Forum Settings
       
This Forum is Read Only

Will 2.0 bring with it a graphical downgrade? Follow

#1 Jul 10 2012 at 9:35 AM Rating: Good
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
Not sure if their is merit to this. Could have been a rumor I heard?

I am looking to buy a laptop. (I know this is a dead horse, but yes I mean laptop). I have been advised of three on newegg that may play this game. My budget is only $700, so it's pretty low but this is why I ask about 2.0s graphics.

The ones I have found are:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834158401&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-_-na-_-na-_-na&AID=10446076&PID=4176827&SID=odexuje8a8es

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834215417&nm_mc=OTC-pr1c3grabb3r&cm_mmc=OTC-pr1c3grabb3r-_-Notebooks-_-Acer+America-_-34215417


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834215419&nm_mc=OTC-pr1c3grabb3r&cm_mmc=OTC-pr1c3grabb3r-_-Notebooks-_-Acer+America-_-34215419

Thoughts? I know I probably won't find a laptop within my budget to play it on high, but it's also not the only thing I'm planning to use it for. (diablo 3, ffxi, etc)


Edited, Jul 10th 2012 11:36am by desabul
____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#2 Jul 10 2012 at 9:57 AM Rating: Default
Avatar
***
2,045 posts
Yes, they stated a few times they are lowering the graphics engine down to play on lower spec pcs.
____________________________
BANNED
#3 Jul 10 2012 at 10:06 AM Rating: Decent
****
4,153 posts
Wait until it's released until you make your purchase. 2.0 is supposed to make the game more friendly in terms of playing on lower spec systems, but until it can be tested it's all speculation.
____________________________
Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#4 Jul 10 2012 at 10:52 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
FilthMcNasty wrote:
Wait until it's released until you make your purchase. 2.0 is supposed to make the game more friendly in terms of playing on lower spec systems, but until it can be tested it's all speculation.


Not sure I can wait. Really itching for the portability. What if I say $850 for budget? Given the speculated graphics of 2.0. What would be a good suggestion for laptop that could, in the meantime, play diablo 3 and hopefully 2.0 when it's released?
____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#5 Jul 10 2012 at 11:09 AM Rating: Good
****
4,153 posts
desabul wrote:
FilthMcNasty wrote:
Wait until it's released until you make your purchase. 2.0 is supposed to make the game more friendly in terms of playing on lower spec systems, but until it can be tested it's all speculation.


Not sure I can wait. Really itching for the portability. What if I say $850 for budget? Given the speculated graphics of 2.0. What would be a good suggestion for laptop that could, in the meantime, play diablo 3 and hopefully 2.0 when it's released?


Unfortunately your budget doesn't dictate how well the team at SE is able to optimize their graphics engine.

I can't, in good conscience, advise you to spend that kind of money based on speculation. If there was a gun to my head then I'd say get something overpowered. Anything I would point at is in the $1100 range so you'd still end up waiting to increase your budget anyway.
____________________________
Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#6 Jul 10 2012 at 11:42 AM Rating: Decent
***
2,214 posts
The graphics you are seeing in the screenshots are run on a business class laptop. Typically these range in price from the 700-1k range.

I am currently playing on a high-end gamer laptop, settings are roughly: Windows 7 64bit Intel i7, 8 gig of ram, SSD Primary drive, high speed SATA secondary drive. Dual Intel (Shared memory pipeline) and NVidia (2 Gig dedicated DDR3+GPU) graphics cards. Game runs as good as a desktop, but laptop has a tendency to overheat and shutdown.

With that said, if you can play Diablo 3 on it, I would expect you can handle 14-2 without any significant issues.

A couple things to keep in mind:
The benchmarks for Final Fantasy have always been kind of a joke. 14s being more of a joke than anything (they render upwards of 100 character models in a low detail area, when in-game the real bottle neck is when there 100+ character models that only 40 are dynamically selected and rendered in a high detail area, e.g. Ul'dah by the crystal).

So, when the Benchmark comes out, you can give it a run for it's money, but take the results with a grain of salt.

Next, would be to try the beta. However, from the sound of the issues that they are currently having with the render optimizations for the desktop client, once the shaders and filters are added to the game (The reason the current screen-shots look like cell-shaded 3D objects, or 2D perspective objects), there is a chance that they are going to run into system specific issues early in the beta. Ideally they will resolve them by the time the game goes out the door, however, MANY games have fought with this for months after their initial release (you can blame it on the client or the company, but the real issue is just that different video cards have different optimizations and APIs, and as a net result, especially business class laptops have issues with high end API calls typically used in render optimizations). There are a few times when the company (e.g. SE) will have to contact the Video Card manufacturer and report the bug in their software, and you have to wait for an update to your card (and they *RARELY* tell the customers that is the route that is being taken).

An example of this would be the recent rash of Black-screens on NVidia cards. NVidia has been systematically updating their drivers for the past 6 months+ to update them to fix this issue.
#7 Jul 10 2012 at 12:44 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
I'd love some suggestions then for such laptops. I could do 750-1000 as budget. Maybe ones that would play diablo 3/skyrim well and we'll assume it will then play 2.0

I found this Sager NP6165
GeForce GT 650M
Intel i5 3210M
8 GB ram
500 GB 7200 rpm
$872


How would this fare?
____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#8 Jul 10 2012 at 1:15 PM Rating: Decent
***
2,214 posts
desabul wrote:
I'd love some suggestions then for such laptops. I could do 750-1000 as budget. Maybe ones that would play diablo 3/skyrim well and we'll assume it will then play 2.0

I found this Sager NP6165
GeForce GT 650M
Intel i5 3210M
8 GB ram
500 GB 7200 rpm
$872


How would this fare?


Personally, I would say if you can't play 14-2 on that laptop, the game is not worth playing on a PC.
While both the processor and video card have the reduced (mobile) instruction sets, they are both designed to be scalable for performance vs battery. Plugged in, that should fare quite well, and actually should be able to play the game in it's current state (down-scaled, and avoid SH and primal fights).
#9 Jul 11 2012 at 3:39 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
****
4,148 posts
I'd advise against a gaming laptop if the budget is tight, you'll get more FPS bang for your buck with a desktop.
____________________________
Mishana: DRG | THF | RDM | NIN
#10 Jul 11 2012 at 6:46 AM Rating: Good
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
Levish wrote:
I'd advise against a gaming laptop if the budget is tight, you'll get more FPS bang for your buck with a desktop.


I do not want a desktop. Portability is a must.
____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#11 Jul 11 2012 at 6:54 AM Rating: Good
***
3,825 posts
desabul wrote:
Levish wrote:
I'd advise against a gaming laptop if the budget is tight, you'll get more FPS bang for your buck with a desktop.


I do not want a desktop. Portability is a must.


I bought a Sager with the 670M, you can build one for under 1K... though for a laptop acting as a sole gaming hub I'd go with the 675m or 680m. I'm happy with the performance of the 670 with the current engine, but I have my gaming desktop which can grow to fully enjoy future titles.

If you buy a Sager go through xoticpc, they sell them slightly cheaper and have better customer service. They also have military discounts if you or a family member is eligable.
____________________________
FFXI:Sylph - Perrin 75 Hume THF; Retired (At least from my use any way)
EVE Online:ScraperX; Retired
WAR:IronClaw- Peryn SW;SkullThrone- Grymloc BO; Retired


#12 Jul 11 2012 at 8:19 AM Rating: Good
**
640 posts
I'd say go get yourself a SSD.
#13 Jul 11 2012 at 2:48 PM Rating: Excellent
I bought an Acer laptop for $600 that has an i5 processor and a 7k-series Radeon mobile card. It has 4 gigs of RAM and I think the processor speed is somewhere in the 2.6 range.

It runs both FFXIV and Diablo III without trouble. There's just a little bit of lag in FFXIV when I'm on my choco, which I could probably do away with if I lowered the graphic settings, but it's not that big of a deal.

That said, the switch to v2.0 may actually be considered a graphics upgrade for many users, seeing as how many players may be able to run the game at higher settings thanks to the new graphics engine. The switch may only be a downgrade for people who play on very high settings.
____________________________
Thayos Redblade
Jormungandr
Hyperion
#14 Jul 11 2012 at 6:24 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
Thayos wrote:
I bought an Acer laptop for $600 that has an i5 processor and a 7k-series Radeon mobile card. It has 4 gigs of RAM and I think the processor speed is somewhere in the 2.6 range.

It runs both FFXIV and Diablo III without trouble. There's just a little bit of lag in FFXIV when I'm on my choco, which I could probably do away with if I lowered the graphic settings, but it's not that big of a deal.

That said, the switch to v2.0 may actually be considered a graphics upgrade for many users, seeing as how many players may be able to run the game at higher settings thanks to the new graphics engine. The switch may only be a downgrade for people who play on very high settings.


Thayos

Do you know what model the Acer is? Or maybe a comparable link to one on newegg?

Thanks for the responses!
____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#15 Jul 11 2012 at 7:02 PM Rating: Good
***
3,825 posts
desabul wrote:
Thayos wrote:
I bought an Acer laptop for $600 that has an i5 processor and a 7k-series Radeon mobile card. It has 4 gigs of RAM and I think the processor speed is somewhere in the 2.6 range.

It runs both FFXIV and Diablo III without trouble. There's just a little bit of lag in FFXIV when I'm on my choco, which I could probably do away with if I lowered the graphic settings, but it's not that big of a deal.

That said, the switch to v2.0 may actually be considered a graphics upgrade for many users, seeing as how many players may be able to run the game at higher settings thanks to the new graphics engine. The switch may only be a downgrade for people who play on very high settings.


Thayos

Do you know what model the Acer is? Or maybe a comparable link to one on newegg?

Thanks for the responses!


Not saying his specs are bad, but if you are buying a laptop as your sole gaming device you really need to buy the best you can afford today. Saving 100 bucks now can mean a nessecary upgrade a few years sooner depending on the types of games you enjoy. Acer does have a new unit with an i7 and a so so GPU for under 800 bucks http://www.anandtech.com/show/6066/acer-aspire-v3571g9435-the-value-proposition personally I wouldn't get anything lower than a 660m on the nvidia side for a dedicated gaming laptop, but it's your money and your call. I think lenovo has a similar spec laptop with a slightly faster AMD GPU for about the same price.
____________________________
FFXI:Sylph - Perrin 75 Hume THF; Retired (At least from my use any way)
EVE Online:ScraperX; Retired
WAR:IronClaw- Peryn SW;SkullThrone- Grymloc BO; Retired


#16 Jul 11 2012 at 8:15 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
K53SD-DS71 Overview

Display:
15.6" LED (1366x768) Glossy
Video Card:
2048MB nVIDIA 610M w/ Optimus
Processor:
2nd Generation Intel® Mobile Core i7 2670QM (Customizable)
Memory:
6GB DDR3 1333MHz (Up to 16GB)
Hard Drive:
750GB 5400RPM Hard Drive (Customizable)

This is the hard part for me. When you say no less than a 660M, I have trouble determining which cards you mean. How would this laptop fair?


____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#17 Jul 11 2012 at 9:18 PM Rating: Good
***
3,825 posts
Are you only wanting this for XIV? If so a laptop is a very bad investment, for ANY single game. Having said that, for the price, anything that comes with a 610m... you are almost better off with the onboard Intel or AMD GPU except that their drivers usually suck.

What's your budget? Can you save up a few weeks or a month or two to increase it?

Maybe this isn't the same for everyone, but for me a laptop is something that I buy that can do everything I need with a graphical comprimise... however it's also the least recurring purchase I make. I upgrade my consoles almost every generation (to include handhelds), I upgrade my PC annually (not totally, but usually a hard drive here, a GPU there, a monitor or keyboard whatever...), I run my laptops until they die. I got 8 years off the second to last one, I paid almost 3K for it. The previous laptop, I went cheap... It still does internet duty and extremely light gaming for the wife, but it's been 2 years and it's going to be replaced shortly... I paid $1,100 for it. The curent laptop I could have got for under 1,100 but I added a few things like a BluRay player (I buy a lot of movies when I'm deployed and I'd prefer to avoid buying movies twice), I expect it to last 10 years if it doesn't die. I didn't expect any of the above to play games released after 2 years of purchasing them. The first one played games pretty well for about 5 years, the second one was lucky to play games on day 1, the current one plays everything except XIV on high settings. I'm not bragging, I never bought Alienware or whatever the cool brand was, I'm just trying to help you think about your purchase.

If a badass game comes out a year from now, and you can't play it because you tried to save 100 bones, you'll kick yourself. Then again, anything you buy that can't play something down the road, you won't be happy... but the longer that road is until you can't play things the way you want to play them, the better you will feel about your purchase.

*EDIT* For current engine XI you want a 7200 rpm HDD minimum, especially if coupled with a crap GPU

Edited, Jul 12th 2012 3:19am by Perrin
____________________________
FFXI:Sylph - Perrin 75 Hume THF; Retired (At least from my use any way)
EVE Online:ScraperX; Retired
WAR:IronClaw- Peryn SW;SkullThrone- Grymloc BO; Retired


#18 Jul 12 2012 at 8:04 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
Your right. I do want a laptop that I can play future games on. My problem is balancing future proof components with my budget. I can tell you one thing my wife would not be happy with me if I spend 1200 on a computer for solely gaming, heh. Plan is to get the laptop for me and then the iMac for her when the new ones come out. I am just trying to get the most bang for my buck on this laptop.
____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#19 Jul 12 2012 at 2:28 PM Rating: Good
***
3,825 posts
You just show her whatever laptop you buy and say, look... I can add ram, change the HDD, change the disc drive, replace the monitor, possibly even upgrade the GPU... and it will be less than half the price of the iMac, your investment is more sound and longer term. ^.^ Seriously, look around the $900 range check xotic or other builders and get what you want at a good price. Newegg is great for building desktops or upgrading systems, but laptops are honestly best bought from boutiques so you get what you want.
____________________________
FFXI:Sylph - Perrin 75 Hume THF; Retired (At least from my use any way)
EVE Online:ScraperX; Retired
WAR:IronClaw- Peryn SW;SkullThrone- Grymloc BO; Retired


#20 Jul 12 2012 at 2:49 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
That's the thing, though. We want a desktop and a laptop. Laptop is going to be my main gaming source, however, since I don't have to sit upstairs in a santioned room away from everyone. I have my eye on the MSI GE60 and the Sager NP9130(or 9150?). Any advice on the custimaztions available at XotpicPC for either of those models? I'm sure one of those would be ok for gaming at default settings for the games I intend to play. As far as the wife and convincing her against the iMac, she really wants all the features of the iMac, plus I think she thinks they are pretty. You know how women are, I'm sure.
____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#21 Jul 12 2012 at 3:11 PM Rating: Good
***
3,825 posts
the 9130 will play anything you throw at it, people say the 670m get hot... I haven't had a single issue and it's hot as balls here in NC, as a matter of fact it's on my lap right now with Sins of a Solar Empire running in the background.

Just jump on it as is, Sagers website has a $100 of instant coupon so double check against xoticpc. 6-8gb ram should be more than enough, if you want to cheap out on anything the ram is the place to do it since you can sneak a ram upgrade past the wife at a later date ^.~ If you have the money the 9150 with the 680m is the way to go though, the driver support has been a lot better for the 680 though the 670 drivers have finally caught up. MSI is nice but the price is higher for what you get. Also with the 9150 you can upgrade or downgrade to various GPUs, beware though that mobile GPUs are extremely expensive unless you get really lucky on ebay. A 500gb 7200rpm hdd is a decent starting point, you can upgrade that later or get an external if you need more storage.
____________________________
FFXI:Sylph - Perrin 75 Hume THF; Retired (At least from my use any way)
EVE Online:ScraperX; Retired
WAR:IronClaw- Peryn SW;SkullThrone- Grymloc BO; Retired


#22 Jul 12 2012 at 7:44 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
Sager NP9130
i7 3610QM
Geforce GTX 670M
IC Thermal Compound
16GB RAM
750GB 7200RPM
Intel Ultimate N 6300 wireless (is this necessary?)
$1279

VS

MSI GE60
i7 3610QM
Geforce GT 650M
IC Thermal Compound
6GB RAM
750GB 7200RPM
Intel Ultimate N 6300 wireless
$1296

Given these two builds and prices, which seems best? From what I have read the Sager is built a bit sturdier and has better cooling? Which is easier to upgrade (ie SSD, GPU, etc)? Whatare the benefits to a SSD, I know nothing about them?

____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#23 Jul 12 2012 at 8:12 PM Rating: Decent
****
4,153 posts
These two builds are almost identical for the purpose of playing XIV. They are also identical in the response you'll get from your wife when she finds out you spent that much on a laptop to play a game that we still aren't sure will survive through next year Smiley: lol

The Sager has the slight edge on paper due to the 670M being the better GPU, but you're missing some info that would help determine which is better or at least a better deal. Do they both have the same screen size? Same resolutions? Are either or both of them using Optimus? Check into the warranties too and make sure that your service and support is up to standard. If one has a better warranty that will factor in to the value. There is more to making the best choice for value than just the specs of the basic components.

SSD cuts loading times in XIV, but that's about it. You won't stack up a noticeable amount of time saved in a single gaming session. Not worth the money imho unless it's really cheap to upgrade purchase.

Edited, Jul 12th 2012 10:13pm by FilthMcNasty
____________________________
Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#24 Jul 12 2012 at 8:46 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
Both are 15.6" and 1920 x 1080.

The MSI I believe has a 2 year warranty versus a 1 year limited warranty with the Sager.
____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#25 Jul 13 2012 at 5:59 AM Rating: Good
***
3,825 posts
You likely won't be upgrading the GPU on that Sager, you can but currently you would have to get a bigger power supply. Down the line when nvidia launches their 7XXm series that may change. For 1200 you're better off going with the 9150 and downgrading the GPU to the 675 if the option is there, notice that MSI is the same price and you have a much lower GPU and less ram (though 16 is excessive... I understand why you would upgrade that high when ram is currently so cheap).

I don't know about all Sagers, but as I said I have the 9130 and it's extremely cool everywhere you would normally touch. I've been impressed with everything but the speakers, they aren't bad I just expected something better from Onkyo.
Filth, both are the same resolution.
____________________________
FFXI:Sylph - Perrin 75 Hume THF; Retired (At least from my use any way)
EVE Online:ScraperX; Retired
WAR:IronClaw- Peryn SW;SkullThrone- Grymloc BO; Retired


#26 Jul 13 2012 at 7:03 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
Actually, when I configure a 9150 after the thermal compound, upgraded wireless, and OS they are like $1425. Let me know if you can see where made a mistake. I would like to get the 9150, but just don't think I can do that much money.
____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#27 Jul 13 2012 at 7:06 AM Rating: Good
Scholar
*
119 posts
Wouldn't it be better to just wait til it gets closer to the 2.0 release date than to buy now? Do you have to buy right now? Would figure it would be better to wait it out til you get confirmation instead of speculation. Prices should also go down as the next best piece of hardware hits the market.
#28 Jul 13 2012 at 7:17 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
**
261 posts
I would prefer to move on it now. I have the extra cash ( thanks to a bonus at work ), I want it for other games not just FFXIV. I technically could wait, but I have been wanting one for a long time already and my patience is terrible.
____________________________
Aller Bennel (Ultros)
#29 Jul 14 2012 at 7:04 PM Rating: Good
***
3,825 posts
Don't waste your money on the thermal compound, the stock stuff xotic uses is good. The better stuff you can do yourself down the road, but really the GPUs don't get super hot at least no where near like my old gaming desktop replacement "laptop"
____________________________
FFXI:Sylph - Perrin 75 Hume THF; Retired (At least from my use any way)
EVE Online:ScraperX; Retired
WAR:IronClaw- Peryn SW;SkullThrone- Grymloc BO; Retired


This forum is read only
This Forum is Read Only!
Recent Visitors: 11 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (11)