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Bouncy chests, no *** marriage (yet) & housing art...Follow

#52 Nov 24 2012 at 5:38 AM Rating: Decent
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DeadlyLust wrote:
David Gaider, lead writer of Dragon Age 2 wrote:
[T]he person who says that the only way to please them is to restrict options for others is, if you ask me, the one who deserves it least.
Of course there were other problems with DA2, but I think that's the best approach to designing a game for a wide audience. You can't please everyone, so please the people whose fun doesn't depend on other people not having it.

I don't understand why you quoted him in response to me. Omitting marriage isn't a matter of excluding anyone from having fun. It's a matter of creating and implementing content to the game that affects everyone.

Kachi wrote:
It seems that you don't get my point at all.
Some players really appreciate roleplaying elements like marriage. That is value.

I get your point Kachi. The problem is that it only adds value to those who would actually use the service. I'm arguing for SE to focus their time and effort on things that will affect everyone who plays, including the minority.



Edited, Nov 24th 2012 6:38am by FilthMcNasty
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#53 Nov 24 2012 at 8:06 AM Rating: Good
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Enough talking about equal rights and support of this will get them to cave on it. It's not as if they're homophobic, at least not if their implied relationship between Vanielle and Fang was genuinely romantic.

I see this more of an issue of Yoshida not knowing the opinions of his player base, and rather than take risks, he raises the subject and sparks the discussion. Then, when the conversation is well stewed he'll 'cave' and release it as another bullet point for 'listening to his playerbase'.

Would I have preferred he just start it off as equal regardless of preference? ****. Yes. However, there ARE those (moronic types) that would oppose such a thing, and it's better to draw out the conversation and put in stark realization just how much in the minority among gamers those who are opposed to equal marriage rights are, and hopefully THOSE individuals will cave without deciding not to subscribe/leave the game.
#54 Nov 24 2012 at 11:05 AM Rating: Good
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Wow this thread turned into a great read overnight!

So, I'll just throw a thought experiment out there: how about interracial marriage? Surely, if you think we need to explain why two consenting adults can pursue a union, you'd you think we need a detailed explanation accounting for why Miqo'tes can marry Elezen, why Lalafells can marry Hyurs.
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#55 Nov 24 2012 at 12:25 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
I get your point Kachi. The problem is that it only adds value to those who would actually use the service. I'm arguing for SE to focus their time and effort on things that will affect everyone who plays, including the minority.


Well, here's a practical lesson in player sociology then. Almost nothing in an MMO is for "everyone." Mages are for people who like magic, then there are different magic options for people who want them. Crafting is for people who want it. Samurai, Monk, Dragoon, Dark Knight, and Warrior were relatively interchangeable jobs in most parties. Except for the people that specifically appreciated the differences between them, to "everyone else" they served the same basic purpose. Get rid of 4/5 of those, and it doesn't matter to anyone who only plays magic classes. Now, I get that you're seeing this as a matter of mechanical value, where crafting and different jobs at least in some minute way contribute to the goal of killing monsters and leveling up-- but enjoying a game is not purely about the mechanics of it. Players have other reasons for playing that you're not acknowledging.

My significant other wants to get married in game. She is more likely to play if we can. It adds role-playing structure, which she values. It improves the viability of roleplaying for all players who want to do it (like the large community of JP roleplayers). Because she values it, it has value to me. If other players want me to play, then as a result it has value to them, too.

Anytime a feature attracts good players to the game and helps them to enjoy it, it is better for the game, which includes "everyone." The great thing about MMOs is that players become game content. So when you add good players, you add good game content. Now, it might not directly matter to you if I play, particularly if we're not on the same server. But it does matter to some people, and most definitely affects everyone.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#56 Nov 24 2012 at 12:46 PM Rating: Excellent
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If they implement marriage, do you think they'll implement divorce?

ETA: Or alimony? Have to give your spouse one great drop a month? lol

Edited, Nov 24th 2012 10:48am by LebargeX
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#57 Nov 24 2012 at 12:56 PM Rating: Good
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LebargeX wrote:
If they implement marriage, do you think they'll implement divorce?

ETA: Or alimony? Have to give your spouse one great drop a month? lol

Edited, Nov 24th 2012 10:48am by LebargeX



What they Should do is either make sure there is some sort of statute so people cannot remarry easily or at least for the wrong reasons or make sure any potential "warp wedding ring" is exclusive. Cannot have entire LS's marrying eachother so they can warp at will to eachother's side.
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#58 Nov 24 2012 at 1:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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ShindaUsagi wrote:
LebargeX wrote:
If they implement marriage, do you think they'll implement divorce?

ETA: Or alimony? Have to give your spouse one great drop a month? lol

Edited, Nov 24th 2012 10:48am by LebargeX



What they Should do is either make sure there is some sort of statute so people cannot remarry easily or at least for the wrong reasons or make sure any potential "warp wedding ring" is exclusive. Cannot have entire LS's marrying eachother so they can warp at will to eachother's side.


While that's a good point, people do get married for all number of reasons, not all of them honorable.
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Teneleven wrote:
We secretly replaced your tank wemelchor with Foldgers Crystal's. Let's see what happens.

#59 Nov 24 2012 at 1:35 PM Rating: Good
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LebargeX wrote:
ShindaUsagi wrote:
LebargeX wrote:
If they implement marriage, do you think they'll implement divorce?

ETA: Or alimony? Have to give your spouse one great drop a month? lol

Edited, Nov 24th 2012 10:48am by LebargeX



What they Should do is either make sure there is some sort of statute so people cannot remarry easily or at least for the wrong reasons or make sure any potential "warp wedding ring" is exclusive. Cannot have entire LS's marrying eachother so they can warp at will to eachother's side.

,
While that's a good point, people do get married for all number of reasons, not all of them honorable.


Understood. The gist of my post is do not allow the community to take advantage of perks, if any at all.
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#60 Nov 24 2012 at 2:14 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
What they Should do is either make sure there is some sort of statute so people cannot remarry easily or at least for the wrong reasons

Cool. And I already thought I was the most mistrusting guy in here! ^.-/

Basically what people want is:

Full-fledged in-game marriage,
although it is just a game.

But without any strings attached,
because it is just a game.

With lots of emotion, official holy ceremony and vows,
although it is just a game.

And the liberty to break those promises anytime,
because it is just a game.


Sounds just like real life.
#61 Nov 24 2012 at 2:25 PM Rating: Good
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Nah, I think most people would be content with some generic cutscene and area for player-conducted ceremonies. Give them a ring with no stats like they did in FFXI, done. This really isn't something that needs significant developmental resources. People just want it to be there.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#62 Nov 24 2012 at 2:37 PM Rating: Good
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Rinsui wrote:
Quote:
What they Should do is either make sure there is some sort of statute so people cannot remarry easily or at least for the wrong reasons

Cool. And I already thought I was the most mistrusting guy in here! ^.-/

Basically what people want is:

Full-fledged in-game marriage,
although it is just a game.

But without any strings attached,
because it is just a game.

With lots of emotion, official holy ceremony and vows,
although it is just a game.

And the liberty to break those promises anytime,
because it is just a game.


Sounds just like real life.



LMAO! That's not what I said at all, @$$HOLE! (kidding about the a$$hole part.)

Listen, how many times have any of us checked a bazaar and see those chocolates and flowers price capped? How uncommon was it truly to see a love letter in someone's bazaar quote? Intimacy is a fact of online reality. Whether anyone. likes it or not it's there. There will be a large enough minority to use it. Just don't segregate the wanted option! Let everyone enjoy the ride. Forgive and the world will forgive you (not directed at anyone).
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#63 Nov 24 2012 at 3:49 PM Rating: Good
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imo these are the most noteworthy tidbits. note the absence of any marriage talk, because seriously, who cares about virtual marriages anymore.

jtftaru wrote:


We are preparing content known as a “Full Active Time Event.” It borrows the words “active time” from the FINAL FANTASY series. I think this will be appearing very often in our PR activities from here on out.

It will be difficult to explain the system without a video. For example, an NM pops. A notification of this is sent to all players in the zone, who then converge on the NM. Parties are automatically formed, and a battle begins. The NM is defeated, rewards are doled out, and the players go their separate ways.

Things like Hamlet Defense and Caravan Security will be considered Full Active Time Events. With this system, many different things will take place in many different places. That’s how I’d like you to think of it for now.


taking some pages from rift/gw2, nothing wrong with that. hopefully they make it their own somehow.

jtftaru wrote:

The reason why we’ve decided to establish them as free company bases first is because inside of the houses there is a new kind of system that involves parks and towers.

Parks would give a bonus to everyone in the free company, like an extra 25% to experience points earned. It could make crafting faster to level, or maybe give success bonuses for HQ crafting. It's a system that allows members to add things that will give boons to the entire free company. You’ll be able to increase the size of your house, and also your company can rank-up through free company points, allowing you to place more parks and towers around.


I’d first like to create a strong community within FFXIV. When new members join, you’ll be able to get more points, and we’d like to establish a system that encourages people to support new players coming into the game. Once the community has had time to come together we will then allow players to have their own private housing and branch out from there


its kind of like guild levels in other mmos, but the housing element could be great if they really give us a robust customization system (hopefully they've been paying attention to rift's player housing)

jtftaru wrote:


Q: When PVP is implemented, will it be possible to face off against Yoshi-P and everyone?
A: We’ve actually expanded the battle team just recently. And there are quite a lot of them that have played PVP games with me. We’ve put a lot of work into the system, including the core design, so, yeah, we’d love to take part.

Maybe I’ll participate incognito. Or maybe the development team will try copying their characters over to characters with different names during events. Regardless, I’m really motivated to play FFXIV: ARR myself, and I’m really, really looking forward to it. I’m logging in for the Alpha Tests as often as possible so I can talk with everyone. Even for the full release, I would like to do this. By playing the game ourselves it really helps us see where the balance is off, and gives us a more direct understanding of player feedback. I’m serious when I say we will do this - as much as the dev schedule allows.

I’d really like to plan events for the future where players can battle the development team and Wada.
Since everyone’s feedback on battle balance is extremely important, especially the perspectives of the top tier players, I’m wondering if we could have a feedback exchange meeting.


I honestly would like to proactively have real live communication between the development team and the community.


******* YES.

jtftaru wrote:

. However, we have seen some world class MMOs released in this past year, or year and a half, such as Rift, Star Wars: The Old Republic, Guild Wars 2, and so forth. The staff and I have spent sleepless nights looking into these titles, and we feel that, this time, we want to be able to compete with these world-class games--and we don’t want to lose.


i like hearing things like this.
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#64 Nov 24 2012 at 5:00 PM Rating: Decent
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Llester wrote:
, because seriously, who cares about virtual marriages anymore.


90% of this thread actually. Whether they care or not it's the dominant discussion. Not to mention the OP Title deemed it worthy of relevance.


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#65 Nov 24 2012 at 5:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
Still waiting for someone to come up with a valid reason to include marriage at all.


I'm still waiting for a valid reason to include a **** boob slider and bouncy chests. For that matter, most people didn't want a reason to have a jump button in this game; they just wanted it to be there. All of these things are unnecessary and offensive to me, but someone out there is getting off on it. I wouldn't have any use for getting married in game either, but like everything else, it's an option for somebody.
#66 Nov 24 2012 at 5:34 PM Rating: Default
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Chromanin wrote:
Quote:
Still waiting for someone to come up with a valid reason to include marriage at all.


I'm still waiting for a valid reason to include a **** boob slider and bouncy chests. For that matter, most people didn't want a reason to have a jump button in this game; they just wanted it to be there. All of these things are unnecessary and offensive to me, but someone out there is getting off on it. I wouldn't have any use for getting married in game either, but like everything else, it's an option for somebody.


I'm rather proud of my boobs. I could care less when some juvenile decides to play **** drag queen. That said, great point. As proud as I am of ******* it Will be exploited. But it's ok. It fits inside the heterosexual homophobic mantra. "I'm not wearing panties. My avatar is".
I
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#67 Nov 24 2012 at 6:52 PM Rating: Good
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Kachi wrote:
Almost nothing in an MMO is for "everyone."

I agree. This is why most popular MMOs tend to offer a variety of content so that even if there are elements that you don't like, there is at least something or several somethings that you do.
Kachi wrote:
Samurai, Monk, Dragoon, Dark Knight, and Warrior were relatively interchangeable jobs in most parties. Except for the people that specifically appreciated the differences between them, to "everyone else" they served the same basic purpose. Get rid of 4/5 of those, and it doesn't matter to anyone who only plays magic classes.

I don't disagree with this either, but it's something that is directly related to the mechanics of XI. It's a design flaw that is not present in all MMOs so it's not accurate to apply it generally to everything.

XI's job system is unique, but it was poorly designed and lack of imagination on the designers part is what led to the generic group compositions. Honestly, if not for the abyssea/voidwatch proc system that pretty much forces group diversity, the majority of the jobs would be obsolete.

Kachi wrote:
Now, I get that you're seeing this as a matter of mechanical value, where crafting and different jobs at least in some minute way contribute to the goal of killing monsters and leveling up-- but enjoying a game is not purely about the mechanics of it.

No, not purely. Mostly.

Kachi wrote:
My significant other wants to get married in game. She is more likely to play if we can.

Anytime a feature attracts good players to the game and helps them to enjoy it, it is better for the game, which includes "everyone."

Marriage will help you enjoy ten minutes that the ceremony might last. What about the other, hold on a sec...

/playtime

Total time played is: 438 days, 17 hours, 33 minutes and 57 seconds.

/calculator

... um, the rest?



Edited, Nov 24th 2012 8:30pm by FilthMcNasty
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#68 Nov 24 2012 at 9:54 PM Rating: Decent
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Again, those are the things you value in the game. There are a lot of players who disagree. You think it's silly to place so much value on something which would be fun for 10 minutes. But a lot of content in games only last for 10 minutes. ****, a lot of ACTUAL wedding ceremonies last that long, and cost thousands of dollars. That doesn't mean that the short experience isn't incredibly memorable and meaningful to the people or players involved. Sometimes the quality of a moment supersedes the quantity of it.

But hey, to level with you, I'm probably the most cynical person here when it comes to marriage. I think it's an empty and meaningless promise that only creates the opportunity for a bitter divorce. I think the best measure of love is not some half-baked promise, but simply to spend every day in love with that person, appreciating and demonstrating that you are there for one another. But to make some promise after even a few short years of time together that you'll always be happy with them, for better or for worse, or that you'll stay with them, even "for worse," is roughly the most absurd thing I can imagine. To me, having no such commitment, not even asking for it, and knowing that either of you could leave in the blink of an eye, lawyers be damned, is a much more meaningful testament to a relationship than a ceremony which unites your assets and creates an artificial aversion towards parting ways. It's a contract that says, "Hey, if either of us is really unhappy and wants to split up, let's make it a nightmare."
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#69 Nov 24 2012 at 10:39 PM Rating: Decent
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From...
Kachi wrote:
That doesn't mean that the short experience isn't incredibly memorable and meaningful

to...
Kachi wrote:
I think it's empty and meaningless...


What made you change your mind? Smiley: laugh

Edited, Nov 24th 2012 11:39pm by FilthMcNasty
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#70 Nov 24 2012 at 10:52 PM Rating: Good
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
From...
Kachi wrote:
That doesn't mean that the short experience isn't incredibly memorable and meaningful

to...
Kachi wrote:
I think it's empty and meaningless...

What made you change your mind? Smiley: laugh


Honeymoon ended.
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"... he called to himself a wizard, named Gallery, hoping by this means to escape the paying of the fifteen hundred crowns..." (Machen 15)

"Thus opium is pleasing... on account of the agreeable delirium it produces." (Burke para.6)

"I could only read so much for this paper and the syphilis poem had to go."
#71 Nov 24 2012 at 11:07 PM Rating: Decent
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catwho wrote:
ShindaUsagi wrote:
Kachi wrote:
Yeah, can't say I'm happy that SE still considers this a sensitive issue, but I guess that's just a reflection of Japanese views.


That's a curious statement. I am Japanese American. I understand traditional Japanese values. I also understand traditional American values. I wonder what the true reasoning is? I personally feel Nippon is more "look the other way" than the red .vs blue mentality this great country has become. Not saying one way or the other. Just curious.


It's not just a red vs blue thing - it's also a greatly widening generational gap. It's young versus old. In fifty years, we'll wonder WTF was wrong with everyone in 2012, just like a good majority wonder WTF was wrong with everyone prior to 1965.



Red vs blue? Approximately 50% of "blue" voters in the 2012 election are anti-*** marriage... The black and latino population for example are heavily against the issue, and yet are "blue" voters. It's not a republican democrat issue, much opposed to the message the media would like to portray. They know that blacks/latinos are going democrat no matter what, and they also know that by making it seem like republicans are racist/homophobes they'll be able to drive the independent vote to the democrat side.

Anyways... who gives a ****. If people want to get all worked up about bouncing tits and two guys sword fighting then they clearly have too much time on their hands.
#72 Nov 25 2012 at 1:19 AM Rating: Good
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je355804 wrote:
catwho wrote:
ShindaUsagi wrote:
Kachi wrote:
Yeah, can't say I'm happy that SE still considers this a sensitive issue, but I guess that's just a reflection of Japanese views.


That's a curious statement. I am Japanese American. I understand traditional Japanese values. I also understand traditional American values. I wonder what the true reasoning is? I personally feel Nippon is more "look the other way" than the red .vs blue mentality this great country has become. Not saying one way or the other. Just curious.


It's not just a red vs blue thing - it's also a greatly widening generational gap. It's young versus old. In fifty years, we'll wonder WTF was wrong with everyone in 2012, just like a good majority wonder WTF was wrong with everyone prior to 1965.



Red vs blue? Approximately 50% of "blue" voters in the 2012 election are anti-*** marriage... The black and latino population for example are heavily against the issue, and yet are "blue" voters. It's not a republican democrat issue, much opposed to the message the media would like to portray. They know that blacks/latinos are going democrat no matter what, and they also know that by making it seem like republicans are racist/homophobes they'll be able to drive the independent vote to the democrat side.

Your numbers are outdated. It was 50% in 2008. Between then and the announcement by the PotUS that he supports it, the number has decreased drastically to just 29%; that compared to the 24% of republicans who support it.

It's really not hard to see why democrats get the ***, black, latino and now women's votes. Their policies are about 60 years old. How do republicans expect to win the Latino vote when they say they'd repeal the Dream Act and that they expect people to 'self-deport'. How are republicans going to win women when their party doesn't support fair pay for women? Why would blacks vote for a candidate who associates with someone that doesn't believe Obama is American? Nevermind minorities, I just don't even understand how white people could vote for that dude. I guess a lot of them didn't.

People didn't really need the help of the media to see that.

Edited, Nov 25th 2012 2:30am by FilthMcNasty
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#73 Nov 25 2012 at 6:59 AM Rating: Decent
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Chromanin wrote:


I'm still waiting for a valid reason to include a **** boob slider and bouncy chests.


Cause boobs?

Seriously, for all we call that chest size is an issue to have as an option, people would never rag on hair styles or eye color or muscel tone or height sliders.

But because the ******* are viewed as a sexual organ, oh no, we got a human right's issue!

Tell you what, if it's that much of an issue for people, why don't we make a suggestion for SE to have a slider for a man's 'package' hm? Would that be fair? Because I can tell you right now most men would have absolutely no objection to that option on the bar at all. (They can compensate for themselves? Awesome!)

So let me put this question to a point. Why do we need uniform, static ******* in the game? Must we always overreact away from those who would treat such things with immaturity? Yoshida already stated that the 'bouncy' physics will be as modest as possible, so that argument is right out the window. And speaking personally, I just want to age my Hyur a little, and chest is a way to do that physically. By the end of 1.0 I was tired of my hardened battle maiden looking like she was still in her early teens.

So she's going to be a little taller, a little fuller in the chest, and will likely have a trophy scar or two due to the Seventh Umbral Era storyline. I'm thankful they have the options in the game to make all that a reality now. Regardless of some prepubescent teen going to go giggle at 'teh boobies'.
#74 Nov 25 2012 at 7:31 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
I'm still waiting for a valid reason to include a **** boob slider and bouncy chests.

I`m still waiting for a valid reason to not include sliders for other parts of the body.
#75 Nov 25 2012 at 10:32 AM Rating: Default
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
From...
Kachi wrote:
That doesn't mean that the short experience isn't incredibly memorable and meaningful

to...
Kachi wrote:
I think it's empty and meaningless...


What made you change your mind? Smiley: laugh


lol, you'll note that I never said I was one of the people who found it meaningful. Unfortunately my passion for role-playing only allows me to defend the idea of fake marriages on principle. (Never married, to much gnashing of the teeth from my current lady. I've been proposed TO about a dozen times, though.)

Anyway:

Quote:
Marriage System

For bonuses for getting married, they are only thinking of simple things like using the wedding ring to teleport to your partner. No bonuses in battle, else it will just lead to fake marriages
To be able to marry, you will have to clear a quest with your partner


Sounds pretty rad to me.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#76 Nov 25 2012 at 1:46 PM Rating: Decent
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Hyrist wrote:
Chromanin wrote:


I'm still waiting for a valid reason to include a **** boob slider and bouncy chests.


Cause boobs?

Seriously, for all we call that chest size is an issue to have as an option, people would never rag on hair styles or eye color or muscel tone or height sliders.

But because the ******* are viewed as a sexual organ, oh no, we got a human right's issue!

Tell you what, if it's that much of an issue for people, why don't we make a suggestion for SE to have a slider for a man's 'package' hm? Would that be fair? Because I can tell you right now most men would have absolutely no objection to that option on the bar at all. (They can compensate for themselves? Awesome!)

So let me put this question to a point. Why do we need uniform, static ******* in the game? Must we always overreact away from those who would treat such things with immaturity? Yoshida already stated that the 'bouncy' physics will be as modest as possible, so that argument is right out the window. And speaking personally, I just want to age my Hyur a little, and chest is a way to do that physically. By the end of 1.0 I was tired of my hardened battle maiden looking like she was still in her early teens.

So she's going to be a little taller, a little fuller in the chest, and will likely have a trophy scar or two due to the Seventh Umbral Era storyline. I'm thankful they have the options in the game to make all that a reality now. Regardless of some prepubescent teen going to go giggle at 'teh boobies'.


I don't know if you stopped reading after the first sentence of my post or if you just missed the point of it entirely. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you just used my post to go on an unrelated tangent, because my point wasn't that those things shouldn't be in the game. The point was that there are many aspects of games that merely exist for aesthetic purposes. Neither fluid breast animation nor marriage are going to make an incredible impact on the game or revolutionize the genre. They're just there for those who want them, and that's okay.

Additionally, I already expressed in page 1 of this topic that I was relieved Yoshida said the breast physics were implemented for realism, not to appease a primarily male fanbase. The only thing that "offends" me about it, as I've already stated, is that I know even though Yoshida's intentions may be nothing but completely righteous, someone out there is enjoying it a little too much.

And "no," a man package slider would not make everything okay. If I think breast physics are a pointless aesthetic, why would I feel differently about ***** physics?
#77 Nov 25 2012 at 2:13 PM Rating: Decent
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Personally I think it would be **** hilarious if my character grew a bulge when a female in a subligar strolled by.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#78 Nov 25 2012 at 4:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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i just think its kind of sad that all this info has been released, including talk of pvping with/against the dev team, player housing details, dynamic events, and the revelation that "the devs will play the game!" (FFXI vets especially should be happy to see that), but all people want to discuss is *** marriage and boob sliders.
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#79 Nov 25 2012 at 5:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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Llester wrote:
i just think its kind of sad that all this info has been released, including talk of pvping with/against the dev team, player housing details, dynamic events, and the revelation that "the devs will play the game!" (FFXI vets especially should be happy to see that), but all people want to discuss is *** marriage and boob sliders.


Hear, hear. Makes me feel bad I poured gasoline on an already roaring fire.

On that note, housing details caught my interest. I like the "home base" idea of it, and giving potential benefits to EXP and crafting makes it more involving and useful. Kind of reminds me of Monster Hunter where I'd return to town after a kill to tend to gardening and other micro management. It always gave a "coming home" feeling. Even though crafting wasn't as exciting as hunting down monsters, coming back to take care of the more mundane tasks after a difficult kill somehow always felt rewarding.

#80 Nov 26 2012 at 8:03 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
And "no," a man package slider would not make everything okay. If I think breast physics are a pointless aesthetic, why would I feel differently about ***** physics?


Red herring to my red herring? Touche.

No, I was going off on a tangent because your point falls on deaf ears.

Aside from making money on behalf of the gaming company, and paying for entertainment on behalf of the player, none of this has any point what so ever. The moment that these two overarching reasons are forgotten or intentionally neglected when asking for reasons in the entertainment industry, the conversation serves no purpose except to stir unnecessary contravercy.

So if we're going to do that, I might as well try to steer the derail into something more entertaining, like a catfight about sexisim. And thanks to the new Male Miqote, we can have ACTUAL catfights between men too. This is gleeful!

Llester wrote:
i just think its kind of sad that all this info has been released, including talk of pvping with/against the dev team, player housing details, dynamic events, and the revelation that "the devs will play the game!" (FFXI vets especially should be happy to see that), but all people want to discuss is *** marriage and boob sliders.


You underestimate the attraction power of gays and boobs. In fact, *** boobs is particularly popular among heterosexual males.

On a sidenote, I keep forgetting that you haven't been following along all this time. Housing, Dynamic Events, Devs playing the game, all old news that was hinted at or confirmed by community rep posts earlier in the year. The details are nice but the actual feel of these systems won't be flushed out in full until people are actually doing it in Beta. (I'm actually a bit concerned that the Dynamic event system may be a touch shallow.)

It was the other interview, the one where Yoshida walks out and flat out admits it was Hubris that caused SE to ***** up so badly, that was something that was direct, refreshing, and needed to be said to turn a few heads as to what this guy actually means for FFXIV and the company in general.
#81 Nov 26 2012 at 8:07 PM Rating: Good
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((Darn Net connection! Sorry for the double posts.))

Edited, Nov 26th 2012 9:08pm by Hyrist
#82 Nov 26 2012 at 8:08 PM Rating: Good
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Hyrist wrote:
(I'm actually a bit concerned that the Dynamic event system may be a touch shallow.)


Oh, I have no doubt that it'll be shallow. People will freak out about how amazing it is for the first few days and then, a month in, the system will feel as stilted as the walls of text before Guildleves, as generic and unilaterally applied as repeatable quests.
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#83 Nov 26 2012 at 9:02 PM Rating: Good
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Kane, everything will feel shallow after repetition has it's way.

My concern is that the system won't be followed up upon well enough. They'll likely be varied given that they're going to be tying things like Hamlet Defense into it. I'm just worried they won't add onto the events themselves - like each zone will get stuck with the same set of 3 dynamic events, and SE will neglect to add more to them.

Moreover, I hope it's not just a matter of "Boss Spawns" and it ends like that. I want to see a physical attack on a town or an attempted kidnapping, ala Guild Wars 2. I don't expect it right away, mind you, as it's likely a recent addition they thought up after seeing it in GW2. But, I do hope they keep it in mind to update into things.

And... I actually diddn't mind the Levequests once the Guildleves were added in for variety. If they could design Levequests around groups they'd make for great Skirmish objectives. Leve's lacked for story, not gameplay.
#85 Nov 26 2012 at 9:20 PM Rating: Decent
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Hopefully unlike in GW2, there's actually some effort to make me care about the fact that a town is under attack. I cared when Whitegate was under attack, for example. As much as I like GW2, I could give a **** about any given settlement or its generic NPCs.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#86 Nov 26 2012 at 9:37 PM Rating: Good
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Kachi wrote:
Hopefully unlike in GW2, there's actually some effort to make me care about the fact that a town is under attack. I cared when Whitegate was under attack, for example. As much as I like GW2, I could give a sh*t about any given settlement or its generic NPCs.


SE's fine storytelling should take care of that, actually.

They could tie in some important resource that needs to be defended like Beseiged, but it's questionable how well that'd tie over in today's gaming world. I'm personally not opposed to it, but would others? This is a question we need to pose to our own base, and then confront the development team with the results of our self-searching.
#87 Nov 27 2012 at 7:13 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Red herring to my red herring? Touche.

No, I was going off on a tangent because your point falls on deaf ears.

Aside from making money on behalf of the gaming company, and paying for entertainment on behalf of the player, none of this has any point what so ever. The moment that these two overarching reasons are forgotten or intentionally neglected when asking for reasons in the entertainment industry, the conversation serves no purpose except to stir unnecessary contravercy.

So if we're going to do that, I might as well try to steer the derail into something more entertaining, like a catfight about sexisim. And thanks to the new Male Miqote, we can have ACTUAL catfights between men too. This is gleeful!


Seems I'm the one who missed the point. Sorry.
#88 Nov 27 2012 at 9:26 AM Rating: Decent
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ShindaUsagi wrote:
Llester wrote:
, because seriously, who cares about virtual marriages anymore.
90% of this thread actually.
All three of you.
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#89 Nov 27 2012 at 9:30 AM Rating: Default
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lolgaxe wrote:
ShindaUsagi wrote:
Llester wrote:
, because seriously, who cares about virtual marriages anymore.
90% of this thread actually.
All three of you.


We the vocal minority. Fair enough.
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#90 Nov 27 2012 at 11:31 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
SE's fine storytelling should take care of that, actually.

They could tie in some important resource that needs to be defended like Beseiged, but it's questionable how well that'd tie over in today's gaming world. I'm personally not opposed to it, but would others? This is a question we need to pose to our own base, and then confront the development team with the results of our self-searching.


It's not like it's a hard thing to do. It's just a question of whether or not they'll do it. And why wouldn't they? For as much as I enjoyed a good Besieged, I would have found it really cool in the modern day starting nations.

lolgaxe wrote:
ShindaUsagi wrote:
Llester wrote:
, because seriously, who cares about virtual marriages anymore.
90% of this thread actually.
All three of you.


Don't mind him. He don't count real good.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#91 Nov 27 2012 at 12:51 PM Rating: Decent
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Kachi wrote:
I cared when Whitegate was under attack, for example.

FYI Whitegate was never attacked, it was Al Zahbi.

Just out of curiosity, why would you care? Aside from trivial travel time or not being able to get your turban, I can't think of anything worthwhile.
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Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#92 Nov 27 2012 at 3:25 PM Rating: Decent
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Bah, that's what I thought. I changed it.

Anyway, there were a few reasons. One was that I depended on the AH in Al Zhabi frequently. But I also had a bit of attachment to the town because of the story missions and the characters that lived in the city. You fought alongside generals. My homepoint was usually there, and I met with friends. This was a place that I regularly came to.

The places that get attacked in GW2 are **** little camps with absolutely no story to them. The main cities are never attacked, not that there's ever any reason to go to them anyway. But as I think I might have said, I would have cared a lot more about Besieged if it were happening in my home nation, or even any of the other starting cities.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#93 Nov 27 2012 at 4:43 PM Rating: Good
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Hyrist wrote:

Llester wrote:
i just think its kind of sad that all this info has been released, including talk of pvping with/against the dev team, player housing details, dynamic events, and the revelation that "the devs will play the game!" (FFXI vets especially should be happy to see that), but all people want to discuss is *** marriage and boob sliders.


You underestimate the attraction power of gays and boobs. In fact, *** boobs is particularly popular among heterosexual males.

On a sidenote, I keep forgetting that you haven't been following along all this time. Housing, Dynamic Events, Devs playing the game, all old news that was hinted at or confirmed by community rep posts earlier in the year. The details are nice but the actual feel of these systems won't be flushed out in full until people are actually doing it in Beta. (I'm actually a bit concerned that the Dynamic event system may be a touch shallow.)

It was the other interview, the one where Yoshida walks out and flat out admits it was Hubris that caused SE to ***** up so badly, that was something that was direct, refreshing, and needed to be said to turn a few heads as to what this guy actually means for FFXIV and the company in general.


sorry, do we know each other or something? this is the second time (chronologically the first actually) that you have purported to understand not only my habits, but the inner workings of my brain. at least i think that was you in the other thread.

okay. here we go. Yes, i'm quite aware that yoshi has been talking about the game's features for awhile, because actually, i have been following, and its kind of weird of you to imply that i haven't without knowing me, but w/e. it kind of seems like you are taking a shot at me for some reason. but you chose to ignore the fact that this was new, more detailed information (than i had seen yet anyway, one thousand apologies if i missed it) on said features, and that is probably why i remarked on them.

so yes, as details get fleshed out, expect me to comment on them from time to time.

needless to say, i share your concerns regarding the FATE system, and agree that yoshi's distaste for the XIV debacle and the decsions leading to it, is a good thing for SEs image at the very least.
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#94 Nov 27 2012 at 5:37 PM Rating: Good
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Everyone seem think I'm taking shots at them for some reason.

In your case, BOTH cases, actually, it's simply a matter of confused identity with this fine individual who is in fact behind the curve. Don't ask me why I keep mixing you two up, but sorry for doing so.

As far as your wonderment as to the bits (Scraps to hard of a word?) of info we're getting. Work alternates from manic business and pure silences, so I'm frequently looking for new info. Even simple dev comments that usually show up in the translation thread days before they get to the NA side of the forums I tend to spot early. (It's more or less just habit at this point, like reading the local newspaper)So while some details, like the price of the housing and the intent for it at the start, is kinda new, the things like the overview of FATE was covered in the live letter and such.

This is also influence by the desire to just settle in and play it already. There's only so much that they an just describe or show on a video that dosen't get an 'ok, just stop teasing me already, I'm trying NOT to get overexcited.'

That, and after the End of an Era, my biggest concern is how the story continues. That was one **** of a cliffhanger.
#95 Nov 27 2012 at 7:05 PM Rating: Decent
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Kachi wrote:
Anyway, there were a few reasons. One was that I depended on the AH in Al Zhabi frequently. But I also had a bit of attachment to the town because of the story missions and the characters that lived in the city. You fought alongside generals. My homepoint was usually there, and I met with friends. This was a place that I regularly came to.

AH in Al Zahbi was literally a minute away from the AH in Whitegate. I agree that the generals were cool, but my reason probably differs from yours. I only gave a **** about them because you could spam protect on them for enhancing magic skill up. You could also spam cures on the undead for healing magic skill ups.

I'll be honest, the only time I was ever excited for besieged was when I needed skillups, if I needed a few ISP for currency or if I wanted to leech exp as a low level tossing out cures on everyone in sight. I probably would have been entertained by being charmed and wailing on random adventurers, but due to the massive amount of crowding in the zone, all I could see was my character swinging at nothing. Same goes for the generals. Unless you sought them out early, there was far too many players and mobs for everything to render to the screen.

I can't speak on GW2 because I don't play it, but it sounds like more of the same.
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Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#96 Nov 27 2012 at 7:27 PM Rating: Decent
Ahh yes, I remember the days of leveling up evasion skill to cap on mobs at the start of Besieged on my THF.
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#97 Nov 27 2012 at 7:55 PM Rating: Decent
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
Kachi wrote:
Anyway, there were a few reasons. One was that I depended on the AH in Al Zhabi frequently. But I also had a bit of attachment to the town because of the story missions and the characters that lived in the city. You fought alongside generals. My homepoint was usually there, and I met with friends. This was a place that I regularly came to.

AH in Al Zahbi was literally a minute away from the AH in Whitegate. I agree that the generals were cool, but my reason probably differs from yours. I only gave a **** about them because you could spam protect on them for enhancing magic skill up. You could also spam cures on the undead for healing magic skill ups.

I'll be honest, the only time I was ever excited for besieged was when I needed skillups, if I needed a few ISP for currency or if I wanted to leech exp as a low level tossing out cures on everyone in sight. I probably would have been entertained by being charmed and wailing on random adventurers, but due to the massive amount of crowding in the zone, all I could see was my character swinging at nothing. Same goes for the generals. Unless you sought them out early, there was far too many players and mobs for everything to render to the screen.

I can't speak on GW2 because I don't play it, but it sounds like more of the same.


I used the Al Zhabi AH for a couple of reasons. One, the crowding in Whitegate was ridiculous for the longest time. Two, there were other NPCs along the way that were useful to me, I believe some crafting NPCs and a vendor or two.

Besieged was a mess for a long time due to the lag and crowding, but as that faded away it was a really fun event. GW2 has never had quite that problem, but the events manage to feel a lot more generic. I mean, you have the quality of a few finely crafted invasions, versus an everyday game feature, so it's no surprise that sometimes the invasion is just mosquitoes or bandits and there isn't really any epic feel to things. Lots of things in FFXI felt epic, to me. There were plenty of memorable NMs just between the few beastmen tribes that attacked.

Point is, it's easy to take for granted the fact that monsters were basically on your doorstep, when in games like GW2 that otherwise do the dynamic events much better (in part because of the improvements in the technology), they're not attacking your home, you barely have a home, and you probably wouldn't care that much if they did anyway. I'm sure that this was in part due to the fact that the world was a dangerous place in FFXI, where in most of these other games you can run about safely without any fear of death.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#98 Nov 27 2012 at 11:54 PM Rating: Decent
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IKickYoDog wrote:
Ahh yes, I remember the days of leveling up evasion skill to cap on mobs at the start of Besieged on my THF.

Evasion too? Hmmm.

thf/whm for diaga and reraise, pull with aoe and pop perfect dodge?

Man the lengths we had to go to if we wanted to complete something that seemed like it should be so much simpler than it was.
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#99 Nov 28 2012 at 12:14 AM Rating: Decent
FilthMcNasty wrote:
IKickYoDog wrote:
Ahh yes, I remember the days of leveling up evasion skill to cap on mobs at the start of Besieged on my THF.

Evasion too? Hmmm.

thf/whm for diaga and reraise, pull with aoe and pop perfect dodge?

Man the lengths we had to go to if we wanted to complete something that seemed like it should be so much simpler than it was.


Oh ya. Buy some potions before the event, then after the CS <Flee> to the entrance. Pop Utsusemi:Ichi, then Ni, then Ichi, then Ni again if you can, then <Perfect Dodge>, then repeat ninja shadows for as long as you can. Could gain 5+ levels within a minute usually.

EDIT: Shadows because the attacks were coming so fast that you were bound to dodge some (Especially with all EVA+ gear on) without the shadows.

Edited, Nov 28th 2012 1:16am by IKickYoDog

Edited, Nov 28th 2012 1:16am by IKickYoDog
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Toofar - Asura (Formerly of Lakshmi (Garuda)) - WHM BLM SMN
Rafoot - Asura (Formerly of Lakshmi (Garuda)) - THF SAM BRD
#100 Nov 28 2012 at 12:07 PM Rating: Decent
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You have to admit, FFXI at times presented players with problems that required a considerable amount of creativity and cooperation. So, that's something, I suppose. Unfortunately it usually just resulted in people looking up the trick online.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#101 Nov 28 2012 at 12:17 PM Rating: Good
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Kachi wrote:
You have to admit, FFXI at times presented players with problems that required a considerable amount of creativity and cooperation.

I think it's more unfortunate that this didn't happen as intended by design, as much as it was a byproduct of poor design Smiley: frown


Edited, Nov 28th 2012 1:18pm by FilthMcNasty
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
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