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Does EXP/leveling need rebalancing?Follow

#27 Sep 11 2013 at 6:36 PM Rating: Good
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FattyJones wrote:
Honestly I would like to have seen a more party based leveling system, nothing as brutal as ffxi but I think the game is going to suffer because it's just easy. seriously, the game has been out for less than two weeks. Most people have a max lvl character or close to it already. The game feels like it could be single player, I kinda of enjoy the social aspect of MMO games but ffxiv seems to be severely lacking in it. I have to wonder how long this game will keep my interest.

Edited, Sep 11th 2013 8:27pm by FattyJones


There's a misconception that I blame FFXI entirely for.

Leveling is not the whole game.

Seriously, reaching level 50 is not the end of the game; in many ways it's the beginning.

As for having level 50 players already? Day 1, legacy players.. multiple level 50 jobs with relics.. these guys exist.
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#28 Sep 11 2013 at 6:39 PM Rating: Decent
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I'm sure there's some hard fights in the end but my goal isn't usually getting to max lvl and having the best gear right away. I like the challenge of working towards it, ffxiv basically hands it to you. It's the fact that just being able to rush to max lvl kills some aspects off MMO games that I and I'm sure others enjoy.

I really do enjoy the game and think it's fun, I just would have like a little more challenge early on and more of a sense of community. I'm really not trying to say anything negative as I really do enjoy the game.

Edited, Sep 11th 2013 8:45pm by FattyJones
#29 Sep 11 2013 at 6:53 PM Rating: Decent
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Heres the way I see it. I don't like fate farming as a way to progress. I do fate farm, for seals more than anything.

I like that they are there and they are popular however. Why? It makes the world feel so alive to see a giant train of players heading in a direction. Its nice to see all those people at the quest hubs between fates. It creates a buzz in the area...it creates community interaction.

If you gave me the reigns of the game I would keep them as is, double the time it takes to level from 30-50, and add some open world 8 man dungeons for group farming as an alternative to fate grinding..have a seal or two drop from the mobs in that dungeon and make them take at least 2 minuets to down each. I want people seeking an archer or mage to pull, I want there to be a tank healer and party healer, diverse dps ect.

I know im in the minority but the best part of older mmorpgs was getting together with a bunch of people and leveling up. Fates are kind of like that...they just need an alternative, such as open world dungeon parties.

Lets be honest, what else are you going to do after you level you main to endgame and want another class up to 50? Fate and...fate? I feel leves are best saved for crafting and gathering.

I hope they don't nerf fates though...they do wonders for community and add to the game. Nerf it and watch them become a pain as a giant boss stands in your quest area for 15min before he despawns.
#30 Sep 11 2013 at 6:53 PM Rating: Decent
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hanibalz wrote:
Nerf the fates or like the above poster said, reduce spawn times so they are equal with everything else, this game is so new there shouldn't even be a level 50 yet.


I agree entirely.

People say leveling is too slow without quests... geez, I was able to grind to ~13 in a few hours just making use of the hunting log, and that was before I had the massive boost from leveling a second class.

And this:

Strangerous wrote:
If you gave me the reigns of the game I would keep them as is, double the time it takes to level from 30-50, and add some open world 8 man dungeons for group farming as an alternative to fate grinding..have a seal or two drop from the mobs in that dungeon and make them take at least 2 minuets to down each. I want people seeking an archer or mage to pull, I want there to be a tank healer and party healer, diverse dps ect.


Well this post just wins the day, as far as I'm concerned. :)


Edited, Sep 11th 2013 8:55pm by KaneKitty
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#31 Sep 11 2013 at 7:00 PM Rating: Good
TwistedOwl wrote:
It's decent XP in dungeons plus the chance for great gear drops. I wouldn't think one who enjoys running dungeons would need more incentive than that.


If you happen to like a damage dealing job then you can do a lot of fates and get a lot of XP in the time it took you to wait 40 - 50 minutes in the Duty Finder. Unfortunately you can't wait in the DF queue while you are in a party or it would be the best of both worlds.
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#32 Sep 11 2013 at 7:00 PM Rating: Default
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Buffylvr wrote:
FattyJones wrote:
Honestly I would like to have seen a more party based leveling system, nothing as brutal as ffxi but I think the game is going to suffer because it's just easy. seriously, the game has been out for less than two weeks. Most people have a max lvl character or close to it already. The game feels like it could be single player, I kinda of enjoy the social aspect of MMO games but ffxiv seems to be severely lacking in it. I have to wonder how long this game will keep my interest.

Edited, Sep 11th 2013 8:27pm by FattyJones


I invite you to play some endgame dungeons and then re-examine this question.

As far as I'm aware only one group has entered level 2 of Bahamut's Coil 100 levels (This statement is based on only a partial understanding of how the coil works - I thought I heard a thing that it had 100 levels. I know the BG group got to level 2. That's all I got).

Yoshi said in an interview they made it so hard that "you'll be crying at the end".


It seems those two groups have already got to Bahamut Coil 5 (out of 5, not 100. That's 2.xx patch, not even 2.1).
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#33 Sep 11 2013 at 7:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Gotta love all of the people who proclaim Tanaka FFXI 2003/FFXIV 1.0 style changes.

"Yeah, like let's totally make it take longer to level and instead of making more methods viable let's just take the easier route and make the most popular one worse than every other option. Because players absolutely hate having options!"

Yeah, we already did that. Guess how it worked out. Complain to get the other methods up to snuff like a dungeon bonus chain, or various other methods. Crying to get FATEs nerfed says nothing more than "I'm a whiney child that doesn't like doing something so therefore change it so NO ONE should be able to enjoy doing that thing."

Edited, Sep 11th 2013 9:06pm by Viertel
#34 Sep 11 2013 at 8:19 PM Rating: Decent
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nonameoflevi wrote:
MitArgento wrote:
Nerf FATE spawn times HEAVILY, leave their exp rewards as it is, because as it is, fates are just a normal encounter, they appear far too frequently(most of the time once you are done with one FATE another one popped up) and thats the problem imho


So when you have no quest to do and are trying to level another class to 50, you want the best way to gain exp nerfed? yeah that makes perfect sense.



What if it were 10x better than it is now? Would it still be crazy to decrease it?

Have you ever stopped to think maybe it's not calibrated PERFECTLY on the first day of release.
#35 Sep 11 2013 at 8:21 PM Rating: Decent
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Viertel wrote:
Gotta love all of the people who proclaim Tanaka FFXI 2003/FFXIV 1.0 style changes.

"Yeah, like let's totally make it take longer to level and instead of making more methods viable let's just take the easier route and make the most popular one worse than every other option. Because players absolutely hate having options!"

Yeah, we already did that. Guess how it worked out. Complain to get the other methods up to snuff like a dungeon bonus chain, or various other methods. Crying to get FATEs nerfed says nothing more than "I'm a whiney child that doesn't like doing something so therefore change it so NO ONE should be able to enjoy doing that thing."

Edited, Sep 11th 2013 9:06pm by Viertel


I agree with most of what you said... but complaining something is too good isn't always equivalent to being a whiny child. I mean, FATES as they currently are are a tad ridiculous. There are literally so many people on the screen that you can't even see anything because there is so much light from peoples special skills, and if you don't have a top notch machine good luck with actually connecting with a mob.
#36 Sep 11 2013 at 8:24 PM Rating: Default
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It's rather true. They tried doing a bunch of alternatives to party leveling in 11 but the reward just was never enough. Campaigns are pretty much where I remember it 'almost' catching up but even that was painfully slow and very much like the FATE system in design.

Besieged - very much like a FATE but it never moves.

Fields of Valor - not enough reward for the amount of time

I agree that it has been their strategy in the past to just buff the easiest method (see: Abyssea) and leave the other choices (that actually had a chance) in the dust.
#37 Sep 11 2013 at 9:54 PM Rating: Decent
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Viertel wrote:
Gotta love all of the people who proclaim Tanaka FFXI 2003/FFXIV 1.0 style changes.

"Yeah, like let's totally make it take longer to level and instead of making more methods viable let's just take the easier route and make the most popular one worse than every other option. Because players absolutely hate having options!"

Yeah, we already did that. Guess how it worked out. Complain to get the other methods up to snuff like a dungeon bonus chain, or various other methods. Crying to get FATEs nerfed says nothing more than "I'm a whiney child that doesn't like doing something so therefore change it so NO ONE should be able to enjoy doing that thing."

Edited, Sep 11th 2013 9:06pm by Viertel


Grind is a frame of mind. Its what people use to describe playing a game they don't enjoy. If you don't enjoy playing don't play, its simple.

The old game had issues far beyond the fact it was a long progression game...which is what players of this game like. The client was a hot mess, the menu system was a hot mess...there was a lack of stuff to do.

They added so much more into the new game, but then put 1-50 on the fast track...which is really my only complaint about this game...its too **** fast...and I didn't fate farm until mid 40's so I could get seals for my GC advancement.

I really hope they add an expansion, level cap to 100, keep the fates, quests, duties, leves, ect. Add 8 man dungeons as an option mixed with fates and the rest. Make it take 6 months casual time to get to 100 and then a whole new set of raids and hard modes.

I would be subbed to this game for years if that were the case. It gets old these new mmorpgs that your done with in a month and then endgame is a month or less to clear....then what? Ill take a game that has me progressing for months anyday...don't care if there is grind...I don't play mmorpgs not to grind I go play single player game and stuff on steam if I want a quick action experience.

#38 Sep 12 2013 at 8:50 AM Rating: Decent
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We have 8 classes. We have 11 professions. Getting to 50 is just the start of getting another to 50.

personally I'd like to see dungeons increase a little in exp, however, you're swapping exp for gear.
#39 Sep 12 2013 at 9:06 AM Rating: Default
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jetah wrote:
We have 8 classes. We have 11 professions. Getting to 50 is just the start of getting another to 50.

personally I'd like to see dungeons increase a little in exp, however, you're swapping exp for gear.


I'm not sure I follow. When I did dungeons, I would come out with a good chunck of exp. I will admit that I had rested exp untill level 43 AND the bonus for having 50s. I also asked to not skip mobs.
#40 Sep 12 2013 at 4:52 PM Rating: Good
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ASpaceman wrote:
We should be able to bang Minfilia for 1,000,000 exp points. HQ 200% bonus points for being a female character or lasting more than 30 secs.


Yes, Minfilia is hot but I would give all my total experience points just for one date with the Elder SeedSeer.

HitomeOfBismarck wrote:
It's rather true. They tried doing a bunch of alternatives to party leveling in 11 but the reward just was never enough. Campaigns are pretty much where I remember it 'almost' catching up but even that was painfully slow and very much like the FATE system in design.

Besieged - very much like a FATE but it never moves.

Fields of Valor - not enough reward for the amount of time

I agree that it has been their strategy in the past to just buff the easiest method (see: Abyssea) and leave the other choices (that actually had a chance) in the dust.


Remember they also nerfed Campaign so many times, that it wasn't worth doing anymore.

Edited, Sep 12th 2013 6:56pm by TwilightSkye
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#41 Sep 12 2013 at 4:57 PM Rating: Excellent
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Strangerous wrote:


The old game had issues far beyond the fact it was a long progression game...which is what players of this game I like. The client was a hot mess, the menu system was a hot mess...there was a lack of stuff to do.



Fixed that for you.

(Last I checked, I play this game and do not want another FFXI style grind to experience the main content)

Edited, Sep 13th 2013 10:54am by Pickins
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#42 Sep 12 2013 at 5:16 PM Rating: Excellent
I don't do fates for the most part. I like dungeons. Solo/duo grinding. I let everyone else run around all willy-nilly.
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#43 Sep 12 2013 at 5:32 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't think the main point of this game is grinding for experience. It is part of it as an MMO, kinda like how GW2 does things.

I think grinding for exp is an introduction, a tutorial to the job and to the game. Instead, the more challenging part of the game is after you are lv50. If everyday, I log in, is just to grind for experience and lv up, it would get pretty boring. So instead, the exping is a bit faster that even the players that doesn't have a whole lot of time can eventually get to end game than to take 6 months to a year to get to max lv.
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#44 Sep 12 2013 at 6:03 PM Rating: Decent
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Strangerous wrote:
Viertel wrote:
Gotta love all of the people who proclaim Tanaka FFXI 2003/FFXIV 1.0 style changes.

"Yeah, like let's totally make it take longer to level and instead of making more methods viable let's just take the easier route and make the most popular one worse than every other option. Because players absolutely hate having options!"

Yeah, we already did that. Guess how it worked out. Complain to get the other methods up to snuff like a dungeon bonus chain, or various other methods. Crying to get FATEs nerfed says nothing more than "I'm a whiney child that doesn't like doing something so therefore change it so NO ONE should be able to enjoy doing that thing."

Edited, Sep 11th 2013 9:06pm by Viertel


Grind is a frame of mind. Its what people use to describe playing a game they don't enjoy. If you don't enjoy playing don't play, its simple.

The old game had issues far beyond the fact it was a long progression game...which is what players of this game like. The client was a hot mess, the menu system was a hot mess...there was a lack of stuff to do.

They added so much more into the new game, but then put 1-50 on the fast track...which is really my only complaint about this game...its too **** fast...and I didn't fate farm until mid 40's so I could get seals for my GC advancement.

I really hope they add an expansion, level cap to 100, keep the fates, quests, duties, leves, ect. Add 8 man dungeons as an option mixed with fates and the rest. Make it take 6 months casual time to get to 100 and then a whole new set of raids and hard modes.

I would be subbed to this game for years if that were the case. It gets old these new mmorpgs that your done with in a month and then endgame is a month or less to clear....then what? Ill take a game that has me progressing for months anyday...don't care if there is grind...I don't play mmorpgs not to grind I go play single player game and stuff on steam if I want a quick action experience.



+1 to everything you just said.
#45 Sep 12 2013 at 9:17 PM Rating: Decent
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I think I'm out of the loop with this. I remember talking about the game 6 mos ago, agreeing with other ppl how we all were going to take our time and enjoy it after waiting so long. I wanted to craft, fish, explore, quest and not rush thru.
I'm sad that FATEs are being used this way because usually if I'm near one, I need to be there first to get anything out of them. I am not going to grind FATEs. I plan...planned to play this for years, but wow. Grinding FATEs thru how many classes? Nope.
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#46 Sep 12 2013 at 10:35 PM Rating: Good
My pug/mnk is 47 (which I started with on release), playtime is lesser compared to most and I've just beem mixing it up and it seems to go fast enough. Quests, hunting log, fate parties, dungeons, etc. I find Fate parties to be pretty chill to be honest, join up, browse the web a bit, run here, run there get exp, more browsing. No one takes it seriously which makes it nice.

All this being said, buffing dungeon exp is a good idea, why not make the final boss give 40,000-50,000exp, it's not unreasonable when compared to some FATE areas.
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#47 Sep 12 2013 at 10:52 PM Rating: Good
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Or limit the amount of people allowed to join FATE to make it challenging. Imagine 40 people vs Odin instead of 4,000 people.

But then that defeats the purpose of FATE.
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#48 Sep 13 2013 at 6:46 AM Rating: Good
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Montsegurnephcreep wrote:

All this being said, buffing dungeon exp is a good idea, why not make the final boss give 40,000-50,000exp, it's not unreasonable when compared to some FATE areas.


I'm not sure I completely agree with buffing dungeon experience, it seems to wholly favor certain classes. I mean tanks and heals would probably be able to level faster than FATEs or with as much efficiency, but it really hinders DPS especially if they lower the efficiency of FATEs and increase the efficiency of dungeons. As far as I'm concerned the FATE farming isn't all that bad, at least because no classes are disadvantaged from using the system. The only individuals that may have an issue using the FATE grind are those with subpar rigs or PS3 - which is a whole other issue entirely, other than that it's an even playing field.
#49 Sep 13 2013 at 6:59 AM Rating: Good
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Fate farming, at least as far as I've seen, is completely mindless. Utterly boring. No challenge whatsoever. I hate to say this but I hope the population on ultros decreases so there aren't throngs of people in every zone frothing at the mouth to farm them.
#50 Sep 13 2013 at 7:11 AM Rating: Good
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There are FATES no one bothers with. So it seems to be just concentrated to popular areas. For example, Simurgh(?), yeah no one bothers with him, unless there's questers, and its usually 3 or 4. The SuperSnipper™ that spawns there is usually not bothered.

And the whole Southern Thanaland has at least 2 FATEs that remain untouched. 1 in particular with the peiste-like mobs that gets heavy probably because it pops right there next to a sanctuary.

I join FATEs as a "in the way" thing. If they in my path, I join them. Sometimes it pays off, like the ones that pop back to back at the Highbridge. I got 10k xp from the last one I was in.

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#51 Sep 13 2013 at 7:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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Solution for Dungeons: Give players an option at each coffer. You can choose to lot on the gear, or choose an exp bonus.

This would make dungeons give more exp if you choose. And it would also keep people from lotting on gear they don't truly need or want badly.

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