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No kick feature in dungeons...Follow

#1 Sep 15 2013 at 3:48 AM Rating: Good
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Ok, so I guess many have complained about lack of kick feature already, but I'm getting really tired of the issue.

Done CM quite a few times on the last few days, and Ive had someone (usually tank) flaming, afking and trolling the run. You cant do anything about it, and top of that they get rewarded for other people clearing the dungeon.

Share your thoughts about this.
#2 Sep 15 2013 at 4:04 AM Rating: Decent
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This would be bad in the same sense as "That person isnt listening to what i say, so i should kick him" or "I'm jealous of his gear" or "I dont like his face".

There's just too much wrong with being allowed to kick someone from a PUG with a randomly asigned leader.

Also gives trolls the option to just kick everyone right before the boss. Or at the end of the dungeon and have a friend join in for the win.

Seriously, we have enough trouble as it is already. This is something we most definitely do NOT need.

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#3 Sep 15 2013 at 4:29 AM Rating: Good
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One person having all the power would definitely cause problems, but maybe there could be some type of voting system?
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#4 Sep 15 2013 at 5:25 AM Rating: Good
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People suggest a voting system. Like a tally, if all the party members vote on 1 person, they get kicked.
#5 Sep 15 2013 at 5:38 AM Rating: Good
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Not really perfect. Rift had the issue in Instant Adventure groups where people would just click "yes" to get the window to go away. Nevermind the "pre-formed" groups that'd just kick people because they weren't part of their group.

I can get that bad apples suck and that hoping someone might join an in-progress dungeon is a crap shoot, especially when you'd been queued for an hour+ as a DPS. The only real safe way to avoid this is to just party with friends and hope the princess types burn out sooner rather than later.
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#6 Sep 15 2013 at 6:45 AM Rating: Decent
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Voting wouldn't work either, soon as you have someone start a vote, the person being voted against becomes an instant ******* and stops caring entirely.

You do have an option, it's leaving, and entering the dungeon finder again.
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#7 Sep 15 2013 at 7:32 AM Rating: Decent
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I couldn't agree more with PH. I am especially glad there isn't a vote option for kicking. Especially after reading some of the other threads about some players whining that someone is not playing precisely according to their own playstyle.

The game was designed to allow more than one way to accomplish an end result, get used to PUG'ing or like the others suggested, leave the party and re-enter the queue.

The only thing the duty finder needs at the moment IMO is faster recognition when the party loses a player due to logging off or whatnot.
#8 Sep 15 2013 at 8:44 AM Rating: Good
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There needs to be something.. Being stuck in an instance with either a AFKer or someone who is trolling the group and wasting everyones times is horrible.

Lets say you have been waiting for an instance for 1 hour or more and you finally get one than someone just AFK's with no word... what do you do? Nothing.. cuz there is no kick option. Or the tank is in all vender gear and you all keep dieing.. (thankfully the GS thing will fix that). Or even some jerk just pulling groups and has everyone wipe over and over.. yea there needs to be a kick option
#9 Sep 15 2013 at 9:21 AM Rating: Decent
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Zosimo wrote:
I couldn't agree more with PH. I am especially glad there isn't a vote option for kicking. Especially after reading some of the other threads about some players whining that someone is not playing precisely according to their own playstyle.

The game was designed to allow more than one way to accomplish an end result, get used to PUG'ing or like the others suggested, leave the party and re-enter the queue.

The only thing the duty finder needs at the moment IMO is faster recognition when the party loses a player due to logging off or whatnot.


Actually, it is instant the moment there is a free slot open in the party. Finding a member depends on a few things. First, only people who selected "join in progress" can join an already started run. Second, only 1 person will be matched to go to your party and that person has 45 seconds to say yes or no. If the duty finder meeps finding people who are AFK or can't immediatley click accept, it's going to appear as if no one wants to join.

As for the vote kicking, this is a great idea. The reason were vote kicking someone is BECAUSE they don't care. They will have a much better reason to act like a responsible human being if they have the fear of being kicked. Thats potential time lost to them, and rightfully so.

This still has a down side though. The majority of people in your party queued up as a party, then your vote will never pass and those people will be able to act as douchey as they want. But at least this feature would reduce the amount of douchebaggary i see at least half the time.
#10 Sep 15 2013 at 9:24 AM Rating: Good
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You do have an option, it's leaving, and entering the dungeon finder again.


That's awful when you're a dps.

(15 minute duty finder cooldown + 30-60 minute queue) * X number of times you need to do it = Smiley: banghead

Voting systems aren't perfect, but we need SOMETHING.
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#11 Sep 15 2013 at 9:30 AM Rating: Excellent
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Well, a vote kick will need a few caveats. First would be it can't be done in combat. Second it can't be done while there's loot to distribute. I'd also say it should be locked between the phase of killing a boss and opening its respective coffer drop(s). That way you cut down significantly on loot griefing.
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#12 Sep 15 2013 at 10:39 AM Rating: Decent
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There definitely should be a vote kick. Yesterday I was helping a friend with Guildhests and we were doing the one where you have to kill all 5 monsters at once. The BLM ignored us for over 15 minutes and continued to kill targets individually. Eventually we just had to leave. The guy didn't communicate at all.
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#13 Sep 15 2013 at 12:05 PM Rating: Excellent
This is all part of the game, to be able to kick people on a whim or because their gear is not up to your standards or for whatever reason you wish, should never happen. You know people will abuse it and abuse it horribly, peoples eligibility should never depend on what you decide is right and proper. Now I think people who go AFK for an overly long time and show no movement should be automatically removed from the dungeon. Being a newb and having a different competence level is just normal.

Edited, Sep 15th 2013 11:06am by ragamuffin
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#14 Sep 15 2013 at 12:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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I disagree. If someone is blatantly ignoring all communication and ignoring the objective for over a half hour, they deserve to be removed from the party.

The player in question didn't attempt to respond, even with an "ok" or "I'll try" when given instructions.

Edited, Sep 15th 2013 2:35pm by LucasNox
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#15 Sep 15 2013 at 1:10 PM Rating: Excellent
I would accept an option if 3/4 vote to kick in a 4 player party. That seems very reasonable. If 100% of every player (3/3) wants you to be kicked, then you have to be doing something wrong.
#16 Sep 15 2013 at 1:22 PM Rating: Default
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You can kick, but it has to be the leader of the group.
#17 Sep 15 2013 at 1:44 PM Rating: Default
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Keysofgaruda wrote:
Zosimo wrote:
I couldn't agree more with PH. I am especially glad there isn't a vote option for kicking. Especially after reading some of the other threads about some players whining that someone is not playing precisely according to their own playstyle.

The game was designed to allow more than one way to accomplish an end result, get used to PUG'ing or like the others suggested, leave the party and re-enter the queue.

The only thing the duty finder needs at the moment IMO is faster recognition when the party loses a player due to logging off or whatnot.


Actually, it is instant the moment there is a free slot open in the party. Finding a member depends on a few things. First, only people who selected "join in progress" can join an already started run. Second, only 1 person will be matched to go to your party and that person has 45 seconds to say yes or no. If the duty finder meeps finding people who are AFK or can't immediatley click accept, it's going to appear as if no one wants to join.

As for the vote kicking, this is a great idea. The reason were vote kicking someone is BECAUSE they don't care. They will have a much better reason to act like a responsible human being if they have the fear of being kicked. Thats potential time lost to them, and rightfully so.

This still has a down side though. The majority of people in your party queued up as a party, then your vote will never pass and those people will be able to act as douchey as they want. But at least this feature would reduce the amount of douchebaggary i see at least half the time.


Actually no it is not always instant, but thanks anyway for stating the obvious that DF only adds people who selected join in progress for a party that loses members midway. I love how the game hasn't been out a month yet and yet there are already tons who think that somehow they are the only one who comprehends the game, were possibly ever in beta or early access.

As far as responsible human beings go, after 16 years of online gaming, the majority of the time I have seen personally when players are given an option to kick someone out of the party, is they act anything but a human being. Those players are usually kicking out of spite and focusing more on nerd raging over a few pixels instead of trying to enjoy the game without having an aneurysm.

And obviously SE tends to see this same perspective since they didn't give into the whining on this topic during beta for which I am glad for.

Edited, Sep 15th 2013 3:45pm by Zosimo
#18 Sep 15 2013 at 3:41 PM Rating: Good
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Zosimo wrote:
Keysofgaruda wrote:
Zosimo wrote:
I couldn't agree more with PH. I am especially glad there isn't a vote option for kicking. Especially after reading some of the other threads about some players whining that someone is not playing precisely according to their own playstyle.

The game was designed to allow more than one way to accomplish an end result, get used to PUG'ing or like the others suggested, leave the party and re-enter the queue.

The only thing the duty finder needs at the moment IMO is faster recognition when the party loses a player due to logging off or whatnot.


Actually, it is instant the moment there is a free slot open in the party. Finding a member depends on a few things. First, only people who selected "join in progress" can join an already started run. Second, only 1 person will be matched to go to your party and that person has 45 seconds to say yes or no. If the duty finder meeps finding people who are AFK or can't immediatley click accept, it's going to appear as if no one wants to join.

As for the vote kicking, this is a great idea. The reason were vote kicking someone is BECAUSE they don't care. They will have a much better reason to act like a responsible human being if they have the fear of being kicked. Thats potential time lost to them, and rightfully so.

This still has a down side though. The majority of people in your party queued up as a party, then your vote will never pass and those people will be able to act as douchey as they want. But at least this feature would reduce the amount of douchebaggary i see at least half the time.


Actually no it is not always instant, but thanks anyway for stating the obvious that DF only adds people who selected join in progress for a party that loses members midway. I love how the game hasn't been out a month yet and yet there are already tons who think that somehow they are the only one who comprehends the game, were possibly ever in beta or early access.


Edited, Sep 15th 2013 3:45pm by Zosimo



I have a feeling this wasn't actually necessary. Restating information is sometime better than assuming everyone knows everything.
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#19 Sep 15 2013 at 5:07 PM Rating: Good
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Had a guy who needed to afk during Praetorian because it was dinner and he was hungry.

Had another guy afk in AK because he needed smokes...the store was across the street so no worries....

Vote kick is needed for these reasons. Without people know they can do whatever they want and get away with it.
#20 Sep 15 2013 at 5:33 PM Rating: Good
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Whenever you think a kick feature is too harsh, just remember that BLMs had Warp 2 in FFXI.
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#21 Sep 15 2013 at 7:02 PM Rating: Decent
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Honestly, the benefits of this are worth it. yeah it sucks, people can be asshats and kick you for no reason, In WoW i got kicked from a dungeon cause I needed on a piece of gear that was a huge upgrade, and another player got ****** cause it was his 10th time running the dungeon for that piece, and I wouldn't just hand it over.

Personally, I'd rather run that chance that I might get kicked by some retards I wouldn't normally play with, then be stuck in a dungeon with some retards I wouldn't normally play with.

Or, just make friends in game, so you don't have to pug with morons, at least, that's what I do...

Edited, Sep 15th 2013 9:03pm by Jeskradha
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#22 Sep 15 2013 at 7:54 PM Rating: Good
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I can see a lot of anyfair booting. i got called a lootwhore because i kept winning the loot drops in halatali and i could see people kicking you just because you won the chests more often then they did.






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#23 Sep 16 2013 at 1:14 AM Rating: Decent
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Two sides to this argument. Two ways to abuse the Duty Finder system. I think the issue is the randomness of the Duty Finder itself, and the anonymity it helps to perpetuate. The most logical solution is not to use the Duty Finder.

I can't swing a dead cat without hitting someone in the game. It stands to reason I should be able to communicate with them, and form a group of others that meet my own goals and time schedule. I ask myself... am I too lazy to recruit other like-minded individuals? Or is it I just like the notion of abuse and the general waste of my time, potentially, when having random strangers picked for me?

Perhaps I'll make use of the upcoming feature to select to join a party within my own server in the Duty Finder. That way the community I am in can police it's own. Will that fix these issues being discussed here? Time will tell.

Until then. I'm Mag Cotti, on the server Ragnarok (EU). I generally play between the hours of 16:00 - 00:00 GMT+3, but because of real life responsibilities, I only dungeon run after 21:00 GMT+3. If any of you are on the same server and schedule, join me.
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#24 Sep 16 2013 at 1:49 AM Rating: Good
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Terrible idea. Would create more problems than it solves.

To paraphrase Christopher Walken: "Why can't we all just... get along?"
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#25 Sep 16 2013 at 3:14 AM Rating: Good
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Personally, I'm all for a kick feature. Sure it can be abused if implemented, but abuse comes from not having one also. One of my first parties I got into we had an ACN AFK and never came back. I play a healer so it would've been no problem for me to leave and start with another party within minutes but I felt bad for the other DD who probably would've been stuck waiting in another long queue. The tank agreed to continue with just us 3 and we managed to clear the dungeon but I hate the idea that the AFK player got credit for clearing it too. Also, it sucked having to wait out the entire timer whenever loot dropped because one player wasn't there to roll.
#26 Sep 16 2013 at 3:36 AM Rating: Decent
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garethrogue wrote:
Whenever you think a kick feature is too harsh, just remember that BLMs had Warp 2 in FFXI.

You're basicly agreeing that a kick feature is too harsh with that statement as well.

You think that warp 2 was a good thing. It really wasnt. If there was anything abused, it was Warp 2. People being warped at 1% on the boss so the leader could invite a friend for the win/drops. People trolling with it during parties and warping people to anoy the crap out of them. Lets not forget the times where someone from the leader's linkshell wanted to join and he'd basicly just free up a space that way, despite asking or even caring.

Especially with how anonymous the duty finder is, this would be terrible. It would basicly give people a get-out-of-jail-free card, since none of the players are on their server usually anyhow. Good dungeon with a chest that you know contains nice loot up ahead, kick everyone and get it :/ Seriously, no, we dont need this.

Tank not up to par? Talk to him. Ask him, politely, if he should considder getting his gear and weapon in order before entering the dungeon, since you're not going to win at this rate. I know it's a hard thing, but that will 9 out of 10 times get him to drop himself really.

Healer not paying attention? Ask him if he's multitasking and if he could focus on the dungeon or leave the party or we wont win.

Damage Dealer not paying attention? ##&##^%&#%^&@#^& Seriously, that's how you guys react to commentary about your performance. Leave group, start over.

I've never had a problem with a tank being an ***, i've never had a problem with a healer being an ***, but my god... Damage Dealers... Luckily they often enough drop right after causing a massive link and wipe to make room for the roulette, but yeah. Still wouldnt kick them though, you can easily make them leave or correct themselves.
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#27 Sep 16 2013 at 5:00 AM Rating: Good
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If we find ourselves short a player and have to pick up a stranger and find them to be completely offensive, we'll just simply sit down. If they ask what's going on, we politely inform them what's troubling us and most of the time they leave the instance within 5 minutes.
#28 Sep 16 2013 at 6:48 AM Rating: Good
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I do not feel that a voting system to remove a player would cause more problems then resolve. If the entire rest of the party feels that one person is not playing properly then they should be removed. I do not feel that the whole 'well if you don't like it, just quit and reduty up' is valid. If I was a DPS class and just spent an hour on DF to find a dungeon and now I have to leave because someone else is being an ***, **** that. All that is saying is this; 'hey, i'm a *** of a player for whatever reason and YOU, not I, have to adjust to it'. So it punishes the good/team players for a bad players decisions. This is more so if a tank or healer is just not doing their fair share. tank/healer time on DF: 5 mins. DPS time on DF: 30 mins. DPS time on DF because they had to quit a dungeon because of a bad/rude/whatever player: 30 mins + 15 mins. So, what does this teach us? That we as good decent team players have to make sure we conform to those bad players.
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#29 Sep 16 2013 at 8:01 AM Rating: Decent
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Yes, vote kick feature does have some issues aswell, but not nearly enough to overshadow issues caused by not having one. Reasoning behind this: the system we have now basically allows ONE person to ruin seven other people's runs and laugh and troll on top of that as there is no fear of being kicked. However if we had votekick, for example where you needed six votes out of seven people (dont count the one being kicked) you would need way more than one people to abuse the system. Yes there would be abus but probablu much less than there is now as anyone who wants to ruin the run can do so without any chances of being kicked by doing so.

I played wow since the launch and had only few random kicks out of dungeon during all these years. I had about four cases of abuse of lack of kick system during ONE WEEKEND in FFXIV. Its always harder to abuse system where you need more people to be able to do so.

Also sorry for possible typos. Writing with phone.
#30 Sep 16 2013 at 8:04 AM Rating: Decent
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keflynmahon wrote:
People suggest a voting system. Like a tally, if all the party members vote on 1 person, they get kicked.



Yes, having a voting system could definitely help. It also has the chance of backfiring (or working towards the best advantage of everyone involved).

It would need to notify everyone other than the person getting voted off the island when a vote has been initiated.
It would need to require 2 ppl in a pt of 4, 5 people in a party of 8, just to allow for a consensus (3 people in a pt of 4 could be problematic).

And of course, the inverse would be true. If someone tries to vote someone off because they don't like them, the party would be able to vote that person out.

But, people always react negatively to negative options...
#31 Sep 16 2013 at 5:04 PM Rating: Good
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I distrust the option. It has far too much potential for blind abuse. I would like to believe a kicking option wouldn't be abused but with the DF waiting times I suffer already, watching my tank get kicked would not be fun.

I realize I'm far from Hard Moding atm, but if I can get through a storyline dungeon at less than optimal rate I will take it over waiting for 'teh epic tank/healer (or DD)'. It's unfortunate I feel this way but Perfect World rules will be abused.
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#32 Sep 16 2013 at 5:19 PM Rating: Decent
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Magilicotti wrote:
Two sides to this argument. Two ways to abuse the Duty Finder system. I think the issue is the randomness of the Duty Finder itself, and the anonymity it helps to perpetuate. The most logical solution is not to use the Duty Finder.

I can't swing a dead cat without hitting someone in the game. It stands to reason I should be able to communicate with them, and form a group of others that meet my own goals and time schedule. I ask myself... am I too lazy to recruit other like-minded individuals? Or is it I just like the notion of abuse and the general waste of my time, potentially, when having random strangers picked for me?

Perhaps I'll make use of the upcoming feature to select to join a party within my own server in the Duty Finder. That way the community I am in can police it's own. Will that fix these issues being discussed here? Time will tell.

Until then. I'm Mag Cotti, on the server Ragnarok (EU). I generally play between the hours of 16:00 - 00:00 GMT+3, but because of real life responsibilities, I only dungeon run after 21:00 GMT+3. If any of you are on the same server and schedule, join me.


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