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I have decided I don't like the term "Toon."Follow

#1 Aug 30 2013 at 9:04 AM Rating: Excellent
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I understand where its coming from and why people use it but come on, in what aspect do you consider the FFXIV PC a "toon?"

I guess Ill get flamed and, no, this is not trolling. I just wanted to state my opinion. "Toon" seems really out of place in this game. I will probably never outwardly express my opinion on the matter again but I felt I should do it now because I got a little irritated reading "toon" over and over again.

Feel free to use it all you want and feel free to flame me all you want. I just needed to vent and what better place to do it than the internet while I'm at work.

/rantoff
/em has added "Toon" to her list of excepted character terms


#2 Aug 30 2013 at 9:12 AM Rating: Good
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So player character is a better and more appropriate term to use than toon? Does the term toon have some other meaning or connotation to you that makes it inappropriate for how people use it in-game?
#3 Aug 30 2013 at 9:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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I never liked the term, it doesn't convey a sense of power. It sounds like my character is a duck that beats people with oversized sledgehammers.
#4 Aug 30 2013 at 9:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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We've got a lot of WoW veterans coming in and I think the only way we can get folks to use the correct term "character" is by correcting them. One . By. One.

"Char" is the same length as toon so it's not like you have to type more letters or anything. Smiley: disappointed
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#5 Aug 30 2013 at 9:14 AM Rating: Excellent
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100% Agree.
#6 Aug 30 2013 at 9:15 AM Rating: Excellent
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Catwho wrote:
We've got a lot of WoW veterans coming in and I think the only way we can get folks to use the correct term "character" is by correcting them. One . By. One.
Avatar. Your player character is your avatar.
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#7 Aug 30 2013 at 9:17 AM Rating: Good
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WFOAssassin wrote:
I understand where its coming from and why people use it but come on, in what aspect do you consider the FFXIV PC a "toon?"

Everyone recognizes that these words are interchangeable by now, yet for some people it's still an issue. I don't get it. It's a 'toon' because 'toon' is short for cartoon and videogames generally look like animated cartoons. If someone who had never heard of FFXIV before looked at the trailer for this game, they'd probably assume it was anime.

I have several cousins in my family ranging from elementary school to just started high school age. When they saw me playing XIV years ago, they literally asked what cartoon I was watching before I explained to them that it was a video game. They don't really make the distinction between the two(video games and cartoons) other than the fact that one is interactive.

You can't honestly tell me that you wouldn't look at a baby behemoth and say it's not cartoonish. These aren't flames, but I think you're already well aware why the term is used Smiley: tongue


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cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#8 Aug 30 2013 at 9:17 AM Rating: Decent
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I will use the term toon even though I never played wow. Why? Because its easiest to type.
#9 Aug 30 2013 at 9:19 AM Rating: Good
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Westyle wrote:
I never liked the term, it doesn't convey a sense of power. It sounds like my character is a duck that beats people with oversized sledgehammers.


Because that's a far stretch from cat women with pointy ears and long fuzzy tails shooting fire out of their fingertips... amirite? Smiley: rolleyes
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cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#10 Aug 30 2013 at 9:19 AM Rating: Good
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Catwho wrote:
We've got a lot of WoW veterans coming in and I think the only way we can get folks to use the correct term "character" is by correcting them. One . By. One.

"Char" is the same length as toon so it's not like you have to type more letters or anything. Smiley: disappointed


That, and getting people to start being civil to each other, including things like passing on items you don't need in dungeons, tossing someone in trouble a much needed heal, and giving mixed lingual parties a shot.
#11 Aug 30 2013 at 9:20 AM Rating: Good
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lolgaxe wrote:
Catwho wrote:
We've got a lot of WoW veterans coming in and I think the only way we can get folks to use the correct term "character" is by correcting them. One . By. One.
Avatar. Your player character is your avatar.


In XI, "avatar" had a very specific term which is why character was used instead.

But yes, avatar is the generally accepted usage of your projection into a virtual reality world.

If you guys haven't done so already go read Neal Stephenson's Snow Crash. It's very awesome.
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#12 Aug 30 2013 at 9:21 AM Rating: Good
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Always liked "Avi" myself.
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#13 Aug 30 2013 at 9:21 AM Rating: Excellent
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Toon also predates WoW. Some of he people using that term will have been doing it for a long time. Best to just deal with it - a leopard can't change his shorts, after all.
#14 Aug 30 2013 at 9:23 AM Rating: Good
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I don't like it either. I don't mind most terms crossing over, but toon just sounds weird for me.
#15 Aug 30 2013 at 9:24 AM Rating: Good
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
Westyle wrote:
I never liked the term, it doesn't convey a sense of power. It sounds like my character is a duck that beats people with oversized sledgehammers.


Because that's a far stretch from cat women with pointy ears and long fuzzy tails shooting fire out of their fingertips... amirite? Smiley: rolleyes

Design-wise, yes. It would feel very odd to refer to a Marvel, DC, or anime character as a toon.
#16 Aug 30 2013 at 9:27 AM Rating: Excellent
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I never liked the term "toon" either. At least not in the FF-MMO series.

XI and XIV never felt very "Cartoony" to me, and that's what I end up thinking everytime someone says "toon."
#17 Aug 30 2013 at 9:28 AM Rating: Good
I've yet to understand why so many in the Final Fantasy community, hate the term toon so much.
Even more so in today's world.
It is like me calling my toys, toys and not calling them Action Figures (or if peopled called them Boy Dolls..not heard that in a long time, but I have).
Toon, character, avatar...they all the same thing.

Edited, Aug 30th 2013 10:28am by Sandinmygum
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#18 Aug 30 2013 at 9:30 AM Rating: Good
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You could just as easily refer to them as your character or avatar, its how everyone on XI refers to them really. "BRB, switching my char" or "Changing to my other char" "What job you need? Hmm.. I'll swap to my mage char". It does not sound silly like "Toon". Does your character really look like a cartoon character so much you refer them as "toons?" Maybe for WoW and its clones, but we all feel really attached to our chars on XI and refer to them as chars or by name anyways.

Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
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#19 Aug 30 2013 at 9:36 AM Rating: Good
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I do not refer to my character, or the characters of others, as "toons." I personally don't like it, but I don't let it bother me when others use the term. It's a cultural thing, and there's no more reason to get mad over it than a regional accent IRL.

Also mad props for the Snow Crash reference. One of my favorite books. ^_^
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#20 Aug 30 2013 at 9:36 AM Rating: Excellent
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WFOAssassin wrote:
I understand where its coming from and why people use it but come on, in what aspect do you consider the FFXIV PC a "toon?"

I guess Ill get flamed and, no, this is not trolling. I just wanted to state my opinion. "Toon" seems really out of place in this game. I will probably never outwardly express my opinion on the matter again but I felt I should do it now because I got a little irritated reading "toon" over and over again.

Feel free to use it all you want and feel free to flame me all you want. I just needed to vent and what better place to do it than the internet while I'm at work.

/rantoff
/em has added "Toon" to her list of excepted character terms




I notice the British and Australian folks using the term frequently. When I hear "toon" I think Roger Rabbit.

Edited, Aug 30th 2013 10:37am by Valkayree
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#21 Aug 30 2013 at 9:39 AM Rating: Good
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Valkayree wrote:

I notice the British and Australian folks using the term frequently. When I hear "toon" I think Roger Rabbit.


I have the exact same reaction.
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#22 Aug 30 2013 at 9:40 AM Rating: Good
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Actually it has nothing to do with wow.

There is FFXI lingo, and there is every other mmo

FFXI said DD
All other mmo i have played call them DPS

Toon, Character, etc

The only people i find with an issue to either or any of these are final fantasy players. Like it or not, your avatar/character/toon are in fact that, a digital representation. There is no power, and it really is no different than a CG duck, heck some of them are already CG cat people, and you want to say the term toon isn't acurate when you have a cos-play cat runing around?
#23 Aug 30 2013 at 9:41 AM Rating: Good
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cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.


This **** is going in my sig on pure ludicrilousness. Yes, I made that word up to describe just how ludicrous and ridiculous this sounds to me.

Allow me to educate you...

If someone says the word 'toon' and you know exactly what they're talking about, the word serves it's purpose. It's widely accepted and it's easier to say and type than character or avatar. ****, it's even easier to type than 'char'. So then, how do we 1 up all the little WoW kiddies now? Smiley: glare
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cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#24 Aug 30 2013 at 9:43 AM Rating: Decent
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DPS is a reasonable way to think of things if status effects aren't in play.

If status effects are significant, and you aren't under a time crunch, there are other considerations at play that can trump it.
#25 Aug 30 2013 at 9:45 AM Rating: Excellent
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dustinfoley wrote:

FFXI said DD
All other mmo i have played call them DPS


DD = Damage Dealer
DPS = Damage per Second
"Hold on guys, I need to switch to my damage per second".
"Wait, the damage per second is not dealing enough damage, we need a new damage per second!"
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#26 Aug 30 2013 at 9:45 AM Rating: Excellent
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I guess I'm not one of the cool kids cuz I just call him "my guy" lol
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#27 Aug 30 2013 at 9:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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Veagan wrote:
I guess I'm not one of the cool kids cuz I just call him "my guy" lol


I call my character "dude".
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#28 Aug 30 2013 at 9:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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Valkayree wrote:
dustinfoley wrote:

FFXI said DD
All other mmo i have played call them DPS


DD = Damage Dealer
DPS = Damage per Second
"Hold on guys, I need to switch to my damage per second".
"Wait, the damage per second is not dealing enough damage, we need a new damage per second!"



How do I increase the Damage Per Second on my Damage Per Second?
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#29 Aug 30 2013 at 9:47 AM Rating: Good
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Yeah i use charcter, because how the game looks, if it looked like a cartoon id call it a toon, just like i dont call anime a cartoon.
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#30 Aug 30 2013 at 9:49 AM Rating: Good
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Woohoo! I've made it as someone's siggy! Smiley: grin
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#31 Aug 30 2013 at 9:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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cocodojo wrote:
Woohoo! I've made it as someone's siggy! Smiley: grin


Right... but it was sort of like the wall of shame though...
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#32 Aug 30 2013 at 9:52 AM Rating: Good
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IMFW wrote:
Yeah i use charcter, because how the game looks, if it looked like a cartoon id call it a toon, just like i dont call anime a cartoon.


Anime is jut a cartoon from Japan. If you look at the early stuff you can clearly see the Disney influences too. Just because you don't like a word doesn't really mean much if it is still correct. Even if a game doesn't look cartoony, toon is still an understood way of referring to a character.
#33 Aug 30 2013 at 9:53 AM Rating: Excellent
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Who cares lol, If I didn't post something worthy of being a siggy, how will my Taru ever feel?
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#34 Aug 30 2013 at 9:57 AM Rating: Excellent
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Sigue wrote:
IMFW wrote:
Yeah i use charcter, because how the game looks, if it looked like a cartoon id call it a toon, just like i dont call anime a cartoon.


Anime is jut a cartoon from Japan. If you look at the early stuff you can clearly see the Disney influences too. Just because you don't like a word doesn't really mean much if it is still correct. Even if a game doesn't look cartoony, toon is still an understood way of referring to a character.



Thats cool, people can still use toon, no skin off my back, i just like useing charcter.
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#35 Aug 30 2013 at 10:07 AM Rating: Good
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This post is sooooo Pauli exclusion principle ;) If ya catch my drift...
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#36 Aug 30 2013 at 10:19 AM Rating: Good
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DPS is used in FFXI, just not as a synecdoche as it is in other games. I suspect this has to do with the speccing system used in other games, where a particular character can only have on set of specs set on it, so you spec it out for maximum DPS and just call it that from then on. As in, "my DPS guy." Then it's shortened to "my DPS" because everyone knows what you're talking about.
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#37 Aug 30 2013 at 10:21 AM Rating: Excellent
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Could always be worse. People could be saying 'Pixels'

/em shudders
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#38 Aug 30 2013 at 10:25 AM Rating: Excellent
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Ouch... "pixels", yes, that's much worse!

Mah pixels brings all the mobs to the yard... yep... that just doesn't sound right at ALL

Edited, Aug 30th 2013 12:26pm by cocodojo
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#39 Aug 30 2013 at 10:27 AM Rating: Excellent
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cocodojo wrote:
Ouch... "pixels", yes, that's much worse!

Mah pixels brings all the mobs to the yard... yep... that just doesn't sound right at ALL

Edited, Aug 30th 2013 12:26pm by cocodojo


Is it bad that I might now want to macro that? Smiley: laugh
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#40 Aug 30 2013 at 10:31 AM Rating: Good
Catwho wrote:
DPS is used in FFXI, just not as a synecdoche as it is in other games. I suspect this has to do with the speccing system used in other games, where a particular character can only have on set of specs set on it, so you spec it out for maximum DPS and just call it that from then on. As in, "my DPS guy." Then it's shortened to "my DPS" because everyone knows what you're talking about.


This is true to WoW.
When each Class as multiple specs, DPS just became the short hand for Damage, or Damage Dealer (I think it is labeled as Damage, too lazy to log in and look). It was the evolution of terms already out in the MMO/Mud world.

Heck it goes for Tank as well..
Tank? I've never outside of talking about a Game used Tank as the way we use it.
"Oh hey, I'm a tank"
*Person not knowing what you just said, pictures your face on the outside of a tank*
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#41 Aug 30 2013 at 10:37 AM Rating: Excellent
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Personally I use char but I don't care what anyone else says. Toon, to me, sounds like yet another disposable wow alt. In XI and XIV, I feel much more attached to my one character.
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#42 Aug 30 2013 at 10:38 AM Rating: Good
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Sandinmygum the Stupendous wrote:
Catwho wrote:
DPS is used in FFXI, just not as a synecdoche as it is in other games. I suspect this has to do with the speccing system used in other games, where a particular character can only have on set of specs set on it, so you spec it out for maximum DPS and just call it that from then on. As in, "my DPS guy." Then it's shortened to "my DPS" because everyone knows what you're talking about.


This is true to WoW.
When each Class as multiple specs, DPS just became the short hand for Damage, or Damage Dealer (I think it is labeled as Damage, too lazy to log in and look). It was the evolution of terms already out in the MMO/Mud world.

Heck it goes for Tank as well..
Tank? I've never outside of talking about a Game used Tank as the way we use it.
"Oh hey, I'm a tank"
*Person not knowing what you just said, pictures your face on the outside of a tank*



Tank, I believe has had the least evolution in terminology (along with healer). I understood the term Tank by the second day my Delf SK graced the landscape of EQ. I think Tank has always been, well... Tank.

PS there's "Meat Shield" but I've always considered that more of a loving nic-name rather than a true definition of the class.

Edited, Aug 30th 2013 12:40pm by ShindaUsagi

Edited, Aug 30th 2013 12:45pm by ShindaUsagi
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#43 Aug 30 2013 at 10:40 AM Rating: Good
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If you have a subjective opinion about something, then by all means treat others as if their subjective opinion is objectively wrong. I'm sure that they will immediately adjust their habits to suit your tastes, and they will in no way react with hostility or resistance Treating your preference as if it is something you can "correct" in others is definitely a smart way of thinking about the issue.
#44 Aug 30 2013 at 10:42 AM Rating: Good
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Catwho wrote:
DPS is used in FFXI, just not as a synecdoche as it is in other games. I suspect this has to do with the speccing system used in other games, where a particular character can only have on set of specs set on it, so you spec it out for maximum DPS and just call it that from then on. As in, "my DPS guy." Then it's shortened to "my DPS" because everyone knows what you're talking about.


Yes, but I thought using an adjective in the place of a noun was funny when you remove the acronym and spell out the words. By the way, I looked for you in game yesterday a few times to give you a FC invite and musit said you were not online. Maybe I just missed, I ran a bunch of dungeons yesterday so I wasn't looking around constantly...

Edited, Aug 30th 2013 11:42am by Valkayree
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#45 Aug 30 2013 at 10:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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KarlHungis wrote:
If you have a subjective opinion about something, then by all means treat others as if their subjective opinion is objectively wrong. I'm sure that they will immediately adjust their habits to suit your tastes, and they will in no way react with hostility or resistance Treating your preference as if it is something you can "correct" in others is definitely a smart way of thinking about the issue.


Tell that to FOX news in a Stephen Colbert tone of voice Smiley: schooled

Edited, Aug 30th 2013 11:43am by Valkayree
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#46 Aug 30 2013 at 10:44 AM Rating: Good
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Valkayree wrote:
dustinfoley wrote:

FFXI said DD
All other mmo i have played call them DPS


DD = Damage Dealer
DPS = Damage per Second
"Hold on guys, I need to switch to my damage per second".
"Wait, the damage per second is not dealing enough damage, we need a new damage per second!"



DD = direct damage
DPS = damage per secon
DOT = Damage over time

These were the eq terms that came from pretty much the grand daddy of all MMO today.
#47 Aug 30 2013 at 10:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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dustinfoley wrote:
Valkayree wrote:
dustinfoley wrote:

FFXI said DD
All other mmo i have played call them DPS


DD = Damage Dealer
DPS = Damage per Second
"Hold on guys, I need to switch to my damage per second".
"Wait, the damage per second is not dealing enough damage, we need a new damage per second!"



DD = direct damage
DPS = damage per secon
DOT = Damage over time

These were the eq terms that came from pretty much the grand daddy of all MMO today.


Before EQ was Gemstone. That is the great grand daddy. "Listen Kiddies, there was once a time where our MMOs didnt have pictures!"
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#48 Aug 30 2013 at 10:48 AM Rating: Good
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I also prefer DeeDee and {Meat}{Shield} but that is always weird to use in other games Smiley: lol
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#49 Aug 30 2013 at 10:48 AM Rating: Good
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I've only played XI and XIV and I never consider these "chars" as "toons". And that will never change.
#50 Aug 30 2013 at 10:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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Valkayree wrote:
KarlHungis wrote:
If you have a subjective opinion about something, then by all means treat others as if their subjective opinion is objectively wrong. I'm sure that they will immediately adjust their habits to suit your tastes, and they will in no way react with hostility or resistance Treating your preference as if it is something you can "correct" in others is definitely a smart way of thinking about the issue.


Tell that to FOX news in a Stephen Colbert tone of voice Smiley: schooled

Edited, Aug 30th 2013 11:43am by Valkayree


I always use a Stephen Colbert tone of voice. And when I talk to my cat, I refer to her as "Nation" even though her name is Luna.

"Nation, I don't want you attacking my feet while I am sleeping... which brings us to tonight's word: 'Garden Hose' ."
#51 Aug 30 2013 at 10:49 AM Rating: Good
Valkayree wrote:
dustinfoley wrote:
Valkayree wrote:
dustinfoley wrote:

FFXI said DD
All other mmo i have played call them DPS


DD = Damage Dealer
DPS = Damage per Second
"Hold on guys, I need to switch to my damage per second".
"Wait, the damage per second is not dealing enough damage, we need a new damage per second!"



DD = direct damage
DPS = damage per secon
DOT = Damage over time

These were the eq terms that came from pretty much the grand daddy of all MMO today.


Before EQ was Gemstone. That is the great grand daddy. "Listen Kiddies, there was once a time where our MMOs didnt have pictures!"


So you are telling me between D&D table top to MUDs, terms changed? I never got into D&D, but friends who did used terms that seem to have been passed up the line of Fantasy/Sci-fi group games.
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