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#1 May 30 2012 at 8:49 AM Rating: Good
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Guys,

I've seen a lot of information about the need to get abilities for various jobs in order to be effective at the later levels. It also seems that in order to enjoy partying I need to have a 40+ class, so that's what I want to do. I'm interested in what's called the 'Criticial Path Method', that's where you do certain things in the right order, without wasting any time, and you get to the end result quickly and efficiently. Let's say I want to be a 50 whm as quickly as possible. Given everything you know, what is the best path? Example: 'Get Gladiator to 15, Conjurer to 30, ____ job to #, ____ job to #, etc. then take whm all the way to the top both solo and partying' I played XI a lot and wished I'd focused on getting one job to the top so I could have done more end game stuff, instead of having a ton of mid range jobs and doing the same thing over and over. Any help would be appreciated.
#2 May 30 2012 at 9:12 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:
I'm interested in what's called the 'Criticial Path Method', that's where you do certain things in the right order, without wasting any time, and you get to the end result quickly and efficiently.


...because that`s what games are all about! Ha!


#3 May 30 2012 at 9:26 AM Rating: Decent
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Leveling up jobs can be a lot of work. It's fun work, that's why I play. There's no harm in working / having fun efficiently. :)
#4 May 30 2012 at 9:26 AM Rating: Good
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Rinsui wrote:
Quote:
I'm interested in what's called the 'Criticial Path Method', that's where you do certain things in the right order, without wasting any time, and you get to the end result quickly and efficiently.
...because that`s what games are all about! Ha!
Because wanting to accomplish a simple goal without going out of your way doing things that have nothing to do with that goal is the wrong way to play a video game.
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#5 May 30 2012 at 9:28 AM Rating: Good
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I bought the game, can't I play it any way I want? Just looking to set a goal and accomplish it.
#6 May 30 2012 at 10:03 AM Rating: Good
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Call,

Your best bet is to go to the Lodestone forums :o Less hecklers :o

Sorry Zam hecklers :o I love you guys too :o <3.
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#7 May 30 2012 at 10:46 AM Rating: Good
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Maybe your right... Awesome how I got sarcasm right out the gate.
#8 May 30 2012 at 11:26 AM Rating: Decent
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Sorry. It's just that the custom of blasting to the (non-existant) endgame in the fastest way possible is
one of the trends that harmed games (in my opinion) most. You can't be blamed for it, because that's
what everybody seems to be doing nowadays.

Basically the best way to level (which drives tears into my eyes) is getting yourself a powerleveller.
Doing it right, you'll be 50 in 3 jobs by the end of the week. And ready to face the endless repetition
of endgame dungeon speedruns. Because that's what SE has in store for those who are in danger
of finishing their game too quick. It's all connected; once you understand that basic truth, you'll possibly
understand why I am so allergic to high speed leveling.
#9 May 30 2012 at 12:16 PM Rating: Decent
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Gladiator to 22 for Sentinel
Pugilist to 36 I believe. Might be wrong there.
Conjurer to 50.

WHM can cross class Gladiator and Pugilist. Sentinel is useful for the 2HRs on Ifrit, Moogle, and Garuda. Pugilist is useful for Second Wind where you can quickly heal yourself if sh*t hits the fan.


By the way, Rinsui, your heckling is getting annoying. The guy is asking a legitimate question.


Edited, May 30th 2012 11:19am by UltKnightGrover
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#10 May 30 2012 at 12:27 PM Rating: Good
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I'm not really interested in power leveling. I just want to get to the point where I can party up with groups and be a productive member of the world. I want to run a healer or tank so i can build my own party easily as time goes on. The path for a75 PLD in FF XI: level your WAR to 18, get your sub job, level your MNK to 15, Level your WAR to 30, unlock PLD, level your PLD to 75.
#11 May 30 2012 at 12:29 PM Rating: Decent
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Thanks.
#12 May 30 2012 at 12:36 PM Rating: Good
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I'd suggest this.

Level PGL to 6 for Second WInd and Featherfoot
Level CJN to 26 for Stoneskin, Protect, and Cure to use on your GLA. Keep going to 30 if you want to start WHM quests ahead of time.
Level GLA to 22 for Rampart and Sentinel
Level CJN/WHM to 50

Edited, May 30th 2012 2:37pm by Cthugga
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#13 May 30 2012 at 3:13 PM Rating: Decent
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Callbeast wrote:
Guys,

I've seen a lot of information about the need to get abilities for various jobs in order to be effective at the later levels. It also seems that in order to enjoy partying I need to have a 40+ class, so that's what I want to do. I'm interested in what's called the 'Criticial Path Method', that's where you do certain things in the right order, without wasting any time, and you get to the end result quickly and efficiently. Let's say I want to be a 50 whm as quickly as possible. Given everything you know, what is the best path? Example: 'Get Gladiator to 15, Conjurer to 30, ____ job to #, ____ job to #, etc. then take whm all the way to the top both solo and partying' I played XI a lot and wished I'd focused on getting one job to the top so I could have done more end game stuff, instead of having a ton of mid range jobs and doing the same thing over and over. Any help would be appreciated.


My advice would be to take it slow and level at your own pace. What is end content now will probably vanish once 2.0 comes out. The game is getting better with every update whilst end game content seems to be on the thin side at the moment.

Its not too difficult to get jobs to 30 anyway, as someone suggested you could get a PL and level up high but 40 - 50 is easy with spiritbond / EXP parties.
#14 May 31 2012 at 8:00 AM Rating: Decent
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Here's a response I recently got that seems helpfull:

'WHM is pretty simple. From the top of my head: Get PGL to 6, GLA to 22, then focus on CNJ until lvl30. Do all sidequests and main scenario quests that you can. You unlock new ones based on your highest class level. They will net you some exp, gil and starting gear. At lvl30, do the quest line to join a Grand Company and get a chocobo or goobbue. You can start the GC quests at lvl22 and to join a GC you need to be lvl25. At lvl30 you can do your first WHM job quest.

From there on, just keep leveling up CNJ while doing sidequests, main scenario and job quests as you reach high enough level to do them.'

Anything else to keep in mind?
#15 May 31 2012 at 8:23 AM Rating: Decent
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That's pretty solid advice. You unlock jobs you need to where you need them, you get exp from questing and you complete quests you won't be able to do again at some point down the road. It's a good starting point and something to keep in mind, but you should realize that you can stray from that path at any point and come back to it. It's a game and you should enjoy it so don't burn yourself out. Try and have some fun too.

A little off topic, but this is exactly the reason why XIV should be pressing the reset button at V2 launch. Players like this are going to want to come in and party up like they did in XI, but they'll quickly realize they can't do that without other new players around them. I get the feeling that even if SE decides not to do this, current players will either be stuck with each other and not be exposed to anyone new(unless they have friends join them) or they'll reroll on new servers because they realize it'll probably be more fun anyway...
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Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#16 May 31 2012 at 1:25 PM Rating: Good
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That's pretty solid advice, but I'd stress leveling CJN to 26-30 before you level GLA. Protect, Stoneskin, and Cure will be invaluable for leveling GLA. Not to mention GLA/PLD have the highest enhancing magic in the game so your buffs would be stronger than if a CJN/WHM in the party is handing them out.

Also Filthy, Yoshida will never hit that reset button. The second he does is the second he loses every player that stuck by this game for a year and a half. It's not too hard for a new player to get a fully non-gimped 50, so there is really no need for it anyway.
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#17 May 31 2012 at 1:39 PM Rating: Decent
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He would lose me, that's for sure. I'm not one to play through something again, not after all the time I've spent already.
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#18 May 31 2012 at 1:56 PM Rating: Good
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Rinsui wrote:
Doing it right, you'll be 50 in 3 jobs by the end of the week. And ready to face the endless repetition of endgame dungeon speedruns.


And that's when the fun starts, right? Right!? The answer had better be in the affirmative, otherwise you'll just be heckling with truth again, and nobody wants to hear that.
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#19 May 31 2012 at 2:35 PM Rating: Good
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Funny, my wife and I just created new characters so we can try and level with people, and to experience the dungeons at level, and go back through some of the quests we chewed through. Basically the stuff that being level 50 kinda stole the fun from... We are even going to try and see if we can get a static party setup to find some good leveling locations and try different party dynamics...

So, in many ways, we are trying to find some fun at lower levels:). And yes, there is some fun stuff to do at 50, but only doing that gets REALLY boring.
#20 May 31 2012 at 5:31 PM Rating: Good
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UltKnightGrover wrote:
He would lose me, that's for sure. I'm not one to play through something again, not after all the time I've spent already.


A tune that may change come V2 when you realize, again assuming that a large influx of players comes to the game, that none of them are on your server. More likely than not there will be a lot of players who aren't playing their 50s wanting to try out what SE is doing for the new players.

No offense, but it's more important for them to bring in fresh meat than keep the old blood there. You guys playing now are probably considered to them as given. You're still paying and playing even though the game is horrible.
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Rinsui wrote:
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HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#21 May 31 2012 at 9:55 PM Rating: Good
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
UltKnightGrover wrote:
He would lose me, that's for sure. I'm not one to play through something again, not after all the time I've spent already.


A tune that may change come V2 when you realize, again assuming that a large influx of players comes to the game, that none of them are on your server. More likely than not there will be a lot of players who aren't playing their 50s wanting to try out what SE is doing for the new players.

No offense, but it's more important for them to bring in fresh meat than keep the old blood there. You guys playing now are probably considered to them as given. You're still paying and playing even though the game is horrible.


I think there's lots of alternatives to straight re-rolling. Additional jobs/weapons available at launch. Increase level cap to 75-80, level sync, level capped events, etc.

Edited, May 31st 2012 8:55pm by UltKnightGrover
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#22 May 31 2012 at 10:30 PM Rating: Default
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UltKnightGrover wrote:
I think there's lots of alternatives to straight re-rolling. Additional jobs/weapons available at launch. Increase level cap to 75-80, level sync, level capped events, etc.


I'm going off what we know already. Who's to say what will be available at launch, but the fact will always be that new players won't be participating with the older capped ones at least for a while. At that point you'll still have people who dabble in everything instead of trying to rush one class to cap. Could be a matter of months before you see anyone new outside of running through town helplessly searching for some elusive NPC.

Not to mention that there are a ton of older, returning players who will come back to find that they were 'merged' to a server that none of their old friends are on. Why not reroll if there will be an overhauled experience anyway? Other than people playing for the wrong reason anyway(tied down to their progress or their unwillingness to let others progress ahead of them) I really don't see a reason not to. I heard you like to start fresh with your fresh start...
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#23 Jun 01 2012 at 2:41 AM Rating: Good
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I'm confused, what do you mean by people merged to a server none of their old friends are on? If two people were playing on the same server, stopped playing, and began playing their same characters again, they would be on the same server.

The older capped events are too being rehauled. We know for sure that the instanced dungeons, the bosses within them, and the primal fights are all being changed. There's some speculation going around that Primal weapons will be drastically different for people who get them come 2.0.

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#24 Jun 01 2012 at 4:26 AM Rating: Decent
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UltKnightGrover wrote:
The older capped events are too being rehauled. We know for sure that the instanced dungeons, the bosses within them, and the primal fights are all being changed. There's some speculation going around that Primal weapons will be drastically different for people who get them come 2.0.


Speculation is just that, but we pretty confidently say that everyone who is playing now will probably have reached cap for their jobs 6 months from now. I doubt people would wait around for new players to level up so they can dig in to new content. It's not going to be easy to bring 3 year vets together with a lot of new players. These players will probably want to be on new servers so that there are a lot of people sharing the same experience they are. They're also more likely to get exp groups, help with group quests, ect.
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#25 Jun 01 2012 at 4:57 AM Rating: Good
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It only takes a month or so to get a class to level 50. (Maybe less.) I'm not buying that argument that people can't wait three weeks or so for their friends/new people to catch up.
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#26 Jun 01 2012 at 7:01 AM Rating: Excellent
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Now let`s see whether I can dodge the heckler brand by being polite, and still state what I believe.

Ultknight, this:
Quote:
It only takes a month or so to get a class to level 50. (Maybe less.) I'm not buying that
argument that people can't wait three weeks or so for their friends/new people to catch up.


is not the solution, but the source of the problem. I don`t want to blast through levels 1-49
just to reach the LV 50 "goal" and be greeted by a Garuda that`s giggling herself to death
everytime she is defeated because she knows that yet another batch of newbies has entered
the .01% drop attrition zone. And those droprates will never go away as long as new players
are able to reach "endgame" within a few weeks. Because SE has to stop all those players
from finishing the game somehow.

Every minute you shave off from the leveling process is a minute more spent doing the same
speedrun. Over and over and over and over. Is this so hard to understand, and is it so hard to
understand why I hate the speedleveling mentality so much?

I believe Yoshi`s (cool) original vision was like this:
- People like to level at their own pace, so we provide a system that accomodates to
both the gemuetlich type (Shploshae, Levequests) and the endgame maniacs (PL).
- People will choose what fits their personal preferences, and everybody will be happy.
- Those who want to go to the extreme and complement their character with abilities
from other classes can do so at their leisure. With the additional benefit that they can
fill several roles in their group at once.

For a producer who claims to know how MMOs work, thats embarassingly naive; because
"options" that make leveling faster or your character more versatile or powerful are not
"options" at all. I still remember my first Ifrit pickup group: "No sentinel - no party."
"Hey," you say, "that`s the community, not Yoshi`s fault!"
"Ho," I say, "it`s the type of community Yoshi`s game breeds."

I would *love* to explore the mysteries of Shploshae with a pickup group. Fighting back
to back for our lifes, having fun and making a bunch of friends on the way. But know what?
It`s (rightfully) considered a waste of time since you can be 50 in 3 weeks. And then you`ll
be able to rape it`s mysteries solo. Not that anyone would do it, because what good is the
LV 21 platinum chest drop @50.

Yoshi is in big trouble. And the biggest trouble he has is his responsibility for a fair
treatment of the paying, patient, and remarkably (*) loyal 1.0 customer community.
Because with their all-50 characters, trillions of gil and hardcore mentality, they are
the subgroup that`s making really radical changes to how the game works (including
item and monetary balance, as well as the adequate allocation of development
resources to different levels of content) really, really complicated.
No, I don`t want to be him.

TL/DR:
Fast Leveling -> Endgame Focus -> Midlevel Content is Ignored -> Rinsui Unhappy.

(*) Arrrgh. It`s so hard not to use the word "blindly" here. Arrrrgh.

#27 Jun 01 2012 at 7:24 AM Rating: Good
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I agree with all of the points you've mentioned, Rinsui. (Even rated you up.)

There is only one raid zone that is available for lower levels, The Thousand Maws of Toto-Rak, and up until the last minor patch, people were speedrunning it as level 50's in order to get the 25,000 company seals for AF weapons. That isn't fun at all. It's a well-designed beginning raid, but poorly implemented.

I would love to see dungeons like Shposhae, and Toto-rak get additional challenges/adjustments/drops, making the former instanced, and imposing level capped raids to where the level 50's would be able to sync down to the capped level. (This would be only a start, I would like to see them make use of more low-level raids, level 5, 15, 35, respectively.)

FFXI had it right for a time with their CoP challenges right before they ruined it by taking off the level caps. I honestly believe high levels and low levels can play together, there just needs to be the right gameplay mechanisms. (



Edited, Jun 1st 2012 6:26am by UltKnightGrover
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#28 Jun 01 2012 at 7:34 AM Rating: Excellent
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I started this thread just looking for some advice on leveling up.

Instead I got more of what I've seen over and over:

Moaning and groaning over how the game is designed, being played, etc.

I can't understand why people don't just stop playing and do something else, especially if they're this unhappy.

Life is too short to keep wasting time on something you don't enjoy.
#29 Jun 01 2012 at 7:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
I can't understand why people don't just stop playing and do something else

I did. Long ago.

Quote:
Life is too short to keep wasting time on something you don't enjoy.

I enjoy discussions.
#30 Jun 01 2012 at 9:09 AM Rating: Decent
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Callbeast wrote:
I started this thread just looking for some advice on leveling up.

Instead I got more of what I've seen over and over:

Moaning and groaning over how the game is designed, being played, etc.

I can't understand why people don't just stop playing and do something else, especially if they're this unhappy.

Life is too short to keep wasting time on something you don't enjoy.



A lot of people are upset about the game and feel the need to post about their frustration in every thread in existence.
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#31 Jun 01 2012 at 11:59 AM Rating: Excellent
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I think a lot of people are also upset at the wasted potential the game has. It's beautiful. The environments are real and breathing, the art design is great (although low level armor design leaves a lot to be desired), and I'd be happy just sitting in the middle of nowhere admiring stuff for a few minutes every day. Unfortunately, leveling is repetitive and tedious, and then endgame is repetitive and tedious. Why build all those absolutely beautiful environments if you never really get to see them?
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#32 Jun 01 2012 at 12:34 PM Rating: Good
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As someone who's only been playing for a week; I'm oblivious of the game that was launched, all I know is what I've seen on the screen every night so far this week. I found a great linkshell by using the server forums. The last couple of nights I've been duo-ing leves with a lalafella (taru) and have really enjoyed that. Before we teamed up yesterday I did a quest that netted me 30k gil and included some cool cutscenes. Right now I'd rather play FF14 than any other game in my ******** and there are plenty.
#33 Jun 01 2012 at 1:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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Shhhh Call... don't /poke the bee's nest.
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#34 Jun 01 2012 at 2:25 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't think he's poking anything. When a new player comes in and tells me he's having fun,
he might actually convince me, as his opinion is not yet tainted by years of investment in the
game. I sincerely hope he posts again in a week or two; if his opinion didn't change by then,
Yoshi's on the right track. ^.-/

Please, Callbeast, be sure to post again. I'll try to provide a useful answer first, and the sarcasm
later next time.

Edited, Jun 2nd 2012 6:02am by Rinsui
#35 Jun 01 2012 at 2:54 PM Rating: Good
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Rinsui wrote:
I would *love* to explore the mysteries of Shploshae with a pickup group. Fighting back to back for our lifes, having fun and making a bunch of friends on the way. But know what? It`s (rightfully) considered a waste of time since you can be 50 in 3 weeks. And then you`ll be able to rape it`s mysteries solo. Not that anyone would do it, because what good is the LV 21 platinum chest drop @50.


Oh, gosh, this. A very good point that encapsulates the problem of swift leveling and endgame grinds. Rinsui, you can use the grave accent in place of the apostrophe as much as you want, so long as you'll bring this attitude along when you party with me.
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#36 Jun 02 2012 at 12:48 AM Rating: Decent
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UltKnightGrover wrote:
It only takes a month or so to get a class to level 50. (Maybe less.) I'm not buying that argument that people can't wait three weeks or so for their friends/new people to catch up.


I don't doubt it, but why would you race to cap? There will be plenty of people(assuming it isn't fail V3) around in various level ranges to complete all types of content with so you can actually enjoy the game instead of trying to burn through it to get to and endgame we're not ever sure will exist. I like to progress through the game completing quests and missions when they are still challenging. It's no fun blazing to cap and mopping up all the content you missed along the way with little or no resistance.

This was actually one of the few things I liked about the seemingly endless grind of XI. When I ran into the choco license wall, I broke to complete Rank 2 missions. When I hit the Kazham key wall, I broke to complete Rank 3. I did up through Rank 5 when I hit the first limit break, so on..

Take a poll. Ultimately it will be the players choice, but the consensus in this thread so far is reroll. The option is there for self imposed reroll and I'm certain that if more players join or resub XIV than are currently playing now, the majority of players playing the game will be on new servers.
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#37 Jun 02 2012 at 10:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
Take a poll. Ultimately it will be the players choice, but the consensus in this thread so far is reroll. The option is there for self imposed reroll and I'm certain that if more players join or resub XIV than are currently playing now, the majority of players playing the game will be on new servers.

I hope I won't have to reroll, because while I may have a couple of high-level jobs currently in XIV, it wasn't through power-leveling, it was through casual playing. I would hate to lose my 3 level 45 crafts.

On the other hand, since I'm a legacy member and a game designer interested to know how SE are "fixing" this game, you can count on one of my 7 free character slots once V2 comes out that I'll try all the low level content "as it should be done" rather than on Cloe who will likely have her "every melee/mage job at 50" crown by then.

This might be one of the reason why they're tossing those 8 character slots to all legacy members -- hopefully they'll use them to play with newbies.
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#38 Jun 02 2012 at 10:44 AM Rating: Good
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It's not even racing to cap. It's very easy to level in this game. I don't think you understand how quickly one can get levels with the rested bonus and simply doing 3-4 guildleves.

I didn't rush to get my six almost seven level 50 jobs. Before 1.20 or whatever patch introduced inns, I only had Gladiator, Conjurer, and Thaumaturge at level 50.

Edit: Actually, looking at my level history. I may have gotten Archer 50 right before the inns were introduced as well.

Edited, Jun 2nd 2012 9:49am by UltKnightGrover
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Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn
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Viva Eorzea Free Company/Linkshell Leader - Hyperion Server

Aegis Server (2012-2013)
Figaro Server (2010-2012)

Final Fantasy XI:
Retired

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#39 Jun 02 2012 at 5:02 PM Rating: Decent
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4,145 posts
I think you're missing my point Grover. I understand it's easy to level and if you focused on one main class you could achieve that in a small amount of time, but how many new players are likely to do that? You said 3 weeks to cap a job. Does this include necessary abilities from other classes as well? Does this include crafting, side quests and companies? Even if it does, you're talking about what you can do now vs what will be available in 2013. We would hope that there will be more for new players to do and this will stretch the gap between new players and vets even more.

The people who already have gear or have at least 6 months to get it(from now) will have geared out their character, possibly for several classes by then. PS3 players aren't coming until well into 2013 so they're even further behind. Vets are not going to wait for new players to cap(under normal leveling circumstances) and then gear up so they can tackle harder endgame content. The question is, will this content still be viable by the time new players catch up. We can't answer that now, but we can say for sure that for a new player rolling on an established server, that window will be much smaller.

Roll on a new server where endgame content will be picking up interest and most populated a few months after release, or roll on an established server where people will be involved in endgame immediately and interest may start fading just as you are leveled and geared up enough to participate? No one can be absolutely certain what will happen, but it's more likely that this is how it will play out.

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cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
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