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#1 Jun 26 2013 at 4:32 PM Rating: Good
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Just found this translated Interview Yoshi just did... pretty interesting what they're planning to implement.

[quote =Yoshi P]For Fisher are you thinking of a way to make them useful for other players like other Gatherer/Crafter classes?
Yoshida: In previous FFXIV they were used in recipes. Like requiring fish scales for a part of armor. As a game it's good to have it but when making a game it's easy to fall into making all classes the same "This class can do this so this class should be able to do the same". This balancing, making all of them the same would be boring, and to make something more complicated (more parts) would cause inconvenience to the players. I don't want to put in the games foundation where it forces player to do stuff (make it more complicated).

That is why we haven't released Fisher in beta test phase 3, Fisher is a class where people really want to enjoy roleplay fishing, but at same time you'll need to choose the fishing rod, bait, setup, and think about the types of water, I was really undecided till the end but if you drop a line in cloud of sea you will be able to fish living in the clouds. Also fishing in quicksand. At first I said it's No Go but they really wanted to do it, they said just being water will make it too small (scale), they pushed saying this is Fantasy (laugh). So I told them if they can make it very persuasive then it's OK, the person in charge is working hard at making the data. I'm cheering them on![/quote]
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#2 Jun 26 2013 at 4:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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What does one catch in a cloud? Lightning trout?

I'm disappointed that fishing will not be a viable source of income (presuming). Fishing was something I enjoyed to do and loved that it was actually profitable on top of that. I'll give it a shot but it really does need to be fun if I'm going to fish for free in lieu of profitable craft time.
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#3 Jun 26 2013 at 5:20 PM Rating: Good
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I prefer fish as food and/or gil, I always thought that as armor they were a bit silly... maybe fish oil for lube on moving parts weapons or scales from GIANT fish or sharks on armor, crabs and such for ornamentation... that makes sense at least. Then again my personal preference isn't very valid if we're fishing in quicksand ^.^
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#4 Jun 26 2013 at 5:55 PM Rating: Good
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Personally, I always thought fishing was a chore. I never really got into it and just grinding out the first 20-25 levels(after they made it easier, not initially) was enough to make me put it off until I literally could not do anything else. If they change fishing to something that doesn't benefit me in some way like making money or perhaps gaining me some item for crafting, there's really nothing there for me. I don't mind this though. If they make it into something that people enjoy then more power to them. It simply wont be for me.
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#5 Jun 26 2013 at 6:25 PM Rating: Default
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Fishing in clouds? WTF? Yoshida's initial assessment was the correct one. It may be a fantasy but not everything has to be outlandish and goofy.

Edited, Jun 26th 2013 9:00pm by BrokenFox
#6 Jun 26 2013 at 6:33 PM Rating: Good
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I realize that some people think his ideas are a little strange, like fishing for fun only. But, on the other hand, GOODBYE RMT fish bots!
He's really going all out to minimize RMT in this game and i'm not sad about that at all.
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#7 Jun 26 2013 at 6:52 PM Rating: Excellent
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ShindaUsagi wrote:
What does one catch in a cloud? Lightning trout?
[...]

Flying fish and wind crystals. :D
#8 Jun 26 2013 at 6:56 PM Rating: Decent
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Ravashack wrote:
ShindaUsagi wrote:
What does one catch in a cloud? Lightning trout?
[...]

Flying fish and wind crystals. :D


Maybe some angelfish to boot. Ice crystals would also make sense.
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#9 Jun 26 2013 at 7:42 PM Rating: Good
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Ravashack wrote:
ShindaUsagi wrote:
What does one catch in a cloud? Lightning trout?
[...]

Flying fish and wind crystals. :D


~laughs~ I forgot pre ARR you guys were fishing up crystals. Will that still be in effect? Fishing may yet still have a monetary/crafting purpose if so.

Edited, Jun 26th 2013 9:43pm by ShindaUsagi
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#10 Jun 26 2013 at 8:15 PM Rating: Good
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ShindaUsagi wrote:
Ravashack wrote:
ShindaUsagi wrote:
What does one catch in a cloud? Lightning trout?
[...]

Flying fish and wind crystals. :D


~laughs~ I forgot pre ARR you guys were fishing up crystals. Will that still be in effect? Fishing may yet still have a monetary/crafting purpose if so.

Edited, Jun 26th 2013 9:43pm by ShindaUsagi


It's odd.

I don't see how it can be any less of a money maker or different from Miner and Botnaist.

Culinary and Alchemy still use fish in recipes. I don't seeing it being any less needed despite any changes.
#11 Jun 26 2013 at 8:40 PM Rating: Good
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ShindaUsagi wrote:
Ravashack wrote:
ShindaUsagi wrote:
What does one catch in a cloud? Lightning trout?
[...]

Flying fish and wind crystals. :D


~laughs~ I forgot pre ARR you guys were fishing up crystals. Will that still be in effect? Fishing may yet still have a monetary/crafting purpose if so.

Edited, Jun 26th 2013 9:43pm by ShindaUsagi


I have no confirmation, but I don't see why not. All of the harvesting classes are supposed to be able to get crystals, as far as I can remember, and Fishing + Alchemy used to be *the* way to get a bunch of them.
#12 Jun 26 2013 at 9:28 PM Rating: Good
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I know it's not exhaustive and that the recipes can always change up until release, but XIVDB.com does not list any recipes for making crystals/shards from fish anymore. With that along with everything yoshi has said about fishing, I'm going to assume they wont be included in any alchemy recipes. So far culinarian is the only one I see recipes that include fish. Even then there aren't that many. Maybe around 10 out of over 100 listed. Even if there are RMT bots fishing for stuff to sell, I don't see enough people buying it up to be profitable. I can still see a bunch of little lala's in lvl 1 gear around camps all with names like "l;kajsdfhajk akjdlkjadlk" doing leves repeatedly.
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#13 Jun 26 2013 at 9:41 PM Rating: Decent
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Parathyroid wrote:
Just found this translated Interview Yoshi just did... pretty interesting what they're planning to implement.

[quote =Yoshi P]For Fisher are you thinking of a way to make them useful for other players like other Gatherer/Crafter classes?
Yoshida: In previous FFXIV they were used in recipes. Like requiring fish scales for a part of armor. As a game it's good to have it but when making a game it's easy to fall into making all classes the same "This class can do this so this class should be able to do the same". This balancing, making all of them the same would be boring, and to make something more complicated (more parts) would cause inconvenience to the players. I don't want to put in the games foundation where it forces player to do stuff (make it more complicated).

That is why we haven't released Fisher in beta test phase 3, Fisher is a class where people really want to enjoy roleplay fishing, but at same time you'll need to choose the fishing rod, bait, setup, and think about the types of water, I was really undecided till the end but if you drop a line in cloud of sea you will be able to fish living in the clouds. Also fishing in quicksand. At first I said it's No Go but they really wanted to do it, they said just being water will make it too small (scale), they pushed saying this is Fantasy (laugh). So I told them if they can make it very persuasive then it's OK, the person in charge is working hard at making the data. I'm cheering them on!


I feel like this is a loose translation? Maybe this has nothing to with clouds would be my initial assumption.

Edited, Jun 26th 2013 11:41pm by supermegazeke
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#14 Jun 26 2013 at 10:20 PM Rating: Good
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swisa wrote:
I know it's not exhaustive and that the recipes can always change up until release, but XIVDB.com does not list any recipes for making crystals/shards from fish anymore. With that along with everything yoshi has said about fishing, I'm going to assume they wont be included in any alchemy recipes. So far culinarian is the only one I see recipes that include fish. Even then there aren't that many. Maybe around 10 out of over 100 listed. Even if there are RMT bots fishing for stuff to sell, I don't see enough people buying it up to be profitable. I can still see a bunch of little lala's in lvl 1 gear around camps all with names like "l;kajsdfhajk akjdlkjadlk" doing leves repeatedly.


That's why I said "used to," I imagine Fishing is expected to be able to provide crystals directly now, just like mining and botany.
#15 Jun 26 2013 at 10:41 PM Rating: Decent
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I loved fishing in FFXI, am a little upset that it sounds like fishing might not be as lucrative or worthwhile doing as the other crafts/gathering. I was very upset before I got into beta. The gathering that I've been able to do so far seems like it will be perfect for me to take over as my relaxing activity, but with the added bonus that you also progress as you're doing it and making money/materials for crafting.

Fishing in the clouds, though? At least we'd be able to tout that as a UNIQUE feature of FFXIV right?!?! Smiley: sly
#16 Jun 27 2013 at 12:27 AM Rating: Good
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I'm disappointed that fishing will not have its own minigame, but if they can make it interesting in other ways like having specific fish come only from hard to reach, or off the path interesting areas, I'll be more excited. Even if the rewards will be more for personal achievements and fluff than actual ingredients to affect the economy, making it interesting in terms of location could be cool.

It'd be fun to go to unusual areas and fish and actually get new stuff. Go deep into a dungeon and start fishing while someone is AFK and fish out something cool and unexpected that you can't get anywhere else. Catch unique fish to put in your house as trophies.
#17 Jun 27 2013 at 12:32 AM Rating: Good
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Teneleven wrote:
I realize that some people think his ideas are a little strange, like fishing for fun only. But, on the other hand, GOODBYE RMT fish bots!
He's really going all out to minimize RMT in this game and i'm not sad about that at all.


If anyone thinks this is even going to put a dent in the bot industry they're just wrong...

Botters make a living off this... If they take away fishing they'll just move to the next thing.
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#18 Jun 27 2013 at 3:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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Parathyroid wrote:
Teneleven wrote:
I realize that some people think his ideas are a little strange, like fishing for fun only. But, on the other hand, GOODBYE RMT fish bots!
He's really going all out to minimize RMT in this game and i'm not sad about that at all.


If anyone thinks this is even going to put a dent in the bot industry they're just wrong...

Botters make a living off this... If they take away fishing they'll just move to the next thing.


From what i have seen so far, there isn't much for RMT to do in ARR. They won't be able to powerlevel, theres no gil to be made in gathering/fishing (you can buy crafting ingredients from vendor), there are no NM's to monopolize.
Will this completely stop RMT? Probably not. I never said that anyway. Will it minimize RMT in our game(put a dent in it)? Yes.
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#19 Jun 27 2013 at 6:01 AM Rating: Excellent
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Teneleven wrote:

From what i have seen so far, there isn't much for RMT to do in ARR. They won't be able to powerlevel, theres no gil to be made in gathering/fishing (you can buy crafting ingredients from vendor), there are no NM's to monopolize.
Will this completely stop RMT? Probably not. I never said that anyway. Will it minimize RMT in our game(put a dent in it)? Yes.


To remove RMT they would need to make a game that only uses tokens to get items and have zero economy. Your kinda wrong on the gathering mkaing no money. You need items gathered once you get high enough in DoH classes. Plus everyone will need crystals and there will be a market for them. Cooks need fire crystals but there from Mining and thats a normal trend for this game that the gathering prof for the DOH wont give the correct crystals .

Also with the cross Doh items some people will either have the option to lvl that said class or buy the item they need form the market. RMT could just farm crystals all day and make money. So I dont see why they killed fishing I always loved to fish in games but im not a achevment person so If thats all fishing does than no thanks.
#20 Jun 27 2013 at 6:05 AM Rating: Excellent
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Teneleven wrote:
Parathyroid wrote:
Teneleven wrote:
I realize that some people think his ideas are a little strange, like fishing for fun only. But, on the other hand, GOODBYE RMT fish bots!
He's really going all out to minimize RMT in this game and i'm not sad about that at all.


If anyone thinks this is even going to put a dent in the bot industry they're just wrong...

Botters make a living off this... If they take away fishing they'll just move to the next thing.


From what i have seen so far, there isn't much for RMT to do in ARR. They won't be able to powerlevel, theres no gil to be made in gathering/fishing (you can buy crafting ingredients from vendor), there are no NM's to monopolize.
Will this completely stop RMT? Probably not. I never said that anyway. Will it minimize RMT in our game(put a dent in it)? Yes.


I'm fairly certain the ability to buy ALL crafting ingredients from the vendor is a beta thing. Even if they allow it at launch, I'm guessing it will be too expensive and people will turn to the markets to get their stuff.
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#21 Jun 27 2013 at 8:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Teneleven wrote:
Parathyroid wrote:
Teneleven wrote:
I realize that some people think his ideas are a little strange, like fishing for fun only. But, on the other hand, GOODBYE RMT fish bots!
He's really going all out to minimize RMT in this game and i'm not sad about that at all.


If anyone thinks this is even going to put a dent in the bot industry they're just wrong...

Botters make a living off this... If they take away fishing they'll just move to the next thing.


From what i have seen so far, there isn't much for RMT to do in ARR. They won't be able to powerlevel, theres no gil to be made in gathering/fishing (you can buy crafting ingredients from vendor), there are no NM's to monopolize.
Will this completely stop RMT? Probably not. I never said that anyway. Will it minimize RMT in our game(put a dent in it)? Yes.



I agree there are actions you can take to help put a damper in RMT, which they are undoubtedly taking. But does largely singling out one particular craft help with this issue in the grand scheme of problem? I would venture to say no, and if it does, it's going to be a marginal solution at best.

What's hilarious and ironic about this WHOLLLEEE situation for me personally, is that every piece of content is made to make everyone more equal to help eradicate the imbalances of MMOs... yet the ONE job I really care about gets nerfed because Yoshi says he doesn't want ever job to be the same... Lol (I rarely use this saying but...) F..... M..... L..... Smiley: lol

Ohhh well no use crying over spilt milk until it's actually fallen off the counter I suppose!

Edit:

Here's a thought for fishing... Make it so that catching awesome fish can give you direct access to awesome gear like LuShangs or even battle gear (after earning that is)... The catch? Make it Rare/Ex. Keeps fishing useful and worth doing... TOTALLY eliminates RMT in the fishing portion of the game.

I offer this solution because the only alternative at this point seems to be that fishing is going in the direction of being a casual event with little reward besides personal gain. People throw the word "relaxing" around so much with fishing that I believe SE has interpreted this too literally. No one will find it relaxing if there is minimal gain to be had from it.



Edited, Jun 27th 2013 10:51am by Parathyroid
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#22 Jun 27 2013 at 8:51 AM Rating: Decent
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Speaking of RMT, will the gathering system be exploitable by RMT bots? I was thinking about this as I was trying out Botany last weekend.
#23 Jun 27 2013 at 9:18 AM Rating: Decent
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I'm not sure about the Cloud comment but I do like the Quicksand idea...thinking outside the box. You could use some kind of insect bait and fish up an Antlion or Sand Crab...and if you get too close you should fall in and lose your bait!
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#24 Jun 27 2013 at 9:18 AM Rating: Good
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Whether or not this idea turns out to be as fun as intended remains to be seen; however, I think that they are doing a good thing by trying something different to add some variety to the game. Maybe it will be popular, maybe it won't, at least they are trying to make ARR stand out and be a more enjoyable experience. They can always patch fishing to what we're all used to if this doesn't work out. I haven't seen any reason to believe that the ARR team is going to implement a fishing system that sucks, though.
#25 Jun 27 2013 at 9:22 AM Rating: Decent
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schneiderw wrote:
Whether or not this idea turns out to be as fun as intended remains to be seen; however, I think that they are doing a good thing by trying something different to add some variety to the game. Maybe it will be popular, maybe it won't, at least they are trying to make ARR stand out and be a more enjoyable experience. They can always patch fishing to what we're all used to if this doesn't work out. I haven't seen any reason to believe that the ARR team is going to implement a fishing system that sucks, though.


I'm sure the system won't suck... but in any MMO (or any endeavor of any kind) the benefit must equal the cost. If we are to spend time doing something, there must be a reward. If the reward is "catching my biggest fish I've ever caught," I'd rather go down to the pond in real life... If it's getting new gear and other in game items, then sure it will be great.
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#26 Jun 27 2013 at 9:23 AM Rating: Decent
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Aerias wrote:
I'm not sure about the Cloud comment but I do like the Quicksand idea...thinking outside the box. You could use some kind of insect bait and fish up an Antlion or Sand Crab...and if you get too close you should fall in and lose your bait!


The XIV team need not look to far to find out how to implement sand sea creatures... Nam-Yensa anyone?

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Yensa?file=Yensa.jpg

Edited, Jun 27th 2013 11:24am by Parathyroid
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