and BRD anyway. I don't have enough experience with the other classes.
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FFXI:Sylph - Perrin 75 Hume THF; Retired (At least from my use any way)
EVE Online:ScraperX; Retired
WAR:IronClaw- Peryn SW;SkullThrone- Grymloc BO; Retired


#59 May 15 2012 at 11:01 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Also, I saw on the forums there was a thread from "the real players" asking SE to end the Welcome Back Campaign because the servers are apparently so overextended by the meager amount of people returning, lag everywhere has become such an issue.


Hahahaha!!! I can't help imagining SE had their server speed throttled on purpose for the event.
You know, like:

Manager: So! How many thousands have come back?
Server Administrator: Err... it's more in the hundreds, Sir... at least it was on the first day...
Manager: ****. We have to simulate a massive influx!
Server Administrator: Well, Sir, there's that old 56k modem...

^u^


Edited, May 15th 2012 1:05pm by Rinsui
#60 May 15 2012 at 11:08 AM Rating: Good
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I admit am a sucker for punishment when it comes to crafting/gathering I find XIV's oddly relaxing. I also feel like the only place where any substantive improvements are obvious in the game at this point is in the crafting system. They've done a good job with that.

Honestly I just can't even begin to comprehend what they are trying to achieve with combat in XIV

a) abilities are boring and lacklustre

b) hate not being able to remove abilities which are pretty useless (for example, PUG "attack from behind" abilities that take TP, when soloing... almost never going to get positioning to use them). The whole appeal of the armory system was flexibility. I never bought the need to make people use all their class abilities if they didn't want to.

c) I can't stand the use of TP here, it is too clunky with the abilities as they are. It worked in XI with the pace of build up, but in XIV I feel like special attacks should just be on cool down, it is too annoying having to babysit the TP bar.
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lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#61 May 15 2012 at 12:02 PM Rating: Decent
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hexaemeron wrote:
Also, I saw on the forums there was a thread from "the real players" asking SE to end the Welcome Back Campaign because the servers are apparently so overextended by the meager amount of people returning, lag everywhere has become such an issue.


This was hilarious to me. I mean, unless the number of welcome back campaign participants is clearly noticeable(and I mean feeling like your server population quadrupled) then people are basically asking SE to starve themselves so that they can eat more... I don't understand the logic.
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#62 May 15 2012 at 2:02 PM Rating: Good
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Olorinus wrote:
b) hate not being able to remove abilities which are pretty useless (for example, PUG "attack from behind" abilities that take TP, when soloing... almost never going to get positioning to use them). The whole appeal of the armory system was flexibility. I never bought the need to make people use all their class abilities if they didn't want to.


That might be part of your problem, you SHOULD be getting behind mobs when solo. For me anyway that's part of the fun, timing mobs or using stuns on them to get behind and do extra dmg.
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FFXI:Sylph - Perrin 75 Hume THF; Retired (At least from my use any way)
EVE Online:ScraperX; Retired
WAR:IronClaw- Peryn SW;SkullThrone- Grymloc BO; Retired


#63 May 15 2012 at 2:36 PM Rating: Good
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my problem is I don't find the combat enjoyable. Running around in circles won't make it more fun.
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lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#64 May 15 2012 at 11:58 PM Rating: Decent
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Olorinus wrote:
my problem is I don't find the combat enjoyable. Running around in circles won't make it more fun.


You mean to tell me I spent the last 10 years of my life running circles around mobs in FFXI for no reason? I swore it increased my dodge chance...




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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#65 May 17 2012 at 2:04 PM Rating: Good
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I couldn't be bothered to reinstall the client to try it out again, not with so many other MMO betas going on and the Diablo 3 launch. I'm waiting for 2.0 to seriously consider giving FFXIV a go again, and, as much as I'd love 2.0 to be successful and as much as I love saving money, I have such huge doubts that 2.0 will ever see the light of day that I just can't justify buying even 3 months of Crysta for the Legacy Campaign.

I'll need to see some gameplay footage of 2.0 looking amazing before I put any more time or money into the game.
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#66 May 17 2012 at 2:20 PM Rating: Decent
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yfaithfully wrote:
I'll need to see some gameplay footage of 2.0 looking amazing before I put any more time or money into the game.


Unless D3, TERA, MOP and GW2 all fail to excite and captivate players, I don't see an out for XIV honestly. I wouldn't even settle for solid gameplay footage. Playability is the biggest issue for me so I'd have to test out the trial they have planned just after 2.0 goes live.
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#67 May 17 2012 at 2:23 PM Rating: Good
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
yfaithfully wrote:
I'll need to see some gameplay footage of 2.0 looking amazing before I put any more time or money into the game.


Unless D3, TERA, MOP and GW2 all fail to excite and captivate players, I don't see an out for XIV honestly. I wouldn't even settle for solid gameplay footage. Playability is the biggest issue for me so I'd have to test out the trial they have planned just after 2.0 goes live.


But then, you'd just hear "DUH IT'S JUST 2.0 BETA, THIS ISN'T THE WHOLE GAME" ad nauseum....you know, again.
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#68 May 17 2012 at 2:40 PM Rating: Good
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hexaemeron wrote:
FilthMcNasty wrote:
yfaithfully wrote:
I'll need to see some gameplay footage of 2.0 looking amazing before I put any more time or money into the game.


Unless D3, TERA, MOP and GW2 all fail to excite and captivate players, I don't see an out for XIV honestly. I wouldn't even settle for solid gameplay footage. Playability is the biggest issue for me so I'd have to test out the trial they have planned just after 2.0 goes live.


But then, you'd just hear "DUH IT'S JUST 2.0 BETA, THIS ISN'T THE WHOLE GAME" ad nauseum....you know, again.


Ahh yes, the 'it's just beta' tune. There was a point I wanted XIV to fail simply because of the outcry of white knights ready and willing to defend the poor development choices of SE. I think it was just me coming to terms with my own denial that the game wasn't going to be everything I'd hoped. I can't imagine the letdown for those still holding out for 2.0 so I really hope they do pull it together. Not only for that reason, but it would be nice to have a lot of options and a competitive MMO market.
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#69 May 17 2012 at 3:50 PM Rating: Decent
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Heyhey. As always, boys, you are one step behind the true whiteknights.
There's plenty of posts on the official forums already that continue to
stress that "Yoshi said several features will be not be implemented
until version 2.0, which technically means that they will be implemented
at 2.0 or sometime thereafter. SE is not lying or trying to fool us. You
whiners simply expect too much.
"

So... there will always be yet another excuse for SE not delivering on time,
or underdelivering, or not delivering at all. Take, for example, the lag issues.

Right now it's "1.0 server limits".
In October it will be "It's the beta, so servers are not up to full power yet".
In spring 2013 it will be "2.1 brought in too many players, so naturally servers are overstressed."
In summer it will be "PS3 network code is f*cked up, that's why the servers keep crashing."
In autumn it will be "2.4 will fix it."
And finally, in winter, "Who cares about lag you whiners, stfu and go play WoW."

Edited, May 17th 2012 5:53pm by Rinsui
#70 May 18 2012 at 8:06 AM Rating: Decent
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Xoie wrote:
Welcome back,
The fees were your ticket out.

Welcome back,
To that same old Eorzea you laughed about.

Well the LS names have all changed since you hung around,
But some bugs have remained and some turned around.

Who'd have thought they'd see ya (Who'd have thought they'd see ya)
Here where Yoshi needs ya (Here where Yoshi needs ya)

Yeah we tease him a lot cause he's geared in a Dated smock, welcome back,
Welcome back, welcome back, welcome back.


As one old **** to another, I present you the Internetz and a cookie.
Thanks for the Welcome Back Kotter reference...now I feel really old.

I'll say as some one that started at release (Beta also) and stopped when they started charging, the one thing I can't get around is the cluttered look of my screen. My apologies for comparing it to FFXI, but there just seems way too much crap on my screen compared to XI. It just seems like I'm forced down to having a 10" view with 4 inches of icons/menus/etc all the way around my screen. It distracts me from taking in the view of the world, leaving me with the impression that I'm not really a part of the world but an interloper looking in from the outside. It's probably just my narrow thought process, but I felt the same when I tried WoW and Rift. I do like having the ability to move things around the screen, but there's just too much of it. The screen-shot of v2.0 looked even worse to me.

Saying that, I'll most likely start playing a few hours a week just to get the bonus stuff. I'm such a sucker for that...SE caught me hook, line, and sinker in XI with those types of gimicks.
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#71 May 18 2012 at 9:07 AM Rating: Decent
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@klausneck

Hmm. An interesting viewpoint. It's one of the aspects the new developer team decided to "adapt" to
what players nowadays - as they believe - have come to expect from a first-class UI. A maximum
amount of information IN YO FACE. Personally, I also think it distracts a little from the beauty of the
landscape. I hope that, at least, they will allow us to tone down the colors to something less Hello Kitty.

Too much flash doesn't fit FF14 for me either, but there's lots more flash in FF X, X-2, (not XI and XII),
and most of all XIII. Seems to be a matter of personal developer preference rather than a real design
philosophy.
#72 May 18 2012 at 9:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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Rinsui wrote:
@klausneck

Hmm. An interesting viewpoint. It's one of the aspects the new developer team decided to "adapt" to
what players nowadays - as they believe - have come to expect from a first-class UI. A maximum
amount of information IN YO FACE. Personally, I also think it distracts a little from the beauty of the
landscape. I hope that, at least, they will allow us to tone down the colors to something less Hello Kitty.

Too much flash doesn't fit FF14 for me either, but there's lots more flash in FF X, X-2, (not XI and XII),
and most of all XIII. Seems to be a matter of personal developer preference rather than a real design
philosophy.


Some things about FFXIV's UI confuse me, like the "walking speed" indicator (is that really necessary?). But ultimately, I think having well-organized information and interfaces is a good thing, as long as you have control over what you get to see and how you'd like to organize it. With higher resolution comes more room for information. FFXI had to limit what its UI could show to fit on a TV screen in "standard definition" which is only 640 X 480. Looking at FFXI on a PS2 gives you that cramped feeling all over again, especially when you're in a party battle and you watch your world disappear under a mountain of menus and read-outs.

Even at its worst, I don't think FFXIV reaches that level of obscurement (unless you go out of your way to position your widgets in the middle of the screen). Of course, the 2.0 interface seems a lot more... busy. And while some people like that sort of thing, I'm hoping the customization options will let you limit what has to be on the screen at any given time.
#73 May 18 2012 at 10:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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Xoie wrote:

Some things about FFXIV's UI confuse me, like the "walking speed" indicator (is that really necessary?).

Well the players asked for this, apparently people couldn't keep track if they were walking or running and they would get 1 shot by the trees near the Moogle fight. The little blue arrows are so spellcasters know that the game knows they are not moving and it is safe to cast... I don't think we need either, but apparently some players do.

I believe they have promised us that our UI will be fully customizable in 2.0 with the option to turn on/off each element.
#74 May 18 2012 at 7:03 PM Rating: Excellent
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So I came back just before the Welcome Back campaign started and expected every single thing in the game to be extremely complicated like it used to be. I was expecting items to be a few million gils expensive even for the starter gears and it would be mind numbingly slow to level up. It took me about a month from scratch to get a marauder from 1 to 50 fully clad in warrior armor and absolutely no worries about money whatsoever. I had more difficulties leveling up on WoW probably because of mouse and keyboard controls in a MMO causes pains for my right hand, but I still spent a lot more time thinking over how to progress with quests and such since there's thousands of them and you pretty much need to level up on them if you don't want to level up in instances. I'm glad they made leveling so quick and painless since there's not much to do before the level cap.

There's stuff like grand company quests that are outright stupid as they want you to do all 3 starter quests for each grand company and the game's maps are HUGE. I spent about 80 animas before I completed the quests and animas regen at an alarmingly slow rate still. Mini Ifrit as people like to call him is ridiculously easy, but you still need 3 other people with you before you can enter. There's no way I'm going to be able to grab 3 other 25s when everyone is 50 already. The cut scenes are cool to watch, but they beg to have voiceovers rather than plain text which brings me to another point. Most of the quests that simply involves killing 10 wolves or something has tons of tons of text to them but mostly the quest logs are well written I think. The writing is different from earlier FFs too as it's much filthier this time around. I don't think I've ever read the line "****" in a dialogue ever in a FF game, let alone "**** off", "*****" and there's even a ***** house in Ul'dah and everything seems to be written with a pinch of old English. We've sure come a long way since "You spoony bard" translate of FF4.

The UI is somewhat slow in combat as I keep myself hitting the same ability several times without seeing it go off, only to be notified that I was too slow to hit it. Stuff like that could ruin a fight, but it has never been the main cause of losing one. There have been a few random crashes here and there that seem to pop out of nowhere, oh and the game still crashes when you hit ALT+TAB during full screen. I can't seem to find an easy way to turn the sound on/off ingame without having to turn off my speakers, the ingame menu has like 5 different bars that you have to slowly move to the left if you want it off which is even worse than on FFXI where you only had 2. I think they could remove the fade effects from the menu and have them pop up instantly. The keyboard configuration doesn't seem to accept all the buttons and I don't know why ESC can't be menu and cancel at the same time, other MMORPGs seems to do that one fine. The menus look nice however and I like how text is presented to you.

Moving from FFXI to FFXIV seems to cure most of my pet peevess like zoning, cramped interface, 6 lines macros, mini map and so on. I personally think FFXIV resembles a FF game more than FFXI did (kind of cool to see your party members in cut scenes too!). It's much easier these days to put yourself into the game these days compared to launch and I like that I don't need to have a wiki next to me everytime I think about doing something new. The last one seemed to be mandatory to play FFXI.



#75 May 18 2012 at 7:34 PM Rating: Decent
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2,202 posts
Solonuke wrote:
So I came back just before the Welcome Back campaign started and expected every single thing in the game to be extremely complicated like it used to be. I was expecting items to be a few million gils expensive even for the starter gears and it would be mind numbingly slow to level up. It took me about a month from scratch to get a marauder from 1 to 50 fully clad in warrior armor and absolutely no worries about money whatsoever. I had more difficulties leveling up on WoW probably because of mouse and keyboard controls in a MMO causes pains for my right hand, but I still spent a lot more time thinking over how to progress with quests and such since there's thousands of them and you pretty much need to level up on them if you don't want to level up in instances. I'm glad they made leveling so quick and painless since there's not much to do before the level cap.

There's stuff like grand company quests that are outright stupid as they want you to do all 3 starter quests for each grand company and the game's maps are HUGE. I spent about 80 animas before I completed the quests and animas regen at an alarmingly slow rate still. Mini Ifrit as people like to call him is ridiculously easy, but you still need 3 other people with you before you can enter. There's no way I'm going to be able to grab 3 other 25s when everyone is 50 already. The cut scenes are cool to watch, but they beg to have voiceovers rather than plain text which brings me to another point. Most of the quests that simply involves killing 10 wolves or something has tons of tons of text to them but mostly the quest logs are well written I think. The writing is different from earlier FFs too as it's much filthier this time around. I don't think I've ever read the line "****" in a dialogue ever in a FF game, let alone "**** off", "*****" and there's even a ***** house in Ul'dah and everything seems to be written with a pinch of old English. We've sure come a long way since "You spoony bard" translate of FF4.

The UI is somewhat slow in combat as I keep myself hitting the same ability several times without seeing it go off, only to be notified that I was too slow to hit it. Stuff like that could ruin a fight, but it has never been the main cause of losing one. There have been a few random crashes here and there that seem to pop out of nowhere, oh and the game still crashes when you hit ALT+TAB during full screen. I can't seem to find an easy way to turn the sound on/off ingame without having to turn off my speakers, the ingame menu has like 5 different bars that you have to slowly move to the left if you want it off which is even worse than on FFXI where you only had 2. I think they could remove the fade effects from the menu and have them pop up instantly. The keyboard configuration doesn't seem to accept all the buttons and I don't know why ESC can't be menu and cancel at the same time, other MMORPGs seems to do that one fine. The menus look nice however and I like how text is presented to you.

Moving from FFXI to FFXIV seems to cure most of my pet peevess like zoning, cramped interface, 6 lines macros, mini map and so on. I personally think FFXIV resembles a FF game more than FFXI did (kind of cool to see your party members in cut scenes too!). It's much easier these days to put yourself into the game these days compared to launch and I like that I don't need to have a wiki next to me everytime I think about doing something new. The last one seemed to be mandatory to play FFXI.



So i take it that you have only played FFXI and FFXIV ? Because i'm pretty sure there was whorehouse in FFVII,
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#76 May 19 2012 at 1:54 AM Rating: Good
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Ostia wrote:
So i take it that you have only played FFXI and FFXIV ? Because i'm pretty sure there was whorehouse in FFVII,


And Barret said ***************** a lot. (At least in the original PS1 version). And the original crew committed acts of eco-terrorism against the Shinra Power Company. And Cloud dressed up like a girl to save his childhood girlfriend from the clutches of the local pimp. And the President of Shinra murdered two entire neighborhoods of people in his city just so he could frame it on the Resistance. And Hojo tried to have Aeris raped by Red 13 after sending his organization's goons to kidnap her. And Sephiroth went on a mass-murdering rampage that even finished off a main character and spanned the entire globe before he attempted to destroy the entire planet. Absolutely shocking!

And that's why it's the most requested FF for a remake, because they just don't make them like this anymore. Smiley: sly
#77 May 20 2012 at 7:51 PM Rating: Decent
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2,202 posts
Xoie wrote:
Ostia wrote:
So i take it that you have only played FFXI and FFXIV ? Because i'm pretty sure there was whorehouse in FFVII,


And Barret said "sh*t!" a lot. (At least in the original PS1 version). And the original crew committed acts of eco-terrorism against the Shinra Power Company. And Cloud dressed up like a girl to save his childhood girlfriend from the clutches of the local pimp. And the President of Shinra murdered two entire neighborhoods of people in his city just so he could frame it on the Resistance. And Hojo tried to have Aeris raped by Red 13 after sending his organization's goons to kidnap her. And Sephiroth went on a mass-murdering rampage that even finished off a main character and spanned the entire globe before he attempted to destroy the entire planet. Absolutely shocking!

And that's why it's the most requested FF for a remake, because they just don't make them like this anymore. Smiley: sly


No, it is the most requested FF for a remake because to the vast majority of the FF fan base, FFVII was their first FF, Story-wise, i was not really impressed with it, having played FFVI prior to it(Also i'm biased, since to me FFVI is truly the best FF ****** to have been created).
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#78 May 21 2012 at 12:09 AM Rating: Decent
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3,177 posts
Xoie wrote:

Some things about FFXIV's UI confuse me, like the "walking speed" indicator (is that really necessary?). .


Walking is how you get past Trees and most sound aggro.

Yes, it's necessary.
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#79 May 21 2012 at 10:28 AM Rating: Decent
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Isn't it obvious from the animation where you're walking or running?

I had no idea about this since I don't know anymore, but it sounds silly...
#80 May 21 2012 at 10:54 AM Rating: Good
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So, the Welcome Back campaign has ended. My opinion going into it was open-minded, cautiously, but after maybe 2-3 logins, I realized that if I didn't have a 50, it was pointless to come back. A bunch of uninspired fetch/kill quests, levequests, the grand company quests that even long-time players admit are boring, repetitive and uninspired, and of course, let's not forget, just grinding mobs.

Why now? This probably should have happened after E3 or after -SOME- meaningful non-50 content was put in place. That's the thing I think that concerns me the most about this whole game/experience from day 1. It just feels like it's being run by amateurs. Not a AAA company with almost 30 years in gaming and 10 in MMOs. It's like Romper Room. Every decision just seems baffling. And what's more... they seem baffled too. They couldn't put out a clear vision, so they asked the players what they want, so they're tap dancing, but they can't even do that quite right.

This whole amateurish, confused vibe pervades everything. I sincerely hope I'm wrong and that 2.0 will put me in my place; that it will be a wonderful game with a rich, engaging narrative, inspired design and a multitude of confidently-developed, immersive activities.

...I just don't see it happening from what I've been presented in August of 2010, or May of 2012.
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#81 May 21 2012 at 6:27 PM Rating: Decent
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Wow, it seems like many of you had different a different experience than a lot of people on Durandal. I personally had 4 people on my FL reactivate their account and every one of them wound up resubing.
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#82 May 21 2012 at 7:07 PM Rating: Excellent
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Ostia wrote:
Xoie wrote:
Ostia wrote:
So i take it that you have only played FFXI and FFXIV ? Because i'm pretty sure there was whorehouse in FFVII,


And Barret said "sh*t!" a lot. (At least in the original PS1 version). And the original crew committed acts of eco-terrorism against the Shinra Power Company. And Cloud dressed up like a girl to save his childhood girlfriend from the clutches of the local pimp. And the President of Shinra murdered two entire neighborhoods of people in his city just so he could frame it on the Resistance. And Hojo tried to have Aeris raped by Red 13 after sending his organization's goons to kidnap her. And Sephiroth went on a mass-murdering rampage that even finished off a main character and spanned the entire globe before he attempted to destroy the entire planet. Absolutely shocking!

And that's why it's the most requested FF for a remake, because they just don't make them like this anymore. Smiley: sly


No, it is the most requested FF for a remake because to the vast majority of the FF fan base, FFVII was their first FF, Story-wise, i was not really impressed with it, having played FFVI prior to it(Also i'm biased, since to me FFVI is truly the best FF ****** to have been created).


If this turns into yet another Which FF is the Best FF thread I will torpedo it toot sweet Smiley: motz
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#83 May 21 2012 at 8:36 PM Rating: Decent
18 posts
Wint wrote:
Ostia wrote:
Xoie wrote:
Ostia wrote:
So i take it that you have only played FFXI and FFXIV ? Because i'm pretty sure there was whorehouse in FFVII,


And Barret said "sh*t!" a lot. (At least in the original PS1 version). And the original crew committed acts of eco-terrorism against the Shinra Power Company. And Cloud dressed up like a girl to save his childhood girlfriend from the clutches of the local pimp. And the President of Shinra murdered two entire neighborhoods of people in his city just so he could frame it on the Resistance. And Hojo tried to have Aeris raped by Red 13 after sending his organization's goons to kidnap her. And Sephiroth went on a mass-murdering rampage that even finished off a main character and spanned the entire globe before he attempted to destroy the entire planet. Absolutely shocking!

And that's why it's the most requested FF for a remake, because they just don't make them like this anymore. Smiley: sly


No, it is the most requested FF for a remake because to the vast majority of the FF fan base, FFVII was their first FF, Story-wise, i was not really impressed with it, having played FFVI prior to it(Also i'm biased, since to me FFVI is truly the best FF ****** to have been created).


If this turns into yet another Which FF is the Best FF thread I will torpedo it toot sweet Smiley: motz


You would think that any traffic here would be good. I guess not.
#84 May 21 2012 at 11:56 PM Rating: Good
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Ostia wrote:

So i take it that you have only played FFXI and FFXIV ? Because i'm pretty sure there was whorehouse in FFVII,


It has been about nine years since I played through FFVII so there's not much I remember about the game, other than polygons resembling characters made of lego and Cloud crossdressing in the most fabolous way. The early FFs were offers of Nintendo of America's censorship where all religion based sprites or text had to be altered and violence and partly nudity were reduced. Some of the translations like "You spoony bard!" is probably one of the prime examples of how bad the translation was and they would retranslate games every time they rerelased them.

I wonder how much the text has been altered since I feel I'm reading quest dialogues from a western RPG instead of a eastern one. The dialogues is written differently from FFXI which is enough for me to feel that it doesn't feel much like it, in a good way. I just hope they make more cut scene based quests since reading 10 pages about why this woman needs you to kill 10 wolves is absurb.
#85 May 22 2012 at 8:20 AM Rating: Excellent
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Jetterbobby wrote:
Wint wrote:
Ostia wrote:
Xoie wrote:
Ostia wrote:
So i take it that you have only played FFXI and FFXIV ? Because i'm pretty sure there was whorehouse in FFVII,


And Barret said "sh*t!" a lot. (At least in the original PS1 version). And the original crew committed acts of eco-terrorism against the Shinra Power Company. And Cloud dressed up like a girl to save his childhood girlfriend from the clutches of the local pimp. And the President of Shinra murdered two entire neighborhoods of people in his city just so he could frame it on the Resistance. And Hojo tried to have Aeris raped by Red 13 after sending his organization's goons to kidnap her. And Sephiroth went on a mass-murdering rampage that even finished off a main character and spanned the entire globe before he attempted to destroy the entire planet. Absolutely shocking!

And that's why it's the most requested FF for a remake, because they just don't make them like this anymore. Smiley: sly


No, it is the most requested FF for a remake because to the vast majority of the FF fan base, FFVII was their first FF, Story-wise, i was not really impressed with it, having played FFVI prior to it(Also i'm biased, since to me FFVI is truly the best FF ****** to have been created).


If this turns into yet another Which FF is the Best FF thread I will torpedo it toot sweet Smiley: motz


You would think that any traffic here would be good. I guess not.


If you've been here any amount of time you know that this particular topic has been hashed and re-hashed to death so no, in this case I wouldn't have the slightest bit of hesitation. Not to mention we have a specific forum for that kind of thing.
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#86 May 22 2012 at 9:39 AM Rating: Good
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3,177 posts
Dizmo wrote:
Isn't it obvious from the animation where you're walking or running?

I had no idea about this since I don't know anymore, but it sounds silly...



Sometimes it's confusing if you get Raised near a tree and you press the button and don't remember which one you have toggled. It makes sense after you actually do Moogle a few times.

If you test out if you're walking or running by making one step, and it's a run... well... 9999 damage to you again.

Edited, May 22nd 2012 8:42am by UltKnightGrover
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