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bought 1.0 and likely skipping ARR, square wants to hear....Follow

#1 Jun 17 2013 at 12:50 PM Rating: Sub-Default
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From you.

I asked square if I was completely hosed since ARR isn't the game I bought nor is it the game I wanted. They told me to call them. They'll plug ARR heavily as if it is some new product but if you push hard and explain that ARR is not something you would spend money on they'll work with you to make you happy.
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Edited, Jun 18th 2013 6:46am by Wint Lock Thread: Stick a fork in this one.
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#2 Jun 17 2013 at 12:58 PM Rating: Decent
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I fail to see what youre saying 1.0 sucked.... no doubt about it.. ARR however doesnt suck. Ssure its not GREAT nor is it as good as FFXI but, SE turned 1.0 from a crappy game that belong sin a landfill to ARR which is something thats not crappy and is very playable. So I fail to see what your issue is, care to elaborate? In otherwords ARR is what 1.0 SHOULD have been when it launched on sept 2010
#3 Jun 17 2013 at 1:02 PM Rating: Default
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Show me where I said ARR sucked
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#4 Jun 17 2013 at 1:04 PM Rating: Decent
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apapertiger wrote:
From you.

I asked square if I was completely hosed since ARR isn't the game I bought nor is it the game I wanted. They told me to call them. They'll plug ARR heavily as if it is some new product but if you push hard and explain that ARR is not something you would spend money on they'll work with you to make you happy.
SQUARE ENIX Support Center: (310) 846 - 0345*
* Please note that this is not a toll-free number. If you would like to contact us toll-free, please use our chat service.


I'm confused on a couple levels. Are you saying you bought a copy of 1.0 recently, expecting it to still be 1.0, and are dissatisfied with ARR? Also, what are you trying to accomplish? Are you trying to get a refund on what you bought?

Lastly... what exactly is it about ARR that you don't like that you liked about 1.0? I have a hard time understanding how anyone could really see the merits of 1.0 over ARR and would definitely like to hear your explanation on it. Thanks!
#5 Jun 17 2013 at 1:09 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think there's a lot of punctuation missing from the title of this thread.


Quote:
Bought 1.0? Are you skipping ARR? Square wants to hear from you.

I asked Square if I was completely hosed since ARR isn't the game I bought nor is it the game I wanted. They told me to call them.

They'll plug ARR heavily as if it is some new product but if you push hard and explain that ARR is not something you would spend money on they'll work with you to make you happy.

SQUARE ENIX Support Center: (310) 846 - 0345*
* Please note that this is not a toll-free number. If you would like to contact us toll-free, please use our chat service.


SE isn't going to refund your 1.0 purchase at this point in time, I don't think. Even if they want to hear your opinion on why you're not going to take their free copy of ARR to make up for the suck fest of 1.0.

For the rest of us, 1.0 was neither the game we paid for or wanted, but ARR is a **** of a lot closer to it.

Edited, Jun 17th 2013 3:10pm by Catwho
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#6 Jun 17 2013 at 1:16 PM Rating: Good
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In before this guy is enjoying ARR in August. ::trollface::
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#7 Jun 17 2013 at 1:19 PM Rating: Decent
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Assuming I'm not misunderstanding, If you bought 1.0, then you can still use the 1.0 disc to download ARR from. You don't need to buy ARR PC unless you want the CE edition.
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#8apapertiger, Posted: Jun 17 2013 at 1:20 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) My copy of FFXIV is being replaced with a different game. Being in California, we have a lot of customer rights so it isn't hard to make things happen because legally it is a bait and switch.
#9 Jun 17 2013 at 1:23 PM Rating: Good
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If you read the ToS for 1.0 Square Enix told you "too bad, so sad" when you bought 1.0 the first time.

They made no guarantee that they'd keep the game running for any period of time. In fact, they explicitly said they reserved the right to end the game whenever they felt like it.

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#10 Jun 17 2013 at 1:25 PM Rating: Good
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apapertiger wrote:
My copy of FFXIV is being replaced with a different game. Being in California, we have a lot of customer rights so it isn't hard to make things happen because legally it is a bait and switch.


Just curious, have you even tried the ARR beta? If not, how would you know that "it's not the game you wanted". Did you ever play 1.0? If not, how would you know that's the game you wanted? I'm just really baffled by your reasoning, please help me understand it.

Also, how exactly was it a bait and switch? Was the game being advertised as 1.0 still at some great sale like "Purchase Final Fantasy XIV, now only $9.99!" or something? Because the whole idea of a bait and switch is that they are advertising something at a discount as something that it's not. If you just saw the game, assumed it was the original XIV 1.0, and bought it, that's your own fault and they have no legal obligation to do jack for you. You just come off sounding very entitled in this thread.
#11 Jun 17 2013 at 1:36 PM Rating: Excellent
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BartelX wrote:
apapertiger wrote:
My copy of FFXIV is being replaced with a different game. Being in California, we have a lot of customer rights so it isn't hard to make things happen because legally it is a bait and switch.


Just curious, have you even tried the ARR beta? If not, how would you know that "it's not the game you wanted". Did you ever play 1.0? If not, how would you know that's the game you wanted? I'm just really baffled by your reasoning, please help me understand it.

Also, how exactly was it a bait and switch? Was the game being advertised as 1.0 still at some great sale like "Purchase Final Fantasy XIV, now only $9.99!" or something? Because the whole idea of a bait and switch is that they are advertising something at a discount as something that it's not. If you just saw the game, assumed it was the original XIV 1.0, and bought it, that's your own fault and they have no legal obligation to do jack for you. You just come off sounding very entitled in this thread.


Look at his/her signature. He WANTS 1.x over ARR.

Edited, Jun 17th 2013 3:36pm by Ravashack
#12 Jun 17 2013 at 1:36 PM Rating: Default
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Why are you all so defensive? I'm not bashing the game. Yes, I've played 1.0 and ARR beta but as it turns out I never waived those rights in the ToS. Square is being cool and at least listening.
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#13 Jun 17 2013 at 1:39 PM Rating: Good
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OK.. so why do we care that your **** hurt that 1.0 got the axe? the game made no money for SE so they changed it so that maybe jsut maybe they can make their customers happy and make some money.


Did u get to play 1.0? yes.. did u enjoy it? acording to ur sig yes.. idk why u have the balls to ask for your money back.. when i buy games and get bored thats my issue not the company. Heck most games have BIG patches that change the games this is just bigger than most. Just be glad ur in CA and ahve rights to do so, I bought 1.0 and quit 2 months in did i try and get my money back... nope :)

Edited, Jun 17th 2013 3:41pm by silverhope
#14 Jun 17 2013 at 1:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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apapertiger wrote:
My copy of FFXIV is being replaced with a different game. Being in California, we have a lot of customer rights so it isn't hard to make things happen because legally it is a bait and switch.


People like you are the reason I hate lawyers and people in general.

Quote:
Bait-and-switch is a form of fraud used in retail sales but also practiced in other contexts. First, customers are "baited" by merchants' advertising products or services at a low price, but when customers visit the store, they discover that the advertised goods are not available, or the customers are pressured by sales people to consider similar, but higher priced items ("switching").

The intention of the bait-and-switch is to encourage purchases of substituted goods, making consumers satisfied with the available stock offered, as an alternative to a disappointment or inconvenience of acquiring no goods (or bait) at all, and reckoning on a seemingly partial recovery of sunk costs expended trying to obtain the bait. It suggests that the seller will not show the original product or service advertised but instead will demonstrate a more expensive product or a similar product with a higher margin.


ARR is cheaper to buy, cheaper to subscribe to and a better product for most.
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#15 Jun 17 2013 at 1:44 PM Rating: Good
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I don't think they are being defensive, I think we just fail to understand the reason for you posting lol makes no sense at all next time explain exactly what u trying to say or accomplish.
#16 Jun 17 2013 at 1:50 PM Rating: Good
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There is no bait and switch.

You bought FFXIV and got to play it until SE took FFXIV 1.0 servers down. The games running costs were too high to warrant the servers staying online based on the player base. It happened a lot sooner than expected and I can understand why that frustrates you. The problem is just because YOU specifically didn't agree with their decision it doesn't mean you are right, it just that you wished XIV 1.0 were still online. Me disagreeing with your viewpoint doesn't make me right, it just means I wished they revamped the steaming pile o' **** XIV 1.0 was.

Now, to get to your point about you feeling that you should be compensated because you feel SE is pulling a bait and switch. They ARE NOT. SE has discontinued the service which was tied to your original purchase (XIV 1.0). Because SE wants to try and keep as many players as possible they are GIVING YOU A NEW GAME, FOR FREE!!!!
#17 Jun 17 2013 at 1:51 PM Rating: Excellent
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apapertiger wrote:
My copy of FFXIV is being replaced with a different game. Being in California, we have a lot of customer rights so it isn't hard to make things happen because legally it is a bait and switch.


It's really not.

You bought, paid for, and played 1.0. You got the product you wanted and paid for, and your case for bait and switch ends right there.

The reality though is that 1.0 was shut down. The terms of service specify that service can be terminated at any point for no reason. The terms of service you agreed to upon installing the game, and every time you played the game thereafter.

SE launches what amounts to a completely different game called FFXIV A Realm Reborn, and gives 1.0 owners a free copy of that game and offers to migrate their character data.

If SE decides to give you a refund, it's only because they feel like it, not because they have any legal obligation to do so.

Furthermore, have you played ARR? Because you get to do so for free. Maybe try the game out before you go clamoring for refunds and vomiting out legal terms you don't understand?
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#18 Jun 17 2013 at 1:52 PM Rating: Good
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Sorry, I don't even really notice the sig because I have all images blocked on my work computer...

apapertiger wrote:
I'm not bashing the game. Yes, I've played 1.0 and ARR beta but as it turns out I never waived those rights in the ToS. Square is being cool and at least listening.


Wow... so let me get this straight. You played 1.0 (clearly for a long time, just looked at your sig on other comp), and now somehow want a refund on a game that you purchased 3 years ago? What is wrong with you? That's not bait and switch. You HAD no rights. SE took them away from you the second you agreed to their user agreement, which you had to in order to play. Are you really that self-entitled to think that you deserve a refund on a game you got 100's of hours of enjoyment out of, simply because you don't like the direction it's heading? Good grief, that's one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard.

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People like you are the reason I hate lawyers and people in general.


I so completely agree with you. It's people like you, OP, that have completely made our legal system into a joke. You'd probably be one of those people suing someone after breaking into their house and then slipping and fracturing your skull on their stairs. It disgusts me that you'd even attempt to get a refund, let alone that you got one. I'm very glad you won't be joining us in the game. Feel free to sub-default this... I really don't care. This dude is a terrible person.
#19apapertiger, Posted: Jun 17 2013 at 1:54 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I posted information in a place where people that might want that information would see it.
#20 Jun 17 2013 at 1:55 PM Rating: Decent
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Archmage Callinon wrote:
apapertiger wrote:
My copy of FFXIV is being replaced with a different game. Being in California, we have a lot of customer rights so it isn't hard to make things happen because legally it is a bait and switch.


It's really not.

You bought, paid for, and played 1.0. You got the product you wanted and paid for, and your case for bait and switch ends right there.

The reality though is that 1.0 was shut down. The terms of service specify that service can be terminated at any point for no reason. The terms of service you agreed to upon installing the game, and every time you played the game thereafter.

SE launches what amounts to a completely different game called FFXIV A Realm Reborn, and gives 1.0 owners a free copy of that game and offers to migrate their character data.

If SE decides to give you a refund, it's only because they feel like it, not because they have any legal obligation to do so.

Furthermore, have you played ARR? Because you get to do so for free. Maybe try the game out before you go clamoring for refunds and vomiting out legal terms you don't understand?


Furthermore, SE made no indications as to the longevity of the original game.
#21 Jun 17 2013 at 1:58 PM Rating: Good
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apapertiger wrote:
I posted information in a place where people that might want that information would see it.

The rest is on you guys... you're just running with it.

Like the you're the reason I hate lawyers guy. Lawyers aren't involved and neither Square or I brought them up and they weren't mentioned until he brought them up.


No you just talked about a bait and switch, which wasn't the case, and how you apparently feel duped by SE after playing their game for 100's of hours free of charge, aside from the initial game price investment. So tell me... when you buy a video game from the store, do you bring it back and demand a refund if it's not exactly what you thought it was going to be?

"This was advertised as a roelplaying game! It's definitely more of an action/adventure game. It's a bait and switch! I have consumer rights!"

Give me a break... Smiley: rolleyes
#22 Jun 17 2013 at 1:59 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah, I am missing the bait and switch. The game was provided as is. ARR is a new game, it is not FFXIV. Instead of going with the silly FFXIV-2 they decided to sub-title it, but semantically it is FFXIV-2, and as far as I can tell no one has been hiding that.

This really comes off as an attempt to inflict pain on SE for being open and honest, and offering you some recompense for your apparent disillusionment. I can understand when a company does attempt to damage or infringe on their customers the need to push people to their customer service or BBB, but when a company has outlined their intent, and gone out of their way (and they have lost ALOT of money on this at this point) to satisfy their customers in an attempt to regain their faith (and by that their money, lets not fool ourselves).

They did not sell you a product, and when the product was delivered it was a different product. And yes, California does have a lot of laws for that kind of deal. However, this really sounds like SE is stepping up to the plate again, and doing the best they can to satisfy someone they know they can not win back.

If that is the case, I am more than happy to give them my money.
#23 Jun 17 2013 at 2:00 PM Rating: Good
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apapertiger wrote:
I posted information in a place where people that might want that information would see it.


Im sry but thats just silly.. most people here enjoy the game why else would we look on here for info? Even knowing what your doing i think its wrong and would never try to get money back on a game I bought 3 years ago.
#24 Jun 17 2013 at 2:06 PM Rating: Good
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If you read the Software License Agreement section 2.7 Right to Change or Terminate the Service

The Service is provided by SQUARE ENIX for so long as SQUARE ENIX wishes to operate the Service in its sole discretion.
The Service may be modified, suspended, restricted, or terminated, or otherwise
discontinued by SQUARE ENIX without liability to you.

By playing the game you agreed with all the terms whether you liked it or not. You waived your rights the moment you started playing. The game ran for a year with 1/4 of it being free to play as they worked on it.

Edited, Jun 17th 2013 4:07pm by SillyHawk
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#25 Jun 17 2013 at 2:10 PM Rating: Good
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FINAL FANTASY® XIV User Agreement
Last Updated: 8/16/2011


If you reject this User Agreement, then you will not be authorized to play the Game. In that case, you may either return the Game to the place of purchase subject to that retailer’s guidelines, or you may contact SQUARE ENIX to request a full discretionary refund (which will not include shipping and handling) if all of the following conditions are met:

(1) You are unable to obtain a refund or exchange from the place of purchase; and

(2) You request the refund within thirty (30) days of purchase; and

(3) You have not already accepted this User Agreement; and

(4) You have not already entered the Registration Code accompanying your copy of the Game; and


(5) You purchased your copy of the Licensed Software in, and are currently located in, the United States or Canada.


sooo.. you played and have no rights to your money anymore..
http://support.na.square-enix.com/rule.php?id=902&la=1&tag=useragreement_e

Edited, Jun 17th 2013 4:11pm by silverhope
#26 Jun 17 2013 at 2:19 PM Rating: Excellent
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apapertiger wrote:
My copy of FFXIV is being replaced with a different game. Being in California, we have a lot of customer rights so it isn't hard to make things happen because legally it is a bait and switch.

Being in California, I think you've been sitting in the sun for waaaaaaaaaaaay too long.
Good luck trying to get the refund or replacement you feel entitled to; SE owes you nothing.
I guess you made that story up, but if SE felt incredibly merciful to grant you anything in that direction,
it would be out of sheer pity for a poor soul that can neither read their terms of service, nor has the
slightest clue about how legal contracts work. Now hush-hush. Back to school, or mommy will get angry!
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#27 Jun 17 2013 at 2:23 PM Rating: Excellent
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Seriously guys. The whole story reeks of being made up on the spot.
I bet the poor guy is sitting in front of a mirror impressing himself with angry grimaces right now, hahaha!
#28 Jun 17 2013 at 2:27 PM Rating: Default
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You see blanks and just fill it in with things you make up. I shot SE an email asking about it, they told me to call. We discussed it like civilized people do. No one was **** hurt. No one was angry. There were no threats of suing or lawyers. They seemed more curious than anything. They actually did a pretty bang up job. They did go for hard sell of ARR like they're supposed to.

The customer service I got was a huge improvement over I can't remember one of my playonline passwords during my time with with ffxi.

I can think of several ways to not wave your rights.

But excuse me, I have to go break into people's houses to sue them because.... I have no idea.
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#29 Jun 17 2013 at 2:33 PM Rating: Good
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apapertiger wrote:
You see blanks and just fill it in with things you make up. I shot SE an email asking about it, they told me to call. We discussed it like civilized people do. No one was **** hurt. No one was angry. There were no threats of suing or lawyers. They seemed more curious than anything. They actually did a pretty bang up job. They did go for hard sell of ARR like they're supposed to.

The customer service I got was a huge improvement over I can't remember one of my playonline passwords during my time with with ffxi.

I can think of several ways to not wave your rights.

But excuse me, I have to go break into people's houses to sue them because.... I have no idea.


You asked for a refund on a game you played for an extended period of time, and one in which you waived every consumer right you had the second you agreed to their ToS. Then you try to claim that it's a bait and switch. It's an unbelievably petty and shallow tactic that you clearly didn't even understand before posting it. If you didn't get your refund already, don't expect to. I bet the CSR's had a good laugh after they got off the phone with you.

I have to agree with Rinsui, I think you're just trolling hard at this point.
#30 Jun 17 2013 at 2:36 PM Rating: Excellent
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#31 Jun 17 2013 at 4:03 PM Rating: Decent
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Actually, a lot of Legacy users I know are unhappy with ARR, and would not have paid the sub to even become legacy if they had known XIV was going the full route to World of Warcraft. I am Legacy and I thought we were going to get 1.23 with a new graphics engine and some upgrades. Not a whole new game based off what every MMO in the last 8 years has tried and failed.

I do enjoy XIV:ARR, but it is def not what I was expecting at all. 1.23 is/was better in some ways.
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#32 Jun 17 2013 at 4:08 PM Rating: Decent
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I can't really call this a bait and switch either because I do believe that SE meant to release a great product and support it. Unfortunately, it didn't quite happen that way.

To be fair, you guys could have just rated the thread down and let it sink to the bottom of the pile. This person obviously played a lot of XIV 1.0 so they've got experience. They also played the beta and are still unsatisfied. I feel qualified to speak about trolling as I've been accused of it so much and I really gotta say, this wouldn't have been a troll unless you guys flooded the thread with the type of responses you have.

Personally, if I were a business owner and had sold XIV to anyone I'd be offering a refund on my product. I realize that SE didn't charge the sub fee for quite a while and obviously they felt it wasn't worth charging for, but at this point in the game I really feel that the client should be free anyway. If I were SE and apapertiger called me I'd apologize, offer a refund for the full amount of purchase(minus any subscription fees paid) and I'd let them know that their account would still be eligible for the free client download for ARR. The only customers who would be charged for XIV are the PS3 and PS4 players(obvious reasons).

All of the legal stuff is aimed at people who are banned from XIV for things like RMT, botting, ect.. If you are banned for something then SE reserves the right to close your account without refunding the purchase of the game, nor the subscription fees remaining beyond the point that service is cancelled. Yes, they reserve that right. No, it is not a right that they can exercise without a valid reason to do so. C'mon guys, really...?
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#33 Jun 17 2013 at 4:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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Well from the "few" legacy i know i see a totally different opinion from yours Failsociety. Not saying there aren't any unhappy legacy but most of them are quite happy actually.
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#34 Jun 17 2013 at 4:10 PM Rating: Default
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"I asked square if I was completely hosed since ARR isn't the game I bought nor is it the game I wanted. "

So you're basically trying to see if you can squeeze out a refund or something, because 1.0 shut down, right? I see you've got your character Papertiger, which means you've played your share of 1.0 already.

Good luck on that, lol.
#35 Jun 17 2013 at 4:11 PM Rating: Good
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I'm Legacy too and I disagree with you very strongly. I feel that the new game is a solid improvement over 1.0 and I have no desire to ever play it again, not even 1.23 when it was actually kind of sort of fun.

I'm sorry that you feel differently and I hope someday you find an MMO that suits your expectations. Maybe TESO will do it for you.
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#36 Jun 17 2013 at 4:24 PM Rating: Default
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Oh I'll be playing ARR as I have enjoyed Alpha, Beta and was in Alpha and Beta for v1. Yes v1 at the start was terrible, but 1.23 was sitting at a good spot. Besides the obvious flaws. It was still different enough to set it apart from 99% of the other MMOs out and about right now. Sadly with Yoshi's direction even taking out the option to do World Roaming/Camping parties is a huge let down. Not everyone wants to spam through quest text just told to go kill the same mobs a group of players could be doing.

I am not saying XIV:ARR is a bad game, because it's not. I love it actually, and I miss it terribly on the weekdays or in between phases. But let's be real, it's not going to be the next big thing, it does not do anything special that any other MMO hasn't done already. The strong grouping aspect has been removed, and instead of the journey it has become about getting cap asap.

Yoshi would do a huge service to those who enjoy playing a MMO for the people aspect by taking off the Exp cap on Mobs and allowing people to get 4-8 people and roaming/camping higher level mobs. You'll see massive complaints come in when people have leveled up 3 classes and have nothing to do but grind anymore as all there quest text they used to just spam through is no longer there.

People today do not want to play a MMO, they want to play a single player RPG with real life people in the background, and that shows by nothing but solo content in the last 10 years. Make a MMO with strong group content and it gets rejected because people don't want to play with others unless it's about getting loot. Anyways, just my two cents, and again I love ARR, just disappointed with some of Yoshi's actions. When he asked us all those questionaires I had no clue this is what he meant.
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#37 Jun 17 2013 at 4:40 PM Rating: Default
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Square is being really cool... I shared that.

I think it is awesome that Square is working with everyone of their customers.

There's nothing in here to be upset about. I'm not bashing the game. You like chocolate, I like vanilla. So I don't buy chocolate. I'm also happy you get your chocolate kind of a deal.

I'm not angry about anything. I had an unused key so how did I wave my rights? I'm also in a state where the ToS doesn't have much meaning because of the physical copy involved.
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#38 Jun 17 2013 at 4:48 PM Rating: Decent
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You bought a bad batch of chocolate, not vanilla.
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#39 Jun 17 2013 at 4:53 PM Rating: Good
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Failsociety wrote:
Oh I'll be playing ARR as I have enjoyed Alpha, Beta and was in Alpha and Beta for v1. Yes v1 at the start was terrible, but 1.23 was sitting at a good spot. Besides the obvious flaws. It was still different enough to set it apart from 99% of the other MMOs out and about right now. Sadly with Yoshi's direction even taking out the option to do World Roaming/Camping parties is a huge let down. Not everyone wants to spam through quest text just told to go kill the same mobs a group of players could be doing.

I am not saying XIV:ARR is a bad game, because it's not. I love it actually, and I miss it terribly on the weekdays or in between phases. But let's be real, it's not going to be the next big thing, it does not do anything special that any other MMO hasn't done already. The strong grouping aspect has been removed, and instead of the journey it has become about getting cap asap.

Yoshi would do a huge service to those who enjoy playing a MMO for the people aspect by taking off the Exp cap on Mobs and allowing people to get 4-8 people and roaming/camping higher level mobs. You'll see massive complaints come in when people have leveled up 3 classes and have nothing to do but grind anymore as all there quest text they used to just spam through is no longer there.

People today do not want to play a MMO, they want to play a single player RPG with real life people in the background, and that shows by nothing but solo content in the last 10 years. Make a MMO with strong group content and it gets rejected because people don't want to play with others unless it's about getting loot. Anyways, just my two cents, and again I love ARR, just disappointed with some of Yoshi's actions. When he asked us all those questionaires I had no clue this is what he meant.


He took the answers of all the thousands of people who answered in around the world and is doing his best to make a game that as many of those people like as he can. Unfortunately, since we all have different opinions about where we would like to see the game, it's impossible to make everybody happy. He'll implement what was most popular out of those answers and just keep going from there. I'd be interested in what questions he may ask if he ever released another questionnaire.
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#40 Jun 17 2013 at 4:59 PM Rating: Good
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Wow I've never seen such a dumb post in all of my Zam'n. The guy is upset because 1.0 no longer exists? So what happens when we play an MMO for 10 years and they shutdown service? Do we still get a refund on everything you ever paid because our game is no longer available? Are MMOs expected to run forever without ever changing any aspect?

Lastly, why is OP so bent on continuously letting everyone know he/she is from California? Are we all supposed to be like "oooh don't mess with him/her, he/she's from a cool place." Is this a troll post?
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#41 Jun 17 2013 at 5:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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I wonder if someone did this to Blizzard when Cataclysm was released. Smiley: lol
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#42Killua125, Posted: Jun 17 2013 at 5:09 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I agree (although I was never a hardcore player of FFXIV).
#43 Jun 17 2013 at 5:40 PM Rating: Good
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For as little as $.10 a day* you can save apapertiger from going hungry.

*about how much we all paid (if you bought the CE edition)

If you were "dedicated" enough to pay a monthly fee, it's probably somewhere around .15 cents a day.

----

Seriously though, SE has no legal or moral right to give anyone's money back in cases like these. It is extremely charitable if they do.

MMOs can and do change/end at anytime; that's the product you pay for.

To even ask is mind blowing.

I would try to draw up an analogous situation but there isn't one because it's so ridiculous.

----

But just for kicks I'm going to call GRAVITY, Blizzard, Mythic, Trion, SE (for FFXI), ArenaNet and see if I can get my money back, because well, their games changed and I feel it was a bait and switch when I stopped enjoying their respective endgame content.

I mean we're all adults here right?

Smiley: disappointed
#44Parathyroid, Posted: Jun 17 2013 at 5:43 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Sorry dude... say anything against ARR on here and you're getting rated to oblivion. Conform or GTFO!
#45 Jun 17 2013 at 5:48 PM Rating: Decent
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electromagnet83 wrote:
Wow I've never seen such a dumb post in all of my Zam'n. The guy is upset because 1.0 no longer exists? So what happens when we play an MMO for 10 years and they shutdown service? Do we still get a refund on everything you ever paid because our game is no longer available? Are MMOs expected to run forever without ever changing any aspect?

Lastly, why is OP so bent on continuously letting everyone know he/she is from California? Are we all supposed to be like "oooh don't mess with him/her, he/she's from a cool place." Is this a troll post?

You saw what you thought was a dumb post and tried to 1 up it? This person didn't subscribe to service for 10 years. Why would you think that question is relevant? Do you even read the posts?

Apapertiger clearly stated that they liked the fact that XIV(pre ARR) was at least a little unique in that it wasn't a generic copy of other MMOs. Now that ARR beta is out and it is looking like they are just borrowing from other popular ideas, tiger no happy. It's a matter of the service being provided and has nothing at all to do with the longevity.

If you pay for a newspaper subscription, you expect to get the news. If instead, tabloids showed up on your doorstep every morning, you would probably ask to have your subscription cancelled if that wasn't what you liked. The difference here is that there was a cost up front. It's like you go to the news stand and buy a TIME magazine, but when you get it home you realize that it's only the cover of a TIME magazine with BOP inside it. I dare you to tell me you wouldn't ask for a refund... Smiley: sly













Oh yeah, did I mention I'm from California?

Edited, Jun 17th 2013 7:49pm by FilthMcNasty
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#46 Jun 17 2013 at 5:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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Parathyroid wrote:
apapertiger wrote:
From you.

I asked square if I was completely hosed since ARR isn't the game I bought nor is it the game I wanted. They told me to call them. They'll plug ARR heavily as if it is some new product but if you push hard and explain that ARR is not something you would spend money on they'll work with you to make you happy.
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Sorry dude... say anything against ARR on here and you're getting rated to oblivion. Conform or GTFO!


It IS kind of strange how fans of ARR might congregate on a fansite... weird.

Seriously though, it's ok to criticize the game. What you can't do though, is sound like an entitled jackass while you're doing it. That's actually just not ok anywhere.

For the record, this is the line that set off my BS alarm:
apapertiger wrote:
My copy of FFXIV is being replaced with a different game. Being in California, we have a lot of customer rights so it isn't hard to make things happen because legally it is a bait and switch.


He was actually fine right up until that point.
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#47 Jun 17 2013 at 5:51 PM Rating: Default
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Archmage Callinon wrote:
Parathyroid wrote:
apapertiger wrote:
From you.

I asked square if I was completely hosed since ARR isn't the game I bought nor is it the game I wanted. They told me to call them. They'll plug ARR heavily as if it is some new product but if you push hard and explain that ARR is not something you would spend money on they'll work with you to make you happy.
SQUARE ENIX Support Center: (310) 846 - 0345*
* Please note that this is not a toll-free number. If you would like to contact us toll-free, please use our chat service.


Sorry dude... say anything against ARR on here and you're getting rated to oblivion. Conform or GTFO!


It IS kind of strange how fans of ARR might congregate on a fansite... weird.

Seriously though, it's ok to criticize the game. What you can't do though, is sound like an entitled jackass while you're doing it. That's actually just not ok anywhere.

For the record, this is the line that set off my BS alarm:
apapertiger wrote:
My copy of FFXIV is being replaced with a different game. Being in California, we have a lot of customer rights so it isn't hard to make things happen because legally it is a bait and switch.


He was actually fine right up until that point.


Didn't say it's weird buddy.

It is weird to rate someone's karma because you don't agree with something they said. Hmmm, let me try it.

Edit: Ohhhh wow! Now I see why it's done! It feels great!

Also, I'm the biggest FF fan in this beyotch. Doesn't mean I rate down every time someone says something I don't like.


Edited, Jun 17th 2013 7:52pm by Parathyroid

Edited, Jun 17th 2013 7:53pm by Parathyroid
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#48 Jun 17 2013 at 5:51 PM Rating: Decent
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Killua125 wrote:
Failsociety wrote:
Actually, a lot of Legacy users I know are unhappy with ARR, and would not have paid the sub to even become legacy if they had known XIV was going the full route to World of Warcraft. I am Legacy and I thought we were going to get 1.23 with a new graphics engine and some upgrades. Not a whole new game based off what every MMO in the last 8 years has tried and failed.

I do enjoy XIV:ARR, but it is def not what I was expecting at all. 1.23 is/was better in some ways.


I agree (although I was never a hardcore player of FFXIV).

I think 1.23 actually was better in more than a few aspects, and I stand by my opinion that all Yoshi-P needed to do was the new UI, battle animations and effects, then work on new areas and jobs.

It was a much more beautiful game, it didn't have zones, I didn't feel handheld non-stop. The game was lacking but destroying the foundation that they had in favor of a World of Warcraft clone (Yoshi-P's words, not mine) doesn't seem to have been the correct route.

I think it is a bait and switch if you bought 1.23, poured a lot of time into that game, etc. ARR is definitely not FFXIV, so in a sense, he no longer has the product that he paid for. BUT, he's definitely not going to be entitled to any money. Whenever you play online games, you sign digital contracts that protect them from things like that.


Just like many of the problems in this country, don't blame Square-Enix, blame your friends, family, neighbors etc. ARR is as it is because of the countless compiled requests and complaints about 1.0...and even currently 2.0. Perusing through the beta forums I am utterly shocked at the requests contained within "popular" threads. Things evolve due to requests. The game is easier because people thought XI and 1.0 were too hard. The graphics aren't quite as high-res because people complained they couldn't run it. The list goes on and on, yet after all that feedback was taken and addressed it wasn't enough. Now people just complain about the monster they've created.

Once it becomes what everyone wants, nobody wants it...almost as if people enjoy complaining just so that once they have shown their power over the company they can lick their fingers clean and walk away with a greasy smile on their face saying "see company, you're not so big after all."

Square has done an amazing job trying to satisfy all of the minutia of (sometimes ridiculous) complaints and requests. If someone isn't happy still, that person must just be a miserable person in general and only finds the negative in everything.



Edited, Jun 17th 2013 7:56pm by electromagnet83
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#49 Jun 17 2013 at 5:54 PM Rating: Default
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electromagnet83 wrote:
Killua125 wrote:
Failsociety wrote:
Actually, a lot of Legacy users I know are unhappy with ARR, and would not have paid the sub to even become legacy if they had known XIV was going the full route to World of Warcraft. I am Legacy and I thought we were going to get 1.23 with a new graphics engine and some upgrades. Not a whole new game based off what every MMO in the last 8 years has tried and failed.

I do enjoy XIV:ARR, but it is def not what I was expecting at all. 1.23 is/was better in some ways.


I agree (although I was never a hardcore player of FFXIV).

I think 1.23 actually was better in more than a few aspects, and I stand by my opinion that all Yoshi-P needed to do was the new UI, battle animations and effects, then work on new areas and jobs.

It was a much more beautiful game, it didn't have zones, I didn't feel handheld non-stop. The game was lacking but destroying the foundation that they had in favor of a World of Warcraft clone (Yoshi-P's words, not mine) doesn't seem to have been the correct route.

I think it is a bait and switch if you bought 1.23, poured a lot of time into that game, etc. ARR is definitely not FFXIV, so in a sense, he no longer has the product that he paid for. BUT, he's definitely not going to be entitled to any money. Whenever you play online games, you sign digital contracts that protect them from things like that.


Just like many of the problems in this country, don't blame Square-Enix, blame your friends, family, neighbors etc. ARR is as it is because of the countless compiled requests and complaints about 1.0...and even currently 2.0. Perusing through the beta forums I am utterly shocked at the requests contained within "popular" threads. Things evolve due to requests. Once it becomes what everyone wants, nobody wants it...almost as if people enjoy complaining just so that once they have shown their power over the company they can lick their fingers clean and walk away with a greasy smile on their face saying "see company, you're not so big after all."

Square has done an amazing job trying to satisfy all of the minutia of (sometimes ridiculous) complaints and requests. If someone isn't happy still, that person must just be a miserable person in general and only finds the negative in everything.

Edited, Jun 17th 2013 7:53pm by electromagnet83


Hey! That's what Kachi has been trying to say!
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#50 Jun 17 2013 at 5:55 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Didn't say it's weird buddy.

It is weird to rate someone's karma because you don't agree with something they said. Hmmm, let me try it.


Actually, until you, I hadn't touched any of the ratings buttons in this thread. And you're right.. *I* said it was weird that fans would be on a fansite. In fact I said it in the post you quoted.

Maybe go for some reading comprehension before you just reach for blind internet rage.
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#51Killua125, Posted: Jun 17 2013 at 6:09 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I don't see any 'internet rage' from him.
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