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Do you think Legacy Beta is a marketing tactic?Follow

#27 Mar 01 2013 at 10:23 AM Rating: Excellent
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By that point I was getting tired of the thread and personal attacks on myself and Thayos. The actual thread that ****** Kao off I think was one where someone posted some thoughts on some illicit Beta videos and Bethany1 posted something like "You better ban this SOB Wint" or some such. We do get paid to moderate here, but it's not enough to deal with that kind of bull.
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#28Poubelle, Posted: Mar 01 2013 at 10:42 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I don't have any sock accounts. be less paranoid. a few negative people and you're convinced it's all the same person?
#29 Mar 01 2013 at 11:12 AM Rating: Excellent
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Poubelle wrote:
I don't have any sock accounts. be less paranoid. a few negative people and you're convinced it's all the same person?

please. look at bethany's post history and she's clearly not me.

believe it or not , not everyone has blind faith in ARR and Yoshi-P, if you went ventured into other public forums you would know this.


Why do you keep using the term "blind faith"? I've been around a looooong time, and I've seen everything from start to finish.

Blind faith was "It will be fixed in beta. It will be fixed in the next beta. It will be fixed before release." without a word from SE that they even acknowledged there were issues. THAT was blind fanboism idiotic faith.

What's happening now is an analysis of Yoshi-P's dialogue with the players and the information he has released detailing his plans. We've gotten to see a lot of those plans in action in the form of videos he has released. So yes, folks have faith in him, but it's for the right reasons this time.
#30 Mar 01 2013 at 11:20 AM Rating: Good
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Pouby, baby, if you're not a troll, you sure do a great impression. If you want to be less troll-like, try treating all topics as a discussion and not make or take things personally.
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#31 Mar 01 2013 at 12:12 PM Rating: Excellent
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The faith in Yoshi-P isn't blind, by a long shot.

Most of us were rather suspicious of the man to start, but were willing to give him a shot because anything was better than Tanaka at that point.

However he started doing something that took players by suprise and gave them a good first impression. That being the Letters from the Developer. He then exemplified that impression by creating the Live Letters, which we've now had five of.

It was a fantastic new trend for the course of FFXIV, but even then that would only take them so far. But he did not stop at just making promises and progress reports. He made promises that he kept. His work in improving FFXIV by 1.2 alone was a staggering contrast to when he he was handed the reins, and a lot of the adjustments were based on feedback.

In the past year he has shown a consistent track record of openness, community participation, listening to feedback, and delivering the best he can on his promises. (And explaining in the instances in which he's late on a promise.) He's adamant in his desire to create a game worthy of the Final Fantasy franchise and his efforts are showing. That is the reason why he has fans. That is the reason why people have faith in him. It is not a faith that was given to him, it was a faith that he earned, and I am optimistic for him delivering on his efforts.
#32 Mar 01 2013 at 12:17 PM Rating: Good
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I think of him kind of like a new father who really wants to do his best for his kids and tells them how much he cares and **** it all I'm doing my best. And it's only natural that some kids would think that this is a really great dad I have here.

Course, I've known plenty of those dads to raise really ****** kids, not for lack of trying. So I wouldn't call it blind faith. Maybe naive faith, or even overly-optimistic faith, but not blind.
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#33 Mar 01 2013 at 12:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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Optimistic I think is the good word.

Just remember: Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.

The worst: XIV 2.0 still sucks. We all quit within a month and go to Wildstar instead.

The best: XIV 2.0 is the best MMO ever made and single handedly saves Square Enix's portfolio and we're all gonna look back ten years from now and laugh at how afraid we are.

The reality will of course be in between those two extremes. Optimism is the belief that it'll be closer to the "best case" than it will the worst case.
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#34 Mar 01 2013 at 1:14 PM Rating: Good
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Why do I trust Yoshi-P?

Have you seen his live letters? That man starts every video with a low bow. Right there, he's telling you, the community, that you are his superior.
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#35Abidtwo, Posted: Mar 01 2013 at 3:03 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Not cool. She, although annoying yes, didn't really break the NDA by divulging any BETA secrets. No even convinced she was in BETA at all.This type of BIG BROTHER ******** needs to stop.
#36 Mar 01 2013 at 3:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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Abidtwo wrote:
Wint wrote:
He's being watched, Bethany1 is gone already and Kaolian isn't very happy with what Poubelle is doing either.

I don't ban people I interact with like him, that way they can't accuse me of making it a vendetta.


Not cool. She, although annoying yes, didn't really break the NDA by divulging any BETA secrets. No even convinced she was in BETA at all.This type of BIG BROTHER bullsh*t needs to stop.

Am I going to be banned now as well?


That's debatable. But breaking the NDA isn't the only thing that can get you removed from Zam.
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#37 Mar 01 2013 at 3:19 PM Rating: Excellent
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Abidtwo wrote:
Wint wrote:
He's being watched, Bethany1 is gone already and Kaolian isn't very happy with what Poubelle is doing either.

I don't ban people I interact with like him, that way they can't accuse me of making it a vendetta.


Not cool. She, although annoying yes, didn't really break the NDA by divulging any BETA secrets. No even convinced she was in BETA at all.This type of BIG BROTHER bullsh*t needs to stop.

Am I going to be banned now as well?


Depends. I don't ban people because they disagree with me. Continue to harass, sure. Ask GYLDL, I can take my lumps and admit when I'm wrong, and I don't think anyone here is going to complain about Bethany1 being gone.
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#38Abidtwo, Posted: Mar 01 2013 at 3:21 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Dude, I have seen people straight up curse people out on ZAM, and not get banned. Not even a warning. I'll go look for some posts later and re-post. What she said was clearly sarcastic, and even if it wasn't she used an acronym. I just don't like power abusers that's all. Yeah if someone breaks NDA by all means reprimand them. But don't play favorites, Jeshush.
#39Abidtwo, Posted: Mar 01 2013 at 3:23 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Wint I totally agree with you, she was annoying. 100%! But ban worthy? I think we both know that's not true.
#40 Mar 01 2013 at 3:28 PM Rating: Excellent
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Abidtwo wrote:
Archmage Callinon wrote:
Abidtwo wrote:
Wint wrote:
He's being watched, Bethany1 is gone already and Kaolian isn't very happy with what Poubelle is doing either.

I don't ban people I interact with like him, that way they can't accuse me of making it a vendetta.


Not cool. She, although annoying yes, didn't really break the NDA by divulging any BETA secrets. No even convinced she was in BETA at all.This type of BIG BROTHER bullsh*t needs to stop.

Am I going to be banned now as well?


That's debatable. But breaking the NDA isn't the only thing that can get you removed from Zam.


Dude, I have seen people straight up curse people out on ZAM, and not get banned. Not even a warning. I'll go look for some posts later and re-post. What she said was clearly sarcastic, and even if it wasn't she used an acronym. I just don't like power abusers that's all. Yeah if someone breaks NDA by all means reprimand them. But don't play favorites, Jeshush.


Reprimand in this case is banning. During the 1.0 beta and alpha, your first post earned you a banning. I'm trying to be more lenient. People who post NDA breaking things get their threads nuked and a warning, she saw fit to keep posting about it after the initial nuke.
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#41 Mar 01 2013 at 3:33 PM Rating: Good
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catwho wrote:
Optimistic I think is the good word.

Just remember: Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.

The worst: XIV 2.0 still sucks. We all quit within a month and go to Wildstar instead.

The best: XIV 2.0 is the best MMO ever made and single handedly saves Square Enix's portfolio and we're all gonna look back ten years from now and laugh at how afraid we are.

The reality will of course be in between those two extremes. Optimism is the belief that it'll be closer to the "best case" than it will the worst case.



And in the best case situation, I'd say that it was the best thing that happened to the company. I still may even if it's not in the best case.

Sometimes getting smacked with a bit of humility can do wonders.
#42 Mar 02 2013 at 12:14 AM Rating: Good
Abidtwo wrote:
Archmage Callinon wrote:
Abidtwo wrote:
Wint wrote:
He's being watched, Bethany1 is gone already and Kaolian isn't very happy with what Poubelle is doing either.

I don't ban people I interact with like him, that way they can't accuse me of making it a vendetta.


Not cool. She, although annoying yes, didn't really break the NDA by divulging any BETA secrets. No even convinced she was in BETA at all.This type of BIG BROTHER bullsh*t needs to stop.

Am I going to be banned now as well?


That's debatable. But breaking the NDA isn't the only thing that can get you removed from Zam.


Dude, I have seen people straight up curse people out on ZAM, and not get banned. Not even a warning. I'll go look for some posts later and re-post. What she said was clearly sarcastic, and even if it wasn't she used an acronym. I just don't like power abusers that's all. Yeah if someone breaks NDA by all means reprimand them. But don't play favorites, Jeshush.


Do you even know what acronym means? And if so, how does using one absolve someone of being a prick? Just because I abbreviate SOB doesn't mean I get away with it.
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#43 Mar 02 2013 at 12:39 AM Rating: Excellent
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IKickYoDog wrote:
Abidtwo wrote:
Archmage Callinon wrote:
Abidtwo wrote:
Wint wrote:
He's being watched, Bethany1 is gone already and Kaolian isn't very happy with what Poubelle is doing either.

I don't ban people I interact with like him, that way they can't accuse me of making it a vendetta.


Not cool. She, although annoying yes, didn't really break the NDA by divulging any BETA secrets. No even convinced she was in BETA at all.This type of BIG BROTHER bullsh*t needs to stop.

Am I going to be banned now as well?


That's debatable. But breaking the NDA isn't the only thing that can get you removed from Zam.


Dude, I have seen people straight up curse people out on ZAM, and not get banned. Not even a warning. I'll go look for some posts later and re-post. What she said was clearly sarcastic, and even if it wasn't she used an acronym. I just don't like power abusers that's all. Yeah if someone breaks NDA by all means reprimand them. But don't play favorites, Jeshush.


Do you even know what acronym means? And if so, how does using one absolve someone of being a prick? Just because I abbreviate SOB doesn't mean I get away with it.

Unless you are referring to the Star Onion Brigade Smiley: laugh
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#44 Mar 02 2013 at 7:51 AM Rating: Good
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Unless you are referring to the Star Onion Brigade Smiley: laugh


Touche
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#45Runespider, Posted: Mar 02 2013 at 10:47 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I think you have to keep in mind that a) many of the moderators here are legacy fanboys and b) their job may very well hang on the success or failure of the game (they may say the money is nothing but if that were truely the case why not do it for free). They are incredibly defensive because lets be honest the game doesn't have that much chance to be anything more than what v1 was and as the forums have so few fanboys they have to try and fill that role. I've never seen a professional forum with paid mods that were the fanboys of the community, to the point they argue with you if you say something negative lol It's quite amusing and actually quite sad to see for anyone that has/had any respect for Zam from XI days.
#46 Mar 02 2013 at 10:57 AM Rating: Good
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Just because you like something, or are anticipating something, doesn't automatically make you a fanboy. (Or fangirl.)

We're not out there writing slash between Yoshi P and Tanaka or any of the more egregious fannish behavior. Smiley: lol
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#47 Mar 02 2013 at 11:23 AM Rating: Decent
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FFXIV has a ton of potential to not only be better than 1.0, but to be better than most of the new batches of MMOs out there. I don't think you quite understand the term fanboy. A fanboy is not just someone who dosen't think like you.

I had a lot of choices of fan sites to join and discuss FFXIV, I chose this one because the moderators showed themselves to be the most reasonable and fair. Just in the last few days it's easy to see from the posts that Wint and the others put up with alot of crap. I know I couldn't put up with the abuse they do and not come unglued.

Their jobs don't hinge on the success of FFXIV, ZAM is a big network of sites, it's been around since freeking Evercrack. If FFXIV tanks, they can always be moved to moderation of other forums. They might not enjoy their job as much, but they would still most likely have a job.

I'm new to this forum, my first dozen posts have been complaints about FFXIV, I have not been banned, I have not even gotten rate downs. I have gotten some pretty good debates and good information. If you post as a reasonable person, you get treated like a reasonable person.

Why is it unprofessional to point out that it makes no sense for you to hang out on a forum for a game you obviously don't like?

If you don't like the game, that's fine. Everyone has different tastes. But spouting off crap that can be easily proven false just makes you look like an unthinking fool and undermines any point you might have.

Edit: Fixed some typos I missed and to add a bit to make sure catwho dosen't think any of this is aimed at them ;p

Edited, Mar 2nd 2013 12:25pm by Wyldkat
#48 Mar 02 2013 at 11:30 AM Rating: Default
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A fanboy is someone that almost takes on the role of PR rep for the company, they put a positive spin on anything and talk up things they have not even played. Normal players don't do this and they complain when things are not to their liking too.

Fanboys are fine, every mmo forum has them. Fanboys arguing with posters as a moderator or admin, that's just a whole other thing.

You should never, ever be arguing with a moderator in posts because they are in a position of power of you and it's just plain unprofessional. I can't think of one professional forum where you can quite commonly start arguing with paid moderation staff, not even the official forums do it and they really have a vested interest in postitive spins.
#49 Mar 02 2013 at 11:38 AM Rating: Excellent
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Meh, the way you talk you'd think you were new around here or something. You're not in Kansas, anymore.

The mods here are very lax because the karma system does most of their job for them. As a result, they get to be themselves and actually be an active part of the community. They don't necessarily have to be professional, at least to a certain extent.

It's vastly preferable to the paid mods who don't really care about the subject at all and basically act like robots. I like that our mods don't have a stick up their ***. I've never felt threatened telling any of them exactly what I think, and I've said some things I'm not particularly proud of in retrospect.
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Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#50 Mar 02 2013 at 1:30 PM Rating: Excellent
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Runespider wrote:
A fanboy is someone that almost takes on the role of PR rep for the company, they put a positive spin on anything and talk up things they have not even played. Normal players don't do this and they complain when things are not to their liking too.

Fanboys are fine, every mmo forum has them. Fanboys arguing with posters as a moderator or admin, that's just a whole other thing.

You should never, ever be arguing with a moderator in posts because they are in a position of power of you and it's just plain unprofessional. I can't think of one professional forum where you can quite commonly start arguing with paid moderation staff, not even the official forums do it and they really have a vested interest in postitive spins.


As I've said in other threads, if it comes down to banning someone, I put it in someone else's hands (unless it's a spammer or egregious breaking of rules). As far as arguing with forum users, where do you think the Zam admins are picked from? People who use the forums regularly and are known to the existing staff and have proven themselves to be qualified to handle the sometimes craptastic situations we have to deal with here. Believe me, it's not all fun and games. I have to regularly stop myself from posting things that would be considered unprofessional because I'm an admin, and having to have that filter really sucks some days.
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#51 Mar 02 2013 at 1:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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Kachi wrote:
Meh, the way you talk you'd think you were new around here or something. You're not in Kansas, anymore.

The mods here are very lax because the karma system does most of their job for them. As a result, they get to be themselves and actually be an active part of the community. They don't necessarily have to be professional, at least to a certain extent.

It's vastly preferable to the paid mods who don't really care about the subject at all and basically act like robots. I like that our mods don't have a stick up their ***. I've never felt threatened telling any of them exactly what I think, and I've said some things I'm not particularly proud of in retrospect.


Smiley: inlove you too Kachi Smiley: tongue
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