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#1 Jul 14 2013 at 6:33 PM Rating: Decent
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Frontline is the name of a feature not currently in the game where faction vs faction conflict will take place in a persistent 24/7 world.This is separate from the arena pvp area which is expected to be in a launch.The game director is an avid DAOC player.He has stated he hopes to introduce it 6 month post launch.I wanted to create a thread where we could add information as it becomes available.
#2 Jul 18 2013 at 9:57 AM Rating: Decent
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Here is a small piece I lifted from another site that quotes from a recient directors letter.I copied the part about the FRONTLINE feature....

"Fans then asked about the "Frontline" PVP system (large scale PVP). They wanted to know if Frontline battles would be available at launch. Yoshida noted that they were planning to implement this system in patch 2.2 or 2.3 (FF:ARR will begin at 2.0). He also noted that crafters will have a place in PVP as well (somehow).
Read more at http://www.warcry.com/news/view/124889-Final-Fantasy-14-Letter-Live-at-E3-Details-PVP-and-More#DazO16KXvKO7ycQ5.99 "
#3 Jul 18 2013 at 10:36 AM Rating: Decent
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Crafters will probably just be frontline repairs, or PvP gear.
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#4 Jul 18 2013 at 11:57 AM Rating: Good
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FlixEffect wrote:
Crafters will probably just be frontline repairs, or PvP gear.


Are we going to need a seperate set of gear for PvP?

I hated that about DCUO.
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#5 Jul 18 2013 at 12:07 PM Rating: Excellent
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Hairspray wrote:
FlixEffect wrote:
Crafters will probably just be frontline repairs, or PvP gear.


Are we going to need a seperate set of gear for PvP?

I hated that about DCUO.


And WoW.

But at least in WoW there was some carry over. At least there the higher level PvP gear allowed you to get into some of the raids a bit easier. If there is separate gearing for PvP and PvE, I hope there's a large amount of overlap.

EDIT:

Quote:
Crafters will probably just be frontline repairs, or PvP gear.


What about this:

"You two crafters! Craft a broom! Last one to complete DIES! Ready . . . go!"

That would work for crafting PvP eh? FUN!


Edited, Jul 18th 2013 2:09pm by Yotis
#6 Jul 18 2013 at 12:13 PM Rating: Decent
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Hairspray wrote:
FlixEffect wrote:
Crafters will probably just be frontline repairs, or PvP gear.


Are we going to need a seperate set of gear for PvP?

I hated that about DCUO.


I'm pretty sure I remember on the Character tab the very last bottom stat on the window being PvP related.
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#7 Jul 18 2013 at 12:27 PM Rating: Good
I just don't want to see PVP ruin the game cause lets face it, FF series has never really about PVP. How many games have come in with great potential only to be destroyed by trying to balance out the PVP. Blm should do tons of damage and a tank should tank. Not a PLD doing as much damage with shield block as a blm casting meteor. They need to take the official forums and add a whole separate area that can be easily ignored for the PVP complainers that will not be happy if the class they want to play isn't at the top DPS. If they start to focus on PVP more than the PVE side this game will not succeed.

They really need to do a good job at separating the PVP and PVE, it almost needs to be a complete rework of your skills and balance of the classes when you zone into the PVP area only so it doesn't affect PVE at all.
#8 Jul 18 2013 at 12:36 PM Rating: Good
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sweetsurrender wrote:
I just don't want to see PVP ruin the game cause lets face it, FF series has never really about PVP. How many games have come in with great potential only to be destroyed by trying to balance out the PVP. Blm should do tons of damage and a tank should tank. Not a PLD doing as much damage with shield block as a blm casting meteor. They need to take the official forums and add a whole separate area that can be easily ignored for the PVP complainers that will not be happy if the class they want to play isn't at the top DPS. If they start to focus on PVP more than the PVE side this game will not succeed.

They really need to do a good job at separating the PVP and PVE, it almost needs to be a complete rework of your skills and balance of the classes when you zone into the PVP area only so it doesn't affect PVE at all.


That's pretty much the plan. PvP will have completely separate abilities from PvE, and will take place outside the scope of PvE (as in, no ganking, no open-world PvP, no PvP servers). And yes, there will also be completely separate gear. I made a thread a few weeks ago with a compilation of all the PvP info, here ya go.
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#9 Jul 18 2013 at 12:39 PM Rating: Decent
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FlixEffect wrote:


I'm pretty sure I remember on the Character tab the very last bottom stat on the window being PvP related.


I dont see anything
http://i.imgur.com/noACTNs.png
#10 Jul 18 2013 at 12:46 PM Rating: Good
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It's not in that screenshot, but it was in game. There was another category in the bottom right with a PvP stat. I can't remember the name of it, but I distinctly remember seeing it... Resilience maybe?
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#11 Jul 18 2013 at 12:55 PM Rating: Decent
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BartelX wrote:
It's not in that screenshot, but it was in game. There was another category in the bottom right with a PvP stat. I can't remember the name of it, but I distinctly remember seeing it... Resilience maybe?



His SS is on Botanist, too. So it may only be displayed with DOW/DOM.
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#12 Jul 18 2013 at 1:12 PM Rating: Good
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Yea, it's not called resilience but it serves the same function of being a PvP only stat.
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#13 Jul 18 2013 at 1:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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http://padraigfahy.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/ffxiv_20130630_093620.png


"Morale" under PvP Properties.
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#14 Jul 18 2013 at 2:14 PM Rating: Good
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BartelX wrote:
It's not in that screenshot, but it was in game. There was another category in the bottom right with a PvP stat. I can't remember the name of it, but I distinctly remember seeing it... Resilience maybe?



I believe it was called Morale, it lowers all the damge taken by other players abilities,
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#15 Jul 18 2013 at 2:15 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah, Flix posted a screenshot of it, thank you for the correction. And again, in case anyone wanted more info about PvP (I noticed the link in my last post is not very obvious), here's a thread with more info of what's known:

http://www.zam.com/forum.html?forum=152&mid=1371495667175233321
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#16 Jul 19 2013 at 8:34 AM Rating: Decent
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The director is an avid and long time DAOC player.That may be a clue to the direction of FRONTLINE.
#17 Jul 19 2013 at 9:20 AM Rating: Decent
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Hairspray wrote:
FlixEffect wrote:
Crafters will probably just be frontline repairs, or PvP gear.


Are we going to need a seperate set of gear for PvP?

I hated that about DCUO.


Really? I hear more people talk about how they hated when PvP and PvE wasn't separated. With t separated they won't have to try to balance everything in game they can keep PvE and PvP separate. The other way seems to kill MMOs.
#18 Jul 19 2013 at 10:59 AM Rating: Decent
BartelX wrote:
sweetsurrender wrote:
I just don't want to see PVP ruin the game cause lets face it, FF series has never really about PVP. How many games have come in with great potential only to be destroyed by trying to balance out the PVP. Blm should do tons of damage and a tank should tank. Not a PLD doing as much damage with shield block as a blm casting meteor. They need to take the official forums and add a whole separate area that can be easily ignored for the PVP complainers that will not be happy if the class they want to play isn't at the top DPS. If they start to focus on PVP more than the PVE side this game will not succeed.

They really need to do a good job at separating the PVP and PVE, it almost needs to be a complete rework of your skills and balance of the classes when you zone into the PVP area only so it doesn't affect PVE at all.


That's pretty much the plan. PvP will have completely separate abilities from PvE, and will take place outside the scope of PvE (as in, no ganking, no open-world PvP, no PvP servers). And yes, there will also be completely separate gear. I made a thread a few weeks ago with a compilation of all the PvP info, here ya go.



Thanks for that, i must of missed it. I didn't see blitzball mentioned though =/
#19 Jul 19 2013 at 1:06 PM Rating: Excellent
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PvP gear sucks. I don't know why MMO's create PvP gear. It makes PvP more about who has played long enough to earn the best gear and has more advantages over someone who doesn't. The reason true PvP games like Counter Strike and such last for so long is because everyone's always on a level playing field.

The typical MMO cycle of get to PvP and get dominated for a while cause you have bad gear, then get competitive just seems silly to me. And then it leads to the idea that no one really is a skillful player. "I lost cause that guy has epic gear in every slot, what can I do".
#20 Jul 19 2013 at 1:28 PM Rating: Good
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Arjuncorpse wrote:
PvP gear sucks. I don't know why MMO's create PvP gear. It makes PvP more about who has played long enough to earn the best gear and has more advantages over someone who doesn't. The reason true PvP games like Counter Strike and such last for so long is because everyone's always on a level playing field.

The typical MMO cycle of get to PvP and get dominated for a while cause you have bad gear, then get competitive just seems silly to me. And then it leads to the idea that no one really is a skillful player. "I lost cause that guy has epic gear in every slot, what can I do".


I completely agree with this. It was especially prevalent in swtor, where grinding for your Elite War Hero gear took considerable time, and you would literally get rolled by better geared players simply because they had better gear, not because they were more skilled. Of course, once you finally have all said gear, it became more fun... but even then, destroying someone in recruit gear because you do 40% more damage than them, get healed for 30% more, and have 40% more damage reduction doesn't make you "leet".
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#21 Jul 20 2013 at 8:21 AM Rating: Decent
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I'm responding to the comments about getting beaten by players with better gear....and have a few comments

-no one likes getting bested by another player
-why should a players who works hard to get good equipment not be rewarded by having better things than others who don't spend the effort to get those same things(like in the RW...those that work hard ...educate themselves....just might have a better car/house) what's wrong with that ?
-having factions makes it so you are not alone,but fighting with others in your faction against another factional group.Frontline is not one vs one pvp.
-perhaps we should punish crafters too.These people obviously have also spent too much time in the game compared to some others.Now they are making money others aren't..... completely unbalancing the games economy and creating high quality items others who haven't played as much might not be able to afford.

One of my points.

Like in the RW...I don't want a game world where no one can excel.where no one can have better.where more effort in not rewarded.
and I reject the idea of sameness and mediocrity some are advocating.
#22 Jul 20 2013 at 8:46 AM Rating: Good
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Shadanwolf wrote:
I'm responding to the comments about getting beaten by players with better gear....and have a few comments

-no one likes getting bested by another player
-why should a players who works hard to get good equipment not be rewarded by having better things than others who don't spend the effort to get those same things(like in the RW...those that work hard ...educate themselves....just might have a better car/house) what's wrong with that ?
-having factions makes it so you are not alone,but fighting with others in your faction against another factional group.Frontline is not one vs one pvp.
-perhaps we should punish crafters too.These people obviously have also spent too much time in the game compared to some others.Now they are making money others aren't..... completely unbalancing the games economy and creating high quality items others who haven't played as much might not be able to afford.

One of my points.

Like in the RW...I don't want a game world where no one can excel.where no one can have better.where more effort in not rewarded.
and I reject the idea of sameness and mediocrity some are advocating.


I don't think anyone is advocating sameness and mediocrity, at least I know I'm not. I think there should be some advantage of working hard and pvping a ton. I think the idea of gaining new abilities through pvp is a really great idea and I think having separate pvp gear is acceptable as well. What I don't think is acceptable is how MASSIVE a gap there is between someone starting and someone who's played for a while. I mean come on, an 80% damage difference from a new player to a veteran? That's a bit excessive don't you think?

I'd love to see pvp groups broken down where people who are new get matched up with people who are new, and people with experience get matched up with people with experience, unless you already have a pre-formed group. This way, you would still be able to go up against players much better if you're in a group with other experienced players, but if you are just starting out and trying to learn the ropes you can go against other people in a similar position. Maybe 3 different "ranks" that each have their own queue. If pop times get too long, make it inter-server.
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#23 Jul 20 2013 at 9:05 AM Rating: Decent
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BartelX wrote:
Shadanwolf wrote:
I'm responding to the comments about getting beaten by players with better gear....and have a few comments

-no one likes getting bested by another player
-why should a players who works hard to get good equipment not be rewarded by having better things than others who don't spend the effort to get those same things(like in the RW...those that work hard ...educate themselves....just might have a better car/house) what's wrong with that ?
-having factions makes it so you are not alone,but fighting with others in your faction against another factional group.Frontline is not one vs one pvp.
-perhaps we should punish crafters too.These people obviously have also spent too much time in the game compared to some others.Now they are making money others aren't..... completely unbalancing the games economy and creating high quality items others who haven't played as much might not be able to afford.

One of my points.

Like in the RW...I don't want a game world where no one can excel.where no one can have better.where more effort in not rewarded.
and I reject the idea of sameness and mediocrity some are advocating.


I don't think anyone is advocating sameness and mediocrity, at least I know I'm not. I think there should be some advantage of working hard and pvping a ton. I think the idea of gaining new abilities through pvp is a really great idea and I think having separate pvp gear is acceptable as well. What I don't think is acceptable is how MASSIVE a gap there is between someone starting and someone who's played for a while. I mean come on, an 80% damage difference from a new player to a veteran? That's a bit excessive don't you think?

I'd love to see pvp groups broken down where people who are new get matched up with people who are new, and people with experience get matched up with people with experience, unless you already have a pre-formed group. This way, you would still be able to go up against players much better if you're in a group with other experienced players, but if you are just starting out and trying to learn the ropes you can go against other people in a similar position. Maybe 3 different "ranks" that each have their own queue. If pop times get too long, make it inter-server.

For structured PvP I feel there should absolutely be ranks and group matches with similar ranked matches unless it is a pre-formed group who wants imbalance.

For larger scale unstructured PvP like Frontlines. I feel gear/skill/progress should be open ended with players who put in more work to advance their character are more powerful than beginners. I'ts how PvE works? You don't start the game and demolish the end bosses right out of the gate. It's where the concept of heroes or villains lie. There can be no hero or master villain if everyone is the same power.

There can be only one.
Or two or three or four but not everybody out of the gate!
#24 Jul 20 2013 at 12:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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The reason I'm fine with gear for PvP is because, invariably, your opponents are not scripted, pattern-following bosses. They are intelligent human beings who are going to exploit every obvious weakness you have to beat you.

Just as an off-the-wall example, as a caster maybe it will be rare for a FFXIV mob to cast silence on you so you never bother wearing gear that resists the effect, but that could end up being a number one choice among PvPers to shut down spellcasters. But if, say, there was an immunity-to-silence crown you could wear, you might think to yourself that's worth getting for PvP even though you'd never wear it in PvE.

There are going to be all sorts of tricks like this that will emerge, things you've never thought of before. Gearing up for it is part of the challenge, and part of the skill in and of itself. If you show up as a glass cannon, you're probably going to get smashed. There's no tank to steal the attention away from you this time.
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