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#27 Dec 15 2013 at 5:12 AM Rating: Decent
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I don't foresee personal housing being anywhere near this. This is meant for group housing, so it makes sense that the price is something you would need to work together as a group to achieve.

But at the same time, holy crap that's a lot of gil.
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#28 Dec 15 2013 at 7:39 AM Rating: Decent
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Vorkosigan wrote:
Hyanmen wrote:
Warby wrote:
Ill admit i was taking a guess at like 20M at most for a large land. 250M on my server is just way too much. The whole point of housing is for your FC community to hang out, now your just going to get FC's inviting everyone and their dog to the FC in order to get more hand on the deck, losing that sense of community along with it.

Either way, yes im unhappy at this but lets be honest, there is alot of content coming to take our minds off it ^^


I don't know about you but I'm not going to be sacrificing all my hard earned currency for a random FC I just joined for them to build a house. I know some people are bad with their financial management but I'd dare to say most of us know a bit better than to trust a random stranger (FC).

If anything this will strengthen that sense of community where every loyal member is putting in more effort than just accepting the FC invite.

Saying that 250M is too much sounds silly to me, it's like people think they are entitled to the largest plot of land on Dec. 17th. Getting access to that mansion is a longer goal than just a week's worth of effort and I don't see any negatives to it with the options we have.

Edited, Dec 14th 2013 10:35pm by Hyanmen


While the thought of an entire FC working together and finally getting that multi-million gil house and furnishings sounds great, I'm going to be cynical here and wonder how soon we'll start to hear about FC's kicking people as soon as they have their housing. The way this is set up is a recipe for disaster IMO, in a lot of ways.


Sounds like a recipe to ruin one's reputation. It can happen but let's not act like there are no negative consequences to it. I mean, FC housing is server-specific, not something that happens in the Duty Finder.

Either Housing is an expensive feature and thus has inherent value, or it is easy for everyone to obtain and thus the value comes from the utility at best.

Also either gil has value in the economy attracting RMT or gil has little value making it a pointless currency. Criticizing that this addition attracts RMT is the criticism of gil having actual value.

Edited, Dec 15th 2013 4:48pm by Hyanmen
#29 Dec 15 2013 at 8:30 AM Rating: Excellent
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I realize this is a shock to some, but the format they've chosen to sell the land isn't without precedent. It's primarily called a Dutch auction, and the prices are supposed to be at a near-impossible, definitely illogical level to start.

SE played a cruel, but intelligent card here. They don't want people rushing to buy houses before they have the ability to expand the instance clusters required to have more than one copy of the servers at a time. That's why they are gagued based on server wealth. It's also why personal housing is six to eight months down the road.

So the supply of the actual space is very low. Therefore the initial cost of them will be exorbitant, and the cost declining as the development crew are given more time to prepare the server structure for more.

Do I like the fact that a large home is far beyond what we will be able to achieve any time soon in the free company I am in? No. But we'll work at it. And it's nice to have a long-term goal to achieve.
#30 Dec 15 2013 at 9:09 AM Rating: Default
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Buffylvr wrote:
The prices are roughly what I expected. Smart for the higher prices for the legacy servers.

The 625m price tag on day one was a surprise. Wonder if anyone does it, lol


How is it smart for Legacy worlds when SE maimed our total gil...? These are prices IF they left our gil alone lol.

Hyrist wrote:
Do I like the fact that a large home is far beyond what we will be able to achieve any time soon in the free company I am in? No. But we'll work at it. And it's nice to have a long-term goal to achieve.


So what you're saying is, in FFXIV ARR a glorified crouch room is equivillent to a large progression point for a character in most other MMORPGs? (Long term goal.) o.o (Especially considering almost every other MMO with housing usually provides accessibility to everyone and building up from it is usually when it starts getting expensive, not just buying the lot THEN being able to build it.)

Edited, Dec 15th 2013 7:13am by Theonehio
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#31 Dec 15 2013 at 10:05 AM Rating: Decent
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Theonehio wrote:
Buffylvr wrote:
The prices are roughly what I expected. Smart for the higher prices for the legacy servers.

The 625m price tag on day one was a surprise. Wonder if anyone does it, lol


How is it smart for Legacy worlds when SE maimed our total gil...? These are prices IF they left our gil alone lol.


New worlds started ARR with zero gil accumulated in August 2013. Legacy worlds started ARR with almost three years worth of gil accumulated / 100.

Yes, it is not as large of a sum compared to if they didn't divide the amount by 100. No, it is still considerably more than zero gil.
#32 Dec 15 2013 at 10:35 AM Rating: Good
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PlanckZero wrote:
There's really no rational reason to even buy housing right now.

There are zero features available until later updates. There's no retainer access, no basement workshops, no chocobo breeding, no gardening...

You pretty much pay tens to hundreds of millions to place furniture and... that's' it.




Same opinion, buying a house at this moment is a place to gather the FC members and put decoration, nothing else, the best option at this point is gathering money to buy a house when they get to half price that is 90 days after housing plot are put for sale.

Patch 2.2 should bring some options for housing.
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#33 Dec 15 2013 at 10:38 AM Rating: Good
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Hyanmen wrote:
Theonehio wrote:
Buffylvr wrote:
The prices are roughly what I expected. Smart for the higher prices for the legacy servers.

The 625m price tag on day one was a surprise. Wonder if anyone does it, lol


How is it smart for Legacy worlds when SE maimed our total gil...? These are prices IF they left our gil alone lol.


New worlds started ARR with zero gil accumulated in August 2013. Legacy worlds started ARR with almost three years worth of gil accumulated / 100.

Yes, it is not as large of a sum compared to if they didn't divide the amount by 100. No, it is still considerably more than zero gil.


I'm on a legacy server and was able to accumulate 1 mil by constant selling and crafting. The smallest plot is 8 million. Only the craziest of hoarders from 1.0 on my server can buy a plot.


Mostly, I'm bummed because this was supposed to give a boost to crafters, which is relatively useless right now. But... now that the 9 people who buy a house on my server will be absolutely broke, I don't think I'll be pulling out my hammer just yet.
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#34 Dec 15 2013 at 10:48 AM Rating: Default
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Louiscool wrote:
I'm on a legacy server and was able to accumulate 1 mil by constant selling and crafting. The smallest plot is 8 million. Only the craziest of hoarders from 1.0 on my server can buy a plot.

Mostly, I'm bummed because this was supposed to give a boost to crafters, which is relatively useless right now. But... now that the 9 people who buy a house on my server will be absolutely broke, I don't think I'll be pulling out my hammer just yet.


Making 1 mil by playing an hour a day was not that difficult in my case (Odin server, highest battle class lvl39 atm). For us the smallet plot is 8 million too.

I don't really know what to say, other than my experiences of making money being quite different.

In all honesty either making that much money is easy or I'm just some superhuman. Especially divided by X amount of people. If nobody can afford the houses as you imply at least they'll go for half the price in a few months, then. We'll see what happens.
#35 Dec 15 2013 at 11:23 AM Rating: Excellent
There's an irony here...

Most people who really care about their FCs and are excited about FC housing (over individual housing) probably belong to small, tight-knit FC that can't afford these huge costs.

Meanwhile, people in the FCs where you have just 10 of 200 members online at any given time probably don't really care... but those FCs are the ones that could actually afford housing now.

Go figure.
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#36 Dec 15 2013 at 11:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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Louiscool wrote:
I found it ironic that they added things to do for casual players, like housing, and then charged the most insane prices imaginable.

Legacy servers cheapest housing is 20 mil. I have 1 mil and a small small FC of friends. Even after a 90-day reduction in price, it's not feasible. I don't even see a route to gaining that much money from the game, except from other players.

Oh well. It was something I was looking forward to and now.. not.

Edited, Dec 14th 2013 2:34pm by Louiscool


This. I guess I'm just disappointed that our FC won't be able to afford a house for a long time. We thought we were doing great with our housing fund, and that's not even a drop in the hat for the SMALLEST house. I was very much looking forward to using the house as a communal spot for the FC to have meetings and fun events. Now, that's one avenue that's completely shut off to us for the foreseeable future. It just feels like another form of intense gating, and I really don't like it.

Edited, Dec 15th 2013 12:48pm by BartelX
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#37 Dec 15 2013 at 12:07 PM Rating: Good
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We still need to understand how this new patch is going to introduce more money from the system. I was of the impression that from the 17th all dungeons mobs will drop gil.




Edited, Dec 15th 2013 2:09pm by Sonsora
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#38 Dec 15 2013 at 12:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah, my FC had raised about half a million gil. We're not anywhere close. Smiley: laugh
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#39 Dec 15 2013 at 12:37 PM Rating: Default
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Louiscool wrote:
I found it ironic that they added things to do for casual players, like housing, and then charged the most insane prices imaginable.

Legacy servers cheapest housing is 20 mil. I have 1 mil and a small small FC of friends. Even after a 90-day reduction in price, it's not feasible. I don't even see a route to gaining that much money from the game, except from other players.

Oh well. It was something I was looking forward to and now.. not.

Edited, Dec 14th 2013 2:34pm by Louiscool

No irony here. What better way for casuals to have endgame without spamming traditional endgame raids than having a club house that everyone can work towards contributing materials, gil,etc?

Maybe a bit lower than 250mil, but shouldn't be too easy or the content get consumed fast.

Edited, Dec 15th 2013 1:38pm by sandpark
#40 Dec 15 2013 at 1:23 PM Rating: Decent
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Just to be clear, I don't tolerate people trying to put words in my mouth, or twist them to suit their arguments. I said long term goal, not equivalent of an unnecessary gear treadmill. If people don't want to pay exorbitant funds, then wait. It's that simple.

Catwho wrote:
Yeah, my FC had raised about half a million gil. We're not anywhere close. Smiley: laugh

We're closing in on two million here. My guess is a large house isn't happening for our LS within the first year, unless Gil influx rapidly increases.
#41 Dec 15 2013 at 4:28 PM Rating: Default
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It'll be exceptionally sad to watch if (when) in reality many FC's can afford these costs and we'll see most low-end plots being bought in less than a month from 2.1 release, just to hear the poor folks claim that it's all bought with RMT gil.

The reason for it being obviously that SE can't keep the /tell bots in check even though they've managed to hold back the gil supply (the part of RMT activity that matters) rather successfully.

If no FCs are buying houses from day one I'll gladly admit I was wrong.
#42 Dec 15 2013 at 4:30 PM Rating: Excellent
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I suspect with housing prices that high, this is going to be a magnet for out-of-control RMT activity, plus a ton of drama once SE gets around to seizing houses purchased with RMT money as they state they will. I could see an FC that mixed funds raised legitimately from members while the leaders stay hush on an RMT supplement to get them the rest of the way, only to have the house seized and most FC members left believing SE made a mistake and they lost all their money hard-earned money for nothing. There's no way this can end well.
#43 Dec 15 2013 at 8:01 PM Rating: Excellent
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The cost of this is beyond ridiculous. Anyone who says differently is well. You know

I am so disappointed with this outcome. I guess the only thing to do now is jump on the gear treadmill since housing is obviously not an option.

I just don't get it. So disappointed
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#44 Dec 15 2013 at 8:46 PM Rating: Good
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Reading all these replies I guess we are all in the 99% and won't be buying group housing anytime soon. Smiley: lol
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#45 Dec 15 2013 at 10:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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Those that are disappointed about the costs should like this post in the official forums (currently at 1650):

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/127458-%E5%9C%9F%E5%9C%B0%E3%81%AE%E5%80%A4%E6%AE%B5%E3%81%8C%E9%AB%98%E3%81%99%E3%81%8E%E3%81%BE%E3%81%99

Translation:

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/127913-It-appears-Japanese-players-are-in-agreement
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#46Hyanmen, Posted: Dec 16 2013 at 1:35 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Sadly those who started a new character on a Legacy server got what they had coming.
#47 Dec 16 2013 at 9:11 AM Rating: Excellent
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Hyanmen wrote:
Sadly those who started a new character on a Legacy server got what they had coming.

On every forum people were warned of the consequences of starting on a hyperinflated world, but all those warnings were heard by no one it seems.

Lowering the prices won't help new players at all. The billionaires will still buy up all the property, only this time they'll only lose pocket change in doing so. End result: rich players continue to be rich, new players will still have no properties to buy.

The solution was always to not start on a Legacy server, and it remains the same even today.


If this is the "solution", then it's clearly a game design flaw. You shouldn't alienate players simply because they wanted to play on a server where they might know people, or on a server where they feel they can get help instantly, or somewhere they just want to play. And no, people weren't "warned of the consequences". In fact, a lot of people here on ZAM were encouraging new players to start on legacy servers so they could get help with anything they needed instantly, or just to play with other players from this community who were staying legacy. And that should be completely acceptable if that's where people want to play.

Hyanmen wrote:
For everyone on a non-Legacy server complaining that 99% can't afford these prices (especially the smaller plots)... I continue to be disappointed in the community. First Twintania was "unbeatable", now "nobody can afford the housing plots". Meanwhile even the most extreme casual player that puts in the effort to making money will be able to participate in this content easily.


Wow, you have a very inconsistent view on the community. First off, some people are always going to complain no matter what. That's just life. However, you make it out like the tiny minority of people complaining about not being able to beat Twintania (which was far less than 1% of the gaming community) is somehow comparable to housing, where there has been a massive outcry on every forum from pretty much all ranges of the playerbase except the crazy-rich that these prices are insane. There's a pretty distinct difference. And I don't understand how you think extremely casual players are participating in this content at all. Unless you are somehow considering farming gil for an FC house for months on end as "participating in content". This has done the exact opposite of creating more content for players, it's excluded all but the most hardcore and the richest on EVERY server.

Our FC has over 100 players in it and the realistic truth is that even if we had half of those players contributing what they could on a weekly basis, it would take us months to get even the smallest FC house... which is kind of pointless for a group our size. Our average contributions from players are 5-10k, and to a lot of people that's a decent chunk of gil. So no, I don't see this as something even the moderate players will be enjoying for a very long time, and that's why I am extremely disappointed in it.
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#48 Dec 16 2013 at 11:45 AM Rating: Excellent
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Hyanmen wrote:
Sadly those who started a new character on a Legacy server got what they had coming.


What a thoroughly ignorant and terrible thing to say.

First, there was no warning Legacy servers were going to have to pay more for housing. All other aspects of the game economy were identical across all servers except that Legacy players would retain 10% of their money. It was only this Saturday where we finally knew this was how it was going to be, so there's no "got what they had coming."

Many people who joined Legacy servers did so to play with old friends or with experienced players, and instead of being welcomed into what appeared a relaxed, casual game, they've been utterly excluded and punished for daring to think FFXIV turned over a new leaf. This runs contrary to the vision the game seemed to have in the beginning. It's not something anyone "deserved." They didn't have to base housing on money. They could have used FC points, or offered some type of challenge that players could compete for through PvE or even the new PvP system.

But instead, new players who dared to roll on Legacy servers have had the welcome mat yanked from under them if they were at all interested in the housing feature, and there's really no good reason for it.
#49 Dec 16 2013 at 12:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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They could have used FC points, or offered some type of challenge that players could compete for through PvE or even the new PvP system.


This would have been the best way. Land gets deeded to to your FC by you allied GC in a feudal type arrangement. The plot of land gets bigger as your FC ranks up. ****, they could have even added a tithe system if they wanted it to be a gil sink.
#50 Dec 16 2013 at 12:54 PM Rating: Excellent
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SkinwalkerAsura wrote:
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They could have used FC points, or offered some type of challenge that players could compete for through PvE or even the new PvP system.


This would have been the best way. Land gets deeded to to your FC by you allied GC in a feudal type arrangement. The plot of land gets bigger as your FC ranks up. ****, they could have even added a tithe system if they wanted it to be a gil sink.


Let players take out a mortgage.

Siphon off 10% of everyone's gil every week as long as they're in the FC, until the "cost" of housing is paid off. That way players can get to enjoy the housing from Day 1, but still have to pay for it over time.

Or make it so that the small house is a 5% weekly fee, medium houses are 10%, etc etc, and the biggest primest choice housing will knock each FC player 25% of their income (considered the most anyone should have to pay by world humanitarian standards) - again, til the house is paid off.

Make it so no one person pays more than their percentage of the house they "own" - a FC with 10 people will never make someone pay more than 10% total of the housing cost.

This way, even a small fry in a big FC can contribute toward the cost of the house, but it'll just take them longer. Rich FC members will initially pay more up front, but their percent of the total cost will be paid off a lot quicker so after, say, a month, they've kicked in their million gil and they're done. If someone joins the FC, they start contributing since they now have access to the house (unless the house is paid off.) If someone quits the FC, they are no longer dinged for their cost of the house, but they don't get anything back either.

Edited, Dec 16th 2013 1:55pm by Catwho
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#51 Dec 16 2013 at 1:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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If they had used FC points, the size of your house would actually correspond to your FC's achievements in the game.

Would have given people incentive to work on in-game achievements too.

I guess that just makes too much sense. Maybe someone can point out the drawback to having done it this way?
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