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#1 Jun 13 2013 at 4:48 PM Rating: Default
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I'm going to go WAY out on a limb here. So much with Square-Enix has changed since 1.0. I"m not just talking about with ARR I mean with the entire company. The way they are handling the trailers, live broadcasts, E3, the media, the advertising on key cards in hotels, and banners on the street is so abnormal for them. And all of these changes happened when 1.0 flop.

The Conspiracy Topic: Did 1.0 really flop, or was it an intentional start to a huge advertising campaign for the entire company product line that was much needed?

If not, it certainly seems to have worked in their favor so far.
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#2 Jun 13 2013 at 4:52 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't see the purpose for anyone intentionally creating a bad product. What I see more likely being the case is that management didn't foresee that their decisions would lead to such huge community backlash. It is the same thing that is happening right now with microsoft. Their arrogance might just be the death of them but they could very well turn around like SE and see the fault in their previous actions.
#3 Jun 13 2013 at 4:52 PM Rating: Excellent
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Seems quite farfetched.

However even though 1.0 flopped it seemed to start at least something good, not just regarding FFXIV but the company aswell. I think SE learned their lesson. That nowadays on the "internet era" it's actually good idea to keep in touch with your customers at least a bit. Usually SE didnt seem to communicate with players much before the 1.0 flop. Also if i remember right the advertising of 1.0 was horrible. I didnt see much of ads anywhere. This time they have done much better, and i really hope it pays off and FFXIV will live on (and hopefully SE will start doing bit better aswell as a company).
#4 Jun 13 2013 at 4:53 PM Rating: Good
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Like "New Coke"?

I hope that's not the case. I've waited for this ps3 release for years.

edit* I still think New Coke was a plot to remove sugar cane from "classic" coke and replace it with corn syrup. I've not researched this mind you. But I believe.

Edited, Jun 13th 2013 6:56pm by ShindaUsagi
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#5 Jun 13 2013 at 4:54 PM Rating: Excellent
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S-E's mentality before 1.0: "We can no wrong" "It's Final Fantasy, people will buy it" "Just fix it down the road, it's fine"

S-E learned that they have to respect their fanbase, and not take them for granted.

Microsoft is going to learn a very similar lesson this upcoming December.

Edited, Jun 13th 2013 3:54pm by UltKnightGrover
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#6 Jun 13 2013 at 5:06 PM Rating: Excellent
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You went too far out onto the limb. It broke. You died of complications from the fall.

Falls kill more than 25,000 Americans each year. Stay away from video game conspiracy theories.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#7 Jun 13 2013 at 5:07 PM Rating: Decent
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Kachi wrote:
You went too far out onto the limb. It broke. You died of complications from the fall.

Falls kill more than 25,000 Americans each year. Stay away from video game conspiracy theories.


It's all in good fun to get the conversation started about Squeenix's dramatic 180 degree turn. We won't be sporting any tinfoil hats here.
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#8 Jun 13 2013 at 5:08 PM Rating: Decent
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electromagnet83 wrote:
I'm going to go WAY out on a limb here. So much with Square-Enix has changed since 1.0. I"m not just talking about with ARR I mean with the entire company. The way they are handling the trailers, live broadcasts, E3, the media, the advertising on key cards in hotels, and banners on the street is so abnormal for them. And all of these changes happened when 1.0 flop.

The Conspiracy Topic: Did 1.0 really flop, or was it an intentional start to a huge advertising campaign for the entire company product line that was much needed?

If not, it certainly seems to have worked in their favor so far.


Why not just NOT flop the game, and then start an advertising campaign? What benefit did having a craptastic game do for their advertising campaign?

I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just asking for some justification?
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#9 Jun 13 2013 at 5:11 PM Rating: Decent
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SE were arrogant and out of touch, and it blew up in their faces. Nothing more.
#10 Jun 13 2013 at 5:14 PM Rating: Excellent
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The move by Square Enix was definitely a reactive move, not a proactive one.

It was SE's financials and their new president who initiated the push. When the disastrous financial results came out in March, we heard rumors of like half the marketing staff getting laid off and stuff, and the president saying he wanted zero line budgeting - from that day forward, all the departments and cost centers in SE would have to justify their funding if they weren't actually making money directly. (So, everyone but sales and licensing.)

In other words, departments like marketing got told to put up or GTFO.

What we're seeing with the sudden outpouring of good marketing attempts is the remaining people, unfettered by the people who were taking home a paycheck but not actually doing anything, desperately fighting to keep their own jobs.
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#11 Jun 13 2013 at 5:16 PM Rating: Decent
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Catwho wrote:
The move by Square Enix was definitely a reactive move, not a proactive one.

It was SE's financials and their new president who initiated the push. When the disastrous financial results came out in March, we heard rumors of like half the marketing staff getting laid off and stuff, and the president saying he wanted zero line budgeting - from that day forward, all the departments and cost centers in SE would have to justify their funding if they weren't actually making money directly. (So, everyone but sales and licensing.)

In other words, departments like marketing got told to put up or GTFO.

What we're seeing with the sudden outpouring of good marketing attempts is the remaining people, unfettered by the people who were taking home a paycheck but not actually doing anything, desperately fighting to keep their own jobs.


Somebody rate up the lady.
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#12 Jun 13 2013 at 5:18 PM Rating: Default
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Parathyroid wrote:
electromagnet83 wrote:
I'm going to go WAY out on a limb here. So much with Square-Enix has changed since 1.0. I"m not just talking about with ARR I mean with the entire company. The way they are handling the trailers, live broadcasts, E3, the media, the advertising on key cards in hotels, and banners on the street is so abnormal for them. And all of these changes happened when 1.0 flop.

The Conspiracy Topic: Did 1.0 really flop, or was it an intentional start to a huge advertising campaign for the entire company product line that was much needed?

If not, it certainly seems to have worked in their favor so far.


Why not just NOT flop the game, and then start an advertising campaign? What benefit did having a craptastic game do for their advertising campaign?

I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just asking for some justification?


Well, if I'm going to play Devil's Advocate here...the flop of 1.0 gave Square enix the most publicity they've had in years. And you know what they say "there is no bad publicity"....
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Check out my Gamer Blog at http://www.baffledgamer.com/
#13 Jun 13 2013 at 5:19 PM Rating: Excellent
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What I see more likely being the case is that management didn't foresee that their decisions would lead to such huge community backlash.


A'la Microsoft?
#14 Jun 13 2013 at 5:19 PM Rating: Decent
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Kachi wrote:
You went too far out onto the limb. It broke. You died of complications from the fall.

Falls kill more than 25,000 Americans each year. Stay away from video game conspiracy theories.


Indeed. Especially when real conspiracy "theories" tend to have much more supporting evidence. That aside, releasing 1.0 in that state was probably a cash grab move. And much like true conspiracy ideology, their PR "didn't let a good disaster go to waste". Even if they didn't intend it, ARR is sort of an underdog story. **** I just discussed XIV with a girl at work and she didn't even know/believe me when I said that it came out two years ago and failed. They didn't seem to have much overwhelming publicity for 1.0 and that may have been because they knew it was underwhelming and broken at release. But now they have all sorts of news outlets discussing ARR. Most of them tend to say something along the lines of "Will it not suck this time?" but there is no such thing as bad publicity.

Edited, Jun 13th 2013 7:20pm by DamienSScott
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#15 Jun 14 2013 at 1:57 AM Rating: Good
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Microsoft is working with the NSA to SPY on us!!!
#16 Jun 14 2013 at 3:06 AM Rating: Good
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Google does it, I don't see why Microsoft wouldn't.
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#17 Jun 14 2013 at 5:13 AM Rating: Good
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1.0 came out about the same time as WOW Cataclysm. SE did not admit it at the time, but WOW was one of the reasons they pushed for an early release date.
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#18 Jun 14 2013 at 1:06 PM Rating: Excellent
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Addyyuna wrote:
1.0 came out about the same time as WOW Cataclysm. SE did not admit it at the time, but WOW was one of the reasons they pushed for an early release date.


I'm not so sure about that. It was plain from the 1.0 UI that they hadn't really paid much attention to WoW at all. What barbequed them in the end was that they had no idea how much the market had changed since FFXI released. Otherwise, there's no way Wada (then CEO) would suggest something so silly as FFXIV and WoW would be competing for #1 subscription-based MMO with what they actually kicked out the door in 2010.
#19 Jun 14 2013 at 1:20 PM Rating: Good
burtonsnow wrote:
I don't see the purpose for anyone intentionally creating a bad product. What I see more likely being the case is that management didn't foresee that their decisions would lead to such huge community backlash. It is the same thing that is happening right now with microsoft. Their arrogance might just be the death of them but they could very well turn around like SE and see the fault in their previous actions.


Microsoft and the XBOXOne would like a word with you.

I still think it's Microsoft easing themselves out of the console market. Whoever thought half of those ideas would be well received is an idiot.
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#20 Jun 14 2013 at 1:25 PM Rating: Good
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Microsoft thought foolishly that Sony and Nintendo would follow their lead, in the effort to make more money. Limit used games and prevent piracy - why not!

They didn't expect Sony to smell blood in the water and backstab them instead. And Nintendo is all like, well if you make the games fun to replay, people won't resell them to begin with...
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I can't understand anyone who skips the cutscenes of a Final Fantasy game. That's like going to Texas and not getting barbecue.

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Curator of the XIV Wallpapers Tumblr and the XIV Fashion Tumblr
#21 Jun 14 2013 at 1:30 PM Rating: Decent
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In my eyes, it was a pretty classic case of the prisoner's dilemma. You'd think they'd have had someone versed in game theory on the staff to warn them!
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#22 Jun 14 2013 at 2:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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Catwho wrote:
Microsoft thought foolishly that Sony and Nintendo would follow their lead, in the effort to make more money. Limit used games and prevent piracy - why not!


Thing is, the Nintendo Wii-U is already out, so in that case they were relying on their irrelevancy. Smiley: lol
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