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Duty Finder Queue DroppersFollow

#1 Dec 04 2013 at 8:07 AM Rating: Decent
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So many troll tanks....

Queue up for 'in progress' then drop instantly if its not almost done. As a dd you see it flash on your screen 'duty available' then 'dutty canceled because some DBag left the queue".

It happens about 15 times / min. So you know its a tank abusing instant queues.

Fix for this cannot come soon enough!
#2 Dec 04 2013 at 9:00 AM Rating: Decent
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You're looking at it the wrong way. It's not so much trolling, atleast not most of the time.

Tanks (and other jobs) dont always get instant queues. Sometimes they're just looking to see what the DF queues look like so they can weigh-off if they want to go as a Tank, or change to a Healer or DPS. Everyone has diffirent jobs these days.

Other times it's people being queue'd up for several dungeons, and when it finally goes through some might feel diffirently about wanting to do the dungeon they queue'd up for after all, for instance if a decent amount of time already passed and they didnt have time for that specific dungeon anymore.

True, a fix would be having the option to queue for "in progress" ONLY. But there are some legitimate reasons to cancel though. If it was a DPS with the same reason people wouldnt bat an eyelid, but if it happens to be a Tank, all **** breaks loose...
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#3 Dec 04 2013 at 9:05 AM Rating: Default
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KojiroSoma wrote:
You're looking at it the wrong way. It's not so much trolling, atleast not most of the time.

Tanks (and other jobs) dont always get instant queues.


Tested - 99.9% of the time (aka almost all the time) I get instant Queues as Tank no matter what I choose, might just be the DF cluster I'm on though.

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Other times it's people being queue'd up for several dungeons, and when it finally goes through some might feel diffirently about wanting to do the dungeon they queue'd up for after all,


As much as I want to believe this...it's Tanks trolling the Queues, just check mondays. When it happens 15-30 times in a very short time (1-3 minutes) it's trolling, people pride themselves on being ***** to people with a Dungeon Finder system, it happens in every single MMO that has one.

A true fix would be to give people a 15 min cool down if they queue/withdraw overandover in a short period of time, as in the people who queue then drop 15 times a minute.

Edited, Dec 4th 2013 7:05am by Theonehio
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#4 Dec 04 2013 at 9:23 AM Rating: Excellent
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This a trend that usually happens after a tomestone reset or last day/minute before a tomestone reset.

This doesn't apply to Tanks, also another jobs, but Tanks most of the time. Why they do that? Because they want to get into party that are "in progress" to get a quick finish because they dont have to do it from the start.

And yes, I do agree it gets annoying and SE needs to fix this. For example they could add a limit on how many times they can cancel/withdraw within a certain amount of time and If they go the limit, they get the penalty and cant queue up again.

Hearing that prompt window closing/opening every few secs is just trolling bad.
#5 Dec 04 2013 at 10:07 AM Rating: Excellent
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dustinfoley wrote:
Queue up for 'in progress' then drop instantly if its not almost done. As a dd you see it flash on your screen 'duty available' then 'dutty canceled because some DBag left the queue".

At least the player is pulling out before the duty starts. It really sucks if you actually get into the dungeon and people pull out immediately, especially if you're a DD that's been waiting 30 to 60 minutes.
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#6 Dec 04 2013 at 11:32 AM Rating: Good
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They are pulling out in advance because there is no 15 minute penalty, once you start, that tank would be locked out for 15 minutes.

And no its not other jobs its tanks. As a dd you wait 30 minutes + for a dungeon some times, your not gonna drop the first DF group you get in 30 minutes. As a tank, you can queue and drop 30 times a minute, there is virtually 0 wait any time. the only times i wait as a tank are HM primals, and even then its 4 minutes tops.

You realize you can click 'duty status' and see its 2 dd + healer queued, and the tank join/dropping right?

They are the only job at the moment that can do this 15 times in the span of a minute.

Sure other people will accidentally cancel / with draw if they are selling/repairing/see an interesting shout, but thats not the norm.
#7 Dec 04 2013 at 12:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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I see this often too. It has always been the tank each time I see it. Dey trollin', dey laughin'...
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#8 Dec 04 2013 at 12:32 PM Rating: Decent
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I saw it twice last night in WP
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#9 Dec 04 2013 at 1:04 PM Rating: Excellent
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Maybe more players should level tank jobs.
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#10 Dec 04 2013 at 1:19 PM Rating: Excellent
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"Whoops, I thought I queued for the HM dungeon, see ya"

40 minute wait down the drain...
#11 Dec 04 2013 at 1:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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I've talked to many people who join in progress and if its not at the last boss they bail :( So stupid. Just run the dungeon already.
#12 Dec 04 2013 at 1:35 PM Rating: Good
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Theonehio wrote:
As much as I want to believe this...it's Tanks trolling the Queues, just check mondays. When it happens 15-30 times in a very short time (1-3 minutes) it's trolling, people pride themselves on being ***** to people with a Dungeon Finder system, it happens in every single MMO that has one.


I actually rather doubt that. Someone who sets out to troll is doing it for the reaction they'll get, and you can't hear the screams of rage over the Duty Finder or even if you're bothering anyone at all. The troll tanks I've seen like to start the Duty and then mess around once they get their audience who will have to re-queue after they've been toyed with.

I suspect the actual problem is just as Yoshida says it is; it's just people fishing for an in-progress dungeon, so they reject any fresh ones that come up because they can't filter those out, and sometimes that means the same fresh one has to be rejected multiple times. This should get fixed in a couple of weeks.
#13 Dec 04 2013 at 1:46 PM Rating: Excellent
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Level a tank job and see if the ULTIMATE POWER of the instant-queue doesn't go to your head.

Bad experience? Guaranteed you will be in a new party in 15 minutes if you leave now. Go take a dump and then try for a better party. It's easy (unless your constipated).

When Duty Finder finder pops for a DD it's like "Ahhh, ahhhh, AHHHH!" the holy grail filled with naked women and hamburgers. You will do your very best to make that party work because you don't want to wait another 30-45 minutes. **** you don't even have enough play-time left to wait again for DF and then complete a whole dungeon if this party doesn't fly.

But as a tank, you have to be absolutely sure you are ready to start the dungeon RIGHT NOW, before you hit the Join button. It's a different world. Ching! Do you want this party? Meh. Take it or leave it. Who cares? Maybe I'll find one that is 2/3 in progress. I am so awesome. Yes, yes you are. Your decision to level a tank has made you the King of matchmaking, which in turn means that everyone should play the way you expect them to and know what you are thinking without any communication.

I'm just about to wrap up my PLD to 50, and if I want to DF a dungeon I can, right now! No really. Now, now, NOW! Farming Tomes will be a breeze. Until more tanks are queueing in DF, I will have ALL THE POWER. Mwahahahahaha!

Will the patch to Warrior change this? Let's hope so.

Edited, Dec 4th 2013 2:47pm by Gnu
#14 Dec 04 2013 at 2:03 PM Rating: Excellent
wcloudxkumo wrote:
This a trend that usually happens after a tomestone reset or last day/minute before a tomestone reset.

This doesn't apply to Tanks, also another jobs, but Tanks most of the time. Why they do that? Because they want to get into party that are "in progress" to get a quick finish because they dont have to do it from the start.

And yes, I do agree it gets annoying and SE needs to fix this. For example they could add a limit on how many times they can cancel/withdraw within a certain amount of time and If they go the limit, they get the penalty and cant queue up again.

Hearing that prompt window closing/opening every few secs is just trolling bad.


Guilty of this (sorry guys). Or at least I used to be. My logic was twofold:

1) Farm tomes faster.
2) Assist groups who have lost a tank.

Yes, in that order. Just being honest.

However, with WP speed runs being so quick there's little benefit to doing it. Any semi-competent/geared tank should be able to clear WP on a SR or quasi-SR faster than it would take to join a DF party that isn't doing a SR.

I can't imagine anyone deliberately queuing up and then dropping just to troll people though. Do people really not have a better way to spend their time? Maybe I'm just naive.
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#15 Dec 04 2013 at 2:06 PM Rating: Good
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I've done this on healer, if I get a new group, ill pass and un-tick that box and re-queue, hoping to get another group stuck at the wall in AK or something :p
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#16FilthMcNasty, Posted: Dec 04 2013 at 3:16 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Actually, the true fix would be to make the content interesting enough that people actually want to play it instead of trying to skip most of it. I can guarantee you that if they implemented a queue cooldown, the wait times would rise sharply. It wouldn't really deter me from trying to find almost completed runs to join either. If I queue'd up and didn't get what I was looking for, I could leave queue and find something else to do for 15 mins until I could attempt to find a group in progress again. The only way to deter people with a cooldown would be to make it longer than the actual time it takes to clear the content they're trying to skip past.
#17 Dec 05 2013 at 2:26 PM Rating: Good
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svlyons wrote:
Maybe more players should level tank jobs.

I've been giving it a lot of thought. I've played every type of role(XI and XIV) except tank.

And I wouldn't do it for queue times. If I do try to be tank though, I'd probably need to do a lot of reading, and have a ton of patience for bullsh*t. The only scary thing is being under the care of a healer that isn't me.





Edited, Dec 5th 2013 3:34pm by TwilightSkye
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#18 Dec 05 2013 at 3:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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TwilightSkye wrote:
The only scary thing is being under the care of a healer that isn't me.

What's the worst that can happen? You die. And that's not a big deal. Consider each death a learning opportunity, even if the lesson happens to be "don't invite PlayerX as a healer in the future."
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#19 Dec 05 2013 at 5:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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FilthMcNasty wrote:
Theonehio wrote:
A true fix would be to give people a 15 min cool down if they queue/withdraw overandover in a short period of time, as in the people who queue then drop 15 times a minute.


Actually, the true fix would be to make the content interesting enough that people actually want to play it instead of trying to skip most of it. I can guarantee you that if they implemented a queue cooldown, the wait times would rise sharply. It wouldn't really deter me from trying to find almost completed runs to join either. If I queue'd up and didn't get what I was looking for, I could leave queue and find something else to do for 15 mins until I could attempt to find a group in progress again. The only way to deter people with a cooldown would be to make it longer than the actual time it takes to clear the content they're trying to skip past.

Also, it's not trolling. Trolling would be doing it with the intent of ******* people off. 99% of the people queue'd up would and do accept the in-progress runs they're looking for. As if the word wasn't already used too much or incorrectly enough...


That's probably 90% untrue. You can make the content as interesting as you want, but it's impossible to make the same content interesting for everyone all the time. You'll either ***** it up with everything you're trying to add to make it interesting to an entire population, and thus queue-dodging, or make it interesting for a few more that already find it so, and the remaining will continue to queue dodge in the name of efficiency.

That's what drives this. Efficiency. If you know how to fix that, you should really spread the word. MMO's have been trying to fix this problem for a decade now.
#20 Dec 05 2013 at 6:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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Gnu wrote:
Level a tank job and see if the ULTIMATE POWER of the instant-queue doesn't go to your head.

This has gotten to my friend and it's been really ******* me off. More so because I decided to hold off on leveling a tank in this game until he's ready to level his alt, WHM. I chose BRD, with support/DPS in mind, because as PLD he wanted to be "the ultimate holy knight". Therefore "I should level DPS and when it is time to level my alt he can level a healer". It's gotten to the point where I'm leveling CNJ up to 12 then PLD to 50, just because of what the instant-queue has done to him.

For instance, he was running Amdapor's Keep the other day until the second boss, and if he didn't receive the drop he wanted then he'd leave the instance and re-queue, totally stranding the party. Later on, when we finally did a Wanderer's Palace run that day, he dropped after the first wipe because the healer couldn't handle a pull of all the mobs to the group before the first boss, stranding ME as well. (Thankfully an awesome PLD came to save the run...I felt so bad for the other members on account of my friend's behavior. He was never like this before!)

A MNK dropped a WP run after not receiving whatever he wanted after the first boss (lol), and his response to my jest --that the MNK pulled a princess move-- was "well at least his role isn't important". Ultimate Holy Knight my ***. Nothing ****** me off more than a princess tank, and here it turns out someone I'm close to has been corrupted into such a tank, by the power of the duty finder instant queue. What happened to you o' friend of friends!?

I cannot wait until I get my relic for my BRD so I can immediately begin leveling WAR to prevent this kind of douchebaggery. Thank goodness my FC is awesome; it is nice not having to rely on a princess for stuff like capping weekly myth. We still are running dungeons and doing all the primal/relic battles together, but I can't continue to be the victim of behavior like this. Will the same thing happen to me when my WAR becomes level 50? I really hope I can resist the seductive malevolence of the instant queue.

Apologies for the rant; it felt really good writing out all of my frustration. GNU's post inspired me to speak up about this, and the way it has personally affected me.

Edited, Dec 5th 2013 4:13pm by fatpolomanjr
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#21 Dec 05 2013 at 7:00 PM Rating: Decent
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Medieve wrote:
FilthMcNasty wrote:
Theonehio wrote:
A true fix would be to give people a 15 min cool down if they queue/withdraw overandover in a short period of time, as in the people who queue then drop 15 times a minute.


Actually, the true fix would be to make the content interesting enough that people actually want to play it instead of trying to skip most of it. I can guarantee you that if they implemented a queue cooldown, the wait times would rise sharply. It wouldn't really deter me from trying to find almost completed runs to join either. If I queue'd up and didn't get what I was looking for, I could leave queue and find something else to do for 15 mins until I could attempt to find a group in progress again. The only way to deter people with a cooldown would be to make it longer than the actual time it takes to clear the content they're trying to skip past.

Also, it's not trolling. Trolling would be doing it with the intent of ******* people off. 99% of the people queue'd up would and do accept the in-progress runs they're looking for. As if the word wasn't already used too much or incorrectly enough...


That's probably 90% untrue. You can make the content as interesting as you want, but it's impossible to make the same content interesting for everyone all the time. You'll either ***** it up with everything you're trying to add to make it interesting to an entire population, and thus queue-dodging, or make it interesting for a few more that already find it so, and the remaining will continue to queue dodge in the name of efficiency.

That's what drives this. Efficiency. If you know how to fix that, you should really spread the word. MMO's have been trying to fix this problem for a decade now.


I think you missed my point. What I meant by 'interesting' was to hold people's interest. A reason for people to be there other than just for the final encounter. Clearly people are interested in the reward so the only fix is to make everything rewarding.

There really isn't a quick fix for XIV because of the mechanics of the game. In other MMOs you're allowed one class. Because you have several different roles that your class can fill, there is incentive enough to return to collect gear or tokens for the other 1-2 roles.

The fix for other games with the single class model is easier because the grind is greatly reduced. They don't need as much incentive to get people to complete content because that content is implemented with the single class system in mind. There is a different philosophy altogether when you're designing content for people to complete a few times to gather gear or tokens for one class(2 roles, possibly 3) vs. designing content for gearing all of the classes and jobs. That's not to say that other MMOs don't run into the same issue, but they're less obvious.
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#22 Dec 05 2013 at 9:06 PM Rating: Good
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I like all these "oh it's not a troll" comments.

So when my queue pops up 20 times within the past 30 seconds, that's not a tank trolling with queue timers? And how about when he decides, on his 7th attempt, to hold the time till the last second that he would be withdrawn to withdraw then and keep queuing?

Yeah, that's called trolling. Maybe you haven't experienced it yourself, but it happens every so often.
#23 Dec 06 2013 at 3:12 AM Rating: Decent
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HitomeOfBismarck wrote:
I like all these "oh it's not a troll" comments.

So when my queue pops up 20 times within the past 30 seconds, that's not a tank trolling with queue timers? And how about when he decides, on his 7th attempt, to hold the time till the last second that he would be withdrawn to withdraw then and keep queuing?

Yeah, that's called trolling. Maybe you haven't experienced it yourself, but it happens every so often.

On the 7th attempt, it will already have rotated to another tank in queue for the dungeon. If that someone is AFK, it simply times out, there's no need for anyone to cancel it at 1 second remaining.

The fact remains, you cannot see if someone simply isnt AFK, if there were a lot of diffirent players joining and canceling or if they had other reasons. There is no way any of us can know. To blatantly asume it would be trolling is a horrible thing. CAN it be trolling? I'm not saying that it cannot be. I'm just saying that there's a whole lot of other (legitimate) reasons someone withdraws from a dungeon.

There's having one or two encounters where someone bails on you, and there's complete over-reaction/fabrication where said thing happens 20 times in 30 seconds.

But ok, you seem to feel strongly about this. How about this. Make a suggestion on the Official Forums stating that SE needs to display a line with the name and server of whoever joins a Duty party or who Leaves. Surely having the anonimity of dropping/leaving taken away will help. Especially if said person decides to join after said 7 attempts after all. You can atleast question him, scold him and/or dump him if he doesnt have a good reason for it.
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#24 Dec 06 2013 at 4:24 AM Rating: Good
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Your naivety is painful sometimes. So here is what you are suggesting:

A tank queues up for a dungeon that I've been waiting for for 10 minutes (healer) or 30 minutes (DPS)
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because of some reason
My queue says it's filling the tank role still
Another tank queues up for a dungeon
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because of some reason
Another tank queues up for a dungeon
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because of some reason
Another tank queues up for a dungeon
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because of some reason
Another tank queues up for a dungeon
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because of some reason
Another tank queues up for a dungeon
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because of some reason
Another tank queues up for a dungeon
My queue pops
The tank decides to wait till the very last second to withdraw from the queue
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because of some reason
Another tank queues up for a dungeon
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because of some reason

Do I really need to continue or are you going to blatantly obtuse a little more?

Here is what is actually happening:

A tank queues up for a dungeon that I've been waiting for for 10 minutes (healer) or 30 minutes (DPS)
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because he's trolling
My queue says it's filling the tank role still
Same tank queues for the dungeon again
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because he's trolling
Same tank queues for the dungeon again
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because he's trolling
Same tank queues for the dungeon again
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because he's trolling
Same tank queues for the dungeon again
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because he's trolling
Same tank queues for the dungeon again
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because he's trolling
Same tank queues for the dungeon again
My queue pops
The tank decides to wait till the very last second to withdraw from the queue (because he's trolling)
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because he's trolling
Same tank queues for the dungeon again
My queue pops
The tank withdraws from the dungeon because he's trolling

So if we've been waiting for around 15 minutes for a tank to queue for our dungeon, do you think 10 other tanks are also going to queue at that very same moment and produce the above? Do you understand statistics at all?

I honestly do not mind it when it happens. I just withdraw, jump on my tank, and queue us up to save lost time. Not a big deal (to me). However, not always an option for people with one job that isn't a tank.
#25 Dec 06 2013 at 4:44 AM Rating: Good
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fatpolomanjr wrote:
For instance, he was running Amdapor's Keep the other day until the second boss, and if he didn't receive the drop he wanted then he'd leave the instance and re-queue, totally stranding the party. Later on, when we finally did a Wanderer's Palace run that day, he dropped after the first wipe because the healer couldn't handle a pull of all the mobs to the group before the first boss, stranding ME as well. (Thankfully an awesome PLD came to save the run...I felt so bad for the other members on account of my friend's behavior. He was never like this before!)
I guess I have people like your friend to thank for all the WP groups I've been getting stuck at the first or second bosses. I don't generally mind newer groups, but then again, I'm the tank that likes to gauge the group's DPS before pulling more than one group and that so -delightfully- ****** off speedrunners. :O

It's nice to get groups nearly done with the dungeon for faster tomes, but it's still a **** move to strand a group who through no fault of their own aren't outgearing the instance to speedrun it or aren't on the last boss.

/yes, I hate speed runs
//blame 1.0 for making them mandatory to get anything worthwhile
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#26 Dec 06 2013 at 6:04 AM Rating: Decent
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HitomeOfBismarck wrote:
A tank queues up for a dungeon that I've been waiting for for 10 minutes (healer) or 30 minutes (DPS)...


Sounds like a bad joke. Perhaps it'll be funnier when they introduce larger scale instances and you have 3 tanks trolling instead of just the 1 Smiley: lol
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