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FFXIV then and nowFollow

#1 Jun 04 2012 at 10:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Hello!

I write game articles for a little-known site (no sarcasm there, unfortunately) and am currently working on a piece about FFXIV--its past, present, and future. I guess I should start further back than that, though. I played FFXI from 2003 to 2008; was a huge fan; met my now-fiance there on Ramuh; and was so psyched about FFXIV when I first heard about it. So this article isn't going to be biased at all. ;)

Anyway after playing a bit of FFXIV at launch I was disappointed with the gameplay quality and quit, and that was that--until recently, when suddenly I could not stop thinking about tarutaru. I've been playing again for about a month now and am so impressed by the changes Yoshida and his team have made to the game that I wanted to write an article about the state of FFXIV especially aimed at old players who are considering coming back and new players who never gave it a chance because of that brutal 49/100 Metacritic score.

And now to the point. I've only been back for about a month, and casually at that, so I'd love to get some information about the state of the game from you all in the trenches, who've experienced higher-level, in-depth content that I haven't seen yet or come across in my research. I'm going to include below a summary of what I've already come up with for FFXIV's past, present, and future, and welcome thoughts, corrections, and additions to what I've compiled.

September 2010 (then)

-There is no auction house. The replacement system, Market Wards, is a joke. In order to buy an item from another player you must manually check the bazaar of the retainer selling said item—in other words, get incredibly lucky or be impossibly tenacious.
-There is no auto-attack. You must hit enter every single time you want to take a swing.
-There is serious lag, painful lag, lag so bad your little brother knows not to come within 15 feet of you while you’re FFXIV-ing for fear of death by asphyxiation.
-The UI is terrible. Just God-awful. Also laggy.
-The most effective way to gain experience is via job-specific quests called guildleves which are available in sets of 8 every 36 hours. This system rewards low-key play-styles and heavily disadvantages dedicated gamers.
-A confusing system is in place where a character has two levels: class rank and physical rank. Physical rank increases no matter what class he levels, including crafting classes (Disciple of the Hand) and gathering classes (Disciple of the Land).
-The graphics are incredible, but you won’t be able to appreciate them if your computer isn’t top-of-the-line.
-No chocobos.

June 2012 (now)

-Lead Developer Hiromichi Tanaka has been replaced by director/producer Naoki Yoshida, a hardcore MMO player who “can work without sleeping” and who openly communicates with players in game forums.
-There is still no auction house. However players can now speak with an NPC to search the Market Wards for and purchase items other players want to sell. It’s a *massive* improvement but it’s still a bit clunkier than an auction house. For example if a city’s Market Wards are full, other players cannot sell their items there, which is ridiculous and frustrating.
-Auto-attack has been implemented, thank the Twelve.
-The lag issues have been sorted out. Little Johnny can breathe easy.
-The UI is better. But not great.
-MP now regenerates automatically (and quickly!) when not in active mode, which has you fighting more, resting less.
-There are now airships between cities, and single-player combos, and some other fun content such as NMs and quests that I haven’t yet had the chance to experience.
-Physical ranks have been eliminated for simplicity.
-Because too much simplicity is apparently bad for our health, a complex and controversial job system has been implemented in addition to and complementing the class system. It’s difficult to boil down, but jobs seem to be focused on perfecting a few skills, whereas classes seem to be less focused and instead more versatile.
-The game still requires a sophisticated computer setup to run smoothly and look fancy.
-Chocobos!

Final Fantasy XIV Version 2.0

1. Complete redesign of repetitive maps
2. Fully-customizable graphics to cater to a broader range of PC capabilities
3. A new server system which will improve current UI and search issues
4. A completely rebuilt UI that will even allow for user-made add-ons (previously unheard of from SE)
5. Unique story content that only those playing before version 2.0 will get to experience

Bring your brutal honesty. The point of this article is not to sugarcoat or advertise but to inform gamers about the state of FFXIV. Thank you for your help!
#2 Jun 05 2012 at 3:05 AM Rating: Decent
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The lag issues have been sorted out. Little Johnny can breathe easy.

Unluckily this is not true. There is still considerable lag when buying and selling in some places,
there are some crashes in Ul'dah related to overcrowding, and depending on where you live, the
latency between your computer and the japanese servers puts you at a serious disadvantage in
battles.

Yoshi promised this problem would be sorted out in the 2.0 version with new servers, but for now,
its still is an issue for *some* players, especially those in europe and the US east coast, while others
have adapted by memorizing the action patterns of bosses like Ifrit so they can predict what will
happen before it happens; like this, they are able to... uh... make "good use of" the fixed encounter
script to evade attacks that they know to come a few seconds later. Whether this is the way a good
boss encounter should work is a matter of opinion.

Your remaining overview is pretty accurate, though. The job system is not really confusing; it's pretty
straightforward: for now, every class gets one (advanced) job. The problem is rather that it is redundant.
Jobs basically are are just a more refined version of the basic class, and for now, there's little incentive
to play a class when you can also play a job. There are exceptions, because jobs are more restricted
in their abilities than classes, but ultimately many players (like me) see no real, imperative necessity to
keep both classes and jobs in the game.

Hmm. At second thought, I think you are right. The job/class distinction is unnecessarily confusing.
The added layer of complexity is in no way justified by the marginal benefits the system provides.
#3 Jun 05 2012 at 3:11 AM Rating: Decent
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Then: Had to use menus to do simple things like opening doors or targeting aetherial gates.

Now: Can easily target them as actual objects.


I'll think of more later.
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#4 Jun 05 2012 at 4:34 AM Rating: Decent
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Raeni wrote:
-There is still no auction house. However players can now speak with an NPC to search the Market Wards for and purchase items other players want to sell. It’s a *massive* improvement but it’s still a bit clunkier than an auction house. For example if a city’s Market Wards are full, other players cannot sell their items there, which is ridiculous and frustrating.
-Auto-attack has been implemented, thank the Twelve.
-The lag issues have been sorted out. Little Johnny can breathe easy.


The 'massive' improvement to the wards system is overstated. You've played XI and possibly other games, but going backward from AH to wards after nearly 10 years will never be an improvement(no matter what adjustments and additions they bring imo).

Auto-attack I guess is a preference thing, but the battle system of XIV is very poor. There isn't much difference from the original stamina building(cooldown) system they had in place except instead of standing there having a staring contest with the mob, you now swing as your TP builds.

As stated above, the lag issues are far from gone.

I guess it wouldn't hurt anything except public perception(which is already incredibly low), but I'm not sure why you'd pick now to make this 'then and now' comparison. Anyone who reads an objective article on the progress up to this point will basically see that the game was unbearable to play for most of it's life and is still really bad. You're just affirming to everyone(anyone who still listens anyway) that all XIV has at this point is promise.

If I were you I'd wait until August/September to do your article. SE has planned to come out with some sort of promotion including the trailer for XIV 2.0 so it would make more sense to line it up with new information. Otherwise all the info in your future section will be stuff people have known is tentative for V2 for over a year now.

Edited, Jun 5th 2012 6:37am by FilthMcNasty
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Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#5 Jun 05 2012 at 4:57 AM Rating: Excellent
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The problem your going to come across is that pretty much everyone who plays FF14 have done so from the beginning so all these tweeks that have actually improved the game will go un-noticed.

I came back following the campaign and the game has come on leaps and bounds. Its a far more refined game than it was when it was released. UI, Lag, content, ease of leveling have all been improved.

Your opening article looks really good and is probably spot on to how the game is now,

Little Johnny can breathe, but currently needs an inhaler to help him overcome his panic attacks in certain situations i.e Ul'dah
#6 Jun 05 2012 at 5:08 AM Rating: Good
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MP now regenerates automatically (and quickly!) when not in active mode, which has you fighting more, resting less.


Hm. While we are at it, I fear I have to be a party pooper on this one as well. It is true that MP now regenerates
automatically, but the crux is the "not in active mode" part. Basically it means that your mages will never draw
their weapons in a fight; they just stand around in passive mode when casting their spells from the outside.
Before patch 1.19, they had to use spells and abilities (Siphon Soul?) to regenerate their mana, which, in my
opinion, was a more involving and tactically challenging mechanic... but perhaps the siphon line of spells didn't
make it into the "15 ability per class" limit.

Btw, one major change between "then" and "now" was that all classes got "streamlined" (or "crippled", depending on
the way you see it). While some mages had about 25 (?) spells at their disposal before, practically all DoT and enfeeble
spells were axed in 1.20, which brought down the spell number to about 15 (?) per class. Some people say this was
an improvement. Well.
#7 Jun 05 2012 at 7:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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DoT and enfeeble spells were NOT removed from the game. They were simply added as random chance additional effects on elemental base spells. In my opinion, this provides a more tactical situation, where the player must kno the when and where to use specific elemental spells.
#8 Jun 05 2012 at 8:02 AM Rating: Decent
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Bio, slow, poison, dia, burn, frost, rasp, blind, silence?
And what is more "tactical" about abilities that require a random chance to go off?
#9 Jun 05 2012 at 9:33 AM Rating: Good
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All of what you mentioned go off if you perform combos with abilities. Slow went to Pugilist. Blind went to Gladiator/Paladin, etc...
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Final Fantasy XI:
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#10 Jun 05 2012 at 10:00 AM Rating: Decent
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Bio, poison, dia, burn, frost, rasp? The THM absorb line?
Hello-o? I seem to be better informed than you guys, and I ain't even playing!
And good luck pulling off that stun combo before a boss finishes his TP move...
...then again, you wouldn't be able to stun in time anyway (lag).

There may be a "bigger picture" we can't see yet, but I can't see it yet.
Perhaps you can. All I know is that people complain about THM (BLM)
gameplay being little more than thunder, thunder, thunder, rest. While
before you still had to check enfeebles were tickin' and paralyze up and
kickin'.

Oh. What happened to paralyze, btw?
#11 Jun 05 2012 at 11:51 AM Rating: Decent
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From BLM perspective:

Enfeebling effects do NOT require a combo to be activated. That statement is absolutely incorrect and should be disregarded.

Blizzara - Chance to Bind any affected targets; AOE effect. INSTANT CAST
Thundara - Chance to Stun the target. INSTANT CAST


Notice a trend here? Not only do you get a chance to enfeeble your enemy, but you also can damage them in the process. White Mage has access to Stonera, which I BELIEVE can inflict paralysis (could be wrong on this).

The idea from the dev team was to split up different enfeeblement across all jobs in order to keep people from taking certain job combinations in battle. Unfortunately, this hasn't really happened for things like instances or primal battles as of yet. The american player base still tend to lean more towards the standard cookie cutter BS it always has.
#12 Jun 05 2012 at 12:39 PM Rating: Decent
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PalidorCarbuncle wrote:
DoT and enfeeble spells were NOT removed from the game. They were simply added as random chance additional effects on elemental base spells. In my opinion, this provides a more tactical situation, where the player must kno the when and where to use specific elemental spells.


Whoa- I hadn't heard anything about this! As an FFXI BLM I prided myself on hitting those key enfeebles, but I wonder if this isn't a more dynamic solution that encourages party cooperation? (Assuming your party has half a brain.) Anyway I can see from these posts that opinions are mixed.

Rinsui wrote:
Quote:
MP now regenerates automatically (and quickly!) when not in active mode, which has you fighting more, resting less.


Hm. While we are at it, I fear I have to be a party pooper on this one as well. It is true that MP now regenerates
automatically, but the crux is the "not in active mode" part. Basically it means that your mages will never draw
their weapons in a fight; they just stand around in passive mode when casting their spells from the outside.
Before patch 1.19, they had to use spells and abilities (Siphon Soul?) to regenerate their mana, which, in my
opinion, was a more involving and tactically challenging mechanic... but perhaps the siphon line of spells didn't
make it into the "15 ability per class" limit.


Interesting. I've only leveled mages at low levels so far and it seemed like a blessing not to have to sit for 3 minutes every time my MP was depleted.

FilthMcNasty wrote:
I guess it wouldn't hurt anything except public perception(which is already incredibly low), but I'm not sure why you'd pick now to make this 'then and now' comparison. Anyone who reads an objective article on the progress up to this point will basically see that the game was unbearable to play for most of it's life and is still really bad. You're just affirming to everyone(anyone who still listens anyway) that all XIV has at this point is promise.


A fair question. I'm coming back to the game fresh, and have really, really been having a blast. I know I'm not unbiased--SE makes MMOs that are appealing to me in ways other MMOs just aren't--so this article can't really be completely objective; but compared to my experience in Sept 2010 this game is like night and day. If that means to you that night was "unbearable" and day is "still really bad," then maybe I just haven't played enough content to realize how bad the state of things really still is. But maybe I'm just looking for a different kind of experience.
#13 Jun 05 2012 at 1:18 PM Rating: Good
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PalidorCarbuncle wrote:
From BLM perspective:

Enfeebling effects do NOT require a combo to be activated. That statement is absolutely incorrect and should be disregarded.

Blizzara - Chance to Bind any affected targets; AOE effect. INSTANT CAST
Thundara - Chance to Stun the target. INSTANT CAST


Notice a trend here? Not only do you get a chance to enfeeble your enemy, but you also can damage them in the process. White Mage has access to Stonera, which I BELIEVE can inflict paralysis (could be wrong on this).

The idea from the dev team was to split up different enfeeblement across all jobs in order to keep people from taking certain job combinations in battle. Unfortunately, this hasn't really happened for things like instances or primal battles as of yet. The american player base still tend to lean more towards the standard cookie cutter BS it always has.


Really? American Player's sticking to a cookie-cutter build, and battle style? Never! (and never mind the comments that SE promotes it...)

And it is not limited to blm either. Almost every class has an enfeeble ability. I have yet to be in a party since jobs were introduced that people actually use them.

It appears to be linked to the idea of: If it's not over-powered, it's completely worthless. In regards to bind and stun, they still work the same, but people got a taste of what it was like to have unlimited bind and stun, and now, they will not even use it (even though the basic functionality would be the same in oh, say the moogle fight), if it was staggered, and more timing was applied (than setting up a spam order).

But, yeah, that is another aspect of the game from when it was launched and now that they still share.

There is a general lack of community (you can find a linkshell, or a click), but there is a definite elitest mentality combined with a "Do it my way only" mentality.
All and all though, as long as you meet people who share your ideas/expectations for the game you can be happy (by either enjoying doing stuff or complaining about stuff) in the game.

I also image that we will see traditional enfeebles and buffs return with Rdm. But, who knows.
#14 Jun 05 2012 at 1:32 PM Rating: Decent
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Raeni wrote:
A fair question. I'm coming back to the game fresh, and have really, really been having a blast. I know I'm not unbiased--SE makes MMOs that are appealing to me in ways other MMOs just aren't--so this article can't really be completely objective; but compared to my experience in Sept 2010 this game is like night and day. If that means to you that night was "unbearable" and day is "still really bad," then maybe I just haven't played enough content to realize how bad the state of things really still is. But maybe I'm just looking for a different kind of experience.


Sorry for the misunderstanding. When you said you were working on a piece for the site I assumed that the article would be objective based on what you said you'd be writing about.

Night and day are complete opposites so it's not really accurate in terms of my comparison. (Good) Humor me here... See what I did there?

Lets say SE is an ice cream sundae company. You're a fan of SE's ice cream so it doesn't matter what flavor you get served, you like it. Me on the other hand, I have a specific taste. Back in 2010 SE was serving my least favorite flavor of ice cream. Fast forward to the present and they still have the flavor I ******* hate, but now they tossed some sprinkles and a cherry on it. Don't get me wrong, I like fudge, caramel, whipped cream and nearly any and everything else you could bathe frozen cow juice in, but at the core; the most important part is the ice cream.

I hope this makes sense, but I'll try to clarify. Basic foundation like battle system, UI and menus, controls, quest structure, encounter design, graphics optimization and other things like this I consider to be the core elements(ice cream). You can pile on a bunch of other goodies like shiny weapons and mounts(fudge and whipped cream), but if you don't like the flavor then you aren't going to really enjoy the sundae.
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#15 Jun 05 2012 at 3:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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Personally, I think if you want to help the game, you'd focus on promoting 2.0 for new players and even returning players who haven't signed back up yet.

I think anyone who was remotely interested in giving FFXIV another chance in its current incarnation has done so already. My concern is that if people sign up for FFXIV now thinking they'll be getting 2.0, they will be utterly repulsed by the shocking disappointment of the current version.

Don't get me wrong, the game has improved. But as you pointed out, it's climbing from a depth of 49/100. Even if it could get a 60-65 now, it's still far from its intended quality. Many problems still exist:

- Controller UI on a mouse-based PC platform
- Incurable lag from poor engine netcode.
- Cut-and-paste environment
- Limits on displayable characters that make NPCs invisible for several seconds (even a minute in busy areas).
- No delivery system
- Sub-par market system
- Almost no new story content since launch
- Heavy on grind content (grinding leves, grinding crafts, grinding end game gear, grinding materia)

That's not even every problem, but you won't see any of this fixed until 2.0 at the earliest, which makes it the best time to give the game a chance, in my opinion.
#16 Jun 06 2012 at 12:50 PM Rating: Decent
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I see what you're saying about focusing exclusively on 2.0. However I think discussion about how far the game has come since launch gives readers solid proof that SE really is dedicated to making it better, and will only make people more excited about all the 2.0 publicity when it does come.

Thanks everyone for your responses! :)
#17 Jun 06 2012 at 1:02 PM Rating: Good
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Raeni wrote:
I see what you're saying about focusing exclusively on 2.0. However I think discussion about how far the game has come since launch gives readers solid proof that SE really is dedicated to making it better, and will only make people more excited about all the 2.0 publicity when it does come.

Thanks everyone for your responses! :)


Has the game come far from where it originally started ? Yes!

Has it come far Enough ? No!

Has SE/Yoshi been outperformed by just about every single MMO developing team out there in updates and quality of patches? Yes!

Is every other MMO out there in the same grave position as FFXIV ? No!

After 2 full years + beta time, is the game up to par with games released in 2010 and earlier ? Nope!

Why should we even think that SE is dedicated to making this game better, when obviously they are doing a terrible job of It ? Now dont get me wrong, i dont think yoshi is a horrible mmo developer, but he is not the jesus christ everybody wants to portray he is, the fact is FFXIV dev team is in a fight for the life of it's game, and they have yet to show that they are willing to go far and beyond any other company in order to succeed.
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#18 Jun 06 2012 at 1:07 PM Rating: Default
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Ostia wrote:
Raeni wrote:
I see what you're saying about focusing exclusively on 2.0. However I think discussion about how far the game has come since launch gives readers solid proof that SE really is dedicated to making it better, and will only make people more excited about all the 2.0 publicity when it does come.

Thanks everyone for your responses! :)


Has the game come far from where it originally started ? Yes!

Has it come far Enough ? No!

Has SE/Yoshi been outperformed by just about every single MMO developing team out there in updates and quality of patches? Yes!

Is every other MMO out there in the same grave position as FFXIV ? No!

After 2 full years + beta time, is the game up to par with games released in 2010 and earlier ? Nope!

Why should we even think that SE is dedicated to making this game better, when obviously they are doing a terrible job of It ? Now dont get me wrong, i dont think yoshi is a horrible mmo developer, but he is not the jesus christ everybody wants to portray he is, the fact is FFXIV dev team is in a fight for the life of it's game, and they have yet to show that they are willing to go far and beyond any other company in order to succeed.


Only major ones out there are SWTOR and WoW really. No game will beat WoW. It came at the right time with the right thing but even it's lost a few million subscribers. Before we event touch that 80% of WoW players are in China (as per blizzard themselves); they've lost over half their NA players.

SWTOR just went free to play till level 15. Not sure what you mean by grave but even with a failed launch XIV seems to be pulling not only the horsehoes but the entire carriage out of their *** with the recent media release.

After 2 years of release is XIV up to par with other games 2 years after their release? Pretty frigging close. Apples to apples; XIV is at about the same pace as other games after 2 years of their own release.

You must be a dam troll or out of the communication loops to not see what they've been doing. Far and above? Oh here; we are going to work overtime hours for 2-3 years spending a 10's of millions of dollars AGAIN just to put out another version of the game; all the while updating the storyline to give cohesievness to the changes.

They've done some sh*t jobs of updates on some things but credit is due for them. They are doing a lot.


Edited, Jun 6th 2012 12:09pm by Elionara

Edited, Jun 6th 2012 12:14pm by Elionara
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Like Final Fantasy XI, the game specs will be extremely high for the time, but in about 5 years, an average machine can run it on max settings with little to no issues. Tanaka also expressed interest in making a benchmark program available.

FilthMcNasty wrote:
I endorse this thread.
#19 Jun 06 2012 at 1:19 PM Rating: Good
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Elionara wrote:
Ostia wrote:
Raeni wrote:
I see what you're saying about focusing exclusively on 2.0. However I think discussion about how far the game has come since launch gives readers solid proof that SE really is dedicated to making it better, and will only make people more excited about all the 2.0 publicity when it does come.

Thanks everyone for your responses! :)


Has the game come far from where it originally started ? Yes!

Has it come far Enough ? No!

Has SE/Yoshi been outperformed by just about every single MMO developing team out there in updates and quality of patches? Yes!

Is every other MMO out there in the same grave position as FFXIV ? No!

After 2 full years + beta time, is the game up to par with games released in 2010 and earlier ? Nope!

Why should we even think that SE is dedicated to making this game better, when obviously they are doing a terrible job of It ? Now dont get me wrong, i dont think yoshi is a horrible mmo developer, but he is not the jesus christ everybody wants to portray he is, the fact is FFXIV dev team is in a fight for the life of it's game, and they have yet to show that they are willing to go far and beyond any other company in order to succeed.


Only major ones out there are SWTOR and WoW really. No game will beat WoW. It came at the right time with the right thing but even it's lost a few million subscribers. Before we event touch that 80% of WoW players are in China (as per blizzard themselves); they've lost over half their NA players.

SWTOR just went free to play till level 15. Not sure what you mean by grave but even with a failed launch XIV seems to be pulling not only the horsehoes but the entire carriage out of their *** with the recent media release.

After 2 years of release is XIV up to par with other games 2 years after their release? Pretty frigging close. Apples to apples; XIV is at about the same pace as other games after 2 years of their own release.

You must be a retarded troll or out of the communication loops to not see what they've been doing. Far and above? Oh here; we are going to work overtime hours for 2-3 years spending a 10's of millions of dollars AGAIN just to put out another version of the game; all the while updating the storyline to give cohesievness to the changes.

They've done some sh*t jobs of updates on some things but credit is due for them. They are doing a lot.


Edited, Jun 6th 2012 12:09pm by Elionara


Ah! white Knights! How i missed you Smiley: laugh

First off, what the F@ck does it meter if 10-20-60-100% of a games population is in China ? Are Chinese people less than Japanese or American people ? And what swotor did is not free to play, is called a trial Idiot! How are they even close ? The closest they are is to Tera, wish released a few months ago in the states, 2 full years and they are close to match a game that just released...... Yup! going far and beyond duty Brah! They cant match cataclysm (Just the expansion not the entire wow universe) they cant match swotor, they cant match rift, and that is in content, or update quality, can they even match in population ? Nope! So please do tell me where does FFXIV matches any of this games at ?

Oh and dont even start with the storyline, 2 FREAKING YEARS!!! No major advance whatsoever........
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