ok need pld tipsFollow

Don't be afraid to use flash more than once. Paladin has a lot more MP than warrior does, and flash does a pretty good job at taking hate on a group when you need it sooner rather than later. Cycling your combo to multiple mobs is good, and I'd keep doing it, but if you're in danger of losing hate on multiple mobs quickly, using flash again and instantly taking a chunk of hate on multiple mobs may be more effective than fiddling with your combo. Once hate is secured and you're not in any danger of losing hate, start cycling again (can still throw in flash between cycles to repeat the blind effect and further secure hate on all targets if you've got the MP to spare).

Also, if you're having a tough time I'd still mark targets even if people tend to ignore them. At least that way if one pulls hate one too many times, they might start following the targets to make the run go more smoothly. Damage dealers are just as capable of watching the enmity list as you are.

I can tell you how I open up each pull

* Shield Lob (Pull)
* Flash as group gets near me
* Use 1st part of 3 part combo (main mob)
* Flash (Cycle through the groups to see where every1 else hate is)
* Use 2nd part of 3 part combo (main mob)
* If borderline losing hate flash and finish combo on the one that you are most likely going to lose hate. (main or near loss of hate)

* Hit main one with 3 part combo, cycling through mobs to see where hate might be. If need be, use rage of halone (3rd) part on the one thats about to run away)

It involves using flash in between my opening combo on the main mob, cycle through to see which one you are about to lose and hit it with a combo, you should have enough hate on the main with opening combo and flash that you can do so without it running after your party members.

Marking targets do help some, if people don't following the marking you place, you are faced with 2 choices. Adjust your pulling and hate management to suite their style or simply put, let them die if they pull hate on mobs they shouldn't be touching yet. I have done both, adjusting my playing style and letting them die and in the end getting praise in the way I ran the group through the encounter.

I put my mark on my shield lob, making that the primary target. you don't have to waste time/macro space with it on a seperate button. you may have to turn it off in raids, but oh well.

Don't forget to weave circle of scorn and spirits within in between your attacks as well. They're off the GCD so you can use them in between your normal combos.

Flash is your weakest threat generator of all the moves that give extra enmity and the riot blade combo doesn't give any extra enmity. Cycling threat moves lands you much more solid threat than spamming flash on anything up to above 4 targets.

I am not saying flash spam is the best hate generation, but that it is the easiest, and even as an i70 pld with i90 blm you can easily hold ae agro on 4+ mobs by simply spamming flash with 0 need to use emnity combos.

I know that riot blade (mp combo) gives 0 hate, but it makes you not need a bard to spam flash non stop. Tanks are not needed for their dmg, they are needed for the dmg they stop mobs from doing to the dd/healers, sure there are a few times (turn 4) where tank dmg can help if your dd is at the border line, but aside from that i cant think of too many instances where you NEED to mix in agro combo and cycle targets to hold hate. Mostly, because cycling targets implies your doing daily high level roulette/dungeon runs/ etc and none of that content has ever required me to do anything other than flash spam, and i never lose agro as an i 82 pld and i have grouped with some seriously hard core blm/brds. Bout the only time i will lose hate...if i venture into CT and Random_Tank_001 decides they want to tank and sit their doing their agro combo with shield oath on for some reason.

Like i said , you guys just try to make things way to hard....agro is so simple and easy, yes you can do it a more complicated way to get slightly better single target agro results, but ultimately you only have 1 ae agro tool, and you can spam it more than a war can spam any of their ae agro tools. Its boring, but its simple and easy and thanks to shield oath's buff months ago, its all you need to do to keep agro.

thanks for all the tips, flashing twice after pull then gain between switching to the next enemy to do an enmity combo is MUCH more effective... Im keeping hate 90% of the time instead of 50% of the time like before. I actually no longer feel like Im wasting a slot/space in the party anymore, went through all of quarn, totorak or haukke manor without losing hate once (except on boss fights where adds pop mid fight but those adds are usually so weak they die in a few hits anyway so i dont really NEED to tank those). thanks again all (i can only imagine this getting even easier when i get shield oath)

yeah i noticed once i hit 50 and did AK for my relic quest I wasnt tanking half a swell as I have been from 35-49... but still better than I was doing before I got tips

If this is ever the case, that's when the importance of marking your mobs with kill order really becomes important. It's the only reason I would survive in dungeons when I had to start learning how to tank a couple months ago for my FC co static.