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did 1.0 have "complex" quests?Follow

#1 Apr 04 2013 at 1:20 PM Rating: Default
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By "complex" I mean talk to an NPC.. find a ??? and get as key item for it... or sawn an nm tat 100% dropped an item for teh quest etc etc or was it just the standard WoW variety of "kill xxxx amount of enemies" or get "xxx amount of drops from killing certian enemy"?
#2 Apr 04 2013 at 1:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quest complexity varied. Some of the levequests were the standard "kill x of y" but then there were some quest/missions that involved micro instances where you had to defend NPCs, escort quests (I remember escorting a baby Sylph across the forest in Gridania with my companion NPC), and some levequests that involved a bit of strategy.

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#3 Apr 04 2013 at 1:48 PM Rating: Default
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WHAT ABOUT QUESTS TYHAT INVOLDED FIGHTING AND KILLING A FORCED SPAWN NMS (KIND ALIKE THE AF WEAPON QUESTS IN FFXI)

opps caps was on -_-
#4 Apr 04 2013 at 2:15 PM Rating: Good
DuoMaxwellxx wrote:
WHAT ABOUT QUESTS TYHAT INVOLDED FIGHTING AND KILLING A FORCED SPAWN NMS (KIND ALIKE THE AF WEAPON QUESTS IN FFXI)

opps caps was on -_-


I love that you noticed it before you posted, made a comment about it, and then still posted it Smiley: lol
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#5 Apr 04 2013 at 2:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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Ill go ahead and make a guess he posted it from his mobile phone, and i know its a pain to re type it. :P
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#6 Apr 04 2013 at 2:26 PM Rating: Default
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Teravibe wrote:
Ill go ahead and make a guess he posted it from his mobile phone, and i know its a pain to re type it. :P



actually i did it from a pc but yes retyping it woulda been pain.. they should mask an option where you can highly full walls of texts, right click then change case.. but noooo clearly n oone was smart enough to think of such a "complex" invention
#7 Apr 04 2013 at 2:30 PM Rating: Good
I've always believed that I should be able to highlight a letter, or even an entire section, and change the case of all letters by simply hitting the shift key.
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#8 Apr 04 2013 at 3:23 PM Rating: Good
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Levequests definitely involved force spawned NMs - like the series that involved gathering dropped pages from one of the books (they appeared as little beams of light, not ???s), and once you had enough pages, they combined to spawn a NM right on top of you.
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#9 Apr 04 2013 at 3:32 PM Rating: Default
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Catwho wrote:
Levequests definitely involved force spawned NMs - like the series that involved gathering dropped pages from one of the books (they appeared as little beams of light, not ???s), and once you had enough pages, they combined to spawn a NM right on top of you.



yay soo then ALL of ARR (hopefully) wont be WoW like "kill xxx mobs" quests.
#10 Apr 04 2013 at 3:38 PM Rating: Excellent
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DuoMaxwellxx wrote:
By "complex" I mean talk to an NPC.. find a ??? and get as key item for it... or sawn an nm tat 100% dropped an item for teh quest etc etc or was it just the standard WoW variety of "kill xxxx amount of enemies" or get "xxx amount of drops from killing certian enemy"?


Aside from the presence of a ??? point, how are those not the same things...?
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#11 Apr 04 2013 at 3:57 PM Rating: Default
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KaneKitty wrote:
DuoMaxwellxx wrote:
By "complex" I mean talk to an NPC.. find a ??? and get as key item for it... or sawn an nm tat 100% dropped an item for teh quest etc etc or was it just the standard WoW variety of "kill xxxx amount of enemies" or get "xxx amount of drops from killing certian enemy"?


Aside from the presence of a ??? point, how are those not the same things...?




Because the one i described (with the ???) is more like a traditional offline RPG side quest.. i.e talk to npc to get quest which consist of finding some item in a location you may have to fight your way through (or sneak and invis) to touch a ??? which will either give you an item or spawn a monster which you have to fight to get item then return to NPC.

Whereas the other is "go outside and kill 10 sheep" or "go outside and collect 10 sheep wools" which might require slaughtering 20 sheep because wools arent 100% drops. Which would get dull in repetitive ever EVERY quest was like that with tehy only change beiking the type or mob you gotta kill xxx times. whereas ffxi had a mixture or BOTH types of quests
#12 Apr 04 2013 at 3:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
Aside from the presence of a ??? point, how are those not the same things...?


I think he's talking about quests with multiple steps. As opposed to "I hate rats, go kill 10 of them for me."

I prefer a mix, personally. When I find a new quest hub I expect a mix of quests (or a chain of quests) that have some kill x of y, some gather x things, and maybe one or two that are a little different just to mix things up so I don't feel like I'm grinding mobs all day.
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#13Killua125, Posted: Apr 04 2013 at 4:12 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Please look forward to it!
#14 Apr 04 2013 at 4:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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Eh, I don't mind having a Fields of Valor type situation where you can gain XP faster by targeting certain types of monsters (assuring that you actually travel around the area and fight different types of monsters rather than finding the best place to grind out Coblyns). I don't want any of that **** in my questing, though. To me, if you can't throw in a bit of original story and scenario, don't ******* bother calling it a quest.

MMOs are notoriously terrible about this. It'd be one thing if they made even the most minimal effort, say by imposing a time limit on the Kill 10 X quest, but it's usually less of a quest and more of a "Hey, why don't you go XP on spiders for a while?"
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#15 Apr 04 2013 at 4:23 PM Rating: Default
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Kachi wrote:
Eh, I don't mind having a Fields of Valor type situation where you can gain XP faster by targeting certain types of monsters (assuring that you actually travel around the area and fight different types of monsters rather than finding the best place to grind out Coblyns). I don't want any of that sh*t in my questing, though. To me, if you can't throw in a bit of original story and scenario, don't @#%^ing bother calling it a quest.

MMOs are notoriously terrible about this. It'd be one thing if they made even the most minimal effort, say by imposing a time limit on the Kill 10 X quest, but it's usually less of a quest and more of a "Hey, why don't you go XP on spiders for a while?"



except when youre so high level that the spiders dont even give xp lol
#16 Apr 04 2013 at 4:27 PM Rating: Decent
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Yeah, at that point, why am I even there killing spiders? You don't give me anything interesting to work with AND there's no challenge? ;/
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Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#17 Apr 04 2013 at 4:30 PM Rating: Default
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Kachi wrote:
Yeah, at that point, why am I even there killing spiders? You don't give me anything interesting to work with AND there's no challenge? ;/




hecause you wanna complete every quest? or dealing with taht quest unlo ksa quest that gives rewards you DO want etc etc
#18 Apr 04 2013 at 5:14 PM Rating: Decent
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Well yeah, that's why I'd do it, but it's not like I'd be having fun.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#19 Apr 04 2013 at 6:18 PM Rating: Excellent
Kachi wrote:
Well yeah, that's why I'd do it, but it's not like I'd be having fun.


Nothing like paying a company to sprinkle a little work into my entertainment that I go to work to pay for.
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#20 Apr 04 2013 at 6:25 PM Rating: Default
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DuoMaxwellxx wrote:
By "complex" I mean talk to an NPC.. find a ??? and get as key item for it... or sawn an nm tat 100% dropped an item for teh quest etc etc or was it just the standard WoW variety of "kill xxxx amount of enemies" or get "xxx amount of drops from killing certian enemy"?


XIV had quests like the former. ARR will have Quests like the latter.
#21 Apr 04 2013 at 7:15 PM Rating: Good
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Kachi wrote:
Eh, I don't mind having a Fields of Valor type situation where you can gain XP faster by targeting certain types of monsters (assuring that you actually travel around the area and fight different types of monsters rather than finding the best place to grind out Coblyns). I don't want any of that sh*t in my questing, though. To me, if you can't throw in a bit of original story and scenario, don't @#%^ing bother calling it a quest.

MMOs are notoriously terrible about this. It'd be one thing if they made even the most minimal effort, say by imposing a time limit on the Kill 10 X quest, but it's usually less of a quest and more of a "Hey, why don't you go XP on spiders for a while?"

Lol, this is so very true! I personaly could go through doing it because I havnt played enough MMOs to be burnt out on it yet, but back whe I played Cabal for 3-4 months every quest was like that but they threw in generic dungeons inbetween. I wont lie though I loved the flashy moves! But because I didnt want to pay anything for the game it took forever to get the skills :( ..

Anyways! I dont like that trains and airships/ships dont let you walk around on them while they fly to the destination. From what I understand you only get a cs and you are in the next zone where the ship lands.. I understand some people dont want to wait and dont want any downtime..

Its Just that.. I remember when I first got access to airships after getting the Kazham keys I was going nutz looking over the edge of the airship and going to the deck or control room looking out the window.. Or the pirates attacking the boat and me being low level going out like a boss to fight and getting owned 30 seconds later.. Just kinda sucks its just a cs then your at your destination.. Seems like it takes away from the very emersion of the game that they are trying to create..


Edited, Apr 4th 2013 9:22pm by SaitoMishima
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#22 Apr 04 2013 at 7:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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Having to click a ??? before fighting something doesn't strike me as particularly complex. Having to complete a series of steps to do something seems like the definition of linearity. Even if a quest is complex, it doesn't make it fun. Mental challenge makes something fun, not following a fifty step quest guide.
#23 Apr 04 2013 at 7:37 PM Rating: Decent
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Dizmo wrote:
Having to click a ??? before fighting something doesn't strike me as particularly complex. Having to complete a series of steps to do something seems like the definition of linearity. Even if a quest is complex, it doesn't make it fun. Mental challenge makes something fun, not following a fifty step quest guide.


That's why he wrote it as "complex" and not complex. Means something more than mindlessly slaughtering 1-5 of x animal or trading item to x spot to pop the same monster over and over for every single quest you come across. Something that actually follows a story flow and the story actually cuts in while in your quest, for example in FFXI there were some quests where you reached the ??? you get a cutscene that gave you story. With the majority of quest based MMOs, that's not likely, even with main storylines, you're usually on a fetch quest even for a main story. How is killing 9 marmots supposed to tell me about Dalamud and the Garleans?


#24 Apr 04 2013 at 8:29 PM Rating: Default
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Theonehio wrote:
Dizmo wrote:
Having to click a ??? before fighting something doesn't strike me as particularly complex. Having to complete a series of steps to do something seems like the definition of linearity. Even if a quest is complex, it doesn't make it fun. Mental challenge makes something fun, not following a fifty step quest guide.


That's why he wrote it as "complex" and not complex. Means something more than mindlessly slaughtering 1-5 of x animal or trading item to x spot to pop the same monster over and over for every single quest you come across.





this
#25 Apr 04 2013 at 8:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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Kachi wrote:
Eh, I don't mind having a Fields of Valor type situation where you can gain XP faster by targeting certain types of monsters (assuring that you actually travel around the area and fight different types of monsters rather than finding the best place to grind out Coblyns). I don't want any of that sh*t in my questing, though. To me, if you can't throw in a bit of original story and scenario, don't @#%^ing bother calling it a quest.

MMOs are notoriously terrible about this. It'd be one thing if they made even the most minimal effort, say by imposing a time limit on the Kill 10 X quest, but it's usually less of a quest and more of a "Hey, why don't you go XP on spiders for a while?"


Yes! Yes, exactly! It's the fact that these MMO "quests" are too bare-bones to be called such, and because they become stale incredibly quickly, that their presence is so annoying.

Give simple, grinding-type content without a story for exp. purposes, and give interesting narratives to quests. If you give a narrative with every little task, then we just get 200 forgettable walls of text that involve poor excuses to hack at monsters spawning right next to us. It's a poor design, it's a poor story and, worst of all, it's not even fun to play through!
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#26 Apr 04 2013 at 9:54 PM Rating: Default
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So... "go and kill 10 crabs" for EXP is fine, as long as they don't specifically call it a "quest"? I don't follow.
#27 Apr 04 2013 at 10:28 PM Rating: Excellent
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Most of XI's quests gave 0 exp. They gave material rewards (raw materials, gear), access to a later quest in the story, or nothing other than the storyline and a cute title, which was its own reward.
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#28 Apr 04 2013 at 10:51 PM Rating: Default
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I was talking about the, uh.

Fields of Valor type stuff. (That was the floating book, right?)

They were just quests to kill x monsters if I recall.

Yeah I know the things were actually called "Quests" in FFXI were generally for items or some kind of access to something, or fame, or story.

Edited, Apr 5th 2013 12:52am by Killua125
#29 Apr 04 2013 at 11:27 PM Rating: Decent
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Killua125 wrote:
So... "go and kill 10 crabs" for EXP is fine, as long as they don't specifically call it a "quest"? I don't follow.


Not really-- kill 10 crabs is a fair assignment if I wouldn't be killing crabs otherwise (presumably because crabs are generally more difficult to kill than is worthwhile). If crabs are a challenge that don't give enough XP for killing under normal circumstances, a quest that gives me a fair reward for killing 10 of them is a nice enough deal. Even better if I have to actually explore the area and fulfill other tasks to be able to complete this objective, rather than killing 10 crabs that spawn on the same beach.

Generally it's more than just calling it a quest, but even if that were all it was, I don't appreciate it. Maybe I actually want to do all of the REAL quests, and now I have to sift through these trash "quests" as well. It's poor information management, and in a video game, information management is critical at every juncture. Those junctures determine the information hierarchy. In short, the labels matter.

Those are the reasons that it matters. As a game designer, you have to show regard for player goals, whether that's having fun while XPing efficiently, or experiencing the entire questing narrative.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#30 Apr 05 2013 at 12:37 AM Rating: Good
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DuoMaxwellxx wrote:
By "complex" I mean talk to an NPC.. find a ??? and get as key item for it... or sawn an nm tat 100% dropped an item for teh quest etc etc or was it just the standard WoW variety of "kill xxxx amount of enemies" or get "xxx amount of drops from killing certian enemy"?


WoW has so many complex quests that go beyond kill/gather x. I don't know why people always use it as an example. Some of the quests are really @#%^ing cool.

For example: In one questline I got to use a gattling gun mounted to a plane to fend off enemy planes. In another I got to participate in aerial jousting. In another I got to infiltrate an entire compound without being seen to assassinate the leader...

What other MMOs have you played with quests such as those? (Not missions, regular xp quests)


Edited, Apr 5th 2013 2:42am by Transmigration
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#31 Apr 05 2013 at 12:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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That was true. Wow had some really god **** cool quests. But on the other had it also had some seriously annoying ones!! To be honest in analogy, wow had more annoying quests than cool ones. I guess its reasonable since there were so many, but the "kill 10 of those" quests or "get 15 of that thing) that had drop rate 1 out of 5 quests were really driving me crazy.
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#32 Apr 05 2013 at 1:32 AM Rating: Decent
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Exactly why it's important to distinguish "real" quests from "fake" quests. Players know the difference.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#33 Apr 05 2013 at 5:37 AM Rating: Excellent
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Killua125 wrote:
I was talking about the, uh.

Fields of Valor type stuff. (That was the floating book, right?)

They were just quests to kill x monsters if I recall.

Yeah I know the things were actually called "Quests" in FFXI were generally for items or some kind of access to something, or fame, or story.


Even Fields of Valor and Grounds of Valor (FoV is outside areas, GoV is inside dungeons) had a teeny bit of story behind them. The story was that the adventurer's union had put together a training guide book specific to each area for people to improve their skills, and by doing their recommended training exercises you would be rewarded with exp bonuses. With GoV, you also earned more for each successive book you completed. GoV had no direct cash rewards, but the tabs earned from doing them could be used for free warps home, buffs, and could also be spent on special fights used to augment existing gear.

GoV/FoV are not considered quests in FFXI by any player that I know of.
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#34 Apr 05 2013 at 10:59 AM Rating: Default
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Transmigration wrote:
For example: In one questline I got to use a gattling gun mounted to a plane to fend off enemy planes. In another I got to participate in aerial jousting. In another I got to infiltrate an entire compound without being seen to assassinate the leader...

What other MMOs have you played with quests such as those? (Not missions, regular xp quests)


For one thing, most MMOs stick to their time period. I'd severely question the development team if I whipped out a Gatling Gun to kill people/enemies for a quest when the level of technology doesn't allow for that. So what other MMOs I've played with quests like that? Plenty, which is the problem...they're all eventually the same type of quests repeated over and over in every new MMO I load up.

None specifically about rolling a rock or whipping out a gatling gun, but escort/infiltration/etc type quests aren't uncommon, they're more common than you think, however, people use WoW as an example because there's more "GO GET ME 10 SKINS!" quests in every new hub you come to than there are unique quests. This is the format SE is and will follow because it's what people come to expect of an MMORPG, and it's quite sad because they're also the first to complain about getting bored.

Like seriously, I felt way more in tune with XI's storyline through the years than I did with XIV's even though XIV didn't have tons of kill quests, but with ARR, I can already see I'll be disconnected from the world after the starter levels because it's looking to be nothing different, especially with how lodestone tore sites apart for stating this because they know it's true (Google will get you all you need to know) and are worried.

#35 Apr 05 2013 at 12:03 PM Rating: Good
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Transmigration wrote:
has so many complex quests that go beyond kill/gather x. I don't know why people always use it as an example. Some of the quests are really @#%^ing cool.

For example: In one questline I got to use a gattling gun mounted to a plane to fend off enemy planes. In another I got to participate in aerial jousting. In another I got to infiltrate an entire compound without being seen to assassinate the leader...


The description of the quest is infinitely better than the quest itself, though, which basically amounted to you sliding along in a cheap-looking plane, clicking the 1 or 2 unique macros given to you for that quest when over the designated point. Let's be honest, those quests are far from the flight-simulating, Dishonored-style, stealth infiltration that you make them out to be.
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"Thus opium is pleasing... on account of the agreeable delirium it produces." (Burke para.6)

"I could only read so much for this paper and the syphilis poem had to go."
#36 Apr 05 2013 at 9:53 PM Rating: Decent
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What makes a quest Epic tho ? Or worthier of the name quest than others ? Story ? Delivery ? A Scene ? Steps ?

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#37 Apr 05 2013 at 11:08 PM Rating: Decent
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That's kind of like asking what makes a good person. People will widely argue about certain things and generally agree that it's open to considerable interpretation, but at the end of the day, when presented with real examples, most people won't hesitate to weigh in that the career criminal was a bad person, and the person who devoted his life to charity was a good person.

In the end it's all about the effort put in. Analysis of elements aside, when there's no real effort to be a good person or design a real quest, it shows.
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Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#38 Apr 05 2013 at 11:42 PM Rating: Good
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Theonehio wrote:
Transmigration wrote:
For example: In one questline I got to use a gattling gun mounted to a plane to fend off enemy planes. In another I got to participate in aerial jousting. In another I got to infiltrate an entire compound without being seen to assassinate the leader...

What other MMOs have you played with quests such as those? (Not missions, regular xp quests)


For one thing, most MMOs stick to their time period. I'd severely question the development team if I whipped out a Gatling Gun to kill people/enemies for a quest when the level of technology doesn't allow for that.


Except Azeroth doesn't necessarily fit in to a time period and Engineering is a craft that you can learn and build flying machines with..

Quote:
Let's be honest, those quests are far from the flight-simulating, Dishonored-style, stealth infiltration that you make them out to be.


It's not assassin's creed but it beats the **** out of "go make me a copper ingot" .

Edited, Apr 6th 2013 1:44am by Transmigration
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#39 Apr 06 2013 at 7:21 PM Rating: Decent
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A Final Fantasy MMO with fanfare has all the room in the world to explore tech or fantasy. Airships, magitek, sand cruisers, bombs, guns, magic, flying dragons, espers, etc. I feel that no matter how much I express my disdain for repetetive quests in mmos or rpgs in general. Nothing will ever meet every hope each individual player wants. They put to much effort into quality and the quantity usually dips. Put too little effort into quality and the quantity usually rises. In a subscription based mmo, I assume most mmo companies aim to do more of the latter to keep your wallets emptying?

Why must quest jobs usually trend towards fetch, kill, escort, and craft?
That is only four job descriptions.. How many jobs/job descriptions exist in the world world to draw inspirations from? Mechanic, artist, musician, recon, sabotage, slander, city community hours, and on and on and on. Maybe on a few npc interactions let us win their hearts or change their minds through conversation and actions.

There were not full blow crafts in every Final Fantasy. Through the use of dynamic hotbars make some fugging mingames in context to what the job quest consist of. Stimulate my reflex, emotional, and cognitive brain by introducing things it is not used to.

Nature: When you go on an adventure in secluded areas(besides frequent tourist attractions). Everything is not sugar and rainbows, it's not safe, it's not convienent, etc. The weather can't wait to **** on your ice cream sunday. Maybe everything is peaches and cream and suddenly a stranger wants to kill you just for the sake of it?

Give me one massive linked region consisting of 10 zones the size of beaucedine glacier. Call this zone the desert of despair. Let the environment affect me during my quests. Bloodthirsty chupacabras attacking out of thin air, spread out oasis that I must reach to not die of thirst(This need to drink could be region specific), sandstorms so fierce that you can't see 5 feet in front of you.

Make me navigate by night watching the stars and navigate by day by watching the sun, make an area with quicksands and narrow passageways that make me drop some inventory to not break my footing, have some elaborate secret passages in a crypt that demand multiplayer cohesion(maybe not good idea on a frequented required quest) but nonetheless. Have safe peaceful areas or machines to get through pieces of this **** on eorzea. Stimulate my reflex, emotional, and cognitive brain. Brainfug me, then when I feel safe, brainfug me again, and again, and again.

Add some landmarks with lore and problem solving. Add some story to this whole affair with a mix of linnear script and non linnear random sequences. Oh look there! There is a collosal beast in the center of that chasm with a dust tornado. Maybe we have to keep an airship in working order until we reach the center and descend down into the chasm?
#40 Apr 07 2013 at 12:48 AM Rating: Good
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Really neat ideas. Even if they couldn't be implemented exactly as you stated it's a great place to start. Lets hope this new dev team is open to suggestions!
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#41 Apr 07 2013 at 1:50 AM Rating: Decent
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Creativity? Not in MY Final Fantasy!
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Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

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#42 Apr 07 2013 at 10:02 AM Rating: Decent
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KaneKitty wrote:
Kachi wrote:
Eh, I don't mind having a Fields of Valor type situation where you can gain XP faster by targeting certain types of monsters (assuring that you actually travel around the area and fight different types of monsters rather than finding the best place to grind out Coblyns). I don't want any of that sh*t in my questing, though. To me, if you can't throw in a bit of original story and scenario, don't @#%^ing bother calling it a quest.

MMOs are notoriously terrible about this. It'd be one thing if they made even the most minimal effort, say by imposing a time limit on the Kill 10 X quest, but it's usually less of a quest and more of a "Hey, why don't you go XP on spiders for a while?"


Yes! Yes, exactly! It's the fact that these MMO "quests" are too bare-bones to be called such, and because they become stale incredibly quickly, that their presence is so annoying.

Give simple, grinding-type content without a story for exp. purposes, and give interesting narratives to quests. If you give a narrative with every little task, then we just get 200 forgettable walls of text that involve poor excuses to hack at monsters spawning right next to us. It's a poor design, it's a poor story and, worst of all, it's not even fun to play through!

I agree with these sentiments. In my opinion, everything comes down to dynamics. Too much of a single thing or theme can begin to feel to familiar or lose some luster. The depth of the great is felt more when there is more tuned down aspects preceding it. If I were to speak to you about the same topic and never shift. You would feel less impacted or maybe just grow slightly disinterested. If I were to speak or project my words at the same speed, without pauses, different inflections, or without the use of different mannerisms. You would feel less impacted or maybe grow quite disinterested.

The same goes with game design. It might be a good idea to approach narrative in the same manner. Create a world with no text based or cutscene narrative and the intepretation is left entirely up to the user. Create a world with text based or cutscene narrative for every little thing and the user has no room to interpret much. The extremes do not have to be the only avenue of delivery.

What about all the subtle flavors?
Each quest could touch upon different emotional themes, an npc might speak through the inflection of different beliefs or moods.The reason to kill beasts differ to each individual. Is it out of neccessity or the fun/ thrill of the pursuit?
Pushing aside the known fact that the internet can be used to look up everything one wishes to know about a game. Would there really be an important neccesary purpose for hunting beasts other than gaining xp? Yes from time to time, but not a constant. When there is dynamics, the lesser things and greater things take on more significance.
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